Interim discussion regarding questions from the jury and Arias on the stand #81

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Because he didn't file properly and timely. imo
I am of the opinion that at least PART of his filing to get off the case was to open his own practice, thus requiring the good tax payers of AZ to pay him $225/hr, rather than the paltry amount he was getting paid as a public defender.
Sorry, I have zero respect for the guy.
 
Katie, will pray for u and others there.

I live pretty near the epicenter and felt it. Not a big quake and all is settled down now. This quake was felt over a large area so it's getting a lot of publicity. It was near Anza, in So. Cal. That area has lots of small quakes, this one was a little bigger is all. Thanks for your prayers. :seeya:
 
I have looked and can't find yet, a picture of the bedroom/closet/bathroom layout that had a arrow pointing to a bloody footprint in the bathroom and the words (foot print) were in a circle in the closet. hope that made sense.

Not sure if answered...catching up on the thread. In Day 3 or 4 testimony from the CSI lady (blonde) she mentioned a possible bloody shoe print they identified by the closet. I'm still listening to all the days I missed. Not much about it was mentioned other than how it was labeled and what it was...so far.

Sorry if I'm repeating any info. :)
 
Not sure I have every fact correct, but:

Jodi originally had two attorney from the Public Defender's office appointed to her, one of which was Nurmi. Jodi petitioned to be her own attorney, and the two PD lawyers were assigned to advise her. The she wanted her attorneys back. The original primary PD lawyer said there was a conflict of interest (she had represented someone else involved in this case, don't know who, and was also undoubtedly thanking her lucky stars), so that attorney was removed, and Nurmi was put back on the case along with Wilmott. Nurmi asked to be removed because he had left the PD office and was in the process of starting up his own practice. Judge said no, the state will pay you for your services. Nothing Nurmi could do to get out of it.

If I had to guess, I would say the issue with the judge was that every time a new attorney is assigned they ask for a long delay to familiarize themselves with the case. Jodi had already been in jail for two years at this point. People have differing opinions on whether Nurmi really made much of an effort to get off the case: some feel he is genuinely stuck there, some feel he was happy to have the income just when he needed it. Perhaps it's both.
The history of the attorneys involved in this case is an interesting read. I'll try to find the link for you, but the two original state appointed attorneys, (not nurmi) got off the case before Nurmi even came aboard.
 
It's probably already been discussed somewhere (you guys are MAD posters!), but what did you all think of the juror questions about JA's relationship with her mother and father? I wonder if some jurors are trying to gauge how a death sentence will sit with the folks.

Two cents.

Ooooooooo. Good one.

I had wondered if the jury were curious about all her relationships. We already know about her boyfriends. I like your idea better.
 
IMO, all it did was show that she was a liar even in her earlier years and her parents disciplined her for it. It seems Jodi was a handful in her teen years and her parents were probably just fed up with it all. IMO, it shows a pattern. Jodi went from LYING teen to a LYING murderer.

IMO, her parents probably tried their best to raise and support Jodi but Jodi wanted to do her own thing....like now..

I did notice that after the parents closed down the restuarants? The money wasn't plentiful like before and Jodi decided to move out.. IMO, they could no longer cater to Jodi and so she moved on....

Jodi wants people to take of her financially and when that falls flat...Jodi is on to the next one.

Just my :twocents:
I think I read that they just last year opened a new one, which was surprising to me considering the health of her father.
 
and single minded pursuit of justice. Is it guaranteed to work with EVERY jury in every case? Probably not. But as far as I know he has been a successful prosecutor.

I understand some think he should present as an unemotional, facts only, representative of the state. But that clearly isn't him. I see him as someone who lives his job and these cases and is truly single minded in his pursuit of justice for the victims of crime and their families.

To me, he is telling the jury that this unimposing little girlish "jodi" character isn't what she appears. He isn't going to play along, be nice and keep it civil and polite. He's going to destroy her and anyone who tries to help her. I also have no doubt that the defense strategy of trashing Travis plays a big part in all this. There is no way he will in any way let these uncorroborated slurs on the victim stand.

You're so right-he is treating her like the killer on death row already and I think it is very effective.





IMO, JM treatment of Jodi. He is treating her like the "killer headed to death row" that she is. He needs to show the jury that she is not worthy of respectful gentle treatment. He has to call her out on her lies and destroy her "poor abused me" posture. He is doing great.
 
And JA acknowledges that using a knife is heinous. She actually says she would have shown 'mercy' and used a gun if she had wanted to kill him.

Well we know she did use both a gun and a knife. Let us use her words and call it 'heinous' Let's us use her words and say she did NOT show him any 'mercy' by stabbing him 28 times and cutting his throat. Let's use her words and send her to death row. Any bets she won't be begging for the death penalty post-conviction like she said on 48 hours? :furious:

Great point!
 
I have an odd feeling about the way he is positioned in the shot that just shows his middle torse, I've never seen a man sit in a shower in that position, not that I'm a peeper or anything, let's just clear that up right now (being mindful of the company we keep in here :floorlaugh: ), but that appeared to be another 'accidental' shot to me, but try as I might I cannot see any blood spatter in the frame. odd, just odd... anyone else??

I read one post, several days ago, that pointed out that if you attach the 5:29:20 photo with the 5:30:30, you have the complete shot of Travis sitting in the shower. She may have cropped the photo leaving certainly the most dramatic one of him staring straight on into the camera for what she thought was his last.
 
BBM - which is why I believe he was stabbed first, the shot to the head was to "finish him off" cause he could have been making noises as air was escaping his throat.
If he WERE shot in the head first, got out and went to the mirror, there would be a crap ton more blood.

I am sticking with my theory, she stabbed him in the chest, he put his hands out to defend himself (defensive wonds on his hands) as he was getting out of the shower. I DO think he went to the mirror/sink, but only to balance himself and mybe catch his breath type of move, coughing up blood and then she continued to stab him in the back. At that point I think he dropped to his knees (she said he was crawling on his knees.... little bit of truth in every lie) trying to get to the door and she stood above him stabbing him more as he got closer to the carpet, where she lifted his head and slit his throat. She then drags him back to the shower, tosses him in and shoots him in the head.

JMO

Another monkey wrench in a series of events that seems to make no sense with either theory...

We know he went to the sink after whatever happened first (stab or shot) if he was stabbed and knew she had a knife, he'd go to the sink and intentionally turn his back on his knife wielding attacker? I'm still going with the gunshot first. The me says there was too much decomposition to tell for sure which (exact) area of the brain wouldve been affected. She mentioned in one of her stories about the ninjas that travis said, 'get help' - and I wonder that might not have happened. If he was stunned and hurt and hoping she might not have really wanted him to actually die. So when she ran off, he mightve thought help was coming and made his way to the sink, but she returned instead with the knife to his back. He turns and gets the defensive wounds but is too weak by then to keep him from his heart.

Re: the photos, at the end of the day its speculation of course but does anyone else think that he looks like he is praying in the one just before the one where he's looking directly in the camera? I can totally picture the ever dramatic JA ordering him to say his prayers, or maybe pretending she's doing him a big favor by allowing it before she does what he now knows she's going to.

With that in mind, the look on his face in the next one seems more like a mixture of sadness, resignation/acceptance, and a little bit of defiance - sure in his faith that he will be ok, but she never will be.
 
Not sure of order, but imo stabs, slit throat, stabs, gunshot. Whatever the order, she had to have been in a maniacal frenzied crazy psycho mode, how does one do that much carnage in about a minute and 45 sec. From 5:30-30secs to 5:36- 16 secs. Insane, she was a wild ninja and just took him down hard and fast.

Exactly. The order really doesnt matter because all the evidence shows she was not running away or trying to get away. Her whole purpose was to brutally kill him and end his life. No matter the order of things.

She was on a mission.
 
What is being on death row in Arizona like? I heard Scott Peterson is allowed FIVE hours outside every single day.
I gotta tell ya, being FORCED outside for even 15 minutes here in AZ between June and October is not a pleasant experience. It can be as hot as 124 degrees. Experienced hikers have to be rescued from the trails here constantly because they underestimate the effects of this heat.

I am originally from southern Oregon, and although I've lived through 5 summers here, I am STILL not acclimated. I call all but about 3 months of the year my "great laying in" period.
 
Sorry this is OT :blushing:

Bringing this over from another Support Travis site. I found this to be an interesting read if you are into astrology: Jodi's B-day 7-9-80/Cancer

http://www.thesecretlanguage.com/report/personology/?r=19800709

http://www.astrology-online.com/cancer.htm





I'm a tried and true Scorpio to the bone and proud of it! :giggle:


I'm glad I'm not the only one peeking in on thread even tho no trial! My doggie is loving it as she's been watching back to back Animal Cops (Canine Soap Opera) lol! :)

Ok I'm a Cancer Moonchild.. I'd like to say in "our" defense 1) sociopaths can be born under any sigh :floorlaugh: 2) we usually are the nuturer of life not the taker!

Seriously we tend be family focused, loyal to a fault, romantic and yes clingy! Also intuitive I always say.. I've got a feeling that... So perhaps JA had this too?? She had a feeling TA was serious about never wanting to see her again that she had a feeling TA was serious about Mimi & her sociopathic tendencies kicked in???

I run about 80% accuracy on my "I got a feeling" about things situations..

Jmo
 
No matter how Jodi acts, she cannot possibly believe this is going well. Nope. I'll never believe it. Her Mother is sitting there watching Jodi flailing and drowning. That's very sad, too.

Keep in mind Mormonattorney's wonderful post exploring the world of parents of sociopathic and/or psychopathic children.

I am a parent of a sociopath as Mormonattorney describes. I would like you to know that after years of struggling, you become somewhat numb yourself. There is shame you feel that somehow this violent person is the result of some mistake you made. My son (the one who is now deceased) was literally born that way--crying and crying, refusing the breast, inconsolable, angry. After he cried once for ten straight hours, I took him to the doctor (this was in the sixties). The doctor offered to enlarge his urethra, thinking he might be in pain. I declined that as just a stab in the dark. Nobody knew what was wrong with him.

By three years old he overturned furniture, pulled drawers out and turned them upside down, climbed on the kitchen counter and threw cans down...By five he was taking kitchen knives and stabbing boxes in the garage. By eight he stabbed his brother by dropping an "arrow" on his little brother's back in the bathtub to see the blood go in the water. He had fashioned this arrow from a chandelier (since I had long before removed knives from the kitchen). I was terrified--the house was full of children who were all vulnerable.

When he was six, I took him to a prominent child psychiatrist at Stanford. He said my son was the most violent child he had ever analyzed and he warned me that he would probably be institutionalized by the time he was ten. I suffered from hyper-vigilance, never knowing a good night's sleep.

He was brilliant, model-level handsome and grew to be six foot four. Violence was his entertainment. Other people suffering was hilarious to him, including mine.

I felt shame and never told anybody about most of the incidents. As he became more dangerous, I called police. I called my Mormon bishop. I sought professional help. The police didn't take me seriously--and there is nothing to be done. No help other than sending him to a school for deviant boys, which we did. It didn't help either.

This is a nightmare for parents. My husband left--it was just too much, leaving me to raise seven children alone. I did my best, but wasn't very available emotionally for the other children and they have suffered as a result.

The sociopath can be showed the evidence plain as day, the parent saying, "I found this marijuana in your room under your mattress," and the child shrugs and says, "It's not mine. I don't know how it got there. Are there any more muffins?"

My child was so charming and so charismatic that he even convinced a social worker that I was mentally ill and persecuting him. I had to present documents from previous admissions, psychiatric treatment to prove I deserved more credibility than the psychopathic teenager!

Mormonattorney describes exactly the cool willingness a parent must have to patiently sit through the lies and wait for the break. I am awed with admiration that she chooses to work with these difficult and unrewarding sociopathic children.

I also saw flashes of the manipulative child Jodi Arias and I don't judge her mother or aunt. You have called everyone. You have done everything. Your child has stolen your car, climbed out windows, pawned your wedding ring, sold your skis, and broken your heart--all with a shrug. There is a gallows humor that helps you survive when you have been through hell raising a hellion. For all you know, they are whispering, "This reminds me of the time she told that ridiculous story about a ninja stealing the car she took."

The mother and the aunt see their child getting what she deserves. She is being publicly humiliated by her manipulations and lying not working. It is a form of justice for them, too, you know. They always said she would end up in jail. Their behavior is not classy, of course, but they have barred her from their home and distanced themselves from her for years. They may also have the genes for sociopathy. She is the classic "bad seed" and if they can benefit in any way from her celebrity, in their view, she owes them.

Unfortunately, to the sociopath, notoriety and celebrity are the same. It is attention, which she can't get by working hard and succeeding because that would be bowing to authority. In her mind, being the most important prisoner is better than being a nobody waiting tables in Yreka.

Which is why I want her on death row, where there is no opportunity to strut and be Queen of the Scene.
 
I have to check out of here in less than an hour, and I'm not sure when I'll have time to get back to reading here. (will have my granddaughter till Thursday night) I have a few observations I'd like to add, and I want to know what others are thinking. Juan has asked Jodi the same questions over, and over and over. He won't accept, I guess, that makes sense, I think, etc. He wants her pinned down, with no way to wiggle out. I think those points are the ones Juan has that will really impeach her. The gas cans are one example, and now we know why. The finger cut was another. Asking her about having a GPS on the rental car is hopefully going to be huge! I'm just hoping that car had an internal GPS, and we get to see exactly where Jodi was on that trip. If she burned her clothes, etc. and they can find that location, at the very least the zipper on her sweat pants would have survived the fire. A big glob of melted plastic from the Walmart gas can would be nice too. I can't shake the feeling that somebody followed Jodi in another car on her trip. MM comes to mind. And why did she have the exact same murder weapons in her new rental car when she was arrested. Two knives and a gun. I've read that two people can keep a secret if one of them is dead. Did she think she needed to kill an accomplice? If not an accomplice to the murder, one that she confided in after the fact. I'm thinking MM could have been her target. It will be interesting to see if there is any more info regarding these weapons. They are her murder weapons of choice!

Really intriguing post. There is plenty of evidence to convict Arias of first-degree murder. I don't want to get my hopes up too high for more bombshells but I'd love it if even just one more piece of evidence is introduced in court. I just love seeing Mr Martinez hammering down on Arias' lies. :great:
 
Is it too late for the prosecution to request a medical exam and xray on JA's hand?

Surely they will not find a broken finger, but a scar and a sliced tendon.
She keeps telling that Travis broke her left finger, and she cut her right fingers from broken glass. If there is medical poof of a scar on her left hand, and damaged tendon, what is she going to do, change her story again to "oh yes, it was my left hand I cut the finger at work."
 
A lot of us here are convinced JA is guilty (heard it out of her own mouth) well....any how as avid trial watchers when was the last trial you felt the defendant was NOT GUILTY or were persuaded they were Guilty after watching the trial.

Last time I was not sure was David Westerfield in VanDam case. I was convinced by the evidence at trial at the beginning I was not sure.

Oh my, yes. Van Dam case was the first trial I ever followed on Ctv. I did not WANT Westerfield to be guilty. I didn't want to believe that there could be a pedophile murderer lurking in a lovely neighborhood disguised as the quiet, reserved neighbor. :furious:

Now that was one amazing prosecutor--Jeff Ducheck (sp?). Brilliant, just like Juan...very different styles, of course. His closing argument was nothing short of genius; the kind of thing where you want to give a standing ovation at the end if it weren't so incredibly sad, so you just sit there and cry instead.
 
seems to me this jury could make short work of their verdict if they first decide whether they believe the defendant.

1. do we believe TA encouraged her to come to AZ?
2. do we believe her allegations of sexual and physical abuse?
3. do we believe she didn't try to conceal her trip to AZ?
4. do we buy the 'fog?'
5. do we believe this was a case of self defense?
6. do we believe she used a gun owned by TA that nobody else knew he had?

there are other questions, of course, but i think the answer to those should be a resounding NO because all of those things aren't corroborated by ANY evidence other than what she says.
they can easily throw out every word she said on the stand and just move to the evidence. then it wouldn't take long at all.

#5 does it for me. No one defends themself by stabbing the attacker in the back.
 
i have to bow out of this discussion. i think my feelings on this subject are already known. i just don't think kirk nurmi is a stupid person and i don't believe he thinks she's innocent any more than we do. they chose this defense and it's his job to support it. he really had to put her on the stand in order for it to succeed. doesn't mean he thinks it's true and i would think the judge is aware of the position he's in, and he's doing his job. that's all i can say about it.

I completely agree with this. In fact, I think Jodi infuriates him nearly as much as she infuriates us. I've noticed him taking extra long pauses after some of her really stupid answers.
 
I'm a great advocate of the fine art of typing things out unless they are well-established abbreviations or acronyms such as the FBI.

As a newb here, I still have to stop and pause when I see someone write:

"IMO JA is just like KC but KT is no JB, but regardless of the DT they should have both gotten the DP, if only JM tried both cases, he would have won over either PD, MOO, and I wish JVM would replace NG on HLN because I'm tired of hearing about MM and RB, and IDK about DB, but I think he's an AATF."

JM2C, UC

Posts like this make me wish we had an 'LOL' button along with the 'Thanks'. :giggle:
 
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