IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #45

[DeDee]

jmo..the problems i have with believing he took them somewhere are - if he took them away from there he'd risk having someone see them, the girls having time to possibly get their courage up to do something to escape and being spotted when he brought them back. Also, if he took them somewhere else and killed them i can't imagine why he'd take them back there instead of taking them someplace that's more secluded, like someplace where there's far less chance people might show up to hike or show up to search for the girls and (i don't even like typing this) i would think with the way the terrain is, taking them back there and getting their bodies to the area where they were found would be more difficult and take more time than just leaving them someplace near the area he would have taken them to.

Jmo

:cow: My own speculations for I do not know who committed this vicious crime.

Little risk of being seen placing two girls in a vehicle with tinted windows or inside a no windows van after going down the hill to the private drive. BG, jmho, took control over the two girls immediately either by zip ties, rope, handcuffs and a revolver. They became captives and would not be escaping.

NIN posted a map depicting several paths to the CS. A narrow path runs alongside the CS. Also, from the rear corner of the cemetery, is an established pathway only 750' to the CS. (There is a youtube for that observation.)

The crimes of death more than likely included another POI, along with BG, and, quite possibly, a group of evildoers or a small gang of them. If the search had not been called off at midnight, perhaps the bodies would have been discovered at another location.

Perhaps your theory does not include a SA. However, if it does include a SA, do you think BG did that ravaging, in the open, on the back of RLs property?

BG went to Monon to SA two young girls during which time they would be murdered or close to it. BG had a his wicked scheme. Perhaps a like-minded partner agreed the death plan would be wickedly delightful. That could place the other possible POI as being an evil female accomplice.

Sgt. Slocum has been the arresting officer in numerous crimes, throughout many years in his career with Carroll County. I am a bit surprised that he doesn't recognize the bad guy's [BG] voice.

 

[Bird of Paradise]

JMO...

Do you think there could be more subliminal reasons to print this than to make it sound like money is more important than those two precious girls? Maybe show the public this could potentially impact their security, pulling OT pay from other budgets? Maybe try to budge someone on the fence about opening their mouth? Just typing out loud here...

Any small rural community would struggle financially in a double homicide with an unknown perpetrator(s). They don't have the resources or financial coffers to deal with it. (My opinion, having resided in a similar sized community in another heartland state.)

JMO.

Wasn't the article about the City Council addressing funds for LE?

Any observation that money is more important than the girls is an emotional response IMO.

Business is business. Bills need to be paid somehow.

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

Wasn't the article about the City Council addressing funds for LE?

Any obervation that money is more important than the girls is an emotional response IMO.

Business is business. Bills need to be paid somehow.

JMO (from experience)...
And small town newspapers usually report everything from City Council, County Board and School Board meetings.

When I read the article I didn't walk away with the impression money was more important. My impression was this is business... sheriff's dept needs to rebudget to cover expenses. But after reading the post I replied to I began to wonder if there may have been just a little more to it. Maybe not. But maybe...

JMO.

 

[Justice101]

So, since there has been no update from LE on the case (other than saying resources were being reduced), does that mean they need no more information from the general public on BG? Or is it just that people's memories are now so far gone from back in February that the information they might give would be not useful?

 

[Bemused]

So, could it be they could not afford to chase all of the tips a good video would generate?

I doubt it.

I think they scaled back because a) they know who did this and, b) why waste resources when their current personnel can handle it. JMO

I would guess their governor could infuse some cash from the state budget if the county needed it to investigate this case, but that's just a guess.

 

[MHCH]

So, since there has been no update from LE on the case (other than saying resources were being reduced), does that mean they need no more information from the general public on BG? Or is it just that people's memories are now so far gone from back in February that the information they might give would be not useful?

They are still sharing the PSA asking for information on local radio stations... And have the signs up on local roads "seeking information"...

 

[St. Anthony2017]

These exact questions are keeping me up at night!! I keep coming back to the possibility that he didn't take them anywhere - perhaps they ran from him on the bridge (in that direction because they knew it was private property and someone might be there, or because it was downhill and they could run faster), he chased them, took until over the creek to catch and subdue both of them. And from there it was quick and he left quickly to avoid being seen. Just pure speculation and JMO.

Or the girls spotted the BG breaking into RL's house and he saw them too and chased them off RL's property. Imo

 

[Bently]

JMO...

Do you think there could be more subliminal reasons to print this than to make it sound like money is more important than those two precious girls? Maybe show the public this could potentially impact their security, pulling OT pay from other budgets? Maybe try to budge someone on the fence about opening their mouth? Just typing out loud here...

Any small rural community would struggle financially in a double homicide with an unknown perpetrator(s). They don't have the resources or financial coffers to deal with it. (My opinion, having resided in a similar sized community in another heartland state.)

JMO.

Nope, I do not think anything other than actual good journalism for a community.

All of us here bring our biases to our comments, I get that.

I, myself, am a planner. Very methodical and anal as to financials and taking emotion out of it, for both my personal and my city as to such..... so I am biased.

It makes me ullhair: when entities that take my money don't plan properly for contingencies and future expenses for the short and long term viability.

Kudos actually for both the city commission to get this on their agenda for planning, putting it out there that just a few thousand for this case required them to move budget monies, and kudos for the newspaper for covering it :moo: :cow:

I have no idea what their bond ratings might be for the community, but this article sends a message to the community to perhaps support a special referendum tax increase if and when this goes to trial.

 

[Novelist]

JMO...

Do you think there could be more subliminal reasons to print this than to make it sound like money is more important than those two precious girls? Maybe show the public this could potentially impact their security, pulling OT pay from other budgets? Maybe try to budge someone on the fence about opening their mouth? Just typing out loud here...

Any small rural community would struggle financially in a double homicide with an unknown perpetrator(s). They don't have the resources or financial coffers to deal with it. (My opinion, having resided in a similar sized community in another heartland state.)

JMO.

Thank you for this. I am normally a logical and non-emotional thinker. But this case and the way it has been handled by LE has me upset to put in nicely.

I would love for it to have been a shadow game LE is trying to play, and there is a part of me hoping it is. But the other half is worried, as someone up-thread stated: were there certain leads that were not followed because someone was screaming about money.

 

[Bemused]

RSBM

All measurements are approximate and field taken (i.e. like walking it as opposed to measured via straight line):



All IMO

-Nin

Thank you so much for reworking your already great work.This is much easier for me to see things in perspective now.

 

[Cryptic]

I do keep coming back to this question: Why did the perp choose to move closer to houses where he risked being seen to hide the bodies at all? Many perps drag bodies into more remote areas like the woods or leave them close to the scene. Why take them closer to roads and houses?

My guess is that he wanted them off the bridge (high visibility area) and also off of the main trails which are more frequently used. As a result, he was not moving the victims closer to the houses per se. Rather, he was moving them away from the other areas.

Or the girls spotted the BG breaking into RL's house and he saw them too and chased them off RL's property. Imo

Though there is no evidence of a break in at RL's property, I think the core idea (girls saw somebody doing "X") is a possibility. This could mean that they indirectly witnessed a drug buy involving an aggressive and paranoid dealer whose meth mind tells him that he is the next "cartel lord". He then decides to act like one?

 

[Deleted member 155000]

:cow: My own speculations for I do not know who committed this vicious crime.

Little risk of being seen placing two girls in a vehicle with tinted windows or inside a no windows van after going down the hill to the private drive. BG, jmho, took control over the two girls immediately either by zip ties, rope, handcuffs and a revolver. They became captives and would not be escaping.

NIN posted a map depicting several paths to the CS. A narrow path runs alongside the CS. Also, from the rear corner of the cemetery, is an established pathway only 750' to the CS. (There is a youtube for that observation.)

The crimes of death more than likely included another POI, along with BG, and, quite possibly, a group of evildoers or a small gang of them. If the search had not been called off at midnight, perhaps the bodies would have been discovered at another location.

Perhaps your theory does not include a SA. However, if it does include a SA, do you think BG did that ravaging, in the open, on the back of RLs property?

BG went to Monon to SA two young girls during which time they would be murdered or close to it. BG had a his wicked scheme. Perhaps a like-minded partner agreed the death plan would be wickedly delightful. That could place the other possible POI as being an evil female accomplice.

Sgt. Slocum has been the arresting officer in numerous crimes, throughout many years in his career with Carroll County. I am a bit surprised that he doesn't recognize the bad guy's [BG] voice.

If he used a vehicle, though, why come back at all?


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[Bird of Paradise]

Thank you for this. I am normally a logical and non-emotional thinker. But this case and the way it has been handled by LE has me upset to put in nicely.

I would love for it to have been a shadow game LE is trying to play, and there is a part of me hoping it is. But the other half is worried, as someone up-thread stated: were there certain leads that were not followed because someone was screaming about money.

BBM

I cannot fathom them not following up on a lead because of money. MOO from the looks on LE faces at the initial presser, this hits home for them and it hit them hard.

They will find the money to fund this.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

My guess is that he wanted them off the bridge (high visibility area) and also off of the main trails which are more frequently used. As a result, he was not moving the victims closer to the houses per se. Rather, he was moving them away from the other areas.

Why not leave them at the base of the hill though? Under the bridge?

Moving the bodies doesn't add up to me. Unless he was afraid he left DNA and thought he could return to RL's property to more thoroughly dispose of them later.

They were covered with leaves and brush it sounds like, but not buried. So clearly, if an experienced criminal had premeditated this, he would know they would be discovered by dogs, right?


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[KyMom]

Perhaps your theory does not include a SA. However, if it does include a SA, do you think BG did that ravaging, in the open, on the back of RLs property?

SBM
I've never really had a firm opinion on there being any SA. So, I'll just say I do believe whatever was done to the girls all took place in the area they were found.

JMO

 

[Jethro4WS]

These exact questions are keeping me up at night!! I keep coming back to the possibility that he didn't take them anywhere - perhaps they ran from him on the bridge (in that direction because they knew it was private property and someone might be there, or because it was downhill and they could run faster), he chased them, took until over the creek to catch and subdue both of them. And from there it was quick and he left quickly to avoid being seen. Just pure speculation and JMO.

The closest house to where the girls were at the South end of the bridge is about 450 feet South-SouthWest of the bridge and another house was 600 feet East-NorthEast of the South end of the bridge. Heading toward the creek would have taken the girls much further away from potential help rather than closer.

 

[Bemused]

Same tree. Girls found across the creek, bottom right.

I never realized that road was there. Now I do wonder if there was a vehicle involved. What is that roadway and where does it go in each direction, anyone know? TIA

 

[Jax49]

Jax49

I looked at map and i think the location of where the girls were found indicated on the map is wrong.
The map shows them being found where Bridge creek joins deer creek, the girls were found on the east side(1/2 mile) of monon bridge. Jmo.
The article seems to have the marker on the bridge. Jmo

Thank you.

You and the other poster who mentioned the map is wrong are correct. The recovery site is too far east. I figured that out about the time the thread closed so this is the first opportunity to correct. MOO

 

[Mainemom76]

They are still sharing the PSA asking for information on local radio stations... And have the signs up on local roads "seeking information"...

IMO that is not good. At all.

 

[Puggle]

I pray the killer(s) realize how much damage they've done to this small community.

High Bridge access changes, parking will no longer be allowed off of 300 North

An entrance to the Monon High Bridge Trail area in Carroll County has been barred to keep the public out, and people will now have to walk twice as far to explore the area.

http://www.newsbug.info/monticello_...a21ffea83d.html#tncms-source=article-nav-next

From FB pics it appears that Liberty was familiar with 300N ...... friends? Close by?

Pic at crossroad of 300N and ? Can't see the other road ..... but should be easy to work out.... if it has any significance???

Also...... not sure if its just my google map images ..... or if its been discussed. ..... but there appears to be a boat or canoe?? At the bend in the river where the girls bodies were found..... or my mind is playing tricks...

If this is a boat or similar...suggests this area has been used by someone...