IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #27

[VeryVeritas]

I don't think so. The confrontation is the reason why Lauren fled her home and we have this missing person case in the first place. That's the trigger. It also appears to provide the only clue for any kind of motive in the case at all.
Of course, ZO should be cleared if video evidence clearly shows he spent the night at Smallwood or went home and stayed put etc.

Positively ZO needs to account for every minute of his time.

 

[VeryVeritas]

According to the recent LoHud article, they do know who the 2nd call was placed to, and it was someone who Lauren was with at Smallwood earlier in the night.

I find it hard to believe that any of these guys had connection to big dangerous drug dealers, when chances are if they were 'dealing' it was more like picking up for friends, not actually dealing to make money. JMO

Ok, lets say JR never bought more than an eight ball.

Who sells eight balls? and if the guy that sells eight balls isn't hardcore, then the one he buys from IS. This stuff doesn't fall from heaven like Manna, there is a distribution system that is protected better than the borders of the USA.

 

[VeryVeritas]

Let's see. When I first came on Websleuths, I said seizures were possible with Lauren's form of Long QT. This could partly explain the condition she was in that night. I was answered with about 4 pages of ridicule. But now, LoHud confirmed what I said and now that has credibility.
On 8,23,2011, I was in the alley where Lauren had been on her last night. I was with another guy and a blonde. The blonde got ahead of us and turned a corner towards Smallwood. A man came running after her. When he saw us he jumped into a speeding car. Everyone on this board thought I'd lied. But, it was not a lie and the blonde had a camera. So yes, I always believed Lauren was ambushed and taken right off her feet.
Should I put their picture on this board? I think the photo has been gathering dust in the BPD files, lost like a needle in a haystack.

I'm sorry but what you said here is not clear.

Please state it as clearly as you can. Thanks

 

[VeryVeritas]

According to the recent LoHud article, they do know who the 2nd call was placed to, and it was someone who Lauren was with at Smallwood earlier in the night.

I find it hard to believe that any of these guys had connection to big dangerous drug dealers, when chances are if they were 'dealing' it was more like picking up for friends, not actually dealing to make money. JMO

Well DR was already called, so who else was she with at SW?

 

[doubtingthomas]

When Rossman, who would end up carrying Spierer through the streets of Bloomington, Ind., cursed him out for interfering, Zach Oakes punched Rossman in the face. It would not be the last time the young men who surrounded Spierer would have an angry faceoff over her.

This is from the Lohud.com article of June 4, 2012 by Shawn Cohen page 2. Does this mean that Oakes and Rossman had another confrontation after Rossman was punched? Or was there someone else that confronted Rossman? Sure would like more detail on this.

 

[elmomom]

When Rossman, who would end up carrying Spierer through the streets of Bloomington, Ind., cursed him out for interfering, Zach Oakes punched Rossman in the face. It would not be the last time the young men who surrounded Spierer would have an angry faceoff over her.

This is from the Lohud.com article of June 4, 2012 by Shawn Cohen page 2. Does this mean that Oakes and Rossman had another confrontation after Rossman was punched? Or was there someone else that confronted Rossman? Sure would like more detail on this.

Early reports told of another confrontation, this one just after Lauren went missing. It wasn't ZO, but a different "young man that surrounded Spierer" - her boyfriend, JW, and his father reportedly had a hostile confrontation with CR.

 

[doubtingthomas]

Early reports told of another confrontation, this one just after Lauren went missing. It wasn't ZO, but a different "young man that surrounded Spierer" - her boyfriend, JW, and his father reportedly had a hostile confrontation with CR.

I think from the report JW and his father confronted Rossman the next day. The article states the young men who surrounded Spierer. Wouldn't that refer
to DR, CR, JR. MB, ZO and whoever else was at JR's party?

 

[AbbeyR]

Ok, lets say JR never bought more than an eight ball.

Who sells eight balls? and if the guy that sells eight balls isn't hardcore, then the one he buys from IS. This stuff doesn't fall from heaven like Manna, there is a distribution system that is protected better than the borders of the USA.

Maybe, but there would be no communication between the person buying a few grams and the dealer of the dealer, you know what I mean? And there's no chance that some low level dealer, let alone those higher up on the distribution line would swoop in after a phone call to clean up the problems of a college student. I just don't think it's a realistic scenario. The only way I can imagine a DD being involved is if the person was already there or Lauren went off to meet someone.

 

[AbbeyR]

Well DR was already called, so who else was she with at SW?

She was 'watching the game' with a group of people at Smallwood before going to JR's.

 

[VeryVeritas]

Maybe, but there would be no communication between the person buying a few grams and the dealer of the dealer, you know what I mean? And there's no chance that some low level dealer, let alone those higher up on the distribution line would swoop in after a phone call to clean up the problems of a college student. I just don't think it's a realistic scenario. The only way I can imagine a DD being involved is if the person was already there or Lauren went off to meet someone.

Lauren was not going off to meet someone, she was not capable of standing or apparently even sitting upright. I do not believe for a minute that she recovered from blackouts and concrete headslams inside of 1 hr such that she could stroll the long way home, unescorted and barefoot with no cell phone.
It's more likely she was abducted by aliens in my view.

I see no reason why a DD of one or 2 notches higher could not be around. People do not necessarily know that this person is what they are, but some might have a clue about it. We have no way of knowing how far up the chain JR, might be. We don't know if he was buying a few grams, or a few oz's He may have not been in it for the money, just maybe well off and liked to keep his guests/friends happy. Some people have said that hardcore DD's up the chain would not hang around. I dispute that. They certainly don't want people to know who they are and generally deal to a very select few who they take their time to know. But how do they expand their business? The only way is to get to know some people and check them out. and what better way to know them than to hang out with one of your low level dealers? Also, if there is even a small bust, LE usually works this up the chain by offering immunity or reduced sentences. I know that people higher up the chain definitely do sniff around to make sure such threats are minimized. And it's not out of the question that they were just hanging around because it was a low key place to be that night and believe it or not DD's have friends too... sometimes lower level buyers who are rich...

I do agree that swooping in would probably not be the role of someone up the chain, calling them for that favor would be a big mistake. If they were already there and confronted with a sudden death, that would be a very different and sticky situation that they would NOT want to be tangled up with. Something like that could cause someone further up the chain to punish them for creating such exposure. Mistakes in that industry are punishable by death. So far, scenarios like this make more sense to me than LS walking even out of the door.

Top 2 things I want to know:

1) Why did MB paint the picture that LS wanted to party more and say she helped put CR to bed, when that is not possible? She was in no condition for that, and would be amazing if she could talk. So why is he lying about that?

2) That second call from JR's. Why is LE holding back on who it is?
Would it make sense that she was calling CR, when he only lived next door and she was just putting him to bed? No. So who else was she with at SW earlier in the evening? Surely LE knows, and there is a story there that might figure into all of this.

 

[VeryVeritas]

She was 'watching the game' with a group of people at Smallwood before going to JR's.

Who was in this small group? Are all of the people known?

 

[VeryVeritas]

I think from the report JW and his father confronted Rossman the next day. The article states the young men who surrounded Spierer. Wouldn't that refer
to DR, CR, JR. MB, ZO and whoever else was at JR's party?

Why would they confront CR and not JR?

 

[doubtingthomas]

Why would they confront CR and not JR?

But out of public view, Wolff was feuding with Rossman and Rosenbaum.
Just days after the disappearance, Wolff and his father barged into Rossman and Beth’s apartment, investigators learned.

This is from the Lohud article.

 

[bx2]

Top 2 things I want to know:

1) Why did MB paint the picture that LS wanted to party more and say she helped put CR to bed, when that is not possible? She was in no condition for that, and would be amazing if she could talk. So why is he lying about that?

2) That second call from JR's. Why is LE holding back on who it is?
Would it make sense that she was calling CR, when he only lived next door and she was just putting him to bed? No. So who else was she with at SW earlier in the evening? Surely LE knows, and there is a story there that might figure into all of this.

1. The asking him to party line originated from CR's lawyer; the closest we've come to hearing an account from MB was through the PI's in the recent lohud article in which he walked her over to JR's to "make her his problem".

2. Holding back? They haven't released a single name of any POI at any time.

Who was in this small group? Are all of the people known?

Not sure why it was a small group, but HT and DR are the only names that I recall having come up in the media from before she left for 5N.

Why would they confront CR and not JR?

We don't really know what was known to anyone at that point, but it was very early on after she was reported missing. CR was most likely seen as the person she had been with most of the night and probably took the brunt of the blame for taking her back out of SW. There was reportedly a confrontation with JW/JR later that fall.

 

[Jupiter812]

I don't think so. The confrontation is the reason why Lauren fled her home and we have this missing person case in the first place. That's the trigger. It also appears to provide the only clue for any kind of motive in the case at all.
Of course, ZO should be cleared if video evidence clearly shows he spent the night at Smallwood or went home and stayed put etc.

Agree. She would flee if these boys were friends of JW's and she didn't want to get into trouble. The group of boys followed CR and Lauren to SW from Sports. After ZO punched him, I can envision ZO and the group wanting to keep a low profile while CR and Lauren are out in the public streets but covertly follow them. I figure they contact JW but I can't figure out why JW doesn't bust in CR's or JR's apt while she is in there...

 

[Jupiter812]

Top 2 things I want to know:

1) Why did MB paint the picture that LS wanted to party more and say she helped put CR to bed, when that is not possible? She was in no condition for that, and would be amazing if she could talk. So why is he lying about that?

2) That second call from JR's. Why is LE holding back on who it is?
Would it make sense that she was calling CR, when he only lived next door and she was just putting him to bed? No. So who else was she with at SW earlier in the evening? Surely LE knows, and there is a story there that might figure into all of this.

2) The second person is a male that she was with at SW, so it's not CR. Perhaps it is the one friend that came forward and provided information. Naturally, it would be important to protect this person's identity.

 

[Darcyline]

Had to take a bit of a break. This case just makes me so angry because I still feel like someone we know in the case knows exactly what happened. It just isn't fair to her family. It is great to see continued activity and differing opinions though. I would hate it if this thread was ever dead!

 

[Seagull]

Agree. She would flee if these boys were friends of JW's and she didn't want to get into trouble. The group of boys followed CR and Lauren to SW from Sports. After ZO punched him, I can envision ZO and the group wanting to keep a low profile while CR and Lauren are out in the public streets but covertly follow them. I figure they contact JW but I can't figure out why JW doesn't bust in CR's or JR's apt while she is in there...

Why do you think they contacted JW? I don't remember hearing of a ZO/JW link, though, I have been following since the beginning and can't always remember what's been discussed in th past.

 

[Seagull]

Agree. She would flee if these boys were friends of JW's and she didn't want to get into trouble. The group of boys followed CR and Lauren to SW from Sports. After ZO punched him, I can envision ZO and the group wanting to keep a low profile while CR and Lauren are out in the public streets but covertly follow them. I figure they contact JW but I can't figure out why JW doesn't bust in CR's or JR's apt while she is in there...

Why do you think they contacted JW? I don't remember hearing of a ZO/JW link, though, I have been following since the beginning and can't always remember what's been discussed in th past.

 

[Jupiter812]

2 sort of random things that I've thought about-

• We've heard about LS walking barefoot through alleys and sidewalks, and also sustaining possible injuries by hitting her head and also falling without her hands stopping her. Is it at all odd that their wasn't any of her blood in the places she went to (at least that we know about)?
• This one might require a map for non-locals to follow. With what we know of westbound 11th Street between College and Morton closed for construction, the only approaches to 5N are driving east on 11th and driving north on Morton. What I'm getting at is that the heavy majority of vehicular traffic to this area would be directed to use westbound 10th Street to Morton. We know for sure that this route is covered by camera because its the same path that the truck photos came from.

I hope LE is looking at video in that area for a wider time frame than say, 4:00 to 4:30 a.m. This is from an old LoHud article: "At Monday's news conference, Qualters said that they have video of one or two cars in the vicinity that they are interested in tracking down."