IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #48

[Lilowlet]

Whenever someone is arrested they are read their Miranda rights.. which in essence say, "...The person in custody must, prior to interrogation, be clearly informed that he/she has the right to remain silent, and that anything the person says will be used against that person in court; the person must be clearly informed that he/she has the right to consult with an attorney and to have that attorney present during questioning, and that, if he/she is indigent, an attorney will be provided at no cost to represent him/her."

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miranda_warning

It is my contention that, RL knew he hadn't killed the girls, therefore he didn't even think about getting a lawyer when the girls were found on his property. He has lived in that town for over 50 years and nothing like this had ever happened before. To him anyway. So, because of that he was "excited" to be a "part" of something big happening in his hometown. He showed where it happened on his property. He talked to the media and LE. It wasn't until he was arrested on charges that were not about the girls that he "lawyered up" as they say. At that point his lawyer told him to stop talking. It's his right. So when LE said he was not cooperating, it was because he had a lawyer and the lawyer knew things RL said could be used against him, especially if he didn't have a lawyer present while LE was talking to him. IMO that is all not cooperating means and why his lawyer told him to be quiet.

Thanks for your insight. I understand it more now and while I do not think BG is RL I am still curious as to if he saw something, and like I posted a moment ago. It left his boot prints behind as well, fresh ones. Thus making him look like he was involved but that wasn't the case so he zipped it as not to be pinned and rightfully so. Imo

 

[Bemused]

If I was LE and I was close to an arrest, I would certainly not tell the public anything (in order not to tip off the perpetrator so they don't flee.)

I would say we are working thru the tips and blah, blah, blah...even if they are close to an arrest.

If and when an arrest comes, it will come quickly out of the blue at 4:00 am in the morning or at his place of work.

Then, and only then, will we know if the case is moving forward and is not hopelessly stalled.

I think we can't judge if the case is taking months instead of days or weeks to get an arrest. Someone posted many threads ago that a case is deemed cold only when they have no leads or information to pursue. If it was cooling down I have to believe LE would be urgently asking the public for tips. IMO

 

[Elley Mae]

Iirc there were someone/others? That backed out for what ever reason that where suppose to go with Abby &Libby that day, i wonder if their SM was looked at as to who could/would have known. Jmo

I agree. Libby started recording and from the time she had decided to do that up until at least the time where the still frames that show BG that we have seen there is nothing that shows a weapon or anything that should have kept those girls where they were. The proximity to the houses on the south side - there is one that is 450 feet away and half that, at best, is woods and the rest is clear/lawn - and that they didn't make a run for it considering the distance BG was from them, not to mention almost all of that distance still on the bridge which is in my opinion not easy to run on.

Something kept them where they were. They weren't chased. The voice on the audio isn't out of breath from running. I strongly believe that what set Libby to take action by starting to record began behind or near the girls. And that means to me that there was at least one other individual involved in this crime.

 

[Lilowlet]

I don't think these were stupid girls , we know Libby was so alarmed she took a video of him. So I can not fathom any excuse he would of told them that they would of believed.

They knew exactly what he was before he even reached them IMO

That is what stumps me when I suggest these things. But then again I don't think it's a question of intelligence. The girls took video That is a big deal. I personally think it's more like, hey we don't know this man. But everyone needs help sometimes and there are some very very convincing people in this world can bring tears to their eyes at the drop of a hat to seem genuine. So they took a vid just in case
But just speculating all imo cause we may never know. But I get where you are coming from.

 

[WebSight]

His lawyer probably knew he would get time since he's had so many passes before. Lawyer probably advised him to stay put as this would be used as time spent towards his future sentencing.

It still seems weird to me though because the one week spent in jail before sentencing couldn't really add up to much in credit towards his potential prison sentence, could it? I would think that if I was looking at years I would forget about the time credit and get my affairs in order. Just so perplexing, all of it.

 

[coastal]

I totally agree with you about the girls just being kids. I cannot imagine the paralyzing fear and numbness and shock. As to the other, I can see your point totally. Excellent thoughts.
I am telling you I really need an emoticon that is a swing, this :fence: is not good enough for the to-ing and fro-ing I do

Enjoy!

 

[gitana1]

I don't think these were stupid girls , we know Libby was so alarmed she took a video of him. So I can not fathom any excuse he would of told them that they would of believed.

They knew exactly what he was before he even reached them IMO

I don't know about exactly but I believe they felt threatened and concerned and weirded out. But I think he they didn't realize until too late how lethal he was.

IMO he got close and pulled a gun and walked them to where he murdered them.

 

[gitana1]

I think the criminal activity commenced the second that BG took control of the girls, be it with a weapon threat, or whatever he did to compel them to move in the direction of his choice. That probably constituted kidnapping right there, but once he made contact, the crime was in process one way or another, hence the video being characterized as taken "right before".

I do not see a scenario where this perp would place the burden of carrying a gravely injured or deceased girl on the other girl, for no other reason than the able victim was a child who would have been utterly distraught and in shock and awe and physically compromised in managing the weight of a disabled victim. That's just too many time-intensive moving parts that risk commotion and potentially draw attention for a killer interested in getting to a place of seclusion to do what he came to do. If nothing else, the able girl would have likely screamed at the sight of such a sudden act of violence on her dear friend.

I do believe that it's very possible that one of the girls could have been forced to assist in securing the other (ties perhaps), but I think the idea was to march them swiftly to his preferred location and any coerced assistance would have occurred in that environment.

I think we also have to consider that they were kids and the intimidating verbal commands and threats of a creepy adult male may have been sufficient to compel the girls to just keep walking. JMO

Excellent post. I agree 100%. People don't realize how easy it is to control kids that age who were taught all their lives to obey authority.

 

[WebSight]

Enjoy!

Yippee! Where did you get that? Can I have one?:loveyou:

 

[Suglo]

Thanks for your insight. I understand it more now and while I do not think BG is RL I am still curious as to if he saw something, and like I posted a moment ago. It left his boot prints behind as well, fresh ones. Thus making him look like he was involved but that wasn't the case so he zipped it as not to be pinned and rightfully so. Imo

If he saw something or knew something his attorney would have used it as leverage to save his client from being locked up for the next few years. There is no way he is involved or knows anything. He wouldn't be sitting in jail right now if he did. I personally don't think LE has a clue who did this. They're just making a strong showing so that people think they're close to catching someone. Time will tell but I have a feeling we will be on thread 70 or so in a few months still going back and forth about RL. I hope I'm mistaken for the families' sake.

 

[FrostedGlass]

Is it possible that the judge rejected the plea bargain recommendation and handed down a harsher sentence? Maybe that's why RL reacted the way he did.

 

[asyousay]

If he saw something or knew something his attorney would have used it as leverage to save his client from being locked up for the next few years. There is no way he is involved or knows anything. He wouldn't be sitting in jail right now if he did. I personally don't think LE has a clue who did this. They're just making a strong showing so that people think they're close to catching someone. Time will tell but I have a feeling we will be on thread 70 or so in a few months still going back and forth about RL. I hope I'm mistaken for the families' sake.

I also think this but then I keep thinking they have more audio so if they are that stuck surely they would just release more of that ?

Unless it's so horrific that they can not do that as maybe this all escalated very quickly.

 

[Yvettea]

I also think this but then I keep thinking they have more audio so if they are that stuck surely they would just release more of that ?

Unless it's so horrific that they can not do that as maybe this all escalated very quickly.

LE has only released stills. Maybe they could release some video which could be more identifiable. It's been suggested many times.

 

[Rossymom]

What are your opinions as to why they removed the white pickup from his property? I am really curious as to why it was removed.


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[jillycat]

That is what stumps me when I suggest these things. But then again I don't think it's a question of intelligence. The girls took video That is a big deal. I personally think it's more like, hey we don't know this man. But everyone needs help sometimes and there are some very very convincing people in this world can bring tears to their eyes at the drop of a hat to seem genuine. So they took a vid just in case
But just speculating all imo cause we may never know. But I get where you are coming from.

I honestly think this was such a fast moving crime that it didn't involve any time spent on lures. I don't think he needed that to get them moving.

I saw a post earlier about there being two perps because of the girls not trying to flee (because there was a second person behind them and they were effectively blocked from getting away). I can see that there may have been two people. But I would think that if someone was going to convince two kids to go along with them using a ruse that an injured friend or dog or whatever needed help down the hill, the person on the bridge would have been a woman, not a menacing male. The latter would have been farther on to ensure control of the victims.

I try to stay with what was simplest for the killer. It makes sense to me that a skilled predator with the boldness to do this in broad daylight would also have no issue with moving fast toward them and revealing a weapon and immediately giving directions before they could do much of anything. If I saw someone coming toward me at a quick pace and I was clearly in trouble, certainly if I was a child, I would be afraid to try and go past them toward the other direction, and afraid to turn and run for fear of being assaulted from behind. And on a precarious bridge, that would be even scarier.

My sense is, even if there were two people, this was a very fluid ambush-like situation and BG knew what he was going to do once he was in their space and he did so with not much effort. I say that also because of what appears to be a very short crime timeline.

 

[SouthernMom]

Snip <Police have had to debunk dozens of rumors regarding the case, including multiple recurring ones that connect Logan to the girls&#8217; murders.>

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/delphi-property-owner-sentenced-in-charges-unrelated-to-murders

 

[Frolic with me]

Gee great job coppers! A poor grampaw is forced by our justice system to serve hard time for his alcoholic addiction. This investigation was supposed to bring the vicious killer of ABBY and LIBBY to justice, not waste valuable resources on convicting a sickly old grampaw.

So this is what happens to innocent folks who want to help the police, media in a double homicide. Good luck getting any tips from BG's family or friends in identifying him. A bungled investigation from the start. Hes gonna lose his home, lovely horses, and his reputation over this. 4 freakin years!!

Casey anthony got less time. Im almost in tears over this poor mans fate. Im sorry if i offended anybody, but in my honest opinion the cops have no idea who the killer is.

 

[chocolope]

Is it possible that the judge rejected the plea bargain recommendation and handed down a harsher sentence? Maybe that's why RL reacted the way he did.

Having dealt with judges who seem to feel the need to "lecture" you during sentencing, I would imagine the judge told RL something along the lines of "maybe in the future, think twice before having another drink" which would've prompted a reply like the one RL gave.

 

[bluesneakers]

What are your opinions as to why they removed the white pickup from his property? I am really curious as to why it was removed.


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I've wondered about this too. All I can come up with is if they'd caught him behind the wheel they would have arrested him and impounded the truck, so that's what happened but in a different order.

 

[Razz]

Or maybe, after possibly pushing Abby over the bridge,
He directed L to "go down the hill." Now he has them both captive. Perhaps he said, "Follow me. I know where we can take her". So they crossed the creek with the perp carrying Abby and Libby close behind. Or maybe he had a truck near by and said, "It will be faster to put her in the truck and we'll take her to the hospital." Both girls are captive w/out realizing they're captive until of course, he finds a private place. But Why would he later bring them back to RLs land is strange unless he was afraid they wouldn't be found.

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