It's time to drain the Anthony pool

[Adrienne37]

As the owner of a pool this size, you wouldn't have to completely take the liner up to have access to a part of it underneath it. We had a leak last year that had to be repaired and it was easy enough to lift the part of the liner where the leak was and patch it and then replace it. It' really wasn't as difficult as you would think it would be.

 

[Capri]

well, it would certainly fit in with "she's close, very close"

 

[Patty G]

As the owner of a pool this size, you wouldn't have to completely take the liner up to have access to a part of it underneath it. We had a leak last year that had to be repaired and it was easy enough to lift the part of the liner where the leak was and patch it and then replace it. It' really wasn't as difficult as you would think it would be.

Did you do this by yourself?

 

[curiositycat]

We had one of those pools about 20 years ago. I have a real hard time wrapping my arms around this theory.

We never changed the water in our above ground pool, we used chemicals to keep it clean.

Once the water is in it it would be hard to move the lining...and I MEAN HARD WORK.

If the A's had done this I would think they would have had to refill the pool and their water bill has probably been looked at by LE.

IMHO

 

[Sleuth5]

If they drained the pool, where did all the water go? Don't you think the very close neighbors would have noticed if their yard or the A's yard were flooded? Surely somebody would have noticed as the yard would have been quite disturbed looking if it had been. Not to mention any dirt samples from the yard would have contained chlorine.

Absolutely. I've had above-ground pools, and let me tell you, it is no small thing to drain the pool. First, it takes considerable time, and second, you're going to end up with a lot of water, even from a 3 1/2' pool -- it would definitely be an issue.

As to the idea that someone might have drained the pool and then buried the child beneath it, one needs to understand that the pool liner is very heavy and that the ground beneath the pool would have been prepared -- leveled and then sanded, usually with nearly a half ton or more of sand. The wall of most above-ground pools (if quality) is made of steel in one continuous piece which is bolted together at one point -- you can't simply "pick it up" and move it --the wall alone would easily weigh in the neighorhood of 200 pounds, without the liner attached. The operation would require a minimum of three people, more would actually be necessary if you didn't want to risk damaging the wall or the liner when you tried to move it to bury the body -- which would be essential if your plan was to place the pool back as though nothing had happened. I can't imagine that you could pull it off without leaving clear evidence that you had done something with the pool -- there would be sand from the "cove base" all around the reset pool, as well as damage to the lawn from the weight as you were moving things around. Most importantly, it would be nearly impossible to avoid damaging the pool in some way during the operation.

Now, people do (and I did more than once) drain the pools for cleaning, etc. -- but it's not something you do as a rule. Most of the time you just drain them down to about 1/3 depth and cover them for the off-season -- then condition and restart the water when the new season begins. Above-ground pools are simply not designed to be moved once they are installed.

The bottom line is that it would really be nearly impossible to do this without lots of help, and no small amount of luck. Could the whole family have done it together? Sure, but I think it's exceptionally unlikely.

 

[future criminologist]

if she was buried under the pool, wouldn't LE have noticed a disturbance at the bottom of it? is it a plastic bottom or a concrete/cement bottom?

 

[Patty G]

Absolutely. I've had above-ground pools, and let me tell you, it is no small thing to drain the pool. First, it takes considerable time, and second, you're going to end up with a lot of water, even from a 3 1/2' pool -- it would definitely be an issue.

As to the idea that someone might have drained the pool and then buried the child beneath it, one needs to understand that the pool liner is very heavy and that the ground beneath the pool would have been prepared -- leveled and then sanded, usually with nearly a half ton or more of sand. The wall of most above-ground pools (if quality) is made of steel in one continuous piece which is bolted together at one point -- you can't simply "pick it up" and move it --the wall alone would easily weigh in the neighorhood of 200 pounds, without the liner attached. The operation would require a minimum of three people, more would actually be necessary if you didn't want to risk damaging the wall or the liner when you tried to move it to bury the body -- which would be essential if your plan was to place the pool back as though nothing had happened. I can't imagine that you could pull it off without leaving clear evidence that you had done something with the pool -- there would be sand from the "cove base" all around the reset pool, as well as damage to the lawn from the weight as you were moving things around. Most importantly, it would be nearly impossible to avoid damaging the pool in some way during the operation.

Now, people do (and I did more than once) drain the pools for cleaning, etc. -- but it's not something you do as a rule. Most of the time you just drain them down to about 1/3 depth and cover them for the off-season -- then condition and restart the water when the new season begins. Above-ground pools are simply not designed to be moved once they are installed.

The bottom line is that it would really be nearly impossible to do this without lots of help, and no small amount of luck. Could the whole family have done it together? Sure, but I think it's exceptionally unlikely.

Thank you. That's my whole point, it is nearly impossible to bury someone under the pool liner without a heck of a lot of help.

 

[Patty G]

if she was buried under the pool, wouldn't LE have noticed a disturbance at the bottom of it? is it a plastic bottom or a concrete/cement bottom?

It is a plastic bottom sitting on soil or sand. LE would probably notice that the bottom of the pool in one spot may not be quite level, not so much a bump, but it would show signs of disturbance at the bottom of the pool.

 

[drumstick]

I thought I would throw this out there because of discussion about the pool and back yard.

We've already discussed the drowning theory and that KC backed the car up to load the baby's body...

What if we're wrong. What if she unloaded instead of loading?

On June 18 when the neighbor said she backed up to the garage and borrowed a shovel for an hour, why did we think she dug up the body?

Isn't just as possible that Caylee died somewhere else and she brought the baby home and buried her somewhere around the house?

Under the pool, under where the new pavers were installed?

Wouldn't it be easy to dig under the pool and hide her there?
Or under her sandbox?

What do you think?

 

[ThoughtElf]

Water is expensive in Florida and unless the liner has a leak, or the pool owner decides to remove the pool, chances of this pool being drained to bury Caylee ... well IMO, I don't feel this happened.

It takes quite a while to drain a pool of that size. Once it's drained, then you have the liner to contend with. It takes a few people to remove this liner. Once the liner is removed you have to deal with the walls of the pool as the walls are pretty flexible without the water supporting the walls. Or it could be visa versa, take the walls down then the liner.

The entire neighborhood would certainly have been aware that the street has all this water running down it for days and days.

ITA. Remember in this neighbourhood, they even noticed when Casey backed the car in, which was unusual. I believe the neighbours would have noted, and mentioned, had the pool been drained any time between June 15th and July 16th.

 

[Sleuth5]

It is a plastic bottom sitting on soil or sand. LE would probably notice that the bottom of the pool in one spot may not be quite level, not so much a bump, but it would show signs of disturbance at the bottom of the pool.

Quite true, and unless you had followed the same procedure used when initially setting the base (levelling, sanding, and compacting), the weight of the water would reveal the gravesite immediately. There's just no getting around how easy it is to see flaws in those sand bases once all that weight is in the pool.

I should also point out that -- as I think you've already said, Patty G -- you could do this without moving the wall at all, simply by draining the pool sufficiently to be able to handle the liner -- but even that is harder than it sounds. You don't have to have much water in the pool for it to be very heavy, especially when you're trying to wrangle a floppy liner around enough to get it out of the way so that you could do your digging. More importatly, though, you'd have to know how to even go about getting the liner free from the wall -- Casey doesn't strike me as being able to work that out without damaging things -- then there's the putting it back together -- It just isn't a practical plan for someone by themselves.

 

[suzet]

But what about the filter? Several weeks ago I posted on another board that I would have hoped in their initial search of the Anthony yard, LE would have taken the filter, it's contents, and any hoses to be examined. I wonder if this was done. It's been bugging me since the case broke. (OT: That, and the pipes/hoses to the washing machine/stationary tub).

 

[Patty G]

Under the pool, under where the new pavers were installed?

Wouldn't it be easy to dig under the pool and hide her there?
Or under her sandbox?

What do you think?

The new pavers were not installed under the pool.

Only way to dig under the pool is to empty it, etc.

Digging under the sandbox is a good thought!

 

[Short_Stuff]

I dont know about the pool, but I know LE dug up 2 holes in the yard. And Ive been saying for weeks, search dogs hitting, or no search dogs, Id feel alot beter if they dug up the ENTIRE yard!

 

[Patty G]

Quite true, and unless you had followed the same procedure used when initially setting the base (levelling, sanding, and compacting), the weight of the water would reveal the gravesite immediately. There's just no getting around how easy it is to see flaws in those sand bases once all that weight is in the pool.

I should also point out that -- as I think you've already said, Patty G -- you could do this without moving the wall at all, simply by draining the pool sufficiently to be able to handle the liner -- but even that is harder than it sounds. You don't have to have much water in the pool for it to be very heavy, especially when you're trying to wrangle a floppy liner around enough to get it out of the way so that you could do your digging. More importatly, though, you'd have to know how to even go about getting the liner free from the wall -- Casey doesn't strike me as being able to work that out without damaging things -- then there's the putting it back together -- It just isn't a practical plan for someone by themselves.

About 44 years , I use to help my in-laws set up their above ground pool, every Spring back in New Jersey, and this was an all day procedure for 4 adults. Nohing like the poolsof today made in hard plastic, but the metal type. Either way, the procedure was and is the same today.

 

[Angelray]

retention pond ..What is this?

 

[Patty G]

But what about the filter? Several weeks ago I posted on another board that I would have hoped in their initial search of the Anthony yard, LE would have taken the filter, it's contents, and any hoses to be examined. I wonder if this was done. It's been bugging me since the case broke. (OT: That, and the pipes/hoses to the washing machine/stationary tub).

You have to keep in mind that 31 days had past before LE got involved. There was a lot of chemicals flowing through the filter of the pool and hoses over 31 days as well as a lot of laundry being done, perhaps with bleach over 31 days.

 

[BondJamesBond]

I dont know about the pool, but I know LE dug up 2 holes in the yard. And Ive been saying for weeks, search dogs hitting, or no search dogs, Id feel alot beter if they dug up the ENTIRE yard!

Interesting responses so far. Some people w/ these pools say it can be done, some say it can't.

I'm thinking w/ all of the resources being expended searching many, many square miles of rough terrain of central FL that (after looking over their montly water bills for the past few years and maybe seeing more usage in Jun/Jul) an OSCO LE intern could go over to the Anthony pool w/ the blessing of the all-too-willing-to-cooperate Anthony's, run a hose out the back, and drain the sucker. In a day it'd be done, the liner could be moved and cadaver dogs, ground penetrating sonar or shovels would rule it out.

Wouldn't it just be priceless to see the Anthony reaction? "Hi, I'm the OSCO LE intern, I'm here to drain your pool."

 

[drumstick]

I dont know about the pool, but I know LE dug up 2 holes in the yard. And Ive been saying for weeks, search dogs hitting, or no search dogs, Id feel alot beter if they dug up the ENTIRE yard!

I agree completely!

In other cases I've seen them totally excavate an entire backyard to clear it.

I can't help thinking that until everything cluttering that yard is removed and searched, excavated and completely cleared there will always be a haunting thought that Caylee has been there the whole time.

:sheesh:

 

[Macushla]

I would think the cadaver dogs would have hit on the pool area, no matter how deeply she might have been buried under it and despite the chemicals that might be around. Didn't the dogs go over the whole back yard, but only hit in two areas?