IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #50

[MistyWaters]

LE rarely will identify a suspect before an arrest. the day of the search they were saying he was not a suspect, yet they were searching his home in connection to the double homicide. Now does that make sense??

Well technically a search warrant allows LE to search for and seize certain things from private property. If they're successful and if the items are connected to the crime, then LE must figure out how that came to be. I can think of ways it's wouldn't necessarily implicate the land owner. For example another person left the items there, or used the items.


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[Bemused]

yes, LE said exactly that in a interview while outside his property on the day of the search. I will look for it when i have a chance. however, someone else will likely come across it and post it before me.

IIRC, it's on videotape with Slocum and Riley. Search the local media stations on 3/17. It may be Fox59 or WTHR. They have YouTube channels. There are several local/Indianapolis reporters like Alexis McAdams and Rich VanWyck (sp?) Both have Twitter and Alexis has videos in her Facebook.

 

[AmateurAnalyst73]

I don't believe the girls were ever on Freedom Bridge that day. Do you have a link.(I may be incorrect)

I think a local. The thought that the perp may have been driving down the road, saw the girls on the Freedom Bridge and turned onto
RT. 300 is a good one!

I don't feel this is an SK but then, I'm not an expert and am not that knowledgeable about it but somewhere along the way, I believe they have talked to this person. I'd go back and put a picture of everyone they've interviewed on a big board perhaps by address and then eliminate or regroup them that way.


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[Deleted member 155000]

Is there an actual quoted source for "clear him or move him higher as a suspect" or is that what a reporter wrote because that sure sounds a lot like a complete misinterpretation of Sgt Slocum's comments.

March 17, 2017
"On Friday, Indiana State Police said they had developed more information that led them to request a new search warrant at the property.

"It's just a normal course of this investigation," said ISP Sgt. Tony Slocum. "We've served multiple search warrants so far. They can either exonerate a person or maybe require law enforcement to take a closer look."

Police had previously searched the property, and are still not calling Logan a suspect in the murders of 14-year-old Liberty German and 13-year-old Abigail Williams last month.

“Just let the investigation run its course and this might not be the last search warrant we serve as part of investigating this double homicide,” said Sgt. Slocum."
http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...erty-where-delphi-teens-abby-libby-found-dead


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“We’re trying to basically clear him or look at him even stronger,” said Sgt. Kim Riley. “That’s about all I can say at this point in time.”

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...-no-suspects-in-the-murders-of-libby-and-abby


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[Shiressleuth]

No, I've seen her name mentioned here but not familiar so thanks for the recap.

Investigating a homicide is not like it happens on TV. It takes time and it takes proof they can use in court. Even if BG was standing over the bodies with a murder weapon in his hand when the police found them, their case would not be completed in 48 hours. Real life murder isn't scripted and finished in an hour or two.

I'm very curious if anyone here really thinks the people in LE working this case, who've seen the evidence, including the bodies, really are interested in dragging their feet to arrest this guy? No LEO I've ever known could let a white collar crime go. This is a double homicide of two young girls.

Bueler?

I think they just want to make sure they have the right person(s) before they arrest anyone. No good without any evidence so they want a cast iron case, that's why I think they're being cautious and rightly so, especially as the county does not have any other murder cases. They must be inexperienced so the help of ISP and FBI must be invaluable to them.

 

[BarryManilow]

Does anyone know offhand the distance from Noblesville to Delphi?

 

[MistyWaters]

yes, LE said exactly that in a interview while outside his property on the day of the search. I will look for it when i have a chance. however, someone else will likely come across it and post it before me.

Thanks because my quote is from an interview from the day of the SW as well. It would be highly unusual for two members of LE to give contrary interviews at the same time.

Notice that Sgt Slocum certainly does not state RL must be cleared or made into a higher suspect. He suggests quite the opposite, it's no big deal whatsoever, a normal course of investigative events.


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[Bemused]

“We’re trying to basically clear him or look at him even stronger,” said Sgt. Kim Riley. “That’s about all I can say at this point in time.”

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...-no-suspects-in-the-murders-of-libby-and-abby


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http://www.jconline.com/story/news/...h-property-where-delphi-teens-found/99304450/

About 15 officers — including Carroll County deputies, Indiana State Police detectives and FBI agents — arrived just after 11:30 a.m. Friday at the home, Indiana State Police Sgt. Kim Riley and Indiana State Police Sgt. Tony Slocum said.

"Basically, we're just following up on some tips and interviews and leads that we've gotten," Riley said while blocking traffic on the county road east of Delphi. "We're trying to either clear him or see if he's more of a suspect than what we originally thought."

 

[GangaMa]

Below is the link to the interview where RL is short of breath after his walk downhill. I remember weeks ago that one of our members thought that strange square object under his shirt might be some type of monitoring device.

Also, it's stated in his court record:

http://www.theindychannel.com/news/...e-bodies-of-two-missing-teen-girls-were-found

It's all MOO that for him to walk down to the nw end of the bridge, cross it, kill those 2 girls and take them back across the creek within an hour or so is a real stretch of the imagination.

RL = Innocent until proven guilty. (MOO)

That link led me to this one :
https://www.whiznews.com/2013/11/di...ton-gets-life-possible-parole-after-25-years/

in which the mother of a killer has a new twist on why her son shouldn't be punished for causing a hideous death :
"On top of his life in prison sentence, Dixon was also sentenced to 11 years in prison for helping kidnap Fronsman. Dixon’s mother, Lisa Moore-Blakely, said her heart goes out to Fronsman’s family, but said her son’s sentence is "unfair justice."
"This is like taking my life away," said Moore-Blakely. "Ya know, I have to go into mourning behind this loss of my child that is mine. And with me knowing where he was at, how do you think i feel about that? I’m devastated.""

See how that works? Don't feel sorry for the victim or her family and friends. No, feel sorry for the perp and his mom. Right.
When we wonder why no one has turned in BG, think about people like this. They raise a child to be a killer and then demand to be free from our justice system because it makes them "feel bad". Actually reminds me of RL's attitude.
MOO.

 

[Deleted member 155000]

Thanks because my quote is from an interview from the day of the SW as well. It would be highly unusual for two members of LE to give contrary interviews at the same time.

Notice that Sgt Slocum certainly does not state RL must be cleared or made into a higher suspect. He suggests quite the opposite, it's no big deal whatsoever, a normal course of investigative events.


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I shared the link above to the Riley quote, but in my opinion it is NOT the opposite of Slocum's. (Quote #730)

Slocum referred more generally to the process, saying search warrants etc. we're a part of exonerating or looking closer at people.

Riley basically applied the same statement to RL saying that's what they were doing with him specifically--either clearing him or looking at him closer.


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[MistyWaters]

I'm quoting what someone else said on here. ( Bemused I think).

Thanks. I've looked but haven't been able to find anything about the 4-6 week timeframe either. That was how I happened to come across Sgt Slocum's comments, mentioning nothing about a SW required to clear RL. It's Slocum who's stated all along that RL is not a suspect. He's also appears somewhat exasperated at SM from time to time because of rumours and jumping to conclusions.


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[Deleted member 155000]

Thanks. I've looked but haven't been able to find anything about the 4-6 week timeframe either. That was how I happened to come across Sgt Slocum's comments, mentioning nothing about a SW required to clear RL. It's Slocum who's stated all along that RL is not a suspect. He's also appears somewhat exasperated at SM from time to time because of rumours and jumping to conclusions.


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I shared the quote and link just a couple comments ago. #730


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[Burnt Toast]

Thanks. I've looked but haven't been able to find anything about the 4-6 week timeframe either. That was how I happened to come across Sgt Slocum's comments, mentioning nothing about a SW required to clear RL. It's Slocum who's stated all along that RL is not a suspect. He's also appears somewhat exasperated at SM from time to time because of rumours and jumping to conclusions.


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they said it would take that long in the HLN interview

 

[AmateurAnalyst73]

I suppose, if we were to assume they could have been stalked on SM, it likely would have been via FB or Twitter.I thought someone said that one of the girls had her privacy settings set for public access on at least one SM site. I don't know if all were like that or not, but have heard several people mention pictures LG had posted on FB, so assume it was likely public accessible as well. It would be relatively easy for a predator to know where someone was going to be, simply by following their SM posts, if privacy features aren't utilized. This is a sad reality, but reality nonetheless.

I'm unsure how possible it even is to know who has seen a photo or not though but interesting thought for sure. Best guess I, and several others familiar with Snapchat have had, is that those two photos weren't sent directly to anyone but posted as a Snapchat "story" which anyone following them would see. A notable thing about Snapchat though (which would definitely narrow things down versus a public Instagram account which Libby had, or Twitter or other social media) is that in order for someone to see your Snapchat story they have to both be following you and you following them. It's definitely not something someone stumbles on accidentally as far as I'm aware. Whoever initially shared the Snapchat photos (and at some point there was a screenshot with a name floating around in the very early days of the investigation. I'm assuming absolutely the police talked to that person who as o recall was a female) that person was almost certainly Snapchat friends with Libby.

But here's why I said it's hard to know who saw the photos- if you send a Snapchat directly to someone it disappears after the first or second viewing (you get one replay if you're fast enough basically. So almost certainly they posted those photos as a "story" like I said) but the "story" will stay up for 24hrs and can be replayed more than once. You don't get any kind of alert when someone posts a story though so chances are some folks who were friends with the girls missed it entirely (I always forget to regularly view the stories posted by my friends). It's also notable that since you don't get an alert I'm unsure what the chances are that someone would've seen that post at just the right time and given how quickly the murders would've happened after the photos were posted in unsure it's even related. Also unsure if even with a warrant Snapchat is able to know or show who viewed a story and who didn't though certainly I assume they would know who is on Libby's friend list. But Snapchat in general was created to be more discreet and private (hence the disappearing messages though as the app got popular they allowed people to take screenshots- which they alert you to- like say someone screenshots a photo I sent them, I get an alert saying they did).

What occurred to me though if we are thinking along these lines and assuming, as would make sense, that most of Libby's Snapchat friends are probably other teens... it's possible a parent or someone else had access to their kids phone and could've seen it. Snapchat would've had to have been logged in so again I don't think this was someone stalking them without them being aware unless someone was pretending to be someone they weren't (which would be harder on Snapchat just given the fact that it's all photos and videos primarily, but people steal photos all the time online) but hey there was some kind of rumor the girls were grounded from using their phones during the time of the murder. Don't think that's substantiated but I mention it because what if one of their friends were grounded and their parent had their phone?

And worth saying, in my own age group which is more the age of the girls parents the people I see use Snapchat tend to use it to connect to family the most. Everyone I know who uses it sends more photos to family than anyone and posts family photos (case in point I forgot what they called the "story" feature so went to my app and looked and the two stories from my friends were photos of family members, like a friend's niece on Easter) I find it hard to imagine the girls would've accepted friend requests on Snapchat from random adults (I believe people have to know your username just to send a request and that's not easy to even find.) so I'd assume any adults they knowing connected with would've been family and maybe some family friends? Like I said, I see Snapchat used a ton between families (I receiver more snaps from my brother than anyone else). We do know most murders and such of young people tend to be commuted by people they know. So... just throwing that thought out there.

But I'm curious what kinds of things Snapchat can and can't share with LE in the case of a warrant (or whatever the proper terminology is for such a thing). I'm unsure they would even know who has and hasn't viewed a story.

Anyway, sorry this was kind of a stream of consciousness post but I kept thinking of more factors into this. Frankly I am of the feeling other than the fact that that snap of Abby is the last photo of her alive, I don't honestly think Snapchat had anything to do with the crime. Especially when I realized you don't get sent alerts when someone adds a story. You basically have to be in the app already and remember to even check that screen (it's shown on a separate screen, when you open the app you're given your friends list and any one to one messages you've received, if you swipe right once it pulls up your camera, swipe right again you see stories. As I said I often forget they're even there and that's a newer feature to the app itself.) we know the the photos were uploaded around 2:07. The crime appears to have occurred very shortly after. So... you can see why I'm questioning how they'd be related.




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[AmateurAnalyst73]

I remember watching this early on, but am unable to find it now. Do happen to have a link. Apologies.And TIA.

It was Kim Riley and it was the presser he did with the Sheriff and the chief of police Mullins on 2/14 just several hours after the girls were found. It's on YouTube and about 10 minutes in length. At about the 9 minute mark pay attention to the question asked and the looks on all three of their faces.

 

[Bemused]

Does anyone on the SA bandwagon remember Samantha Runnion?
She was a beautiful and sweet little girl who was snatched by a dirtbag. Unspeakable what that sub-human did to her. He got the death penalty but CA seldom actually puts anyone to death and it's not enough.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Murder_of_Samantha_Runnion

I remember very well when they were searching for and found her. And I remember her mother's grief, anger and strength. Erin went on to make something positive out of her daughter's senseless murder and I have tremendous respect for her.

 

[BarryManilow]

I suppose, if we were to assume they could have been stalked on SM, it likely would have been via FB or Twitter.I thought someone said that one of the girls had her privacy settings set for public access on at least one SM site. I don't know if all were like that or not, but have heard several people mention pictures LG had posted on FB, so assume it was likely public accessible as well. It would be relatively easy for a predator to know where someone was going to be, simply by following their SM posts, if privacy features aren't utilized. This is a sad reality, but reality nonetheless.

If the perp had even the basic understanding of SM, why wouldn't they erase cloud storage?

 

[Bemused]

I remember watching this early on, but am unable to find it now. Do happen to have a link. Apologies.And TIA.

I'll look but I posted the Journal & Courier link to the statement. Kim Riley can't be unaware he's being quoted so I'd think he'd demand a correction if the quote was inaccurate, IMO.

http://www.jconline.com/story/news/...h-property-where-delphi-teens-found/99304450/

 

[JLSChook]

Does anyone know offhand the distance from Noblesville to Delphi?

About 60 miles. Drive time: 1 hour 18 minutes

Now, my curiosity is peaked. Care to share?

 

[Razz]

I don't believe the girls were ever on Freedom Bridge that day. Do you have a link.(I may be incorrect)

No, sure don't. I just read what you had posted a view posts back. Someone had theorized that perhaps someone had seen them riding their bikes across while driving on the road beneath them. Made sense but I saw where LE misspoke about the Freedom B.

But I still think the perp is local
If not RL.

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