IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #66

[kstephens98]

Fact: LE have not publicly named anyone who has been "cleared". This is what publicly clearing someone looks like http://www.denverpost.com/2008/07/09/da-clears-ramsey-family-2/
Fact: LE have not publicly NAMED any "suspects". Only a few cropped, enhanced, and zoomed video stills of a suspect, an audio recording of a suspects voice, and a composite sketch of a suspect... all of which are of a/an "unkown" individual(s).
Fact: No one is a "suspect" until and unless LE says/believes they are. Just because LE says they are not a suspect doesn't equate to being "cleared".

I respectfully request that anyone who wishes to post false statements about individuals being "cleared" please refrain from doing so. Please be accurate in your statements. TIA

 

[htiff]

Fact: LE have not publicly named anyone who has been "cleared". This is what publicly clearing someone looks like http://www.denverpost.com/2008/07/09/da-clears-ramsey-family-2/
Fact: LE have not publicly NAMED any "suspects". Only a few cropped, enhanced, and zoomed video stills of a suspect, an audio recording of a suspects voice, and a composite sketch of a suspect... all of which are of a/an "unkown" individual(s).
Fact: No one is a "suspect" until and unless LE says/believes they are. Just because LE says they are not a suspect doesn't equate to being "cleared".


I respectfully request that anyone who wishes to post false statements about individuals being "cleared" please refrain from doing so. Please be accurate in your statements. TIA

Actually LE has stated that they have a suspect--though not by name.

"Cleared" is just a form of speech, perhaps not the best choice, but certainly not an outright misrepresentation of the matter. Although, it could be assumed that some type of "clearing" regarding RL was performed, in that RL's property was searched and he was declared NOT to be a suspect. LE has stated very plainly that RL is NOT a suspect. So though they may not have pointed to another suspect by name, they have been "clear" that RL is not in that category.

And in regard to the Ramseys as an example of a suspect or suspects being cleared--are you sure this is the best example of this? As in, doubt persists on that case as to exactly what happened.

It is not a false statement to say that someone is cleared if you can see that they were investigated and then a statement is made publicly that this person is not a suspect. Although, it could also be surmised that RL was never a suspect--that the search was simply a precautionary measure, in the event that the killer did make their way into RL's home or vehicle.

We just don't know.

But it would be true to say that LE didn't state it that way.

 

[flourish]

Respectfully...LE rarely "clears" someone. The Ramsey "clearing" is unusual and seemed much more of a political move than anything else. There's still a lot of suspicion cast on the Ramsey family (for good reason). There's a whole jonbenet area here to discuss that case and that "clearing," but that case should definitely not be used as an example of a typical case as both the crime itself and the investigation were anything but.

If the moderators made a rule regarding "cleared" or "uncleared" persons, perhaps it would be prudent to "bump" those posts, as it's actually against the rules to "tell others how to post." The moderators can be private messaged with concerns about what's being said. Tlyca, Tricia, and Silly Billy are moderators just off the top of my head.

Hope that helps.

 

[htiff]

I don't want to get too far off the case at hand, but in regard to the Ramsey case, the "clearing" or public exoneration of the family, by the Boulder DA in 2008 has been criticized, and very recently by the current DA of that jurisdiction--as being misleading.

Where this feels relevant to this case is as a reminder that all the information we are dealing with is possibly flawed. Though it's important, I think, to substantiate a theory with some type of reliable fact, unfortunately, nothing is 100%. And sometimes news reports are off, as well.

I don't personally care about being right or wrong--I do work hard to be accurate. But sometimes I fail. The effort to to back up claims with the best facts we can find, seems to me the best way to help the investigation. And to me, that's all we really can do. But I could be wrong. I often am wrong.

We are so low on the food chain in these investigations. We aren't just observing through a glass darkly, we are almost in the pitch-black-darkness.

But personally I have learned a tremendous amount from following these cases. Learned about Stingrays today. I am very knowledgable about Ping Data because of the McStay case. And my knowledge of Search Warrants is pretty comprehensive as well. There's something to be said, I think, for trying to get it right.

 

[kstephens98]

Not trying to argue inferred meanings of LE statements, or the guilt or innocence of anyone in this or any other case. I am simply asking for accuracy. The example I provided was a clear example of someone being publicly cleared. There is no ambiguity about the intent. In this case, no one has been publicly cleared. I fail to understand why WS members state what they, themselves, believe LE "really means" as fact instead of just quoting LE directly and opining on what they believe LE "really means". Saying LE has "cleared" anyone publicly is false and misleading statement

Cleared - Confident that individual person(s) are not involved.
Suspected - Reason(s) to believe that individual person(s) are involved.
Not a suspect - No reason to believe that individual person(s) are involved.

 

[Spellbound]

What makes you so sure this is Monticello rather than Delphi? Not that it really matters. If it's not the Monon Bridge, it negates my whole reason for being interested. But curious is all.

I can't tell you which thread, but this was discussed in depth in an early thread and it is definitely not Delphi.

Actually LE has stated that they have a suspect--though not by name.

(Respectfully, snipped by me)

Gracie, you have confused me with this statement. what do you mean? have they said they have a suspect, or are you meaning the sketched person is their suspect? or is there something else my tired brain and body is overlooking?
Thanks!

 

[NorahB]

OK here is my take, draw back a wee bit from what LE has presented us with and ignoring all the loony speculation about hats and what he may or may not have in his jacket - from the video, BG is an unathletic white guy with a pot belly, seemingly at home with walking on the rickety bridge. From the photo fit - he has red hair, widely spaced eyes that slant down at the lateral edges, his nose has a wide bridge and obviously been broken before ..... Doesn't this remind any of you of anyone's photo you have looked at a hundred times before???

 

[deedee21]

i am not sure about this... the girls are from the area and most likely did not travel to that part of town to prospect. it was probably an area they had visited before, as parents let them go without an adult present. the girls are from delphi, and people from surrounding areas do not go to delphi for gold prospecting... honestly people don't really go to delphi at all unless they have a specific reason.

People do come from other areas looking for gold. Including out of state.

 

[deedee21]

OK here is my take, draw back a wee bit from what LE has presented us with and ignoring all the loony speculation about hats and what he may or may not have in his jacket - from the video, BG is an unathletic white guy with a pot belly, seemingly at home with walking on the rickety bridge. From the photo fit - he has red hair, widely spaced eyes that slant down at the lateral edges, his nose has a wide bridge and obviously been broken before ..... Doesn't this remind any of you of anyone's photo you have looked at a hundred times before???

That nut that killed the college student is in jail.
LE did say this killer has brownish red hair.

 

[Sleuthin' n TX]

Checking back in after a break. So maddening to have no arrest yet.

With so many points debatable and contentious, I keep thinking about one thing that seems ironclad to me: that the reward amount is way enough for anybody to turn BG in by anybody who even remotely recognized him from the sketch. Even a wife or girlfriend or mother. I have no doubt in my mind about that whatsoever.

That leads me to wonder about the accuracy of the sketch.

I'm sure the reward has produced hundreds or thousands of tips, and wonder if he's already been called in, but I feel like LE is so invested in tracking leads in this case that it isnt like there are hundreds of tips laying around on a desk waiting to be investigated.

It also makes me believe he lives in another state where the sketch and the crime were not given the same level of publicity as in Indiana.
.
I wish the sketch could be given another boost of national exposure.

I did submit a request on Monday for the American Trucking Association to distribute the "new" sketch. Although I haven't heard anything yet, I don't think it could hurt for others to request the same from them. Here is the link to their site: http://www.trucking.org/

I would be happy to share the content of the email if anyone would like. Thank you.

 

[Jethro4WS]

What makes you so sure this is Monticello rather than Delphi? Not that it really matters. If it's not the Monon Bridge, it negates my whole reason for being interested. But curious is all.

You would have to go back to the early threads. Can't tell you which thread off the top of my head. There were at least 4 image analysts that were going bridge by bridge looking for power lines crossing, the right type of bridge, and then the right angles alignments to be make it possible for the picture we see to have been taken in each place. There are at least a half dozen image analysts that are very good at what they do around WS.

We were fortunate to have the power lines in the image. Made it easier to find bridges where there were power lines crossing in proximity to them. Then it is the type of bridge it is which eliminates bridges with overhead structures and all concrete bridges, etc. The only thing that was for certain it couldn't be the Monon High bridge. After a several days of effort the bridge was identified in Monticello.

 

[minazoe]

IMO the accent doesn't vary much between those areas. What I hear in the snippet of audio is more Southern IN. It reminds me of the Columbus, Edinburgh part of the state.

JMO





Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

I find it to sound either Missouri or Wisconsin, no matter where he comes from, he's scum and I can't wait, I cannot wait for him to spend his first night in jail. IMO

 

[ezrah]

That nut that killed the college student is in jail.
LE did say this killer has brownish red hair.

Argree w you. Reddish Brown hair. Not red.

 

[No it's not]

Thanks for the reminder Nin. The searcher who found them is just referred to "as a neighbor" so not specific to anyone.
"The gruesome discovery was made on Ron Logan’s 40-acre lot by a neighbor who volunteered to help with the search." from Fox 59

No worries Ezrah. It's possible RL has more than just 1 friend..;--)

-Nin

 

[Yemelyan]

I have been looking into the proximity of the railways to the crime scene and thinking about the types of people who would be familiar with that area and yet not be local. On the Norfolk Southern Corp website, they list some career paths: http://www.nscorp.com/content/nscorp/en/work-at-ns/career-paths/hourly-positions.html

I was drawn to the job description of the "signal maintainers." They build and maintain signal equipment along railways. They don't travel to locations via rail, they actually drive themselves (and a CDL is required). Extensive regional travel is required for this particular job so they may travel to different sites along the entire length of the corporation's tracks and stay out of town for days or weeks at a time. I'm thinking they may stay in motels/extended stay hotels during their assignments? In their downtime, maybe they have time to explore the towns they are periodically stationed in, so that someone who, for instance, normally works and lives in Fort Wayne, comes to Delphi for a week-long assignment two or three times each year? I'm just wondering if this occupation fits the bill for someone who is a non-local and yet has local knowledge?

 

[BubbleHopper]

Assuming or speculating is fine but LE have never confirmed nor denied it. Much like they have never confirmed or denied a vehicle involved, nor a TOD, nor a COD, nor a weapon, nor SA, nor catfishing, nor a second perp, nor a rucksack......In fact it may be a good idea to come up with a list of facts that we haven't got - but IMO we wouldn't be able to agree on it.

BBM - true. I got excited Sun after watching AFV and seeing a man wearing a square bag on his belt. It made me wonder if a specific profession wears them and my mind went all over the place. But in the end, the image is too blurry to definitively say he was or wasn't. (sigh)

 

[rosesfromangels]

What if...he doesn't work at all. On disability, living with elderly parent; mother.
Loner. Secretive. Keeps to himself. No accountability; free to move about without question.

This profile makes sense to me.

 

[mrtnira]

Roses, that pattern makes perfect sense.

 

[Deleted member 172065]

Wonder how LE checks all those 1,000+ tips and their alibis. Talk to ALL their employers or relatives? What about an acquaintance of the perp? How would an acquaintance of the remember where BG was 7 months ago at this point? Sounds complicated.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Wonder how LE checks all those 1,000+ tips and their alibis. Talk to ALL their employers or relatives? What about an acquaintance of the perp? How would an acquaintance of the remember where BG was 7 months ago at this point? Sounds complicated.

Yes, it is. That's why LE is being measured and thoughtful in their investigation. Good news is that a skilled investigator can help shake loose pertinent details, and help jog memories. Their techniques are pretty amazing. Methodical ...