IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #59

[rosesfromangels]

I have wondered if it matches to any other crimes with an unknown assailant. Because if this is his first rodeo, his level of preparedness and execution is high.


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First place i'd look for an unsolved crime DNA match would be *young* or young looking, child like prostitutes within a 300 mile radius

 

[Marples]

LE definitely watch the funerals and wakes, I've read other cases where the killer went to the funeral and also they sometimes join the search party.

I've wondered that about these girls. If he was one of the people searching. He looks so average Joe.


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[Marples]

Thanks so much. Since the Delphi killings, most everything I hear about other cases I wind up relating back to Abby and Libby.

Someone here posted a link to a crime in Europe where the murderer assisted in the search. [emoji32] There was a YouTube documentary about it.

The above is just my opinion.

There was a case here in Australia many years ago where two young girls were murdered and one of the men who assisted in the search had killed them and had them in the boot of his car, that he parked at the search!!!


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[rosesfromangels]

First place i'd look for an unsolved crime DNA match would be *young* or young looking, child like prostitutes within a 300 mile radius

Alternatively, i would question said profiled prostitutes about any Johns that were particulary abusive....meaning the ones still living, of course!

All just an amateur theory, but it's niggling at me.

 

[Evania]

You sound like my kind of people, Evania. I replied with something similar. It's too bad that such an innocent activity caused such tragedy.

I think this is what's really pulling on my heartstrings with this case and has really affected me. These girls almost seemed like they could be part of my generation. This is what we did; we rode bikes, went for walks, softball, crafts, drew and took pictures for fun. Sure they had cell phones, but they truly were living life to the fullest, and were enjoying life without being constantly behind a computer or TV screen. Completely innocent kids in a place they both loved, and they were killed in cold blood all because some random jerk had nothing else better to do that day. I just hope they find this guy...


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[Jennifer17]

I get what you're saying. However, I'm guessing that they were the more "outdoorsy" types. I personally hate being cooped up all winter, so the nice weather that day probably seemed like a welcome break. According to all the interviews they were very active girls interested in things such as crafts, sports, knitting hats for NICU babies, hikes, camping etc...They probably were just wanting to get out and take some artistic pictures of the park since the weather was nice. In fact, if I'm not mistaken that's what Libby's grandfather said in a very recent interview.

As for why they weren't scared, I think it was probably a place they felt so happy and comfortable with that it almost felt as safe to them as playing in their backyard. One thing is for certain though...I wish they hadn't gone.


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But if they were so 'outdoorsy types, why were they driven there and had an appointment to be picked up? Why not walk all the way there? The park was in walking distance of one of the girl's homes. I don't get why they were driven there if they just wanted to enjoy the nice weather. I am not trying to say that that shouldn't have been driven there. I just don;t understand it.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Not in the US... 4th amendment protection against illegal search and seizure. LE cannot arrest, or even search, based on mere "suspicion." They must have probable cause, an objective reason and evidence, to believe they will find evidence related to the crime and present that to a judge for approval [ie, search warrant] before a search can be executed. They even have to list on the warrant the evidence they expect to find.
Taking a DNA swab involuntarily requires the same showing of probable cause.

Is a tip sufficient probable cause? I would think it depends on the tip. Someone calling and saying "you should look at my neighbor" without much in the way of specifics wouldn't be enough. But a caller that says "my neighbor looks and sounds like BG and he told me he was going hiking at the bridge that morning, I saw him sharpening a knife right before he left and he came back covered in blood, and the next day shaved his moustache and asked me to look after his puppy because he was leaving town for awhile"... yeah, that would probably be sufficient cause for a search and DNA swab. [emoji6] [emoji190] [emoji4]

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Ok thanks. That makes more sense. Love that puppy emoji. :-D

 

[Idareyato]

They are also excellent gags. Easy to carry, fit all mouth sizes and plastic bag is so fine you'd be scared you'd swallow it unlike a thicker material, so you'd be fearful of trying to dislodge it in case it back fired and you choked.


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The mention of hanging brought thoughts of revenge killings to mind. Maybe the perp had an uncle or dad or brother silenced by the Law. Or the hanging "The way the bodies were found..." suggesting foul play instead of suicide, plus the inability to identify the remains...hangings will disfigure and discolor features beyond recognition a [in] short time. The murder was subtle, not easily discerned. The gag is well thought out in advance. If LE doesn't have any evidence of SA then retaliatory madness makes sense.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Mod note: Numerous posts that have attempted to divide the members of this thread into cliques have been removed. Cliques will not be tolerated. Cliques steer the attention away from the purpose of the thread...these threads are NOT about you, me, or "us," they are about justice for Abby & Libby. Cliques are also exclusionary and they stifle discussion. Everyone is welcome here at Websleuths and the differing of opinions is one of the things that makes this site so great. Please humor me a bit on this one, as it's just my own opinion, but cliques remind me of high school, before we (collectively) began to understand that there are a ton of interesting people in the world, and our fear of differing opinions unnecessarily limits us from experiencing life and the opportunities it has to offer. Cliques are tiresome and the disrespect that results from them serves no purpose and in no way contributes to the greater good.

It is my hope that this gets the message across. There are many great posters here and no matter what opinion we may hold on who we feel is responsible (or not), we all are here for Abby and Libby and want to see the right people arrested and prosecuted.

KLJ, Just so I'm sure, do you mean the fence sitting we've been doing? If so, I didn't know it was against TOS . Just attempts at levity so sorry about that. Never been in a high school clique before )
P.s. Thanks for keeping thread open the last few nights. It really helps us overseas posters.

 

[Shiressleuth]

I'm sorry if this is not allowed, but I really want to know why the property across from RL's (the Mears) was searched.

I don't think we know. Some have suggested RL's truck was parked there.

 

[rosesfromangels]

I'm sure this isn't a new thought or theory, but I'll share it anyway.
The notion of silencing and punishment comes to mind strongly.
Had this man had some previous encounter with one of the girls, or the girls and perhaps they said they were going "to tell?"
This seems like a solid theory to me.
Maybe the girls walked that trail frequently, but I know that young girls go for long walks with their best friend when they "need to talk". I just think that maybe something happened previously, and this guy was silencing them.

 

[Shiressleuth]

Thanks for your clarification. Another example I was thinking about was a very strong anonymous tip involving second hand information with no proof (perhaps the tipster is anonymous in fear of retaliation). Because the tip was anonymous it also might not serve as sufficient cause?

What if the person who shops the perp (maybe a family member or friend of theirs) provides the DNA with the tip? E
G. Hair, saliva, etc. Would that be legal?

 

[Jennifer17]

There was a case here in Australia many years ago where two young girls were murdered and one of the men who assisted in the search had killed them and had them in the boot of his car, that he parked at the search!!!


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Yeah? What case was that?

 

[Shiressleuth]

There was a case here in Australia many years ago where two young girls were murdered and one of the men who assisted in the search had killed them and had them in the boot of his car, that he parked at the search!!!


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Talk about brazen. In this case, it would let the killer know exactly when the search was called off and the coast was clear. Did searchers park in the cemetery during the initial search on the 13th?

 

[Shiressleuth]

I get what you're saying. However, I'm guessing that they were the more "outdoorsy" types. I personally hate being cooped up all winter, so the nice weather that day probably seemed like a welcome break. According to all the interviews they were very active girls interested in things such as crafts, sports, knitting hats for NICU babies, hikes, camping etc...They probably were just wanting to get out and take some artistic pictures of the park since the weather was nice. In fact, if I'm not mistaken that's what Libby's grandfather said in a very recent interview.

As for why they weren't scared, I think it was probably a place they felt so happy and comfortable with that it almost felt as safe to them as playing in their backyard. One thing is for certain though...I wish they hadn't gone.


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It was virtually Abby's backyard. They would have known it very well. It's unthinkable they couldn't do this. My youth was spent hanging around in places like that, woods, rope swings, often more than a mile or two from home.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Yes, I have heard that Perp's will often get involved in post-crime activities such as search parties, posting flyers, vigils, etc. It must nourish the memory of the crime, and perhaps they revel in their secret knowledge. It also seems as if it's some warped form of control. You see killers going to their lethal injection refusing to disclose where they hid a body, etc., despite the anguish they know they are causing the deceased's family. In these cases I am convinced they are incapable of empathy and/or have absolutely no sense of remorse. I can't decide whether it's a soul sickness, brain disorder, or both.

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

In this photo from the media, you will see the north side of the crime scene. You can see the east side (left) tape and the west side (right).

The crime scene marked off is not very large. North to south tt is at most 125 feet in length (and likely less) on the east side due to the direction (angle) of the creek with respect to the crime scene, at most 100 feet on the west (and likely less). The crime scene is approximately 150 feet wide measured east to west. The whole area is more than likely 1/3rd of an acre perhaps a little more.

JMO...
I've missed a few threads so I'm not sure if this has been mentioned, but despite the "rough terrain" there appears to be a worn path that the photographer followed to get nearer to the tape line. I'd be interested in knowing if this was a previously existing path or if it was worn through use by the media and/or the authorities on or after February 14th. If it existed prior to February 13th, it seems to me that BG could have used it as his exit route. I'm not sure if he could have maneuvered 2 bodies down it, but it appears he could have easily walked up it.
JMO.

 

[Jennifer17]

It was virtually Abby's backyard. They would have known it very well. It's unthinkable they couldn't do this. My youth was spent hanging around in places like that, woods, rope swings, often more than a mile or two from home.

So if it was her backyard, why were they driven there and dropped off? Were you driven to your backyard? I don't get that part of it.

 

[rosesfromangels]

So if it was her backyard, why were they driven there and dropped off? Were you driven to your backyard? I don't get that part of it.

This could be a very significant question, potentially.
Why not, indeed? Did they not want to walk past someone's house or be seen by someone......?

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

I have wondered if it matches to any other crimes with an unknown assailant. Because if this is his first rodeo, his level of preparedness and execution is high.


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JMO...
I think it totally does. Possibly more than one.
JMO.