IN - Lauren Spierer, 20, Bloomington, 03 June 2011 #30

[Mahouston69]

I still don't get why her boyfriend who was "always" looking out for her, known her forever, knows what she was doing and who she was doing it with and her roommates said she "went too far" this time and yet takes over 12 hrs to discover her "missing", look for her, and report her missing. (I'm texting my 25 year old son when he is 30 minutes late)
Unless he is covering something horrible up and getting his Dad here to help him first. I still can't move past a possibly jealous boyfriend who hasn't been ruled out..and parents who have since attacked her memory.

 

[AbbeyR]

Here's what I'm pondering: If JR had anything to do with Lauren why would he mention the black eye? There would be no good reason. Even if he said it to make her look bad would be stupid because it makes him a *advertiser censored* for letting her leave.

It sounds to me like at some point the story changed, and went from Lauren being totally fine and wanting to party, using the phone herself at JR's, to MB and JR being concerned about her, making the calls to find her a ride, and the details about the ipod and black eye. Maybe MB changed his story or told the truth to the investigators?

Or maybe some of JR's details were added in later when he spoke to the investigators or the Spierers... His lawyer, ftr, has been accused in the past of coaching his clients to add in little fake details that make stories sound realistic. (Although you're right about the black eye part doing nothing but making him look worse, so maybe it's true?)

 

[AbbeyR]

Or maybe once they realized there was video surveillance and/or witnesses to Lauren's fall, they had to admit she wasn't totally fine. She could also have fallen or been injured earlier too. We just happen to have one fall documented.

 

[MamaJoJo]

And skeletal remains were found in Warsaw IN today. That is west of Fort Wayne which is in I69 in northeastern Indiana which is in route to Michigan. Hmmm...

Sadly, the remains were of Aurora Shoemaker...
http://www.staceypageonline.com/2013/10/01/remains-confirmed-those-of-missing-woman/

 

[akh]

One thing we don't know is what was told to LE and when. Just because we became privy to some things late in the game (mainly thru the interview with the PI's a year later) we don't necessarily know that any of that was from changing stories. It could all be the police keeping things close to the vest, bad reporting, and the 'phone game' at play more than anything. This is especially true when we know early reporting was very prone to mistakes. And that is compounded by the fact that LE has not felt the need to share much of anything or clarify info that has slipped into the narrative. We have no idea what was in those initial LE interviews transcripts.

 

[AbbeyR]

True, Akh, but we also have the statements from their lawyers from 2011.

 

[akh]

True, Akh, but we also have the statements from their lawyers from 2011.

The lawyers were spinning the case for public consumption and trying to take the heat off of their clients in the court of public opinion. Further they were probably doing it with full knowledge that LE wouldn't be releasing anything of importance to that same court of public opinion. They probably didn't count of the PI's giving any inside scoops a year later but I'm not sure how much that mattered by that point anyway.

The public has really not had a chance in helping with this case beyond the searches because we don't know what we don't know.

Unless someone with direct knowledge comes forward, or an enterprising investigative reporter takes up the case, there's really nothing here for us in the public to grasp onto to feel certain of anything.

 

[Jupiter812]

It sounds to me like at some point the story changed, and went from Lauren being totally fine and wanting to party, using the phone herself at JR's, to MB and JR being concerned about her, making the calls to find her a ride, and the details about the ipod and black eye. Maybe MB changed his story or told the truth to the investigators?

Or maybe some of JR's details were added in later when he spoke to the investigators or the Spierers... His lawyer, ftr, has been accused in the past of coaching his clients to add in little fake details that make stories sound realistic. (Although you're right about the black eye part doing nothing but making him look worse, so maybe it's true?)

This is helpful to know. Explains why we know what JR was supposedly wearing when he answered the door. What I want to know is did he floss his teeth before going to bed, too?:floorlaugh:

 

[Chuz Life]

Hi all,

Could someone direct me to a post or link to the most detailed timeline of Lauren's whereabouts the night she was last seen?

Specifically, I'm looking for the most detailed "paths" that she took as she went from her apartment to the "5 Townhouse" location, to the bar, back to her apartment and so on. I have found more than one map which shows where she was seen and the time that was recorded... however, it's not clear what path's were taken.

I'm wondering if any of the persons of interest (those who walked with Lauren that night) were ever asked those questions in their depositions.

In addition, I'm looking for the specific locations where the purse and her keys were found.

 

[monkey222]

I thought that there was survelience film as well of LS falling at SW in/or out of elevator. Just what I am remembering from WSleuth earlier posts.

 

[bx2]

Hi all,

Could someone direct me to a post or link to the most detailed timeline of Lauren's whereabouts the night she was last seen?

Specifically, I'm looking for the most detailed "paths" that she took as she went from her apartment to the "5 Townhouse" location, to the bar, back to her apartment and so on. I have found more than one map which shows where she was seen and the time that was recorded... however, it's not clear what path's were taken.

I'm wondering if any of the persons of interest (those who walked with Lauren that night) were ever asked those questions in their depositions.

In addition, I'm looking for the specific locations where the purse and her keys were found.

This attachment from the first post of the thread has the path with times. The only deviation we've been made aware of not depicted in that picture is when headed back to 5N, instead of continuing straight along the alley just west of Tenth and College, CR and LS turned right on 10th and went up the stairs to the front door of the building where there was an unsuccessful attempt to reach one of the girls that had been at JR's earlier that night.

The light blue of the path is verified via security camera, the red is speculated upon. Purse and keys were located right at the intersection of these paths, but supposedly off camera. You can see the spot (looking back south) in the last picture from [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=6679912&postcount=3"]this post[/ame].

 

[Chuz Life]

This attachment from the first post of the thread has the path with times. The only deviation we've been made aware of not depicted in that picture is when headed back to 5N, instead of continuing straight along the alley just west of Tenth and College, CR and LS turned right on 10th and went up the stairs to the front door of the building where there was an unsuccessful attempt to reach one of the girls that had been at JR's earlier that night.

The light blue of the path is verified via security camera, the red is speculated upon. Purse and keys were located right at the intersection of these paths, but supposedly off camera. You can see the spot (looking back south) in the last picture from this post.

Thank you BX2.

That map was one (of several) that I was looking to build upon. It helps visualize the data better than anything else does (for me). Thank you for explaining about the different colors.

I have an aerial image from 2011 which shows that some of the buildings were under construction when Lauren went missing.

I'm hoping to use that image to illustrate the same thing that your links show. I would like your input and thoughts on it along with anyone else who can help pinpoint specific locations and details.

Can you tell me if there was any video (ever) released that shows Lauren walking with any of the guys she was reported as being with?

 

[akh]

Thank you BX2.

That map was one (of several) that I was looking to build upon. It helps visualize the data better than anything else does (for me). Thank you for explaining about the different colors.

I have an aerial image from 2011 which shows that some of the buildings were under construction when Lauren went missing.

I'm hoping to use that image to illustrate the same thing that your links show. I would like your input and thoughts on it along with anyone else who can help pinpoint specific locations and details.

Can you tell me if there was any video (ever) released that shows Lauren walking with any of the guys she was reported as being with?

There was not...

 

[Dixie811]

I thought that there was survelience film as well of LS falling at SW in/or out of elevator. Just what I am remembering from WSleuth earlier posts.

I know there is video of LS and CR at Smallwood that LE has. But Lauren's parents have stated that they have not viewed that footage, so apparently LE is keeping it under wraps. I don't know if the PI's hired by the Spierer's have seen it or not?

 

[AbbeyR]

Can you tell me if there was any video (ever) released that shows Lauren walking with any of the guys she was reported as being with?

No, there was an article that described surveillance video from an anonymous source -- that's as close as we get.

Source: Lauren Spierer falls in building video, in no condition to help friend get home http://www.lohud.com/article/201107...condition-help-friend-get-home?nclick_check=1

[At Smallwood, Lauren ] stumbled out of her elevator, fell against a wall and had to be helped to her feet by a male friend who led her out of the building, a person who saw the video evidence told The Journal News on Thursday...The account contradicts statements by friend Corey Rossman's lawyer, who said Spierer, a 20-year-old from Edgemont, helped his client walk home June 3 after he was punched in the face and suffered memory loss.

"As for this idea that she was Florence Nightingale and taking him back because she was concerned, she wasn't in any condition to take care of herself, let alone another human being," said the source, one of scores of people who have seen the evidence, who was willing to comment only anonymously. "She couldn't even stand up on her own. I have difficulty with this individual (Rossman) saying he can't remember anything when he's the guy who picked her up and took her out of the building."

bbm.

And then there's also the description from the PI's in this video -- it sounds like at least some of it is based on surveillance video, but none of that has been shared with the public: [ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1sQVq0JNFFI"]Lauren Spierer Timeline _ LoHud.com _ The Journal News_3_xvid.avi - YouTube[/ame]

 

[akh]

If there are "scores" of people who have seen it, why aren't there "scores" of leaks describing it?

 

[AbbeyR]

You only really need information to be 'leaked' once?

 

[Ixchel13]

You only really need information to be 'leaked' once?

I have to disagree, I think they should have listened to as many accounts as possible so as to sift through the drunken and high accounts until they had some sort of idea as to what happened. Why they haven't shown this video to the Spiers' is beyond me. The idea that LE is protecting ZO because he's a confidential informant has been discussed in detail on PT. Why else would they never give a complete answer about this confrontation?

It's beginning to become clear that LE is sitting on alot more than the 5N
POIs. First, let me say for the umpteenth time I'm not on the 5N POIs
"sides", but, I feel they are being railroaded. With so much going on and Lauren being in the center of some sort of fracas, being the last to see her
may not be the end all that is usually the case. IOW, this case may not be easily fit into the typical, obviously something is very amiss.

All of the witnesses, or most of them, have been anonymous. Why is that?
Maybe there's some hard-hitting local drug dealers involved in this. Would LE be so callous to consider a high level investigation for dealing more important than finding out who took Lauren? Or are the two ideas merged and that's why nothing is coming out?

Follow the money. Is Lauren's disappearance wedged between Kilroy's--multi millions per month, and a high level drug dealer?
If so, they've had 2 1/2 long years to close that BS, and I would hope that
any drug investigation they've been working on is not as important as Lauren.

 

[Ixchel13]

BTW, the IDS reported today that another rape/drugging situation happened. Whenever these reports are filed, it is always the victim was in a "downtown bar" but they never say the name of the bar! This time, the woman left the "downtown Bar" at 2 a.m., and woke up up to a man raping her at 4 a.m. Aman she had exchanged e mails with earlier that day. She only remembers leaving the bar, not leaving with him and she was drugged.

I think if someone was raped after leaving a bar, the name of the bar is completely OK to name. What's up with that?
It's this kind of favoritism that is leading to rape and murder. If these bars are harboring drugging rapists, this needs to be blown off the hinges instead of being veiled by secrecy. lawsuits be damned, people are being raped and killed. If the bar has this occuring on a regular basis, they need to be shut down, and not be allowed to reopen!

 

[akh]

You only really need information to be 'leaked' once?

What about verification? If "scores" of people have seen something then it shouldn't be too hard to track down another anonymous source or two or three and verify what was said.

I can understand only having one leak (source) in a tight-lipped investigation. But if that same source says "scores" of people have seen the video then I start expecting some further leaks. Some more info. Another point of view. Different reporters with different sources to be worked. Whatever. I start questioning the credibility of anyone who says scores of people have seen something yet we only get their leak. It doesn't compute.

Why say "scores" of people have seen it? Is it a lie to try and bolster credibility in a backdoor kind of way? Have "scores" of people really seen it and all remained tight-lipped except one?

I would expect to read "several people who wish to remain anonymous....".

So that adds one layer of skepticism. The other layer comes from the idea that social media (and likely the old fashioned media) were being manipulated early on so it wouldn't surprise me to see someone wanting to make 5N appear more guilty to lie about what they'd seen in the video, if not lie about seeing the video at all. Certainly I wouldn't put skewing what it showed out of the question. Or someone inserting themselves into the case just looking for their 15 mins or whatever. By the same token I take things like what 5N lawyers have said with a grain of salt too. Everyone had free rein to manipulate the media and the public because LE wouldn't really confirm or deny anything of significance. And to this day have not really done so. So the rumors, bad reporting, etc all have gotten blended together with questionable memories to get us to a point where sadly there's little we can trust or believe. And certainly nothing to draw any conclusions from that doesn't have some gaping holes that we can't fill.

As I said previously, we don't know what we don't know. And that could be a cavernous lack of knowledge on our part versus all the mitigating and condemning evidence that must've been collected. Yet nothing was enough to move this case forward.