Jason Young to get new trial

[Madeleine74]

The advice is: "don't talk to police without a lawyer present." Not "don't ever ever ever talk to police."

The smart thing to do is get a lawyer. I would do that for sure. Then, if I had nothing to do with the crime, I would at least be willing to assist where I could, if I could, with my lawyer present to guide and protect my interests at all times.

How were police to know if this was a burglary gone wrong? Who would know this other than the very people who resided in the house? Well, one adult was dead, murdered, and the other the only one who could say for sure what, if anything, was missing.

And, if I were guilty of such a crime, I would do exactly as JY did. Not say nuttin' to no one ever. JY protected himself as long as he could; he avoided indictment for years. But eventually it does catch up.

 

[Nymeria]

Answers/Questions in Bold-

Police used tunnel vision and attempted to wrap evidence around the suspect. For example, when they learned that a door was propped open, they attempted to attribute this to Jason. However, they failed to recognize the fact that Jason did not need to prop open a door that would be unlocked at 6AM, as that was prior to the time that he could return from Raleigh to the hotel (if he committed the murder). The door was propped open, but there was no reason for Jason to prop open the door. Police allege that Jason left his hotel room unlocked, but it is very difficult to believe that this was not noticed when the receipt was slipped under the door and the newspaper was hung on the door handle. Police need the hotel door to be unlocked, but evidence does not support his belief.

Just bear with me, OK?
Try to see it from a different POV....
Maybe he propped it because he thought he might make it back before 6 am?

People pushing papers under a door or hanging newspapers would have no clue a door was unlocked. That is if this is the "keycard" type of hotel room door.
If you mean he had his room door propped open then I can say Yes, that would be noticed.
(I do not know any of these specifics to date...).


The Judge screwed up, obviously, as the appeal was successful.

Is the onus always on the Judge when a case is appealed?
I am going to admit total bias when it comes to Judge Stephens, so I will have a hard time being convinced he did something termed a "screw up".

 

[JusticeFever]

I didn't say which witness, if any of the morning witnesses at/near Birchleaf Ln , I "trusted." I might not believe any of them and discard all of them in the end.

Gracie had corroborating facts in that she was able to tell police a light colored large SUV (not unlike a Ford Explorer as an example), pulled into the furthest pump from the office. The time was correct (right before 5:30am) That was unprompted. She further had a cash receipt that showed a $15 purchase of gas, paid with a $20 and she also told and showed a $5 overage in which the person, after cussing her out, left without taking his $5 in change. Her story holds true and the receipt proves there was such a customer.

Like any "eye witness," it comes down to believing their story or not and incorporating or disregarding their testimony. One person's "credible" is another person's "untrustworthy." Good thing eye witness testimony is not the only evidence in this case.

Gracie did the best she could, but her testimony was not convincing, imo. She needed help from the Judge to describe Jason and she insisted that there was a customer in her store that witnessed Jason's rude behavior. No such person was ever found, despite numerous efforts by LE, handing out flyers and putting them in the store. She said the person was a regular customer and came in every day, Then she said he was a newpsaper delivery person, and that person failed to confirm. I would be curious what the Jurors in both trials thought of her testimony..I don't think she was lying, she was just very mixed up. I would have loved to have seen her balance sheet from her shift to see if there was indeed a $5.00 overage, nothing like that was ever presented when Tiki Ingram, the store manager testifed. Gracie described Jason as the same height as her and we know Jason would tower over her if he ever got into her face, I seriously doubt anyone who just killed their wife would do anything, anything at all to bring extra added attention to themselves by cursing out a clerk over having to come in and pay for gas. Plus, Jason would have no idea the cameras in the store were not working that morning and he would have been arrested immediately or if LE was sure of Gracie's identification of him.However, unsure and somewhat of a risk, Gracie was the person they needed, and they told her so, when they went to see her.
Gracie will have a 3rd time to testify, soon.

 

[JusticeFever]

Answers/Questions in Bold-

Sorry, your post didn't come through!!

Young's door was not just unlocked, it was ajar. And, if you hung a newspaper on the doorknob, it would be noticeable, the same when Keith Hicks put the hotel receipt over the door.

 

[JusticeFever]

I don't care how many times you post it. I said IMO.

twisting your words, lying and misquoting does not make you guilty.

There is no evidence of alot of things the JY-innocent here are posting. That is what you do on a forum- discuss and speculate. You think he would have kept the spare gas cans if there were any??? Probably would have kept that dark shirt too.

Still doesn't explain away the witness saying it was him, acting like him, or explaining why the overpay.

The was a reason for it... we just don't know what.

What is with this JY-innocent name calling? I have supplied links, corrected several things that were not right by people that believe Jason did it, there is no reason to call people out because they see reasonable doubt.

 

[otto]

Why would you (otto) not provide all the information you could? Whatever the question lines. What could he possibly say to incriminate himself at that point?
Hanging up is rude/suspicious/stupid IMO.

Seems from what I recall he was very sleepy on the return trip. Tired or depressed?

I have no idea how I would react in that situation. It sounds like a man had just learned that his wife had been murdered and he was rushing home to get more information. While he was rushing home, police phoned him and said something that was perceived as rude. He had been forewarned that police believed him to be the prime suspect and that he should get a lawyer prior to speaking with police. In that situation, I would probably be inclined to cut short a conversation with police. I'm pretty sure that police would do everything possible to avoid ending the call, so perhaps Jason had little choice but to either speak with them, or hang up on them. I don't know, but I do know that police have all sorts of tactics for getting information from people - including prolonging a conversation to the point where rudeness may be the only option for ending that conversation.

 

[otto]

Did the Judge screw up those things... or was it because of the civil case being brought in?

The Judge chose to allow evidence that would advance the guilty verdict, but which was not allowed for consideration by the jury. I think the Judge knew better.

 

[JusticeFever]

I have no idea how I would react in that situation. It sounds like a man had just learned that his wife had been murdered and he was rushing home to get more information. While he was rushing home, police phoned him and said something that was perceived as rude. He had been forewarned that police believed him to be the prime suspect and that he should get a lawyer prior to speaking with police. In that situation, I would probably be inclined to cut short a conversation with police. I'm pretty sure that police would do everything possible to avoid ending the call, so perhaps Jason had little choice but to either speak with them, or hang up on them. I don't know, but I do know that police have all sorts of tactics for getting information from people - including prolonging a conversation to the point where rudeness may be the only option for ending that conversation.

I would have to go back and look, but I am pretty sure it was Jason's mother who hung up on the police. The call was getting heated , something was said like "he is on the way back, and they said "he better be" .
But, it won't be that long before a 3rd trial and we can do this all again!

 

[dgfred]

That is not calling someone out or name-calling. It was a description only. Sorry if it offended you. You can call me JY-guilty if you like... it doesn't bother me.

My point was that both sides speculate because you said there is NO evidence of gas cans.

 

[JusticeFever]

The Judge chose to allow evidence that would advance the guilty verdict, but which was not allowed for consideration by the jury. I think the Judge knew better.

Otto, I am curious if the word slayer was actually used in court too, as well. Do you know?
I have to admit there are some things I don't remember, even though I am looking up stuff and listening to previous testimony even now. Between this and the Cooper trial, there is so much stuff to research!

 

[dgfred]

Did he/they have to answer the call in the first place?

 

[JusticeFever]

That is not calling someone out or name-calling. It was a description only. Sorry if it offended you. You can call me JY-guilty if you like... it doesn't bother me.

My point was that both sides speculate because you said there is NO evidence of gas cans.

I didn't say anything about gas cans, I don't even know what you are talking about.

 

[dgfred]

Otto, I am curious if the word slayer was actually used in court too, as well. Do you know?
I have to admit there are some things I don't remember, even though I am looking up stuff and listening to previous testimony even now. Between this and the Cooper trial, there is so much stuff to research!

He was named as Slayer in the civil one. It sure was used here... but not in trial as far as I know.

 

[dgfred]

I didn't say anything about gas cans, I don't even know what you are talking about.

Sorry again... that was jova I think.

 

[JusticeFever]

Did he/they have to answer the call in the first place?

I would imagine if LE calls, you answer. They probably wanted them to know they were on the way back to Raleigh and would be there as soon as they could. And, they were.

 

[JusticeFever]

He was named as Slayer in the civil one. It sure was used here... but not in trial as far as I know.

I know that was the ruling in the civil case, I am just wondering if the actual term slayer was used in the criminal case, because that would definitely be prejudicial.
All of this doesn't really matter though, we are geared up and ready to go for Trial 3,,probably 2015,
I was just thinking of all the people who are going to have to testify again, families, friends, witnesses,

 

[sunshine05]

I know there was no rape kit done.
But if there were any signs of rape during autopsy I am sure they would have done one.
There has to be a pretty good reason they did not do one.
Autopsies (and people performing them) can tell when sexual intercourse has occurred with or without fluids present (semen).

Not trying to be a PITA but honestly, from reading here, so far-
Court system was incompetent/corrupt
LE was incompetent/corrupt
Witness' were incompetent
And now possibly ME was incompetent

That seems to be a lot of groups doing things wrong to make sure JY gets the blame for all of this, KWIM?

Not necessarily to make sure he got the blame. I just think investigative expertise is lacking in NC based on what I know from the Mark Carver case, the Brad Cooper case and this case. I don't believe it's to intentionally botch the investigation but there are some major problems. ie. in the Cooper case CCBI placed entomology specimens in a locker for two weeks and few survived by the time they were tested. That could have presented a much better indication of time of death.

In this case, they didn't collect the body for the autopsy until almost 24 hours after she was found. Again, time of death could have been much more precise had they acted sooner.

Carver - There's some questionable "touch" DNA in that case and they overlooked evidence of suicide.

 

[sunshine05]

Otto, I am curious if the word slayer was actually used in court too, as well. Do you know?
I have to admit there are some things I don't remember, even though I am looking up stuff and listening to previous testimony even now. Between this and the Cooper trial, there is so much stuff to research!

Yes, it was.

Note that I made this video *before* the appeal decision was released.

Why Jason Young Will Win His Appeal - YouTube

 

[MyBelle]

My understanding of "rage killing" is that it is a spontaneous, uncontrolled response to a situation or experience, and I don't understand how anyone could drive for several hours in an uncontrollable rage. If rage was a factor in this murder, I would categorize the rage as an underlying trait that is commonly seen in sociopathic behaviour. Has Jason been diagnosed as a sociopath?

"The sense of entitlement that comes with sociopathy is astonishing to those who abide by the social laws and conventions of our culture. Where does the entitlement come from? It stems from an underlying sense of rage. Sociopaths feel deeply angry and resentful underneath their often-charming exterior, and this rage fuels their sense that they have the right to act out in whichever way they happen to choose at the time. Everything is up for grabs with sociopaths and nothing is off limits."

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...g-the-sociopath-cause-motivation-relationship

"Antisocial Personality Disorder--also referred to as sociopathy, psychopathy or dyssocial personality --generally involves, since childhood, a chronic and pathological anger, rage and resentment toward others. As I have suggested elsewhere (see previous post), antisocial personality disorder is, at its core, an anger disorder. Sociopathy centers around a deep-seated hostility toward family, culture, world, destiny, fate, God, reality, and indeed, toward life itself. But the dyssocial personality is highly proficient at masking this underlying and largely unconscious hostility and hatred. They are masterful actors, having honed and practiced their skills since early childhood. Like the narcissistic personality disorder, they have learned to conceal their deeply wounded true selves behind what Winnicott called a "false self." What the world sees in such badly damaged and dangerous individuals is an extremely rigid defensive persona, to employ Jung's pragmatic term, which originates from the dramatic masks worn by stage actors in the ancient Greek theatre. A carefully constructed and meticulously maintained false self, behind which the raging, wounded, depressed true self lies. For example, Drew Peterson has been reportedly described by former girlfriends and wives as extremely controlling, possessive and jealous, at times spying on them and reacting angrily and abusively to any actual or imagined abandonment, betrayal or rejection."

http://www.psychologytoday.com/blog...ting-disguised-personality-disorders-part-two

Great post, Otto. Thanks for pointing this out.

 

[Tia]

I have no idea how I would react in that situation. It sounds like a man had just learned that his wife had been murdered and he was rushing home to get more information. While he was rushing home, police phoned him and said something that was perceived as rude. He had been forewarned that police believed him to be the prime suspect and that he should get a lawyer prior to speaking with police. In that situation, I would probably be inclined to cut short a conversation with police. I'm pretty sure that police would do everything possible to avoid ending the call, so perhaps Jason had little choice but to either speak with them, or hang up on them. I don't know, but I do know that police have all sorts of tactics for getting information from people - including prolonging a conversation to the point where rudeness may be the only option for ending that conversation.

Who forewarned him? I don't remember that.
Thank you!