IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #71

[Deleted member 278]

There is no such thing as sweat DNA. DNA is found in blood, semen, skin, saliva or hair.

I think what you are referring to when you refer to sweat DNA maybe touch DNA from skin cells.

Forensic scientists can use DNA in blood, semen, skin, saliva or hair found at a crime scene to identify a matching DNA of an individual, such as a perpetrator.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNA#Uses_in_technology

There most certainly is DNA in sweat.

 

[deedee21]

I'm in a 'wait and see' mode regarding DN. Trying to be patient.

I see the similarities in his photo to the sketch, ( though not as much to the nose. )

My biggest stumbling block, ( and it may be all my own doing, ) is that I pictured BG as calm, cold, and calculating. Very methodical, capable of meticulous planning of the murders, as well as eluding LE.

As anyone knows who remembers any of my earliest posts, I had BG marching the girls off the bridge, then spiriting them away by a vehicle to a secluded spot to torture and kill them.

I gave BG so much more credit than he deserved IF he is DN.

THAT is my stumbling block. If DN is BG, then my previous theories are wiped off the table.

DN does not seem capable of planning to that degree. Imo, he's a constant explosive powder keg, waiting for a lit match, which 'life' keeps throwing his way.

If DN is the killer, I will revise all my previous ideas. I now believe the girls DID cross the creek in absolute terror for their lives.

I believe he killed them on the spot, in an irrational rage that can never be understood by anyone except DN.

If BG is proven not to be DN, then I'm back to square one...

My deepest thoughts are for their families. Can't begin to imagine the anguish they have lived with since February 13.

I pray they're surrounded by much love and support...

There is no way DN or anyone else could take the girls away and then bring them back. The logistics would have made that impossible.

 

[JazzTune]

Interesting that Robert Ives (Carroll County's Prosecutor) opened a new case filing with the courts on 10/05. There's been a motion filed that reads: Verified Request to Prohibit Public Access to a Court Record filed


Under the Charge heading, it shows a date of 02/13/17.

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...UYzRORGN3TnpFNE1EQXhPalEzTXpJMk5qZ3lZMk09In19

​BBM


Great! Thank you for this. Good sleuthing on your part. Looks like this could turn out to be very important...

 

[deedee21]

(O/T, All eyes on deck, we've got an Amber Alert out of Richardson, Texas, 3 year old female named Sherin, asian, last seen at 3am by father in the backyard, believed to be in "grave and imminent danger" and "abducted"...

WS Link:

AMBER ALERT TX - Sherin Mathews, 3, Richardson, 7 October 2017
http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...TX-Sherin-Mathews-3-Richardson-7-October-2017 )

3am in the yard. And the father did not bring her indoors. Then waited 5 hrs to call LE. Poor kid.

 

[JazzTune]

There is no way DN or anyone else could take the girls away and then bring them back. The logistics would have made that impossible.

Yes, I do agree with you now. At the time though when I thought BG was pretty sharp, I envisioned him taking them away to a secluded area to torture in privacy.

I then pictured him outfitting himself with a police scanner to know when he ( and possibly an accomplice ) could bring the girls back without risk of detection.

I don't believe any of that now. Even if DN is not BG, I think the murders were much more straight-forward. They happened where they were found, and they happened quickly.

None of this cloak-and-dagger stuff I had in my head...

 

[deedee21]

Those citizens should have gone directly to LE, not to the media.

Maybe no one went to the media. Its a safe answer for LE to give.

 

[margarita25]

Interesting that Robert Ives (Carroll County's Prosecutor) opened a new case filing with the courts on 10/05. There's been a motion filed that reads: Verified Request to Prohibit Public Access to a Court Record filed


Under the Charge heading, it shows a date of 02/13/17.

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...UYzRORGN3TnpFNE1EQXhPalEzTXpJMk5qZ3lZMk09In19

​BBM


Great! Thank you for this. Good sleuthing on your part. Looks like this could turn out to be very important...

Woah...good find!!!

This could be it then!?!!!??!!!!!!!

 

[Peace777]

Right, but the key would be WHERE on the bodies it was found.

I hate to say it but maybe in a bite mark?

 

[margarita25]

Interesting that Robert Ives (Carroll County's Prosecutor) opened a new case filing with the courts on 10/05. There's been a motion filed that reads: Verified Request to Prohibit Public Access to a Court Record filed


Under the Charge heading, it shows a date of 02/13/17.

https://public.courts.in.gov/mycase...UYzRORGN3TnpFNE1EQXhPalEzTXpJMk5qZ3lZMk09In19

Case Summary

« BackNew SearchRefine Search

SUBPOENA DUCES TECUM

Case Number 08C01-1710-MC-000198
CourtCarroll Circuit Court
TypeMC - Miscellaneous Criminal
Filed10/05/2017
Status10/05/2017*,*Pending**(active)*


SubjectSubpoena Duces TecumState Plaintiff
State of Indiana

State of Indiana

Attorney

Robert Thomas Ives*
#485308

Attorney address*

101 W Main St.
Suite 205
Delphi, IN 46923

Attorney phone*

765-564-4514(W)


Charges

Show all charge details

0102/13/2017No Charge Applicable/M

Chronological Case Summary

10/05/2017

Case Opened as a New Filing

10/05/2017

Request for Subpoena Duces Tecum Filed

Filed By:

State of Indiana

File Stamp:

10/05/2017

10/05/2017

Motion Filed

Verified Request to Prohibit Public Access to a Court Record filed.

Filed By:

State of Indiana

File Stamp:

10/05/2017

10/05/2017

Subpoena/Summons Issued

Judicial Officer:

Diener, Benjamin A.

File Stamp:

10/05/2017

 

[suspicious]

Case Summary

« BackNew SearchRefine Search

SUBPOENA DUCES TECUM

Case Number08C01-1710-MC-000198CourtCarroll Circuit CourtTypeMC - Miscellaneous CriminalFiled10/05/2017Status10/05/2017*,*Pending**(active)*

Parties to the Case

Show all party details

SubjectSubpoena Duces TecumState PlaintiffState of Indiana

Charges

Show all charge details

0102/13/2017No Charge Applicable/M

Chronological Case Summary

10/05/2017

Case Opened as a New Filing

10/05/2017

Request for Subpoena Duces Tecum Filed

Filed By:

State of Indiana

File Stamp:

10/05/2017

10/05/2017

Motion Filed

Verified Request to Prohibit Public Access to a Court Record filed.

Filed By:

State of Indiana

File Stamp:

10/05/2017

10/05/2017

Subpoena/Summons Issued

Judicial Officer:

Diener, Benjamin A.

File Stamp:

10/05/2017

What does all of this mean?


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[margarita25]

What does all of this mean?


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

(Gitana, where you at sister?)

Actually, I think we've got a few attorneys floating around here, maybe someone will chime in.

 

[deedee21]

I agree, Boxer. You can give your attention to one POI without causing detriment to the investigation by completely ignoring other leads. So far, for me, the evidence to charge DN just isn't there. I am happy to have LE continue to investigate him, but I also hope that they continue giving attention to other leads and tips that might take them away from him as well.

Im not sure DN left DNA behind. But Im sure LE will take every piece of clothing he owns and look for transfer DNA. This will take time. DNA has to be isolated before its matched.

 

[margarita25]

I'm quite excited about Agent Apricot's find. Not sure what it means exactly, but I think it means soooomething....

Are they getting ready to file charges!?!? And are sealing everything in advance?!

 

[Steleheart]

There is no such thing as sweat DNA. DNA is found in blood, semen, skin, saliva or hair.

I think what you are referring to when you refer to sweat DNA maybe touch DNA from skin cells.

Forensic scientists can use DNA in blood, semen, skin, saliva or hair found at a crime scene to identify a matching DNA of an individual, such as a perpetrator.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DNA#Uses_in_technology

There most certainly is DNA in sweat.

Hoping to not derail the thread here but from what I can see, although sweat itself has no cells it can contain cells such as skin, blood and hairs. So it appears you are both saying the same thing"
"

• Perspiration. It is thought that sweat can increase the amount of DNA transfered for two reasons. First, as the sweat passes through the pores and makes its way to the skin surface, it can collect cells along the way and wash them to the surface. Second, it has been shown that sweat also contains both epithelial cells and cell-free nucleic acids

."
https://www.forensicmag.com/article...-literature-help-answer-some-common-questions

A lot of info can be obtained from the Forensicmag site with regard to touch DNA. Excellent for personal research:lookingitup: :biggrin:

 

[JazzTune]

I'm quite excited about Agent Apricot's find. Not sure what it means exactly, but I think it means soooomething....

Are they getting ready to file charges!?!? And are sealing everything in advance?!

That's exactly what I think. Looks like they are getting ready to file charges, based on the 02/13/17 heading. Then they are filing to seal everything in advance.

Not an attorney, so I may be wrong. But that's what it appears to be...

 

[deedee21]

That's exactly what I think. Looks like they are getting ready to file charges, based on the 02/13/17 heading. Then they are filing to seal everything in advance.

Not an attorney, so I may be wrong. But that's what it appears to be...

I googled it. Someone is court ordered to produce documents and any tangible evidence that can be used in a case. Tangible evidence by definition is something you can touch or feel.
I wonder how many subpoenas went out?
This case is going to take time folks.

 

[Jennifer17]

That's exactly what I think. Looks like they are getting ready to file charges, based on the 02/13/17 heading. Then they are filing to seal everything in advance.

Not an attorney, so I may be wrong. But that's what it appears to be...

I am almost too scared to hope. I am frightened of the disappointment if if goes nowhere.

 

[her]

It doesn't look like they are getting ready to file charges.
It looks like they were filing a court order to obtain something.
What, we won't know they sealed it.

 

[otto]

Delphi police say they have enough evidence to convict. So either they include him or exclude him. This case is further along than when they were serving a SW on RL.

http://www.wlfi.com/story/36134334/...dence-six-months-after-delphi-double-homicide

Do you think the hatchet has anything to do with his arrest in the murdered girls investigation? How and why did investigators zero onto him after he was arrested with a hatchet at the park and something about young children nearby?

It can't be his mug shot. His mug shot doesn't look anything like the hulking capped stocky figure photographed on the bridge. The mug shot doesn't look like the figure on the bridge - or was he wearing layers of clothing? What does his wife say about this?

Would he have known the area, or did he scope it out a day before he attacked the girls?
Is the footage that has been cut from the phone video of this suspect exposing himself?

What's his alibi for the day of the murders, and they day before?

 

[otto]

Did his wife log into Facebook and say something about how she thought his voice sounded like the recording?

If so, what are her circumstances that prevented her from trusting herself and reporting this sooner?

It's been linked, right - her social media outburst?

The suspect has gotten away with a lot of violent type of activities. Who is enabling him? His wife? His family? His friends? His family's friends? Authorities?