IN - Grandfather charged in cruise ship death of toddler Chloe Wiegand #6

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Could he been holding Chloe by her bathers out the window with his left hand/arm only?

It bothers me I can see SA’s right elbow leaning back on the railing while his body was leaning out.
Like a flying game?
SA could have been holding her bathing suit straps in the back while she was in a flying position and lost his grip on them.
 
Puerto Rico is just getting better and better. Two earthquakes, intermittent power. I bet that the prison system doesn't have any AC.
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I agree -- I don't think he wanted to kill or hurt her. He was probably happy and excited to be there, maybe a bit pepped-up (no drugs, etc.), just a bit of adrenaline. Chloe was fidgety, excited, and energetic possibly from being in the play area previously, IDK, and Grandpa just got swept up, made a horrible decision to put here up there, something may have distracted him, or she just jumped or wiggled out of his hands and those couple of seconds were lethal.
I do see it as negligence on his part, using poor judgement, and certainly something that he could have easily avoided.

As another poster once stated... I don’t think this was his first ‘dangle’.

His movements looked too confident. I’d be willing to bet he had done this a bunch of times with Chloe in the past (over parking lot railings, hotel balconies, etc.). Unfortunately, this time it resulted in a fatality.
 
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Nothing about this families’ actions lead me to believe they will give up suing RCCL. They are opportunists who won’t easily relinquish the chance to profit even in tragedy. IMO the only reason they’d drop their suit would be because the video was leaked and they know it is destined to lose.

Sadly, I agree. The family has planted a stake in the ground, and IMO they are not gonna back off. I can see at least one of their reasons for suing -- they were hurting unbelievably over the loss of their beautiful, innocent, and trusting little toddler, and she died in a most awful and unnecessary way -- there's blame here somewhere, right? Yes, Chloe didn't just jump out the window all by herself. Blame something, and they did. No way they can back away now -- it would be a silent admission of a rush to judgement about who/what is to blame. JMO
 
Speaking of the earliest news reports being the most accurate, here’s an interesting early report from a PR news channel....

Ocupan los vídeos del crucero donde falleció bebé en San Juan

It says that “In an initial interview the girl’s FATHER said that the accident happened near the pools when the GRANDFATHER took the girl out of the window and she slipped from his hands, falling to the pavement”.

Was this really AW’a first statement to investigators? If so, it seems KW is the driving force behind this lawsuit against RCCL and AW is just along for the ride.

Article was written July 8 (one day after Chloe’s death)
 
Sadly, I agree. The family has planted a stake in the ground, and IMO they are not gonna back off. I can see at least one of their reasons for suing -- they were hurting unbelievably over the loss of their beautiful, innocent, and trusting little toddler, and she died in a most awful and unnecessary way -- there's blame here somewhere, right? Yes, Chloe didn't just jump out the window all by herself. Blame something, and they did. No way they can back away now -- it would be a silent admission of a rush to judgement about who/what is to blame. JMO

I agree. Also, considering their rush to hire a civil attorney and file suit so quickly, their actions seem to indicate it is more to it than just finding someone to blame. Further, their siding with SA before the completion of PR’s LE investigation is quite strange especially considering the parent’s professions. As a LEO and attorney in performance of their jobs (in cases they investigated and prosecuted), I am sure neither just relied on the statements of the person involved in an incident. JMO
 
I agree. Also, considering their rush to hire a civil attorney and file suit so quickly, their actions seem to indicate it is more to it than just finding someone to blame. Further, their siding with SA before the completion of PR’s LE investigation is quite strange especially considering the parent’s professions. As a LEO and attorney in performance of their jobs (in cases they investigated and prosecuted), I am sure neither just relied on the statements of the person involved in an incident. JMO
So strange that both parents reportedly advised Grandpa to refuse the toxicology tests. I would certainly want to know, in their place, if Sam were impaired by medication or substance. I get that they felt protective of him but surely their daughter comes first.
 
Speaking of the earliest news reports being the most accurate, here’s an interesting early report from a PR news channel....

Ocupan los vídeos del crucero donde falleció bebé en San Juan

It says that “In an initial interview the girl’s FATHER said that the accident happened near the pools when the GRANDFATHER took the girl out of the window and she slipped from his hands, falling to the pavement”.

Was this really AW’a first statement to investigators? If so, it seems KW is the driving force behind this lawsuit against RCCL and AW is just along for the ride.

Article was written July 8 (one day after Chloe’s death)

No question she’s the driving force. He didn’t say two words during most of the interviews. And it’s HER step father.
What have we heard from Wiegand’s parents? Not one single word.
 
As an added attraction, did I mention that I think someone else dressed Chloe? She had the cutest sundresses, bows, shoes, sport outfits, winter outfits. I never saw any of her parents or maternal grandparents in anything really fashionable. AW came the closest.
So there must be a sister, aunt, cousin. His family? Someone else in her life that is/was a big influence. Or big brother’s family.
There’s another player here. Chloe was someone’s favorite. Who might not have been on the cruise.
Any ideas?
 
Speaking of the earliest news reports being the most accurate, here’s an interesting early report from a PR news channel....

Ocupan los vídeos del crucero donde falleció bebé en San Juan

It says that “In an initial interview the girl’s FATHER said that the accident happened near the pools when the GRANDFATHER took the girl out of the window and she slipped from his hands, falling to the pavement”.

Was this really AW’a first statement to investigators? If so, it seems KW is the driving force behind this lawsuit against RCCL and AW is just along for the ride.

Article was written July 8 (one day after Chloe’s death)


From Primera Hora
“They occupy the videos of the cruise where baby died in San Juan.” That’s the translation. But reading the entire article, what really hit me was it was investigated initially by

Lieutenant Nelson Sotelo, director of the Sex Crimes Division of the San Juan area, was in charge of the initial investigation and the occupation of evidence.

What does that mean? Some of google translate wasn’t quite right, but most of it could be understood by a non Spanish speaking person like me. By the time I read it three times, I really was wondering what was going on right after it happened.
 
Just thinking on the positioning of Chloe. (MOO) I believe she was placed, at minimum, on the window ledge. (Maybe on and completely out?)

Now assuming she was ON the ledge, and she were standing, I could see her feet slipping off. Either due to panic or just that she was a wobbly toddler on a precarious ledge. - but IF she had been seated on that ledge I could imagine she wiggled off - in pain: because the surface would have been blazing hotter than hades, right? (4ish, full day sun, metal ledge, windows reflecting light back onto that surface.)

and in MOO, he wasn’t prepared for either situation because a) he’s a moron or b) he’s a stupid moron.

#justice4Chloe #thewindowdidntkillher
Medstudies, I think that she was held "dangling over the void" when she fell, not on the ledge, though she may have briefly stood on it at some point. In the video it looks as though Sam's head is out of the window himself, so it appears that she was already past the window frame, held by his left arm. And David Begnaud, who likely saw a larger, clearer version of the film, said to Sam that jurors would think that holding Chloe OVER the railing was reckless. Begnaud makes no mention of her standing in the window frame at the time of the fall, though he earlier spoke of Chloe initially both standing and then sitting on the railing, IIRC.
 
From Primera Hora
“They occupy the videos of the cruise where baby died in San Juan.” That’s the translation. But reading the entire article, what really hit me was it was investigated initially by

Lieutenant Nelson Sotelo, director of the Sex Crimes Division of the San Juan area, was in charge of the initial investigation and the occupation of evidence.

What does that mean? Some of google translate wasn’t quite right, but most of it could be understood by a non Spanish speaking person like me. By the time I read it three times, I really was wondering what was going on right after it happened.
I'm seeing that he's the Sergeant of the Cuerpo de Investigaciones Criminales de San Juan. Unfortunately it looks like their website is down, likely due to the recent earthquake, so I wasn't able to find an organizational chart that listed his position(s). My guess would be that he is the Sergeant as well as the director of sex crimes division and that this particular publication simply labeled him as the latter?
 
So strange that both parents reportedly advised Grandpa to refuse the toxicology tests. I would certainly want to know, in their place, if Sam were impaired by medication or substance. I get that they felt protective of him but surely their daughter comes first.

Maybe, but I get the feeling it's not just about being protective of Sam. If they were so worried about him they wouldn't be suing RC. No, they're dragging him through the mud and actually making things worse for him. If anything, this may be the only way they can get some sort of revenge against him (a not-so-subtle way of letting him know how they really feel about him and what he did to their baby).
 
Did SA have children that he raised previously?

My husband is fantastic babysitter for our grand baby because he had lots of experience with our kids. He would NEVER EVER put a child in a dangerous situation like that.

How much experience did SA have with children? He didn't seem very good at holding them correctly. Nor at holding their hands in crowded restaurants where people might have hot coffee or food trays.

Was this his first experience with a toddler?
 
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