IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #74

[Boxer]

I dont think any LE would let go of this lead. MOO.

DN has all the edge pieces -- Crime history, boldness, sex crimes which have escalating from exposure to peeping, domestic violence, proximity to the crime, good match to police sketch, no alibi, his employer stated that it could be his voice.These are the public pieces. IMOO, I would conclude that nothing in the private information the police have has concretely excluded him (attendance of the KN US).

Regarding the opinion that DNs behaviors are within a certain predictable range and that his DV and sex offenses don't add up to indicate a capacity to jump to killing. IMHO they do, the direction of his behavior shows escalation from exposure to peeping -- I am linking an article about that specific jump.

• https://www.dallasnews.com/news/irvi...ing-conference​
  
  
  

 

[Shiressleuth]

Something from the KN youtube interview has been nagging at me. She is referencing a couple points of origin and uses the phrases "from day one" and "from the beginning" .

14:54 mark
Interviewer: What about the sketch? Do you think the sketch looks like Daniel?
KN: Sorry?
Interviewer: The sketch. The police sketch in Delphi. Do you think that sketch looks like Daniel?
KN: I think that looks a lot like Daniel.
Interviewer: You do
KN: I've said that from day one.
(KN goes on to elaborate on similarities)

So her point of reference as "day one" would appear to be the day the sketch was released. July 17, 2017. And if she's been saying that from day one, who was she saying it to? Is there a person or people out there that as soon as the sketch came out she told them 'hey, that sketch looks a lot like my husband'?

43:27 mark
Interviewer: I have put myself onto this case since the beginning. Because this is right up the road from us. Literally. We went to Delphi yesterday. It's just up the road, and for something like that to happen in a small community of 3,000 is unheard of. It was mind blowing that that could even happen there. So we have put ourselves into this and kind of looked at it from every angle there is and like I said I know that him being your husband that this could be a little touchy in some areas, so you know I'm not trying to make it that a way.
KN: Oh no. Um, I look at it this way, um just to comment on the fact that he is, he is my husband. Any bond that was there has been destroyed, to be honest with you. Um, he's, he's not who I thought he was. He's a different person. And I've been saying that from the beginning. He's not the person I married.
(Interviewer goes on to say he can believe that, he wondered where KN was mentally, he finds her bright)

Interviewer is talking about the Delphi murders and his interest as being "since the beginning". So his point of reference for "the beginning" is when the murders occurred. But what is KN's reference point for "the beginning"? DN's not who she thought he was, he's a different person and she's been saying that from the beginning. From the beginning of what? Since the topic at that point is the murders, is she on the same page as the interviewer is and she is also referencing the Delphi crime itself as being "the beginning" ? Or is she referring to when LE first started talking to her as the beginning? She says any bond that was there has been destroyed, and she says it like it was a specific event that became the final straw that broke the camel's back. Is she referring to Delphi? Or an event in CO? I hope this makes sense. I guess we can't know for sure what she's referencing but I am curious how others interpret it. It's a small comment but it has bugged me.

ETA: here's the source link but I broke it so it won't plaster a preview. Have to take the space out of the "s" and "://" https ://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=155&v=ZnyYRMbdGDs

Her beginning may be when she got back with him (Greenwood motel ) or when they left for Co with a 12 day old or when the sketch came out (18 July) or when he choked her or when he was arrested, or even indeed when the murders happened. Would someone living in Martinsville (l presume) be following a murder in Delphi when there are probably more murders nearer to Indianapolis that would be more relevant? I think it more likely her beginning is the birth of the baby and leaving for Co - but JMO.

 

[Boxer]

Something from the KN youtube interview has been nagging at me. She is referencing a couple points of origin and uses the phrases "from day one" and "from the beginning" .

14:54 mark
Interviewer: What about the sketch? Do you think the sketch looks like Daniel?
KN: Sorry?
Interviewer: The sketch. The police sketch in Delphi. Do you think that sketch looks like Daniel?
KN: I think that looks a lot like Daniel.
Interviewer: You do
KN: I've said that from day one.
(KN goes on to elaborate on similarities)

So her point of reference as "day one" would appear to be the day the sketch was released. July 17, 2017. And if she's been saying that from day one, who was she saying it to? Is there a person or people out there that as soon as the sketch came out she told them 'hey, that sketch looks a lot like my husband'?

43:27 mark
Interviewer: I have put myself onto this case since the beginning. Because this is right up the road from us. Literally. We went to Delphi yesterday. It's just up the road, and for something like that to happen in a small community of 3,000 is unheard of. It was mind blowing that that could even happen there. So we have put ourselves into this and kind of looked at it from every angle there is and like I said I know that him being your husband that this could be a little touchy in some areas, so you know I'm not trying to make it that a way.
KN: Oh no. Um, I look at it this way, um just to comment on the fact that he is, he is my husband. Any bond that was there has been destroyed, to be honest with you. Um, he's, he's not who I thought he was. He's a different person. And I've been saying that from the beginning. He's not the person I married.
(Interviewer goes on to say he can believe that, he wondered where KN was mentally, he finds her bright)

Interviewer is talking about the Delphi murders and his interest as being "since the beginning". So his point of reference for "the beginning" is when the murders occurred. But what is KN's reference point for "the beginning"? DN's not who she thought he was, he's a different person and she's been saying that from the beginning. From the beginning of what? Since the topic at that point is the murders, is she on the same page as the interviewer is and she is also referencing the Delphi crime itself as being "the beginning" ? Or is she referring to when LE first started talking to her as the beginning? She says any bond that was there has been destroyed, and she says it like it was a specific event that became the final straw that broke the camel's back. Is she referring to Delphi? Or an event in CO? I hope this makes sense. I guess we can't know for sure what she's referencing but I am curious how others interpret it. It's a small comment but it has bugged me.

ETA: here's the source link but I broke it so it won't plaster a preview. Have to take the space out of the "s" and "://" https ://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=155&v=ZnyYRMbdGDs

Good Point -- I think she had limited news exposure after leaving the motel on May 12. By July 18 sketch date she was in CO -- with DN never leaving her for more than 15 minutes, with her cell, the keys and all the money. So day one I would believe for her is Woodland Park arrest day.

 

[Area52]

Still crickets as far as MSM, Twitter. Which is very odd. If the judge did something like issued a gag order doesn't the media usually report at least that much? I'm stumped. Unless not much came of it to report.

RE: the docket. Once a court appearance has occurred, they remove it from the docket. (Yesterday's hearing has been removed.) I do see something new added. He already had 3 hearings in El Paso Co for 11/29 at 11:00 a.m. Now they've added a Teller Co Plea Hearing for the case # that had a Preliminary Hearing yesterday. Set for same date & time as El Paso hearings. The Location says Teller Co but the Division says it's the same room as the El Paso Co hearings. Not sure if that's an error or they're lumping both counties together in the same courtroom? (I didn't think they handled cases from different counties together. MOO)

Good point, Kizzy. Evidently something occurred in court yesterday in order for the progression of that case number to go from Preliminary Hearing to Plea Hearing on 11/29. But why so hush-hush. The press in both states have been all over his every court appearance since September. Now nothing??? Doesn't sound right to me, unless for some reason, it was decided behind closed doors. But why????

 

[cathdawg]

I was just thinking that perhaps all the reporters were caught up in the mass shooting in TX. I believe the suspect was originally from CO.

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

I dont think any LE would let go of this lead. MOO.

DN has all the edge pieces -- Crime history, boldness, sex crimes which have escalating from exposure to peeping, domestic violence, proximity to the crime, good match to police sketch, no alibi, his employer stated that it could be his voice.These are the public pieces. IMOO, I would conclude that nothing in the private information the police have has concretely excluded him (attendance of the KN US).

Regarding the opinion that DNs behaviors are within a certain predictable range and that his DV and sex offenses don't add up to indicate a capacity to jump to killing. IMHO they do, the direction of his behavior shows escalation from exposure to peeping -- I am linking an article about that specific jump.

• https://www.dallasnews.com/news/irvi...ing-conference​

Hi, Boxer!

One thing you left off your list for escalating behavior is the rage. Allegedly keying a vehicle, chopping trees/chairs with a hatchet, killing the pigs, and all the things former employer(s) and landlord(s) have said in interviews about his temper and how he acts out, IMO, add another dimension of escalation.

JMO...

What really bothers me is his location on February 13. We can’t place him in Delphi. We can’t place him anywhere. No alibi. At this point he could make a statement saying he was abducted by aliens and apparently no one could come forward to say ‘no he wasn’t, D was with me that afternoon’.

Until I hear about a solid alibi, DN is still in play, but I won’t overlook other possible BG POIs either. It’s possible he did it. It’s possible he didn’t do it.

Still enjoying my view here :fence:

 

[Boxer]

Good catch. I took it to mean something happened in Colorado between the two of them. Maybe more violence towards her or the kids? She didn’t say but it leaves one wondering what her “beginning” or when their bond was destroyed would be.

i give her the benefit of the doubt as she is a victim. But the whole ultrasound story just doesn’t ring true. Unless.....if there is drug use by both of them, they may not recall clearly from one day to the next.

During her interview, I found it interesting that while in Colorado she didn’t know the time of day or one day from the next because DN was in complete control of her phone, car, etc.

I agree its very possible when the bond was destroyed is Day One -- but I think she didnt have access to news at that point. I dont know what day she first saw the sketch is.
MOO. She may be hedging on the US because, so far, he always get out.

I thought it interesting that MP had announced a new push in August to paper truck stops, rest stops, and public campgrounds with the sketch -- apparently redoubling an emphasis on truckers, transients or the camping homeless was being started.

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

Her beginning may be when she got back with him (Greenwood motel ) or when they left for Co with a 12 day old or when the sketch came out (18 July) or when he choked her or when he was arrested, or even indeed when the murders happened. Would someone living in Martinsville (l presume) be following a murder in Delphi when there are probably more murders nearer to Indianapolis that would be more relevant? I think it more likely her beginning is the birth of the baby and leaving for Co - but JMO.

RBBM
JMO...

I didn’t get the impression he/she/they were following the coverage of Abby and Libby’s murders. I read it as they saw it on the news and commented on it to each other.

Also, if I’m not mistaken, you and I are both considerably further from Delphi than anyone in Martinsville and we’re following this case. Just saying....
:innocent::daisy:

 

[Rossymom]

I just wanted to share this as an example of how we need to keep an open mind on possible BG’s. I snapped this picture on my walk in Lebanon today. Our Pizza Hut is getting a new building. I noticed the blue coats hanging over the top. I have seen others suggest that there are Amish in the area of Delphi. Their coats have snaps (like BG) because they often do not use zippers. Just my own simple opinion. Let’s help LE solve this, Friends!

 

[Deleted member 172065]

Good Point -- I think she had limited news exposure after leaving the motel on May 12. By July 18 sketch date she was in CO -- with DN never leaving her for more than 15 minutes, with her cell, the keys and all the money. So day one I would believe for her is Woodland Park arrest day.

I'm leaning along these lines. When DN chased the person/vehicle with a hatchet and the police arrested him and interrogated her, that was probably the beginning of the end. She's been saying this all along to the authorities and media is how I took it.

 

[Boxer]

I just wanted to share this as an example of how we need to keep an open mind on possible BG’s. I snapped this picture on my walk in Lebanon today. Our Pizza Hut is getting a new building. I noticed the blue coats hanging over the top. I have seen others suggest that there are Amish in the area of Delphi. Their coats have snaps (like BG) because they often do not use zippers. Just my own simple opinion. Let’s help LE solve this, Friends!

Wow. Would explain the LE pay attention to the clothes comments.
My first search result for amish windreaker with snaps is

:

https://www.pinterest.com/pin/196821446196553478/

 

[mtnlites]

RBBM


Also, if I’m not mistaken, you and I are both considerably further from Delphi than anyone in Martinsville and we’re following this case. Just saying....
:innocent::daisy:

Good point. Distance has very little to do with interest, IMO. It has a lot to do with media coverage, the horrific nature of the crime, whether you know someone from that area, etc.

 

[Scarlett12]

Her beginning may be when she got back with him (Greenwood motel ) or when they left for Co with a 12 day old or when the sketch came out (18 July) or when he choked her or when he was arrested, or even indeed when the murders happened. Would someone living in Martinsville (l presume) be following a murder in Delphi when there are probably more murders nearer to Indianapolis that would be more relevant? I think it more likely her beginning is the birth of the baby and leaving for Co - but JMO.

No, Abby and Libby was and still is Big News. Honestly, there was nothing to trump the coverage..as much as there was Nationally, locally there was sooooo much more.


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[kc1023]

MOO - All this KN talk and what did she know and when etc and how she seems detached from the info or whatever - IMO - I've started wondering the last week or so if perhaps he had asked her back in Feb to say he was with her that fateful day. Not to say I think he told her did it or anything, but maybe she has been prepared to fudge about Feb 13th for quite some time based on some story he gave her. She does mention he lies a lot. Perhaps she only put two and two together when he was arrested in CO and that is why she is "unsure" of whether or not he was with her - she doesn't want to outright lie for him at this point. Again MOO.

Also, I believe Martinsville gets Indianapolis news stations for their main broadcast news locally so they probably watched just as much as those of us up here in Indy in the early days and weeks. Plus there were a lot of news stations posting FB videos about the case back then as well.

 

[Jethro4WS]

No, Abby and Libby was and still is Big News. Honestly, there was nothing to trump the coverage..as much as there was Nationally, locally there was sooooo much more.


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Yes. Every channel out of Indianapolis not only had multiple reporters in Delphi for a few days they even had their lead anchors anchoring the newscasts from Delphi. That even started with the Noon newscasts that were in progress at the time the girls were found. There was considerable coverage. You couldn't miss it if you tried.

 

[LadyL]

um, yeah ... I'm in Canada and following

RBBM
JMO...

I didn’t get the impression he/she/they were following the coverage of Abby and Libby’s murders. I read it as they saw it on the news and commented on it to each other.

Also, if I’m not mistaken, you and I are both considerably further from Delphi than anyone in Martinsville and we’re following this case. Just saying....
:innocent::daisy:

 

[Boxer]

KN said she followed Stroup, said she learned more from his youtube videos than from anywhere else-
Stoup said she friended him on Facebook, and that is how they connected.
So, at least after 2/25 she was looking into the case. I am hopeful something will shake on DNs whereabouts on the afternoon of 2/13 that will either include or exclude him.
DN did have a Delphi connection - though how extensive is not known, including whether he had ever been there before.

 

[mtnlites]

DN did have a Delphi connection - though how extensive is not known.

What's the connection?

 

[WestieMom]

RBBM
JMO...

I didn’t get the impression he/she/they were following the coverage of Abby and Libby’s murders. I read it as they saw it on the news and commented on it to each other.

Also, if I’m not mistaken, you and I are both considerably further from Delphi than anyone in Martinsville and we’re following this case. Just saying....
:innocent::daisy:

I’m in Indianapolis and this case has been all over the local news, since day one. Martinsville has the same local news stations and therefore I would not find it odd that everyone in Indiana knows about this. MOO


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[hilary1617]

I'm sure that is the case. What's the consensus re DN among Delphi insiders then? Yeay or Nay?

Possible.

My interest in this case stems from days of yore when I walked there while a Purdue student. I had roommates who grew up in Monticello and had friends living in Delphi (and Flora). I grew up in Massachusetts and live elsewhere, but I certainly found my way there from West Lafayette.

If I found myself on the trail, certainly it isn't *that* hidden - it is not a state secret. It just took having friends nearby, free time, preference for back roads, and a desire to explore / hike / canoe local trails and creeks. I have no reason to believe that DN couldn't have found it, no reason to believe he did.