IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #67

[LaneGirl]

Imagine the process of trying to describe features in detail so someone else can understand them enough to draw them.

Were the eyebrows curved? Where was the curve? Mid, inner edge or outer edge? Did they extend past the edges of the eyes? How high above the eyes were they? Were the brows pronounced or more even with the forehead?

Imagine the poor artist trying to draw something with limited detail. What do you put in there when you don't have good detail?

Sketches are more to highlight the major details so it resembles someone, likely in order to trigger other memories, or confirm other memories. "Hey, that sort of looks like my creepy coworker who also wears a red cap all the time, and that was the day he took an extra long time to do a delivery."

I believe the sketch artists have renderings of different type eyes/brows/noses etc to help. Basically point to a similar eyebrow then artists sketch.

ETA- I agree under pressure/fear etc one can be off on their description. Witness's identification of a suspect I think has been way off before.

 

[ezrah]

I understood your post perfectly and I am in agreement. Thank you for your contribution to the discussion!

I think the reason the sketch of BG shows a head covering is because he was wearing one in Libby's photo/video. LE doesn't know the status of his hairline IMO, and if his hairline is receding or he's mostly bald it can really alter his appearance. Could they have used a different type of hat? Of course but I think a hoodie, a baseball cap, or a cowboy hat would have obscured his face in the sketch even more and they want everyone to focus on his facial features. Therefore, a golf cap with a small brim was pictured. They never used the specific words "disregard" the hat, did they? I thought they just wanted to make sure everyone knows not to focus on that detail specifically because this individual could have been wearing a disguise that day, or clothing he didn't wear normally. He could have gotten rid of the cap (if it does resemble the one in the sketch) since then, now that he knows his image is out there. They don't want anyone who thinks they recognize the face to NOT call just because they've never seen him in a hat. Just MOO.

Repost of statement about sketch.

 

[watcher9]

Thought this was interesting coming out of Minnesota. 3 men involved.

http://www.ctvnews.ca/world/minnesota-girl-held-captive-for-29-days-before-swimming-across-lake-to-escape-1.3580388

WS thread on this case for those interested.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?346119-MN-JB-15-Alexandria-8-Aug-2017

 

[deedee21]

The families will appear on the Dr. OZ show. They probably got the green light from LE to do so. It makes me think LE really has no idea who he is. Hopefully someone will recognize him and do the right thing.

Off topic. How many coincidences does there have to be before it may not be a coincidence at all?

 

[ezrah]

WS thread on this case for those interested.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?346119-MN-JB-15-Alexandria-8-Aug-2017

deleted by me.

 

[kc1023]

A monster admitted his guilt and was sentenced today in the 1975 kidnap and murder of sisters Shelia and Katherine Lyon, aged 10 and 12. The Lyon family waited 42 years for this day. I hope and pray it does not take this long for the monster in Abigail and Liberty's case to be sentenced

I grew up in nearby Northern VA and was 8 years old when these girls went missing. It was BIG NEWS around there and really put the fear of stranger danger into me as a small girl. This is such wonderful news, finally, thank you for posting it.

 

[watcher9]

I think they put that hat on him because he was wearing one that closely resembled it, either by witness recollection, the video of him by Libby, or both. IMO


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Maybe he had two hats? The witness saw him in the "sketch hat" which was different than the one from the picture Liberty took so that's why the LE said to disregard the hat?

 

[BIC]

Maybe he had two hats? The witness saw him in the "sketch hat" which was different than the one from the picture Liberty took so that's why the LE said to disregard the hat?

That's possible, or maybe the witness knew he had a hat on but couldn't describe it.


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[lindylou]

I think we have discussed the" hat" backwards and forwards. Can we move on?

 

[DarkSkink]

To clarify, I was in no way knocking the victim's description of the assailant to the sketch artist or criticizing the sketch artist's skill or ability. I understand the purpose of sketches. I was simply commenting on what the mind notices and remembers. So many posts here have mulled the ears, nose, area between the brows, brow, eyes in BG's sketch, looking at the trees versus the forest.

I regret bringing it up. I'll lurk on.

lol... have no regrets. I was simply adding to your post. Not only is the memory an issue, so is communicating it, receiving it, and translating it into a drawing. That is a complicating factor, because if you can't remember in detail, what is the artist supposed to do? They can't leave the eyebrows out.

Really, great memory or not, the best they can do is get the major, stand out features on paper and hope it clicks in someone's mind.

LE said that BG's hat may have been the type with ear flaps. They probably should have drawn that with the hair edges sticking out, rather than the one they have on him, but I suspect the purpose was to make the face as clean and stark as possible. Covering the ears and hair may dull the facial features a bit, and look a bit less human.

Perhaps the witnesses saw him without the hat or the flaps up, and the hair detail is accurate. It's tough to know for sure. The hope is likely someone who recognizes that body shape and those clothes also suddenly recognizes the facial features. They then will hopefully go back in their memory, and remember where that person was that day.

 

[DarkSkink]

I believe the sketch artists have renderings of different type eyes/brows/noses etc to help. Basically point to a similar eyebrow then artists sketch.

ETA- I agree under pressure/fear etc one can be off on their description. Witness's identification of a suspect I think has been way off before.

Absolutely.

There are tons of descriptions online about the process. Each artist and jurisdiction will have different skills and procedures. Each individual case will also likely require some individualized adjustments to suit the witnesses' needs. Some will obviously be better than others. We've probably all seen some lousy sketches.

Here's a good link about one process from an articulate witness.

http://m.huffpost.com/us/entry/8150090

 

[Brubon]

The person I suspect....his family thinks he's wonderful...maybe they have to really sit down and think aloud of the actual possibility which can be very shocking especially if he truly is an SK.

Please call the tip line 844 459 5786. Your call may tip the scale in the right direction.
Thanks.

 

[minazoe]

Blimey, I can't get over how similar the area is to the Delphi Girls Thanks for posting.

KR
Reacher

they had a suspect in tis case possibly. http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/cr...ource=infinity-scroll-summary-siderail-latest

 

[BIC]

I think we have discussed the" hat" backwards and forwards. Can we move on?

You're free to scroll and roll. Thank you.


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[kstephens98]

I think we have discussed the" hat" backwards and forwards. Can we move on?

We've literally discussed EVERYTHING backwards and forwards.

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[jillybean51]

they had a suspect in tis case possibly. http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/cr...ource=infinity-scroll-summary-siderail-latest

Jeff Altmayer...... very interesting! He actually looks like what I picture BG as looking like.Also arrested for impersonating a police officer. Hope they're digging deep and compare any DNA!❤️


Always my opinion only [emoji230]

 

[ezrah]

Jeff Altmayer...... very interesting! He actually looks like what I picture BG as looking like.Also arrested for impersonating a police officer. Hope they're digging deep and compare any DNA!❤️


Always my opinion only [emoji230]

JA has been incarcerated since Jan.

 

[gregjrichards]

Please feel free to share this on your social media.

 

[BigCityAccountant]

lol... have no regrets. I was simply adding to your post. Not only is the memory an issue, so is communicating it, receiving it, and translating it into a drawing. That is a complicating factor, because if you can't remember in detail, what is the artist supposed to do? They can't leave the eyebrows out.

Really, great memory or not, the best they can do is get the major, stand out features on paper and hope it clicks in someone's mind.

LE said that BG's hat may have been the type with ear flaps. They probably should have drawn that with the hair edges sticking out, rather than the one they have on him, but I suspect the purpose was to make the face as clean and stark as possible. Covering the ears and hair may dull the facial features a bit, and look a bit less human.

Perhaps the witnesses saw him without the hat or the flaps up, and the hair detail is accurate. It's tough to know for sure. The hope is likely someone who recognizes that body shape and those clothes also suddenly recognizes the facial features. They then will hopefully go back in their memory, and remember where that person was that day.

I think they know who he is, I don't think they have enough evidence to charge him. I found someone who has a tie to the area, who was wearing that exact same hat.

I about fell off my chair when that sketch came out. :scared:

I'm waiting patiently to find out if it is the same guy.

 

[DarkSkink]

I think they know who he is, I don't think they have enough evidence to charge him. I found someone who has a tie to the area, who was wearing that exact same hat.

I about fell off my chair when that sketch came out. :scared:

I'm waiting patiently to find out if it is the same guy.

Well, the sketch does seem like it's quite detailed.

You're thinking they have someone in mind and released actual details, like the hat and face, of the person they are watching?

What's the point of releasing the sketch then? Seeking other witnesses to tie him to the location? Throwing a scare into him and hoping he does something incriminating?