Jahi’s family wants her declared 'alive again’

[Leilei]

A link would be helpful.

FYI: the Court hearing was POSTPONED.

Other tests performed by various physicians had not been conducted, which is needed for the court to consider.


http://www.christianpost.com/news/j...dead-despite-her-breathing-and-eating-127813/

The fact that this article considers Jahi's surgery "routine" tells me that they are either not informed, or pushing an agenda. JMO. It's been almost a year, and we all know that this was NOT a routine tonsillectomy.

 

[TJL]

The fact that this article considers Jahi's surgery "routine" tells me that they are either not informed, or pushing an agenda. JMO. It's been almost a year, and we all know that this was NOT a routine tonsillectomy.

All one needs to do is to consider the source (the part between the http:// and the last /) to know it was pushing an agenda. The article's content merely confirms it.

 

[Leilei]

All one needs to do is to consider the source (the part between the http:// and the last /) to know it was pushing an agenda. The article's content merely confirms it.

Absolutely. Can we get some legit links up in here?

 

[Donjeta]

It's not very hard to manipulate menstruation in a female of fertile age as any ladies who have ever taken hormones to skip their period can testify.

Normally the hypothalamus in the brain produces GnRh to stimulate pituitary hormones LH and FSH which in turn stimulate the ovaries. Ovaries produce estrogens which stimulate endometrial growth, progesterone from the corpus luteum maintains it, and if you didn't get pregnant, menstruation occurs when progesterone levels drop low enough. But birth control pills bypass the normal hormonal control in a way as they bring synthetic hormones into the system, suppress the LH peak and allows menstruation without ovulation.

Women with pituitary or hypothalamic dysfunction (hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism) can menstruate as long as they get estrogens in their system and it is thought that hormone replacement has health benefits as low estrogen can cause some problems.

Now if you want to induce an ovulatory cycle in a woman with no pituitary and hypothalamic hormone production, that would be more complicated and involve fertility drugs, but anovulatory menstrual cycle wouldn't be hard to accomplish I think.

 

[TJL]

It's not very hard to manipulate menstruation in a female of fertile age as any ladies who have ever taken hormones to skip their period can testify.

Normally the hypothalamus in the brain produces GnRh to stimulate pituitary hormones LH and FSH which in turn stimulate the ovaries. Ovaries produce estrogens which stimulate endometrial growth, progesterone from the corpus luteum maintains it, and if you didn't get pregnant, menstruation occurs when progesterone levels drop low enough. But birth control pills suppress the Women with pituitary or hypothalamic dysfunction (hypogonadotrophic hypogonadism) can menstruate as long as they get estrogens in their system and it is thought that hormone replacement has health benefits as low estrogen can cause some problems.

Now if you want to induce an ovulatory cycle in a woman with no pituitary and hypothalamic hormone production, that would be more complicated and involve fertility drugs, but anovulatory menstrual cycle wouldn't be hard to accomplish I think.

Unless you provide us with links that birth control exists, I refuse to believe it.

 

[TJL]

And what agenda are they pushing? I only post the article, I don't write the content or get my panties in a bunch over details such as whether a tonsillectomy is routine or not. Seems to be a hysterical over-reach on the part of the reader rather than the writer.

JMO

I would say for starters, an agenda of not publishing facts. When an article deliberately omits critical, factual evidence, mislabels other factual evidence, and draws conclusions for the reader, then they do not even meet a journalistic standard of reporting facts. They're just perpetuating an agenda. This is not a fine line, or even an accidental one.

 

[Leilei]

<modsnip>

I am not hysterically over-reaching. This has never been about a routine surgery, and anyone who looks back at the links and posts would realize that. That person can also look back at very recent links about Dolan's agenda, and possibly the families. IMO.

 

[TJL]

<modsnip> I am not hysterically over-reaching. This has never been about a routine surgery, and anyone who looks back at the links and posts would realize that. That person can also look back at very recent links about Dolan's agenda, and possibly the families. IMO.

Whenever I see Omari Sealey standing around on camera, I always think back to his on-camera interview in front of the hospital where he said, "This is about chump change."

It's all I need to remind myself that the family's agenda has been money. I mean, Omari said it himself. It's about chump change.

 

[K_Z]

A day after withdrawing his petition to ask the courts to find Jahi McMath alive again, Christopher Dolan is getting back to other matters in his law practice.

http://www.sfexaminer.com/sanfranci...ss-expanded-in-california/Content?oid=2908653

 

[K_Z]

Does anyone have an opinion about the retired reknowned neurologist saying that Jahi could understand speech because that part of her brain is functioning? Also, he said that her brain stem and pons are damaged. Has anyone ever improved from brain stem damage enough to breath on their own, or would they stay in a vegetative state and on a respirator?

Jahi's pons and brainstem are not merely damaged, but essentially destroyed and largely "missing" on the MRI images publicized by Dolan and the family. Anyone with that degree of central brain damage would be permanently unable to breathe, and unconscious. Donjeta wrote a wonderful post up thread explaining the interconnections within the central brain structures. Brain cortex is not really intact either. Just because some structural remnants remain doesn't mean that the tissue is at all functional. And as Dr. Fisher pointed out in his declaration to the court, there is no requirement for the brain to be liquefied to meet brain death criteria. Presence or absence of anatomic structures is not addressed in the brain death criteria. And brain tissue, once lost to the sequelae of anoxic destruction, doesn't regenerate.

This isn't "locked in syndrome." Jahi's brain was without any blood flow or perfusion for at least 2 weeks, 10 months ago.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locked-in_syndrome

 

[TJL]

Jahi's pons and brainstem are not merely damaged, but essentially destroyed and largely "missing" on the MRI images publicized by Dolan and the family. Anyone with that degree of central brain damage would be permanently unable to breathe, and unconscious. Donjeta wrote a wonderful post up thread explaining the interconnections within the central brain structures. Brain cortex is not really intact either. Just because some structural remnants remain doesn't mean that the tissue is at all functional. And as Dr. Fisher pointed out in his declaration to the court, there is no requirement for the brain to be liquefied to meet brain death criteria. Presence or absence of anatomic structures is not addressed in the brain death criteria. And brain tissue, once lost to the sequelae of anoxic destruction, doesn't regenerate.

This isn't "locked in syndrome." Jahi's brain was without any blood flow or perfusion for at least 2 weeks, 10 months ago.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Locked-in_syndrome

I'm glad a medical professional with no financial interest in this matter, with expertise in the areas of breathing and unconsciousness, weighed in here personally. It's very telling when even semi-anonymous professionals with nothing to gain or lose will come right out and say that the visibly-destroyed and largely missing parts of the brain shown are directly and independently responsible for brain functions that, without which, would render the brain dead.

DocBastard said the same things

 

[K_Z]

Big thanks to TJL for this reference up thread. I'm working my way thru all 150 pages or so.

Basically, Dr. Machado is cut from the same cloth as Dr. Shewmon, which should be no great surprise that Dolan and the family are using them. Machado also believes in the "organism" explanation of alive, same as Shewmon-- meaning that the brain dead body on somatic organ support is still "alive"' in their opinion. They both separate out the "human personhood" from their discussions, and leave that up to philosophers and religious authorities. This is largely how they arrive at the conclusion that brain dead individuals are not dead, or should not be considered dead until irreversible cardiac death. (I sort of wonder how they would define a hypothetically brain dead body on cardiopulmonary bypass? Or a decapitated body that was somehow able to be supported mechanically?)

Also noted that Dr. Paul Byrne, not entirely unexpectedly, authors a chapter on "brain dead is not dead."

It's a good read, even of one doesn't agree with all of the opinions.

Here is the link again, with credit to TJL.

http://books.google.com/books?hl=en...PMhmxwFc6uCGmROwYVARwceuc#v=onepage&q&f=false

 

[TJL]

A day after withdrawing his petition to ask the courts to find Jahi McMath alive again, Christopher Dolan is getting back to other matters in his law practice.

http://www.sfexaminer.com/sanfranci...ss-expanded-in-california/Content?oid=2908653

Wow, that's rather strange. So, he was right back to preparing, researching, and writing articles about other "stuff" the very morning he was actually focused on and prepared to be in court for a high-profile case. Where does he find the time to switch between issues so quickly and adeptly?

 

[K_Z]

Wow, that's rather strange. So, he was right back to preparing, researching, and writing articles about other "stuff" the very morning he was actually focused on and prepared to be in court for a high-profile case. Where does he find the time to switch between issues so quickly and adeptly?

Presumably, the "sandbagging" didn't leave any permanent damage, lol!

He's a busy bee, that attorney! Master of multitasking!

 

[TJL]

Big thanks to TJL for this reference up thread. I'm working my way thru all 150 pages or so.

Basically, Dr. Machado is cut from the same cloth as Dr. Shewmon, which should be no great surprise that Dolan and the family are using them. Machado also believes in the "organism" explanation of alive, same as Shewmon-- meaning that the brain dead body on somatic organ support is still "alive"' in their opinion. They both separate out the "human personhood" from their discussions, and leave that up to philosophers and religious authorities. This is largely how they arrive at the conclusion that brain dead individuals are not dead, or should not be considered dead until irreversible cardiac death. (I sort of wonder how they would define a hypothetically brain dead body on cardiopulmonary bypass? Or a decapitated body that was somehow able to be supported mechanically?)

Also noted that Dr. Paul Byrne, not entirely unexpectedly, authors a chapter on "brain dead is not dead."

It's a good read, even of one doesn't agree with all of the opinions.

Here is the link again, with credit to TJL.

http://books.google.com/books?hl=en...PMhmxwFc6uCGmROwYVARwceuc#v=onepage&q&f=false

You're most welcome. I have to admit that I was a little overwhelmed and out of my league with some of the terminology he was using, so I just went for the areas that weren't above my level of comprehension. I was fortunate that much of it wasn't too difficult to digest, and the part about human being vs. personhood was interesting to me, too, but I couldn't get past his suggestion that it needed to be left up to religion. In other words, I didn't want to start a religious discussion so I left it up to the reader to find that stuff in his own writings and interpret as they see fit, LOL.

 

[katydid23]

Big thanks to TJL for this reference up thread. I'm working my way thru all 150 pages or so.

Basically, Dr. Machado is cut from the same cloth as Dr. Shewmon, which should be no great surprise that Dolan and the family are using them. Machado also believes in the "organism" explanation of alive, same as Shewmon-- meaning that the brain dead body on somatic organ support is still "alive"' in their opinion. They both separate out the "human personhood" from their discussions, and leave that up to philosophers and religious authorities. This is largely how they arrive at the conclusion that brain dead individuals are not dead, or should not be considered dead until irreversible cardiac death. (I sort of wonder how they would define a hypothetically brain dead body on cardiopulmonary bypass? Or a decapitated body that was somehow able to be supported mechanically?)

Also noted that Dr. Paul Byrne, not entirely unexpectedly, authors a chapter on "brain dead is not dead."

It's a good read, even of one doesn't agree with all of the opinions.

Here is the link again, with credit to TJL.

http://books.google.com/books?hl=en...PMhmxwFc6uCGmROwYVARwceuc#v=onepage&q&f=false

As a mother, I can't help but wonder, is this the way I would want my child to 'live?' Without their 'human-personhood? 'Would I want her to have a beating heart and be able to breathe by machine, but have no way to communicate or comprehend? It is so sad. I cannot imagine the pain of losing a child. It must be incomprehensible. But millions of people have to deal with it and it still seems better than keeping the child in a limbo type state of living-death, imo.

 

[K_Z]

Also interesting that Dr. Paul Byrne has, for his entire career, opined as a medical doctor on the religious nature of personhood, as he opines on the organism theory of alive versus dead. He is a devout Catholic, yet is at odds with Vatican position statements on a lot of things related to brain death, death of the person, when organ donation is ethical and permissible, etc. (Discussed in some of the older Jahi threads here.)

 

[K_Z]

As a mother, I can't help but wonder, is this the way I would want my child to 'live?' Would I want her to have a beating heart and be able to breathe by machine, but have no way to communicate or comprehend? It is so sad. I cannot imagine the pain of losing a child. It must be incomprehensible. But millions of people have to deal with it and it still seems better than keeping the child in a limbo type state of living-death, imo.

I think it is even sadder, and reprehensible, that so many people are so willing to encourage her delusions about Jahi improving and recovering. I really think it's unethical. Call it what it is, but don't encourage false hope. NW clearly believes that if she wills it, and appeals to a higher power with enough faith, that her daughter will rise again. She even had it tattooed on her arm. There is hope and faith, then there is false hope. She is pressuring her God for a resurrection, and won't take no for an answer, IMO.

And the woman "befriending" NW, who has paid $150,000 to Defina's IBRF? Gmab. Paying a snake oil salesman? That's extortion, IMO-- but clearly the woman has no qualms with paying these vast sums to Defina's organization out of desperation to try to improve her daughters plight. That's profoundly sad, IMO. And probably not the kind of "friend" NW needs, IMO.

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/loca...-Lisa-Huse-Friends-Brain-Death-278545241.html

Doctors told Huse her daughter wouldn’t survive.

Huse didn’t listen. And she held fundraisers to pay the initial $100,000 to Philip Defina, CEO of the International Brain Research Foundation in Flanders, NJ.

Her daughter, now 23, still is seen by foundation specialists, which her mother pays $50,000 each year for their services. She held the fifth annual "Journey for Jessica" fundraiser last month.

Defina is now the quiet coordinator of Jahi’s family’s latest attempt to convince a judge the teen is not dead, based on expert testimony his foundation has funded. Two witnesses Defina paid for are arguing that Jahi is alive because of a new EEG and MRI taken in September at Rutgers University.

BBM.

 

[TJL]

Presumably, the "sandbagging" didn't leave any permanent damage, lol!

He's a busy bee, that attorney! Master of multitasking!

Yep. I guess my insinuation - or opinion - is that he knew all along he wasn't taking it to court, and had prepared his "CHO forces a postponement" press release long in advance because he had more profitable things to do that morning.

 

[TJL]

I think it is even sadder, and reprehensible, that so many people are so willing to encourage her delusions about Jahi improving and recovering. I really think it's unethical. Call it what it is, but don't encourage false hope. NW clearly believes that if she wills it, and appeals to a higher power with enough faith, that her daughter will rise again. She even had it tattooed on her arm. There is hope and faith, then there is false hope. She is pressuring her God for a resurrection, and won't take no for an answer, IMO.

And the woman "befriending" NW, who has paid $150,000 to Defina's IBRF? Gmab. Paying a snake oil salesman? That's extortion, IMO-- but clearly the woman has no qualms with paying these vast sums to Defina's organization out of desperation to try to improve her daughters plight. That's profoundly sad, IMO. And probably not the kind of "friend" NW needs, IMO.

NW has been surrounded by the same types of people peddling the same agenda from the very beginning. It came as no surprise to me that a major contributor to IBRF's "research funds" latched on to NW's inner circle.