IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 - #19

[Alliecog]

I wish BPD would come forward with any new information they might be able to share with the public, no matter how small. All this silence and secrecy (and might I add, censoring their fb page) makes them seem so incompetent!

I'm curious to hear what you all think, incompetent or cautious?

 

[cspring]

I Dont think u rambled at all darcyline! That was a great post.

 

[Walker]

If JW is guilty of killing LS (even unintentionally), then most likely CR, MB and JR are all telling the truth to the best of their knowledge. Conversely, if CR, MB & JR improperly disposed of LS's body, they would be very unlikely to confide that fact in JW. Could LS have interacted with some other people that morning, whose names have not been discussed in the media? Maybe her friends include some other person or group who is extremely hostile towards both JW and her Smallwood-Five North circle.

 

[Walker]

I wish BPD would come forward with any new information they might be able to share with the public, no matter how small. All this silence and secrecy (and might I add, censoring their fb page) makes them seem so incompetent!

I'm curious to hear what you all think, incompetent or cautious?

Cautious. The public needs to be more patient.

 

[Alliecog]

Cautious. The public needs to be more patient.

I should've continued my previous post and explained that I do believe they are being cautious too. I just feel like the general public sees them negatively at this point in time.

 

[Darcyline]

I definitely see cautious over incompetent right now too. They are being portrayed in a more negative light lately, but sometimes that is unfair. I really think a lot of the stuff that has people crying incompetence may just be the public not needing to know the information or misreporting.

I do wish they would release more, but I understand that there are reasons why they don't. I would love a checklist and timeline of the following: The POIs names, when they spoke IN PERSON to LE or if they haven't, when and if each took lie detector tests and if those tests were private or LE-administered, and finally exactly who gave DNA tests. I still see contradictions in reporting about those. I am sure LE knows though so it isn't really incompetence so much as media problems and me being impatient, lol.

 

[Tr.]

TR you asked if Lauren's disappearance is evil in itself. I have several theories

Thank you. You are too kind.
The OD rumors have been around from the beginning and persist today.
The parents acknowledged the possibility and made plea after plea to friends to come forward with that info...nothing.
Of course the boyfriend theory has and probably will continue to be explored and stranger abduction possibilities have been explored.

I agree it is difficult to see the Spierer's on t.v. and read the painful words of CS.
I've never been so disturbed as the first time I saw Charlene walking through a field with a long stick searching for her daughter in weeds over three feet tall.

I get the sense that the Spierer's thoughts as to what happened to their daughter has changed and evolved with the investigation. I trust a mother's intuition and that's why I'm paying close attention to the letter that CS wrote.

Take a close look at the first and last sentences.

(excerpt from letter) "I've learned there lurks an evil, a cruel, heartless element that cares more about themselves than the life of my daughter. That this element of humanity exists in the world is beyond comprehension. Your silence is deafening. Your lack of compassion is irreprehensible. Your lack of respect for another human being which allows you to go day, by day, watching is unimaginable. Everyone is put on this earth for a purpose. Everyone has a defining moment. In the blink of an eye Lauren disappeared. Do not let this be your defining moment. You have no idea what you have taken from us. "
Do you see?
"..that cares more about themselves than the life of my daughter."

This sounds to me as though she feels like LS was either murdered or at best is being held somewhere.
This is not an appeal to someone with knowledge of an OD.
So thinking along those lines what kind of scenario do you think fits the facts?

 

[Darcyline]

We may just have to agree to disagree about that part. I took that as meaning if she did OD there may have been a chance to take her to the hospital or call 911-an attempt to save her life that was lost in trying to save one of their own butts.

But, either way, I do not see her as talking to a random maniacal stranger that popped out of the streets and grabbed Lauren. We are all a bit OD-obsessed right now, but I am less married to the OD option as I am that I truly think LE/the parents think whatever happened happened with a friend or acquaintance or that, at the very least, that friend or acquaintance knows more than they are revealing. So, if we try to get out of the OD mindset for a moment, what are the possibilities if it was murder by someone known to Lauren?
-Accidental-pushed down stairs? Fell? Some sort of fight? I believe one of the very early beginning theories was actually that JW got in a fight with her and she somehow fell down stairs.
-Accidental-malicious-Drugged her for some reason? Slipped something in her drink to take advantage of her and she had a reaction to it?
-A reason for killing-She saw something she shouldn't have?
-JEalousy/Emotional-JW? JR? Hell, someone else random that had some sort of problem with LS?
-Budding criminal-We cannot say for 100% certain that any of these people aren't rapists/murderers. Maybe one of them had the beginnings to become a criminal and then saw Lauren vulnerable and couldn't stop themselves?

It is hard for me to refocus on a stranger abduction just because of my own gut feelings and the way that LE/The parents are not acting like this is a random stranger abduction. Comparing statements by her parents and LE to other random stranger abductions even just on this board and the differences are astonishing.
So, right now I am a bit biased and you will have to forgive me for that. At one point, I was convinced in the stranger abduction theory, but right now it is pretty low on my scenario list. I am not totally convinced that JR is the culprit of any kind just yet though. There are other POIs we don't know, other people she may have seen after JR, other people in the apartment buildings between JR's place and her home. When I say not a random stranger abduction I just mean not a total and complete stranger that has no connection whatsoever to Lauren or any of her friends.

What are your thoughts, TR? Like I said, I am getting a bit of tunnel vision and I always appreciate people trying to break me out of that!

 

[goodgirl65]

An interesting rumor.

Suppose this rumor is true. LS's fake ID may have been taken by a friend; that is, someone who just wanted her to stop drinking that morning.

OTOH: They probably would have put the fake ID into a wallet to ensure that it would be found. Could be a plant, similar to Morgan Harrington's tee shirt.

Or possibly the ID was taken from her by a bartender/bouncer at one of the bars that night...after she went missing they forgot they had it and panicked, tossed it...
Or maybe they held it as an excuse to catch up with her later that night to "return" it...Hmmm

 

[SUNchips]

I agree that we should discuss theories involving foul play by one or more POI, not involving an OD. I was thinking that Lauren was at CR/MB's place for so long, and I don't believe that CR was "put to bed" right when they got there. What if something sexual happened to Lauren at their apartment involving one or both of the men. That would surely create a motive for them to hide her if something went wrong afterwards or even during. I'm not sure what would make JR say she was with him later unless maybe JR had something to do with her death or hiding the body, or maybe he wasn't involved and just was trying to defer blame from CR/MB. Their statements to HT and media could easily be a story they agreed to tell, and CR's amnesia is just way too convenient IMO. So JR calls DR later, at 4:15 to warn him about what happened, and to get their story straight with DR also. And to explain this phone call, JR agreed to say that Lauren went to his place after CR's. Jut one of my theories.

 

[Pedrosmom]

I really don't think that if they are all into drugs and stuff that they are gonna want the body found because its not like she is your junkie off the street this is a pretty college girl and even if she just OD'd they are gonna run a back check on who she was with and they are gonna /exspecially with this peing so high profile that they are gonna wanna bring in the DEA and thats gonna get alot of or from what i have been reading . Alot of shady people in the mix so i disagree with just dumping the body wanting it found because its an OD. also the 4 P0I's that gave dna I disagree with the thinking that one of them gave dna because he knew no sexuall assault maybe he just assumes because he used a condom that theres none to be found inside her. I think now adays with DNA any sexuall predator with a tv knows he cant or shouldnt leave behind his cemon and thus uses a condom exspecially if he has ever been convicted and his dna is allready in the system.. Last thing and to make clear im just giving out some of my oppinions from the posts i have read. you never or rarly hear the press ask a question so i dont think that friend is hiding anything at all and she did say she didnt just bring that up she did go into that she was with her bf a loving bf of 2 years. most likely you just didnt hear a reporter ask it or u can bet its edited to just the awnsers anyways...

I asked and wondered why the DEA wasn't brought in earlier. The FBI as well. There is a high probability she crossed state lines with one of these POI's as well as the fact that BPD doesn't have the resources to fly to these various towns and re-interview these POIs. At what point does a small town police department fess up that they need some national assistance? 2 months have almost past. No offense to BPD but I imagine there are some lay offs after the semester ends and they're working with a skeleton crew. JMO

 

[Pedrosmom]

http://newsonlaurens.blogspot.com/2011/07/day-50-letter-from-charlene.html

They certainly don't mention that she has a loving boyfriend.

 

[Pedrosmom]

Thanks. I wonder how many are even there for the summer? I'd think most students wouldn't have the funds for this, but their parents may. Having said that, if parents are as concerned about security, you'd think their kids wouldn't be living in a place w/o cameras (when so many offer them). However, I also understand that kids don't think about that and they usually chose their own place, then parents see it the first time months later when they come to visit (if they do).

This says "security", not "investigations" but since he used to be a Cop, do you think maybe this is the guy the Spierers is rumored to have hired? I wonder exactly how many private investigators are in the area. He could have been their only choice.

Could it be that the DEA is finally soinf some surveillance on this drug house? If anything, taking down plates of all visitors and going from there.

 

[bloom54]

I feel like her parents pretty strongly feel like the answers to what happened to Lauren lie with her friends and maybe even more specifically JR since he has been criticized for his silence the most out of all of them. The defining moment to me even seems like they aren't fully blaming the person for the death. Would you say to a random maniac that rapes and kills for fun that "don't let this be your defining moment"? I wouldn't. I MAY say that if I think one of my daughter's friends may know where my daughter's body is.
.

All of a sudden this morning, as I re-read her letter I felt very strongly that she was speaking to JR -- and your comment reminded my WHY.... whether or not JR and LS were childhood friends (and I'm not convinced that they even knew each other before IU), their families have a history. I think that history would compel the family of JR to encourage him to talk - but the family's involvement from the very beginning was to get him a high-powered attorney who won't let him talk.

on a side note: JW's recent interview is actually a good indication of why these kids NEED to have decent lawyers and then listen to them!

 

[bloom54]

Hypothetical here, I don't want to be spreading rumors. What if you heard, "Rossman admitted he and Lauren went up to an apt and did “all kinds of drugs” in the short time they were at Smallwood."

Would it change anyone's theories if true? How?

It might make me wonder if they were with ZO et al as the supplier, and if the "altercation" was related to that....

 

[Jupiter812]

Jupiter, what is in front of the security car in your photo? It looks like a little shack or storage shed among trees.

In front and to the left is the dumpster which is surrounded by fencing (and foliage obviously).

 

[bloom54]

Just responding to your first inquiry, it is very very very common for students whom have graduated or aren't taking summer classes to stay out for at least part of the summer. If they are taking classes, like LS was, they would not have been over yet. I believe JW stayed out there to hang out with friends and LS until they went home later in the summer together. I remember reading JW and LS were traveling home together once her classes were done.

Also, in Bloomington, leases typically run from August to July or September to August -- and if you're paying the rent you might as well stay in your apartment.

 

[Jupiter812]

Upthread someone posted about LS's found wallet/ID as found or posted by a person doing the searches. On same post there is a link to the online sounding board for the H-T "news"paper where this rumor appears.

1. Any person doing the searches who publicizes found items is not legitimate IMO as this is in violation of the instructions and agreement.

2. Members/posters of the Online H-T board are among the most vile and uninformed in the Bloomington community. It is often a very ugly place. I imagine they've had to do a lot of scrubbing to keep threads from turning hateful. One doesn't share opinion there to have intelligent conversation. Apologies to anyone here who posts there and makes true contributions. End of rant.

 

[bloom54]

Did he? He wrote, "If I failed a polygraph everyone in the world would know." If it were a private polygraph, that would not be true. Perhaps this is why he responded to the follow-up question asking again whether it was LE-administered, "I don't think you are understanding what i just said to you."

When I read his interview and read "between the lines" this is what I heard him say... "yes, you (*^&ing idiot, it was an &(*&ing LE poly and if I had (*^&ing failed it I'd probably be (*^&ing booked by now, right?"

 

[Cazzie]

It might make me wonder if they were with ZO et al as the supplier, and if the "altercation" was related to that....

I wonder if there was some rivalry/turf battles between 2 (or more) DD's?

IOW, perhaps a DD found out about or observed one or more of their customers buying from another DD? From things I've read about the illicit drug market, this would be a "no no"...DD's can be very competitive/possessive and some-such would affect their bottom line.

Actually this kinda makes sense if considered with the report(s)? about the Smallwood altercation...that 1 faction wanted LS to stay with them and not go with CR...

JAT (just a thought) and not even MOO...