IN - Abigail Williams, 13, & Liberty German, 14, Delphi, 13 Feb 2017 #83

[gregjrichards]

Then he waits a few days for things to calm down, and goes and gets it. Where the crime took place is secluded and on private
land, no one would be disturbing it there.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

It seems hell of a risky to leave a bag of evidence behind and go back and get it a few days later. Would he not be concerned about it being found in the meantime? It would be very brazen to go back not long after it happened but he attacked and murdered two young teens in the daytime so he is clearly capable of anything. I do wonder if he has been back since to relive that day I would love to read research on this and how common it is.

That’s one aspect to think about. It seems so much evidence was left behind, but not enough. If there was ever a duffle bag, and this brazen creep (seems there’s a new noun to refer to BG tonight) went back to get it, that would be brazen on top of brazen. I don’t doubt the possibility though.

I don't think lack of evidence is the problem. They have dna, they have his voice, they have images and video and no doubt other evidence too. I think the problem is he has never been arrested for a crime before or if he has dna wasn't taken. The problem is law enforcement are trying to find one adult male in a country that has a male population of approximately 162 million males.

They're fairly active. I've never been out there and not run into anyone. That's actually one of the reasons why I DON'T believe that BG knew school wasn't in session that day. On the week days, the park is much busier in the later afternoon (ie, after 3pm). It's not as busy while the kids are in school on the weekdays. I think he thought school was in session and that's why he was there at that time. (Still some people there, but not as crowded so less likely for anyone to see him.)

Thank you for sharing this information it is really helpful to get first hand local information about the area.

It is hard to believe it is March already I hope you all have a happy and safe weekend.

 

[NJcares]

That is an interesting thought... he thought he would be alone. Apparently, he wasn’t, based on some prior posts here that other kids had been there. I wonder what in the world he was doing there to begin with and what triggered the attack? I know, we all do. It does lead me to think of a different personality than just a guy on the hunt (for the moment). It’s so hard to figure out disordered thinking.

Maybe he felt ridiculed or mocked by the girls and then reacted. Maybe he has a history of a temper or violence. Maybe he pretended to have a gun to subdue them, but then physically assaulted/killed them. Iirc, they were "brutally" murdered--doesn't sound like a gunshot wound be the cause.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Try2solve]

Great pics of the bridge:
https://www.flickr.com/photos/historic-landmarks-foundation-indiana/26052375094

 

[Jabarn]

Maybe he felt ridiculed or mocked by the girls and then reacted. Maybe he has a history of a temper or violence. Maybe he pretended to have a gun to subdue them, but then physically assaulted/killed them. Iirc, they were "brutally" murdered--doesn't sound like a gunshot wound be the cause.



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

When this crime first happened, that was my gut reaction. The murders were committed because of an immediate anger reaction by something the girls did (as perceived by the BG, who may have a fragile and disordered personality- my thoughts at the time).

Then I had a dream of a wolf stalking two deer around the bend of a trail that hit me hard. Since then, I have had a difficult time not seeing this as a sexual offender tracking the girls. The recent story about the searcher finding the bodies after seeing deer has given me pause - searching for meaning I guess.

Anyway, plenty of us have been troubled by this crime, and in no way to the degree of the families. Hopefully, the effort we produce will help, in some small way, keep the case active and in the forefront.

Thanks for hanging in there.

 

[No it's not]

bbm

I remember Alexis McAdams reported that. Not sure if it is still available but we discussed it here when the video was posted. moo

Yes:

https://twitter.com/AlexisMcAdamsTV/status/887816655836938240?s=04

-Nin

 

[Jabarn]

I don't think lack of evidence is the problem. They have dna, they have his voice, they have images and video and no doubt other evidence too. I think the problem is he has never been arrested for a crime before or if he has dna wasn't taken. The problem is law enforcement are trying to find one adult male in a country that has a male population of approximately 162 million.

I snipped this from your longer post, and I agree. That information might help, if the general public knew it. It’s important for family/friends/acquaintances who might be suspicious to consider while he’s not been arrested for a crime involving DNA capture before, he might be culpable here.

 

[minazoe]

this guy who did this is as mean as a snake and has been all his life. wouldn't surprise me if he was a known bully in school.

I can t for the life of me figure out how he shows up there with his crappy coat stuffed with god knows what and has the wherewithall to corral two girls and perform this killing out in the light of day.

I just can't...thats why Im thinking he's younger than he looks in the photos.

honestly we dont know if the girls could have turned into the path to find another of satan's miserable minions waiting
at the bottom of that hill.

I really hate this case...and pray every night he is found.

MOO

 

[curiousgene]

I have some questions about Libby filming the video. Did she think BG was strange but not dangerous? Why not 911? Did daylight give them a false sense of security? If BG did see her recording him, Libby could've been on FaceTime or Facebook live-wouldn't BG hesitate? Maybe BG did enter the Southend and turn around quickly. Maybe Libby really was filming Abby and BG just entered the shot. Thoughts?

In my opinion, Libby was filming Abby and surroundings and BG just came into the shot. That's the reason we have a very blurry picture of him. BG may not have realized that his image was captured in the shot. I do not think Libby felt threatened at that point in time. When she saw BG she might have become a little alert and decided to put her phone away as he was getting closer but the phone was still in video mode and recorded the audio. if Libby had felt threatened she would have asked Abby to run or walk faster because they had almost neared the end of the bridge, they were young teenage athletic girls who could have easily outrun the middle-aged BG. BG surprised the girls by grabbing Abby and taking his gun out. The girls may have been too shocked to react.

 

[gregjrichards]

What is your opinion on why he attacked in this location? Do you think he is a railroad enthusiast? Or do you think he worked the railroad when he was younger? Why did he attack in a secluded trail in Delphi, Indiana of all places on that day?

Everyone's opinions are welcome.

 

[curiousgene]

What is your opinion on why he attacked in this location? Do you think he is a railroad enthusiast? Or do you think he worked the railroad when he was younger? Why did he attack in a secluded trail in Delphi, Indiana of all places on that day?

Everyone's opinions are welcome.

I do think he is a railroad enthusiast and does frequent such secluded old abandoned railway tracks.IMO he is very informed about the railroad tracks, old abandoned ones. Boys generally do have a fascination for trains but he could also be from a family who had been employed in the railroad for a long time, generations maybe.

 

[Boxer]

It seems hell of a risky to leave a bag of evidence behind and go back and get it a few days later. Would he not be concerned about it being found in the meantime? It would be very brazen to go back not long after it happened but he attacked and murdered two young teens in the daytime so he is clearly capable of anything. I do wonder if he has been back since to relive that day I would love to read research on this and how common it is.



I don't think lack of evidence is the problem. They have dna, they have his voice, they have images and video and no doubt other evidence too. I think the problem is he has never been arrested for a crime before or if he has dna wasn't taken. The problem is law enforcement are trying to find one adult male in a country that has a male population of approximately 162 million males.



Thank you for sharing this information it is really helpful to get first hand local information about the area.

It is hard to believe it is March already I hope you all have a happy and safe weekend.

I did some looking at the 5 counties bordering Delphi and Delpi.

After looking at populations stats came up with 66,000 men in the 30-60 age range. Then start taking away men at work that day, blonde hair, taller shorter etc. I am sure the number quickly drops to a quarter of that number.
I hope they are being systematice about checking them all out.

 

[mtnlites]

Driving down my road today, I passed 5 men on ATV's. Every single one of them looked like BG. Two were even wearing similar blue jackets. (When I got closer I could see that one that I thought was blue was actually black.)

Seriously, it's like he's everywhere.

 

[coffeeandacig]

this guy who did this is as mean as a snake and has been all his life. wouldn't surprise me if he was a known bully in school.

I can t for the life of me figure out how he shows up there with his crappy coat stuffed with god knows what and has the wherewithall to corral two girls and perform this killing out in the light of day.

I just can't...thats why Im thinking he's younger than he looks in the photos.

honestly we dont know if the girls could have turned into the path to find another of satan's miserable minions waiting
at the bottom of that hill.

I really hate this case...and pray every night he is found.

MOO

BBM

I agree. Definitely younger than the sketch and thinner too. Venturing to guess height about 5' 9" size, 34/30 jeans. Horrible thought...but I bet he was carrying a rope around his neck. ​

:sick:

 

[hilary1617]

Listen to this video you can hear DOWN THE HILL much better and background sound more defined, no overlooping https://www.facebook.com/PatMcAfeeS...fref=gs&dti=118214458837235&hc_location=group This is an interview with Carter (LE) so is allowed per rules.

You can definitely hear a sloshy/wet leaf sound. This means they were off the bridge at this point. Did the recording sequence go like this? 1. Girl talk on the bridge-> 2.Initial contact with BG on bridge -> 3.Down the hill, off the bridge 4......

That's the sequence that makes the most sense to me in terms of logistics, although I can't rule out (2) that not being initial contact - their paths could have crossed previously that afternoon without serious incident.

I also noted that Superintendent Carter said "they were brutally murdered" in that particular clip. IMO the term "brutally" implies some violent physical contact. That possible indication of physicality and the lack of reporting in MSM of anyone hearing sounds of guns being fired lead me to believe that the cause of death was probably not attributed to a bullet. I do think it likely, however, that a gun was used to threaten / coerce the girls.

 

[Imvp2]

How can we be certain this duffle bag LE was asking about was BG’s & not Libby or Abby’s? Didn’t Abby stay overnight at Libby’s on Feb 12th? IF the duffle bag was Abby’s, that could also mean (IF there was no SA) that the UG’s found could have been from Abby’s overnight bag, IF she in fact had one with her at the trail that day? MOO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

My thought as well. If Abby thought she was going home after the pictures and hike, she may have had her overnight bag, LE refers to as duffel bag, with her. I wonder if BG may have taken it away with him? MO

 

[RIP Meagan + Johnny]

My thought as well. If Abby thought she was going home after the pictures and hike, she may have had her overnight bag, LE refers to as duffel bag, with her. I wonder if BG may have taken it away with him? MO

Hi Imvp2,
JMO but the impression I got from LE from the beginning was the duffle bag was BG’s, not either of the girls’. IIRC, it was in the clip of LE asking about anyone seeing anything out of the ordinary, a hitchhiker, someone who changed their appearance, someone with unusual interest or disinterest in the case, missed work or an appointment that day, etc.
JMO.

Edit: the clip I referred to was from one of the first press conferences. The link is in the media thread.

 

[sleuther0192837465]

Hi Imvp2,
JMO but the impression I got from LE from the beginning was the duffle bag was BG’s, not either of the girls’. IIRC, it was in the clip of LE asking about anyone seeing anything out of the ordinary, a hitchhiker, someone who changed their appearance, someone with unusual interest or disinterest in the case, missed work or an appointment that day, etc.
JMO.

Edit: the clip I referred to was from one of the first press conferences. The link is in the media thread.

LE has not stated whether or not the duffel bag was BG’s, correct? Unless someone has a link that could clarify this? (I’ve watched the press conferences.) So we have no way to know 100% either way. It’s still a possibility. MOO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[sleuther0192837465]

My thought as well. If Abby thought she was going home after the pictures and hike, she may have had her overnight bag, LE refers to as duffel bag, with her. I wonder if BG may have taken it away with him? MO

Yes, exactly! MOO


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Shiressleuth]

Then he waits a few days for things to calm down, and goes and gets it. Where the crime took place is secluded and on private
land, no one would be disturbing it there.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

This could explain the search of RL's property. I can't see LE missing a duffle bag left at the CS however but it is interesting that they were looking for one. Perhaps they found it as they haven't asked about it since. I also noticed in Holman's interview that more than one property near the trail was empty at the time and they had to go back more than once to speak to the owners, so it is possible BG may have stashed his duffle and been hiding out at one of those properties before the murders.
:cow:

 

[Shiressleuth]

I have some questions about Libby filming the video. Did she think BG was strange but not dangerous? Why not 911? Did daylight give them a false sense of security? If BG did see her recording him, Libby could've been on FaceTime or Facebook live-wouldn't BG hesitate? Maybe BG did enter the Southend and turn around quickly. Maybe Libby really was filming Abby and BG just entered the shot. Thoughts?

Holman explained that there was conversation between the girls of a stranger following them so I don't believe he came from the south end. I believe Libby was videoing Abby and caught him in the video intentionally and may even have been hurrying Abby off the bridge at the time. I think he then got out a gun and directed them DTH.
:cow: