IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #56

[Burnt Toast]

Is it clear what he means? They're using every process, including DNA testing, to analyze the evidence. Well, sure. But did all the testing provide any substantial lead? I'm not so sure. He seems to be wanting to assure the public that no stone will be left unturned (i.e., the investigation includes the human, which probably means evaluating tips and conducting interviews; and science, which means forensic testing). That's fine, and to be expected. But he doesn't really indicate that anything significant had been uncovered. Or am I reading it wrong?

LE has been tight lipped from the get go. i highly doubt that they would share any significant evidence in the case, as to not compromise their investigation. In other words they are not showing their cards.

 

[Brighty]

Mostly in domestic murders, probably. Often it is known right away who killed family members, girlfriends etc...

Stranger killings are much less likely to be solved. I noticed that the cases of the young woman in IN, as well as the one in TX who were both recently murdered have had arrests, and the women knew their killers in some way. Neither was random. This is partly why I feel the murders of Abby and Libby were probably random. Jmo

I agree. If a victim has any ties to their murderer the connection is usually found by LE pretty fast. Interviewing all family, friends, and going through electronics and accounts would nearly always show the connection. After the connection is made then evidence has to fall into place to show if that connected person is actually the murderer. If a complete stranger is the murderer then no connection can be made so that angle of the case is blank. So much harder to work the puzzle unless technology can fill in the blank pieces for them. I feel these murders are random too and I think it is a SK. I can't explain why I think that right now but that is my gut feeling.

 

[sumzero]

LE has been tight lipped from the get go. i highly doubt that they would share any significant evidence in the case, as to not compromise their investigation. In other words they are not showing their cards.

Yes, I agree. I'm only questioning whether the reference to DNA testing should lead us to believe they've actually uncovered something important. Based on their public statements of late, I'm not encouraged.

 

[Brighty]

I still am holding on to my original theory that BG is tied to the trail/ bridge in some way, weather it be that he hiked it frequently, was involved in "Geocatching"(can't discuss it or sleuth it here) or was connected by some other outdoor activity there. I have zero evidence to support it, but I just can't seem to get away from the location holding some key in connecting BG to the crime. Maybe it was just a serial killer just passing through, but I just can't shake the feeling that BG knew the location very well.....MOO

I think it is a serial killer from out of the area, I would think he could just scout likely places ahead of time if he was going to choose random victim/s. Maybe I have read too many books about serial killers.

 

[Ember123]

OMG saw pic of his hand ..congenital?..other (brain defects?)..call tip in! Could be him, he impregnated a 12 yo, r hand, approaches with weapon, changed hair, level 3, was free on Feb 13. Others see him online..thoughts?

I doubt it's a dog but IF it is could it be a chihuahua? Some folks of interest nearby have Chihuahuas. IMO MOO .

I misunderstood you to be talking about the mystery black and white thing at his neck being like the BB movie character. Sorry. And a goat is like a skinny sheep, often with a black and white face.

 

[Burnt Toast]

Yes, I agree. I'm only questioning whether the reference to DNA testing should lead us to believe they've actually uncovered something important. Based on their public statements of late, I'm not encouraged.

i don't think they would tell us if they did.

 

[gliving]

Still, we seem to interpret whatever they say in opposite ways.

Confirmation bias.

 

[sumzero]

i don't think they would tell us if they did.

Is there an echo in here? ;o) Like I said, I agree. But their lack of optimism, together with their repeated appeals for that one key piece of evidence, suggests to me (and me alone) that the forensic evidence, if there is some, must not be significant. I certainly don't know for sure; it's just the sense I get.

 

[gliving]

I doubt it's a dog but IF it is could it be a chihuahua? Some folks of interest nearby have Chihuahuas. IMO MOO .

Good point about it not necessarily being human DNA. Gotta keep an open mind.

 

[Idareyato]

I tend to think so, too. My guess, and I could very well be wrong, is that he somehow became aware of the location and realized (given his perverted thinking) it'd be possible to "corner" an unsuspecting victim at the end of the bridge. He could have even done some limited "scouting" of the surroundings to formulate his plan.

I can really agree with both of these thoughts. When I look at that area it is easy to see how vulnerable someone could become. My justification for doing so is to judge my own safety. I hadn't thought about it from the other side. It is not difficult to step into his shoes, so to speak and actually work out what he could have planned.

 

[Blue Amethyst]

Is there ever such a thing as a slam dunk case, especially in a double homicide? (I'm genuinely asking)

I followed the case of the triple murder by Douglas Garland in Calgary AB. First he drove the old green farm truck and his sister turned him in after it was caught on camera. Then in the search of his parents home where he lived they found a hard drive with information hidden in the rafters. To top it off a mapping plane had an aerial shot of the three bodies laying behind a shed on the property. Then there was DNA evidence of the victims at the farm before he incinerated them. BUT there was not one trace of DG's DNA in the house from where he took them. The defence lawyers really didn't have much to say.

 

[ab01]

Is there an echo in here? ;o) Like I said, I agree. But their lack of optimism, together with their repeated appeals for that one key piece of evidence, suggests to me (and me alone) that the forensic evidence, if there is some, must not be significant. I certainly don't know for sure; it's just the sense I get.

I wouldn't quite say insignificant, The problem may simply be that they have DNA but nobody to match it to. No matches in CODIS etc. And if they do have BG dna then that would have ruled out friends and family and RL very quickly IMO

 

[KellyNoonan]

I guess that can be any kind of hydration?

It would be very unusual / unlikely to see someone using those in this area. I highly doubt it.

 

[Molecularblonde]

There are also cases that take many months or even years to bring charges when the suspect is known to the victim. Tara Grinstead and Stephen McAfee are two with recent arrests after 11+ years and 1+ years respectively. In both cases the suspects were known to the victims in some capacity.

I agree, though, that cases that are solved quickest are generally domestic and involve family/friends. I still have a hard time wrapping my brain around this being a totally random stranger crime given the very brief time frame and remote location. Jmo.

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Hi Momma...

with the Tara Grinstead case, they had no one. No suspects, no crime scene, no images, nothing. I think that is why that case took so long to be solved.
JMHO.

 

[Owl4]

This case has me going bonkers. Everywhere I go now in Michigan and see a man wearing a cameo hat and blue jeans I'm out right muttering 'BG'. Please find this piece of crap before I go nuts. I'm so beside myself over this case. What does it really matter if it is a dang plastic bag? Or if it's a inside out blue windbreaker? Will it catch this ? No. Damn It! Get this guy before we all are sleuthing the next. Much love to all. Sorry all. Venting. Carry on.

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[mtnlites]

In my experience, the less LE says and the fewer details about a case they offer, the more confident they are in solving it. I suppose that is why I am hesitantly optimistic about the solvability of this case. I am not in LE but for many years I was the ghost writer for a private detective that was frequently hired by both private citizens and LE for both missing persons' cases and murders so I've been around a lot. (Plus, I just flat out watch a lot of TV. ) I've seen MANY cases where LE has had a strong opinion about "who did it" and even had DNA, but there just wasn't enough to make them feel confident about going to trial so they spent years building a stronger case.I suppose that is why I haven't been too worried about wanting more details released. I mean, I want them released on a selfish level. I selfishly want to know more details because my sleuthing mind wants to put the case together and solve it. My logical mind knows that I have to be content in being satisfied with what I get and letting my imagination run freely.

My own personal theory is that this case is probably much less complicated than I originally thought it to be. I believe it was random only in who the victims were. I think it was planned in some sense, but perhaps only in that BG became unhinged and was out that day to relieve his frustration. I think he might have been capable of hurting just about anyone and, unfortunately, Abby and Libby got in his path. I think he either lives in the Delphi area or he used to live there and was visiting. I believe he knew the park, knew the trails, and had walked on the bridge in the past. I think it's possible he has a history of violence but not necessarily a record of such. And I believe the crime happened very quickly. My opinion is that one of the girls (probably Libby) was killed almost right away. Perhaps he meant to take Abby with him but they put up a much bigger fight than he was expecting so he killed her there as well.I don't know about SA, but I think it's possible. It doesn't actually take much time to commit SA. I know from personal experience. I can see and understand the theory of taking them away and bringing them back to the place where their bodies were found, but I honestly believe that is too complicated a theory. I think they were simply missed on the 13th. I know there are lots of other theories out there about the girls being removed, one still living until the 14th, etc. but I am not putting stock into any of those until I see information straight from a reputable source (reputable meaning either LE or a parent/grandparent's mouth).

I, for one, am glad about the softball field/concert/remembrance walk/etc. I wish I could participate. At this point I feel like I've gotten so involved in talking about/thinking about/investigating their deaths that I probably need to do something to remember their lives. Just for my own state of mind.

 

[Ember123]

Time not wasted on RL ... Cold have been a good distraction to hopefully cause perp to be more careless thinking he was in the clear?

 

[Lilowlet]

This case has me going bonkers. Everywhere I go now in Michigan and see a man wearing a cameo hat and blue jeans I'm out right muttering 'BG'. Please find this piece of crap before I go nuts. I'm so beside myself over this case. What does it really matter if it is a dang plastic bag? Or if it's a inside out blue windbreaker? Will it catch this ? No. Damn It! Get this guy before we all are sleuthing the next. Much love to all. Sorry all. Venting. Carry on.

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This made my day thanks for venting!🤗 what's funny too is I saw your name"owl" and all I could think, is that half of us think we see a BG and we go all owl eyed with our heads turning almost completely around to look at them. O.O

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[Bird of Paradise]

Appreciate your insight. Question though, from your experience how common/rare is it for someone to become "unhinged" as you said and make that jump to killing two girls? Or do you think he's killed before?

bbm

In my experience, the less LE says and the fewer details about a case they offer, the more confident they are in solving it. I suppose that is why I am hesitantly optimistic about the solvability of this case. I am not in LE but for many years I was the ghost writer for a private detective that was frequently hired by both private citizens and LE for both missing persons' cases and murders so I've been around a lot. (Plus, I just flat out watch a lot of TV. ) I've seen MANY cases where LE has had a strong opinion about "who did it" and even had DNA, but there just wasn't enough to make them feel confident about going to trial so they spent years building a stronger case.I suppose that is why I haven't been too worried about wanting more details released. I mean, I want them released on a selfish level. I selfishly want to know more details because my sleuthing mind wants to put the case together and solve it. My logical mind knows that I have to be content in being satisfied with what I get and letting my imagination run freely.

My own personal theory is that this case is probably much less complicated than I originally thought it to be. I believe it was random only in who the victims were. I think it was planned in some sense, but perhaps only in that BG became unhinged and was out that day to relieve his frustration. I think he might have been capable of hurting just about anyone and, unfortunately, Abby and Libby got in his path. I think he either lives in the Delphi area or he used to live there and was visiting. I believe he knew the park, knew the trails, and had walked on the bridge in the past. I think it's possible he has a history of violence but not necessarily a record of such. And I believe the crime happened very quickly. My opinion is that one of the girls (probably Libby) was killed almost right away. Perhaps he meant to take Abby with him but they put up a much bigger fight than he was expecting so he killed her there as well.I don't know about SA, but I think it's possible. It doesn't actually take much time to commit SA. I know from personal experience. I can see and understand the theory of taking them away and bringing them back to the place where their bodies were found, but I honestly believe that is too complicated a theory. I think they were simply missed on the 13th. I know there are lots of other theories out there about the girls being removed, one still living until the 14th, etc. but I am not putting stock into any of those until I see information straight from a reputable source (reputable meaning either LE or a parent/grandparent's mouth).

I, for one, am glad about the softball field/concert/remembrance walk/etc. I wish I could participate. At this point I feel like I've gotten so involved in talking about/thinking about/investigating their deaths that I probably need to do something to remember their lives. Just for my own state of mind.

 

[mtnlites]

It would be very unusual / unlikely to see someone using those in this area. I highly doubt it.

I am going to respectfully disagree. Hydration packs can be found in any outdoor/camping or sportings goods’ stores. Delphi has at least two of such stores. Lafayette has a Kohls and a Target and hydration packs can be purchased there as well. They are also readily available online. You can purchase them on their own but they also come in a lot of backpacks. I have family in Lafayette and Flora and they are all avid hunters, campers, and hikers and they all have them. My 23-year-old cousin in Lafayette is also a runner and has several of them (great for long runs like half marathons or marathons). I don’t personally think that it looks like a hydration pack on BG, but I do know that they are fairly popular and readily available.