IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #30

[AbbeyR]

Again, drugs, drugs, drugs. I think these selfish little morons are thinking since they can't bring Lauren back, why tell the whole truth and risk getting drug abuse on their resumes forever? IIRC, only DR has admitted to taking klonopin w. Lauren. Is it a coincidence that he was the only one to take a LE poly? The only other "evidence" that Lauren took other drugs is from an employee of Kilroys after they were in trouble for serving Lauren alcohol.

Ix, I think you're probably right about some people not wanting to come forward or tell the truth because of drugs. But I'm confused, what is the evidence from an employee at Kilroy's? I don't remember seeing any statements from anyone at Kilroy's...?

 

[Jupiter812]

Just want to clarify a few points from upthread:

(1) DR was not at Kilroy's after the pre-game and (2) Kilroys was cited for letting Lauren in and for serving her. Personally, I can't see DR stealing her phone and taking covert pics of Lauren, (let alone him or anyone then returning the phone to Kilroys).

"...surveillance footage shows Rohn returning at about 12:30 a.m., June 3, and remaining there until around 11 that morning. Rohn later took an FBI-administered polygraph test that showed “no deception.”

http://www.indianapolismonthly.com/features/Story.aspx?ID=1712477


If Kilroy's had more than a citation for the offence, perhaps this is when they did the remodeling.

http://www.wishtv.com/dpp/news/local/south_central/bar-cited-in-connection-with-lauren-spierer-case

 

[Jupiter812]

I do not think CR asking if anyone has seen the small blonde girls means that he knew LS was missing. He might of just been trying to find her because he had limited memory of the previous night and was trying to get a better picture of what had happened.

I agree. My first reason though is he may have said it braggingly--that he was with a pretty blonde girl and he wants her back.

Secondly, I'm not sure he could pull off a successful "acting as if..." If he did know she was missing at that point, it may have been in the very early phase during which peeps thought she might be passed out at someone's apt.

 

[mandiedq]

Indiana is on the same time as New York.

Parts of Indiana do not observe daylight savings. So some are on EST and some on CST depending on the time of year. I don't know which parts geographically.

ETA: This should help: http://www.timetemperature.com/tzin/bloomington.shtml Ashley426 is correct that Bloomington is in the same time Zone as NY; however, not the entire state is in the same time zone.

 

[Ixchel13]

Just want to clarify a few points from upthread:

(1) DR was not at Kilroy's after the pre-game and (2) Kilroys was cited for letting Lauren in and for serving her. Personally, I can't see DR stealing her phone and taking covert pics of Lauren, (let alone him or anyone then returning the phone to Kilroys).

"...surveillance footage shows Rohn returning at about 12:30 a.m., June 3, and remaining there until around 11 that morning. Rohn later took an FBI-administered polygraph test that showed “no deception.”

http://www.indianapolismonthly.com/features/Story.aspx?ID=1712477


If Kilroy's had more than a citation for the offence, perhaps this is when they did the remodeling.

http://www.wishtv.com/dpp/news/local/south_central/bar-cited-in-connection-with-lauren-spierer-case

always I have said someone could have been using their own phone to send such pics. having Lauren's phone means she couldn't get to it to erase anything on it. She could have always borrowed someones' phone if she wanted to call/text JW. Having someone's phone these days almost means you have "them".
Kilroy's received a slap on the hand. what I think is criminal is that they
then smeared Lauren's name and then closed for remodelling. Had they been closed down by the state, the whole town would have known.

 

[Dixie811]

I just don't understand why CR would approach random students asking about "a little blonde girl". I guess there is not always a perfect reason for everything, but to me that doesn't make much sense.

Firstly, how many little blonde girls attend IU? This descriptor is really not helpful if you're truly searching for someone. Secondly, what did he think... that Lauren was wandering around this public area the next morning still? Alone? If Lauren was still out wandering from the night before, why would he pick that location in particular to ask after her?

I am trying to imagine a scenario in which I have lost a "little blonde" friend and would approach strangers asking about her by that description. The only scenario that comes to mind is if I was very recently (within the hour) in that same proximity with my "little blonde" friend, and fairly sure that she had been present in the area within the last thirty minutes to an hour or so and perhaps passed by or interacted with these individuals. That is not the case with Lauren & CR of course, so I am just really curious as to what could have been going through his mind.

Perhaps there is more detail to this exchange than we are aware. With what we know, it doesn't make a whole lot of sense.

I am not even going to get into what CR's motivations would have been for this had it been an effort by him to cover up guilt. That is another can of worms and I feel like my brain is too lazy at the moment.

 

[akh]

I just don't understand why CR would approach random students asking about "a little blonde girl". .

We'd need more context than we currently have. For one thing, was it random strangers he was asking or neighbors and people (vendors, waiters, cashiers, etc) he might see every day? And was he out of the blue asking about 'a little blonde girl' or did he add to that description? He could've added something asking if they'd seen her with him the prior night... so then it wouldn't be a random little blonde girl but the little blonde girl that was at his apartment complex and with him that prior night at Kilroy's.

Also... let's say it is random people he's asking. What exactly would he say to describe her to people who didn't know her? Maybe his point in asking about 'a little blonde girl' was to see if anyone had seen anything odd happening with 'a little blonde girl' (someone wandering disoriented, being put into a car, already in a car and something looking odd about the circumstances, a blonde girl coming in with injuries.... etc...).

IOW... He could be hoping someone seen something odd happening with a little blonde girl that could help lead to a clue in finding her.

I don't think there's necessarily anything odd about him looking for 'a little blonde girl' considering we aren't hearing any conversations in their entirety. It might've been a sham for all we know, but at least he was looking. ...And if he hadn't been looking (or we at least didn't read anything about it) someone would surely be pointing out how odd it was he wasn't looking for her later.

If someone you'd met only recently went missing and you were looking for them out of concern, what would you say to describe them?

 

[Ros]

HT, ZC, and others were in Bloomington that night. Motivation to hide her phone could be to get her in trouble with JW, or to just break them up. HT didn't "express doubt" until after they were named POIs. Initially, she stood up for both JR and JW.
Notice I wasn't accusing anyone who hid her phone of disposing her body.
IMO, all these 'kids' were drinking and drugging that night. Anything such as
hiding Lauren's phone from her might have been out of jealousy, and IMO
not intended to actually cause physical harm to her.
They would want to return the phone because they didn't want to be blamed for causing Lauren to disappear after continuing to look for her phone.
Fear and Guilt. Powerful motivators.
How about this? Before they ever began to report her missing, if someone had her phone, they knew she was missing because JW was texting her. They get together w. JR, get
their stories straight because really, it's a standoff. JR says, she rounded the corner. XYZ says, you sold her the drugs. JR says, you hid her phone and
were also doing/selling drugs. XYZ says, ok, I'll back you up but no mention of drugs or phone. Later on, after POIs give their stories, heat goes up on them and XYZ vaguely criticized them--not a finger-pointing, but
just confusion as to why they won't be more forthcoming. Not enough to make JR rat them out, that would make him look even guiltier.
In this scenario, POIs still could have disposed of her body, and JW still could have been a POI too. There's always truth in the best lies, and maybe the truth is she was looking for her phone, and knew it wasn't at kilroy's, or if she had left it there, she knew it still wasn't there.
Zoe Camp admits she is consumed with guilt for not letting Lauren in 10th and College. She says the 5N POIs are being scapegoated, but won't say why.
Am I the only one who doesn't quite believe her story? Or at least thinks she knows more?
Again, drugs, drugs, drugs. I think these selfish little morons are thinking
since they can't bring Lauren back, why tell the whole truth and risk getting
drug abuse on their resumes forever?
IIRC, only DR has admitted to taking klonopin w. Lauren. Is it a coincidence that he was the only one to take a LE poly? The only other
"evidence" that Lauren took other drugs is from an employee of Kilroys after they were in trouble for serving Lauren alcohol. Just the klonopin mixed with alcohol is enough to make her super-intoxicated.
But if she in fact was taking anything else she wasn't doing it alone.
we know others were also at JRs at the end because LE has said so. 2 phone calls were made by either JR or LS at 4:15. LE hasn't informed us if anyone else made calls from there, and that wasn't an oversight by LE. Knowing what other phone calls were made by whom and to whom is important to the
hidden part of the investigation. We know JR is saying those 2 calls were made, and the conclusions we are making are based on his timeline of events.
IMO, it is very telling that LE hasn't mentioned any other statements from
anyone else at JRs. Is it because they believe them, or don't believe them?
ZC's statements were not released by LE, she came forward after two years
and released her own statements, not to LE but to MSM, IMO, so that LE would read it. Was she worried about something?

I don't recall an employee from Kilroy's being quoted as saying that LS was doing drugs other than alcohol. I do recall an article by TG stating that she was on cocaine and Xanax, according to a "person close to the case."

http://tonygatto.wordpress.com/2011...-was-thrown-out-of-bar-alone-not-with-friend/

Also, AWG (who claimed to be JW's roommate) alleged on PT that she was on Xanax and coke. Post by aaronwg - 2011-06-21 12:27:01 -0400

Also, JR was the one who alleged that either DR or LS had told him that they had used Klonopin and that he believed they had also used cocaine.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/06/02/missing-student-boyfriend-family-fume/2382909/

 

[Ros]

Parts of Indiana do not observe daylight savings. So some are on EST and some on CST depending on the time of year. I don't know which parts geographically.

ETA: This should help: http://www.timetemperature.com/tzin/bloomington.shtml Ashley426 is correct that Bloomington is in the same time Zone as NY; however, not the entire state is in the same time zone.

In 2006, the whole state started observing daylight savings time. Most of the state is on Eastern Time but some counties in the NW and SE areas are on Central time.

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Time_in_Indiana"]Time in Indiana - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[Ashley426]

Parts of Indiana do not observe daylight savings. So some are on EST and some on CST depending on the time of year. I don't know which parts geographically.

That's what I meant. I think it's Central time up near Chicago and further southwest near Evansville. It was somewhat recent that we switched to using DST...it still confuses me when we have to change the clocks, lol :scared: But yes indeed, Bloomington and probably at least 90% of Indy is on EST.

I can't believe how much this case is still getting to me! Reading all the old threads makes me really wish I would've driven the 45 minutes to Bloomington back in summer of 2011 and helped search lease:

 

[Mahouston69]

Me too! The "Hangover movies" were popular during this time. Last night I dreamed she was found on the roof of Smallwood...my brain just spins.

 

[Ros]

Me too! The "Hangover movies" were popular during this time. Last night I dreamed she was found on the roof of Smallwood...my brain just spins.

That's weird. Early on I dreamt that she was found on a rooftop, under leaves. I am too much of a materialist too put much stock in dreams, though, even though I reject materialism for religious reasons.

 

[ellehill]

I just don't understand why CR would approach random students asking about "a little blonde girl". I guess there is not always a perfect reason for everything, but to me that doesn't make much sense.

Per USA today article...
"Rossman was outside his apartment, asking Malone if he'd seen Spierer.
"What's up boys?" Malone quoted Rossman as telling him. "Did you happen to see a little blond girl?"

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-06-12-lauren-spierer-missing_n.htm

I don't see anything strange with CR asking his neighbors if they'd seen LS.

 

[Ixchel13]

I don't recall an employee from Kilroy's being quoted as saying that LS was doing drugs other than alcohol. I do recall an article by TG stating that she was on cocaine and Xanax, according to a "person close to the case."

http://tonygatto.wordpress.com/2011...-was-thrown-out-of-bar-alone-not-with-friend/

Also, AWG (who claimed to be JW's roommate) alleged on PT that she was on Xanax and coke. Post by aaronwg - 2011-06-21 12:27:01 -0400

Also, JR was the one who alleged that either DR or LS had told him that they had used Klonopin and that he believed they had also used cocaine.

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/06/02/missing-student-boyfriend-family-fume/2382909/

yes JR stated they had told him about klonopin, and I made the leap that he didn't deny it, admitted it, since the lE poly came back no deception.

can't remember if it was our newspaper, but I don't think it was just Gatto,
who discussed an employee of Kilroys saying that Lauren had admitted to
doing xanax, coke, and being drunk. none of the so-called witnesses from KIlroys were ever identified, then they closed.
I realize people need to be brought up to date, but this was discussed
many times!

 

[Dixie811]

Per USA today article...
"Rossman was outside his apartment, asking Malone if he'd seen Spierer.
"What's up boys?" Malone quoted Rossman as telling him. "Did you happen to see a little blond girl?"

http://usatoday30.usatoday.com/news/nation/2011-06-12-lauren-spierer-missing_n.htm

I don't see anything strange with CR asking his neighbors if they'd seen LS.

It is my personal opinion that it is strange for CR to have been asking about Lauren when, according to the story of the POI's, there would be no reason to believe she did not arrive home in the early hours of June 3rd after leaving JR's on foot. I'm not sure why CR would think she would still be lingering nearby (drunk and barefoot?) that morning.

However, there is definitely some confusion about when exactly this exchange took place, as the original article stated an incorrect date. Although the date is extremely wrong (February 4), excluding the date, I got the impression that this event happened "the next morning" as in June 3rd, technically still the same calendar date as 4:15AM June 3rd when Lauren supposedly walked away. Could have been June 4, which would not make this incident as strange (IMO).

It's just my own opinion.

 

[Jupiter812]

yes JR stated they had told him about klonopin, and I made the leap that he didn't deny it, admitted it, since the lE poly came back no deception.

can't remember if it was our newspaper, but I don't think it was just Gatto,
who discussed an employee of Kilroys saying that Lauren had admitted to
doing xanax, coke, and being drunk. none of the so-called witnesses from KIlroys were ever identified, then they closed.
I realize people need to be brought up to date, but this was discussed
many times!

Ixchel, I'm more interested -- and I think a few others are too -- in a link that can vouch for the veracity of what this Kilroys employee said. Just because this was discussed before doesn't make it true or less open to challenge.

 

[Ashley426]

I think it's a little odd that CR would ask if someone saw a little blonde girl, but if he truly just passed out in his bed then I guess it makes sense. According to the floorplans I looked at a long time ago, the 5N townhomes were pretty huge. He might've just thought since they were both messed up that Lauren would stay there & then didn't hear her leave a few minutes later? Not saying I can say with confidence he's innocent, but if he'd yet to talk to MB that morning, I can see him wondering where she went in her supposed state.

 

[AbbeyR]

I agree. My first reason though is he may have said it braggingly--that he was with a pretty blonde girl and he wants her back.

Secondly, I'm not sure he could pull off a successful "acting as if..." If he did know she was missing at that point, it may have been in the very early phase during which peeps thought she might be passed out at someone's apt.

Maybe he was just trying to get the story out there that he was "put to bed" and didn't remember anything in response to (or in anticipation of) people looking for Lauren. They seem to have mentioned this to a few different neighbors early on.

It's true that it's hard to read these comments without more context. But I think the reactions of other people are telling. It doesn't sound like they came across as totally normal or convincing to those around them either.

If you heard that friends or neighbors were the last people seen with a missing girl, wouldn't you probably believe and defend them if they said they had nothing to do with it? This didn't seem to be the overwhelming reaction to the guys at 5 N in the days following Lauren's disappearance. Their stories were publicly questioned by people who knew them on FB and there were reports about an angry confrontation at 5 N. And at this point, the only thing people had to go on was rumors.

The witness statements also seem a little skeptical. The guy who told the story about CR looking for a little blonde girl, adds:

"Supposedly he had that big altercation, but he didn't look like anything happened to him," said senior Chris Malone, who saw Corey the next morning

The friend who ran into them at CVS, tells the story that MB told him, and as context, describes CR and MB's relationship as:

... not just roommates, but also close friends; he described Rossman as "cool and sometimes cocky" and Beth as his slightly younger buddy who looked up to Rossman.

On PT, the reaction to JR was similar. "Ray" described the odd and uncaring way that JR told his roommates about the situation, telling them that police had come to the apartment and stressing that "it wasn't his fault". He also described JR as a liar with "no soul". To be fair, I believe he said he didn't think JR could be responsible for Lauren's disappearance, and there were others who agreed, but even then, the main objection, IIRC, wasn't that JR was incapable of a heinous crime, but that he was "too stupid."

I think the only person who really defended the POI was HT, when she told JR's story to the media and said she believed him. And all that did was convince most people that HT was lying or in on the coverup...

All this to say that I don't think we're reading too much into it and that these stories sounded totally legit at the time. They always sounded awkward and strange, IMO.

 

[bx2]

It is my personal opinion that it is strange for CR to have been asking about Lauren when, according to the story of the POI's, there would be no reason to believe she did not arrive home in the early hours of June 3rd after leaving JR's on foot. I'm not sure why CR would think she would still be lingering nearby (drunk and barefoot?) that morning.

However, there is definitely some confusion about when exactly this exchange took place, as the original article stated an incorrect date. Although the date is extremely wrong (February 4), excluding the date, I got the impression that this event happened "the next morning" as in June 3rd, technically still the same calendar date as 4:15AM June 3rd when Lauren supposedly walked away. Could have been June 4, which would not make this incident as strange (IMO).

It's just my own opinion.

Regarding the Feb 4 date typo:[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6757297&postcount=235"]http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6757297&postcount=235[/ame]


The Lohud side of that is now in their paid archive, so the USA Today copy is more heavily cited unfortunately.

 

[Mahouston69]

It is my personal opinion that it is strange for CR to have been asking about Lauren when, according to the story of the POI's, there would be no reason to believe she did not arrive home in the early hours of June 3rd after leaving JR's on foot. I'm not sure why CR would think she would still be lingering nearby (drunk and barefoot?) that morning.

However, there is definitely some confusion about when exactly this exchange took place, as the original article stated an incorrect date. Although the date is extremely wrong (February 4), excluding the date, I got the impression that this event happened "the next morning" as in June 3rd, technically still the same calendar date as 4:15AM June 3rd when Lauren supposedly walked away. Could have been June 4, which would not make this incident as strange (IMO).

It's just my own opinion.

I think he was curious and checking out whether or not his neighbor saw or heard anything...at all.