IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #76

[mi_hiker]

If he intended to kill them, he could’ve done it then and there, near or on the bridge. Instead, he herded them (apparently) across the (shallow part of the) river. Where was he taking them? Did he intend to rape one or both of them out in the woods? I suppose it’s possible, but the conditions (I would assume) were less than ideal. Did he park a vehicle at the cemetery? Is this the direction in which he was headed with them? Did he plan to remove them to a more secure location where he could exercise more control over them? The fact that he (apparently) crossed the river with them suggests that he had a definite plan in mind. Otherwise, it seems illogical to take that route. That he “cornered” them at the end of the bridge, leaving them with no clear path to escape, also seems well-planned. Hard to believe it just happened without some forethought.

Expanding on this. What if instead the girls fled in that direction. They knew the area, may have known the lower water level (although still quite high in some areas that day), and thought they could loose him or get to safety. I can’t quite reconcile how “down the hill” would fit in here and obviously it needs to for a theory to stand.

They were nervous/alert enough to start filming, the next natural reaction when he keeps coming is to run. That is unless a weapon or other threat occurs before you can run.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Jax49]

IIRC at the big press conference on 2/22 LE initially said it was 4 words. I don't remember if he quickly corrected himself or if it was just thereafter reported as 3 words. For what it's worth I have always heard "Get down the hill", or more "G'down the hill".

IIRC, he very quickly corrected himself to three. It was odd; seemed they might have planned to share four words, then changed their minds? moo

 

[her]

I know. It seems more obvious to me since I have filtered so many versions which would be pointless to share as there is an eye-witness sketch. LE and NASA as was mentioned on Dr. Phil would have much better capacity. The thing that stands out is the calmness of his face in the sketch and the nasty grimace and bared teeth I seem to catch in the caps. Just my impression. Chilling.

It seems possible there is somebody who has seen both sides of him?

Can you point out where you see what you see. I’m curious just that I see a blob atm.

 

[Jax49]

Can someone please point me to the link to the Dr. Phil show?

TIA

Did you find a link? If so I'd appreciate it also.

If not, there are some clips from the show at this link:

https://www.drphil.com/shows/the-indiana-train-track-murders-the-search-for-a-killer/

There was a pirated copy on youtube but it is gone.

 

[GMF3]

http://www.kktv.com/content/news/El...ea-deal-in-Daniel-Nations-case-464469823.html

Guys - I know this article was mentioned a few pages back. However, there wasn't much discussion about it. And I think it's pretty big news, here's the article:

**********************

COLORADO SPRINGS, Colo. (The Gazette) - Prosecutors said Friday they are mulling a plea deal for a man linked to a threat of violence on Mt. Herman near Monument - but offered no sign they can prove he committed additional, more serious crimes.

During a brief appearance by Daniel J. Nations in 4th Judicial District Court, prosecutor Pam Ratigan told a judge that she had offered a plea bargain to the defendant. The defense extended a counteroffer, which Ratigan said she hadn't been able to evaluate because she had been in trial on a different case.

Nations, 32, had been scheduled to enter a plea on charges of trespassing and menacing. Instead, his arraignment was postponed to Jan. 3 to accommodate further talks, Ratigan confirmed

****************

So, what does this tell us? I would doubt that he'd take a plea for murder, especially of A/L. That said, I'm not even sure they would offer a deal for murder, in either case. And it does say they plea deal is for the lesser chargers. And let's be real, at this point, no murder charges have even been filed.

I hate to be negative, but is this telling us that he's no longer of interest to Indiana?

I'm a little worried now. I liked knowing there was someone in custody that was of interest. This may tell us that they have nobody and don't know much more. We could be right back at square one.

He's basically decided to stay in jail until 01/03 and will take a plea deal at that time.

Cheers!

 

[FindHG]

Can you point out where you see what you see. I’m curious just that I see a blob atm.

Below are some of the filtered screen caps I still have that gave those impressions. You may just see blobs still.
But since the sketch exists as does a face to face eye witness who described him, if not more, the below is moot.

It's the point that he may be a very controlled person to go from his expression, as well as can be filtered from the bridge moment, to the calm poker face the witness who gave the description saw.


https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TdXdzZ3g1amE1a0k

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TZkVOVVpGUmFkYTg

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TODNsaDdjYzNBY28

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TZWZFci1OTUpyQUU

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TWkhUeG9IZV9EbDg

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

This is some of the filtered ones I still have that gave those impressions. You may just see blobs still.
But since the sketch exists as does an face to face eye witness who described him, if not more, the below is moot.

It's the point that he may be a very controlled person to go from his expression, as well as can be filtered from the bridge moment, to the calm poker face the witness who gave the description saw.


https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TdXdzZ3g1amE1a0k

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TZkVOVVpGUmFkYTg

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TODNsaDdjYzNBY28

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TZWZFci1OTUpyQUU

https://drive.google.com/open?id=0B5THWxMrS67TWkhUeG9IZV9EbDg

Hi FindHG,

These links were helpful! Having the original (or close to original) cropped image enabled me to make out which of BG’s features you were manipulating. I’m still not completely following your purpose, but at least I’m making out more of what the original image area was. May I ask what software you worked in and what type of filters you used?

 

[FindHG]

Hi FindHG,

These links were helpful! Having the original (or close to original) cropped image enabled me to make out which of BG’s features you were manipulating. I’m still not completely following your purpose, but at least I’m making out more of what the original image area was. May I ask what software you worked in and what type of filters you used?

bbm

Hello,
I'm pretty sure it was a cromebook at the time, and you see, contrast, brightness, the basic features to filter on most of them at the bottom of the caps, not manipulated or changed, just light and contrast added or taken away. No grand purpose. He can sneer (from what I saw in the caps) and he can have a poker face as shown in the sketch. The caps are where I see the sneer, the teeth, the contours of the lips, nose and mouth. He can go from one to the other on demand and murder in between, it seems.


Great that NASA and the FBI worked on the case, wouldn't you say? I think the sketch is very accurate.

 

[Nancy1954]

I don't believe that DN is bridge guy either, and never have. I can't see the resemblance . My opinion only though.

 

[Jo in Calif]

Dang, wish I could. Maybe someone else remembers.

In the meantime I'll see if I can find the video...

Is this the video you were looking for? Not the top one but the bottom one.

http://fox59.com/2017/08/14/lead-de...ave-more-audio-from-teens-phone-dna-evidence/

 

[Jennifer17]

If he intended to kill them, he could’ve done it then and there, near or on the bridge. Instead, he herded them (apparently) across the (shallow part of the) river. Where was he taking them? Did he intend to rape one or both of them out in the woods? I suppose it’s possible, but the conditions (I would assume) were less than ideal. Did he park a vehicle at the cemetery? Is this the direction in which he was headed with them? Did he plan to remove them to a more secure location where he could exercise more control over them? The fact that he (apparently) crossed the river with them suggests that he had a definite plan in mind. Otherwise, it seems illogical to take that route. That he “cornered” them at the end of the bridge, leaving them with no clear path to escape, also seems well-planned. Hard to believe it just happened without some forethought. I have to believe that he knew the area, that (perhaps) he had staked it out in advance, and that he’d probably done something like it before. This was not an impulsive act, IMO. The killer is brutal, calculating, and cold-hearted.

I think that he did sexually assault one or both of those girls. I don't think that he thought it all out, beforehand. He just came across an opportunity to do that and took it. I don't think that he planned it, but was prowling around looking for that opportunity.

 

[MistyWaters]

I haven't found the video but 2Hope4 did a great job updating us as the show was aired. He/she posted this:

"Police believe sketch is a face to face encounter with a person from Delphi. Thinks others saw him. Police thinks people know who he is. Untucked shirt, gait, hands in pocket."

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Delphi-13-Feb-2017-76&p=13812501#post13812501

If anyone finds video with the comment, I'd like to hear it again. TIA

Yes that was said as the large photo was displayed. It was asked that people look at him, did they recognize someone in the way the photo illustrated him that was captured as he was walking on the bridge. Nothing about a limp though.

 

[Yougottabekiddingme]

Couple of things that I took from the Dr Phil show (not sure if these were discussed here already or not):

1) Timeline has always given the impression that no one looked for these girls before 5:30. There was already a trouble flag at 3:30 - slightly more than an hour after the last known time that they were safe. I can't wrap my head around something God awful happening while folks were out there looking. Even if off in the distance...I think whatever happened was quick.

2) The sister, when flashing back to when the girls were found, saying that someone yelled up the hill "what were they wearing?" If you're looking for missing people and you find a body or bodies, you aren't asking this question. I think the searchers found clothes with them and could not easily distinguish exactly what they had stumbled upon. I got the impression that confirming the clothing was when they realized they found them.

Seeing the recent developments in the case of the Tinder date in Nebraska, I sure hope LE takes a look at that guy, if they haven't already.

 

[MistyWaters]

The sketch of BG appears older than DN.

My understanding of a Parabon snapshot is that it's unable to determine age so therefore it's estimated.

Maybe that's why Parabon keeps getting mentioned over and over again?

If we disbelieve absolutely everything LE has said, then I suppose we can make any theory fit. But what's the point of that?

 

[kkdj]

Because of the timeline, I'm still thinking the killer either hid them really really well or he took them somewhere. I do not think that he could have corralled them, murdered them, hid them, cleaned up and left in that short period of time. Besides, what would be the point? I also think the girls were more than likely SA and that was more than likely the killers motive.
Another thought is that he was in the midst of SA, heard people yelling for the girls and simply murdered them to get outa there before getting caught. But because they weren't found on the 13th I doubt this. It sounds like they were hidden in some fashion and that would take time and thought.

 

[Yougottabekiddingme]

Because of the timeline, I'm still thinking the killer either hid them really really well or he took them somewhere. I do not think that he could have corralled them, murdered them, hid them, cleaned up and left in that short period of time. Besides, what would be the point? I also think the girls were more than likely SA and that was more than likely the killers motive.
Another thought is that he was in the midst of SA, heard people yelling for the girls and simply murdered them to get outa there before getting caught. But because they weren't found on the 13th I doubt this. It sounds like they were hidden in some fashion and that would take time and thought.

By the time police were on scene, it was already dark and no one thought they were there or suspected foul play. Their searches were confined to accessible areas. I doubt they searched any woods a half mile away before the next day.

 

[kkdj]

By the time police were on scene, it was already dark and no one thought they were there or suspected foul play. Their searches were confined to accessible areas. I doubt they searched any woods a half mile away before the next day.

I'll bet the families did. I'll bet the families scoured the area. If my child were missing in a wooded park into the cold night I would look everywhere for them as long as it took. Even if I didn't suspect foul play, I would certainly think something was wrong and they needed me to find them. I'm not expressing anything bad about the families if for some reason they couldn't/didn't, but I would bet my last dollar they tried to find them that night with everything they had!

 

[Yougottabekiddingme]

I'll bet the families did. I'll bet the families scoured the area. If my child were missing in a wooded park into the cold night I would look everywhere for them as long as it took. Even if I didn't suspect foul play, I would certainly think something was wrong and they needed me to find them. I'm not expressing anything bad about the families if for some reason they couldn't/didn't, but I would bet my last dollar they tried to find them that night with everything they had!

I totally agree. It's hard to imagine what they thought at that point. Small town, no one could have imagined this outcome. I bet when the decision was made to shut down the search for the night, MOST people were convinced that they weren't there.

I can't see them getting to that location at night though...

 

[MistyWaters]

By the time police were on scene, it was already dark and no one thought they were there or suspected foul play. Their searches were confined to accessible areas. I doubt they searched any woods a half mile away before the next day.

This was talked about on Dr Phil as well. Amy's mom though the girls might've fallen somewhere along the trails and dropped their cellphones. Others were searching throughout the town. People were most certainly not searching for dead bodies that same evening.

Question - does anyone recall, did Amy's mom actually say " cellphones" or was I hearing things????

 

[Yougottabekiddingme]

This was talked about on Dr Phil as well. Amy's mom though the girls might've fallen somewhere along the trails and dropped their cellphones. Others were searching throughout the town. People were most certainly not searching for dead bodies that same evening.

Question - does anyone recall, did Amy's mom actually say " cellphones" or was I hearing things????

It was Libby's grandmother....and she never said cellphones....

https://www.drphil.com/videos/murde...arch-efforts-the-day-their-teens-disappeared/