Jodi Arias; the sequence of events

[danzn16]

Just think about it. Get him into the shower. A gunshot wound to the head. And, leave.

No mess to clean up, just a few swipes of the dustcloth, one laundry--and leave.

No one knows you were there. No pings on the cell phone. No gas station receipts, no witnesses to your car or your blonde head.

This was almost the perfect crime.

How many lovers scorned dont think about the perfect crime and instead take out their anger beating their partner to death or stabbing them? To get the rage out. A shot would not have allowed that. I really don't know if JA wanted him to hurt or she was filled with such anger she wanted to stab him. Or if she wanted the perfect crime scene, which she didn't do.

We are rational humans not sitting in prison right now. I don't know if we can compare what we would do to something like what JA would do.

 

[bananarama]

One theory I haven't seen that I will throw out there.

Travis is finished with his shower after the last photo of him sitting. He gets up and out, goes over to the sink to brush his teeth or comb his hair. She comes behind him and stabs him in the back of the neck, blood spatters on the sink. He spins around, completely in shock, she stabs him in the chest. More blood on sink and floor around it. Unable to get the knife away from her, he sustains defensive hand wounds. Tries to get away by running down the hall, but collapses at the carpet. She stabs him in the back, pulls his head up for the neck wound. Drags him back to the bathroom, but he is still alive, possibly on his side, trying to get up one more time. Gun is hiding in the linen closet, she shoots him, puts him back in the shower.

Unleash the Sleuthers! ;-)

 

[SunDawnn]

My biggest question is about the roommate(s).

How many roommates does he have?
Where were they the 5 days TA stuffed in the shower? I know that they could not have been there, but I've heard little about his roommate.

My understanding he had two roommates. One being relatively new. Like only a few week tenancy by June 4th.

This was a big house. 5-bedrooms. 3-baths. I've heard Travis' portion of the house referred to as 'a wing'.

These 3 roommates weren't close friends and pretty much stayed to themselves. I read they never once ate a meal together in the house so it gives the impression it was more a flop house for the two roommates. A place to sleep, eat and bathe and not necessarily hangout.


What hasn't been mentioned that I can find is, did Jodi have their routines memorized? It appears she knew she's have this window of opportunity to kill Travis and make her escape without being found out by the two other men. Pretty risky if you ask me unless she knew for sure, they'd be out.

 

[SunDawnn]

In all due respect, I don't think the sequence of events is THAT important seeing they can establish motive without know what came first.

A gun was stolen. Same caliber used in shooting.
Hair was dyed before reaching Arizona.
Extra gas was brought and cash payments made along the way.
Cell phone was turned off.
Lied countless times to countless people about her whereabouts and cell conundrum.
She applied 3 methods of killing. Throat slash. Gun shot. Stabbing.
She changed her story 3 times.
Placed erroneous phone calls/text message/emails to Travis' after he was dead
She forged documents claiming he was a pedophile.
Blackmailed Prosecutor w/plea deal. When denied, pedophile was brought out as blackmailed.
She tried passing an encrypted message from her jail cell about 'her story'.

I mean....I can go on and on. So the question begs: does the order in which she actually killed Travis really matter?

There won't be one juror who won't find her not-guilty of 1st degree murder. She will be sentenced to death I believe.

 

[joypath]

I agree that this is how it should be. But, practically speaking, I don't think this is the way it works in my state. Think of the Cynthia Sommers case.

In my state, the Prosecutor and the ME work for the same boss. Have you ever seen the ME argue with the Prosecutor or vice versa?

You have a Jury who should stand outside of any government power making the decision. That is how it should be. Their salaries, livelihoods, and well-being does not depend on this verdict.

They have the collective life experience of 12 people. How do you know what they have seen? They have the common sense God gave them. And, the only thing directing them is, or should be, their conscience.

:twocents::twocents::twocents: M. D. does NOT stand for "major Deity" (and for those of you who have HCPs with the D. O. designation after his/her name), nor does D. O. represent "Deity other"!!!! :twocents::twocents::twocents: These are academic degrees achieved by INDIVIDUALS of varying levels of personal & professional attributes....my favorite quote from my Dad, who WAS a forensic pathologist: "How does the unknowing public address the lowest ranking graduate from medical school?" AS DOCTOR!

BBM
Regarding the dichotomy of OCME vs "BIG BOSS", in MANY States the agency has been removed from the political process and placed in an autonomous position answering to a Board of "what ever you want to call them". Long ago it was recognized that the OCME spoke for the decedent(s) and families. It is NOT part of the judicial system, it does NOT compete for funding et al.
UNDERLINED:
OH YEAH, I HAVE seen and DONE IT! :floorlaugh: I witnessed (as a child!)the aforementioned hero physician take on a well-entrenched politically protected, prosecutor even after said prosecutor was informed that the scientific data did NOT match his hypothesis (the prosecutor was going after a IRISH MAFIA
character).....Let's just say St. Patty's day was a bit tense @ Florian Hall that year! :great:
:rocker: Now on the other hand, I've never had to taken on a prosecutor but I have broken the hearts of a few LEOs by spoiling their weekends with suicide-like cases becoming actually homicides and vice versa! :rocker:

:waitasec: It's AMAZING what details can be determined with a well honed blade! :blushing::blushing:

 

[ExigentPlan]

Maybe JA just thought the knife would be quieter. She only used the gun after realizing how loud the attack ended up being and yet nobody came running. Who knows, who cares what her reasoning was. It doesn't change anything.

 

[ExigentPlan]

As for why JA says she shot first.... She could explain the presence of the knife through the rope/sex. But if she were to claim stabbing first and then going into a "fog" or blacking out then she would not be able to explain where the gun miraculously came from and ended up in her hands.

And for those that question how she could have gotten away with stabbing first without him beating the crap out of her... Look at the "accidental" picture of him sitting in the bottom of the shower. Besides being in an awkward half sitting/ half laying down position, notice how tightly legs are crossed and jammed in that tight shower. How easily could any of us get up quickly from that position while using our hands defensively from someone over top of us swinging a knife. Getting him into such a vulnerable position is just more evidence of her premeditation.

I would love to see prosecutor point out this position seconds before the attack started and show how impossible it would have been for him to lunge out of that shower as quickly and forcefully as she claims.

 

[Smelly Squirrel]

Just think about it. Get him into the shower. A gunshot wound to the head. And, leave.

No mess to clean up, just a few swipes of the dustcloth, one laundry--and leave.

No one knows you were there. No pings on the cell phone. No gas station receipts, no witnesses to your car or your blonde head.

This was almost the perfect crime.

No, it was far from a perfect crime from the get go. We shouldn't analyze this as from the perspective of a smart, well planned murder. Jodi is not smart at murder. It was a horribly planned murder, especially in that it was so obviously planned.

 

[danzn16]

Joypath what is your explanation for little blood being in the cranial cavity from the gunshot? Do you agree with the medical examiner?

Interested in your opinion!

 

[MajorCynic]

What hasn't been mentioned that I can find is, did Jodi have their routines memorized? It appears she knew she's have this window of opportunity to kill Travis and make her escape without being found out by the two other men. Pretty risky if you ask me unless she knew for sure, they'd be out.

I think she did know their basic routines. Further, it came up on several occasions during her direct testimony that she and Travis would discuss the roommates and whether or not they were home or expected any time soon - that was how they determined how much noise they could make (her words - not that she isn't a liar, but that part is probably true). She probably ascertained that one roommate was housesitting at his girlfriends, and the other one was out somewhere. She also knew that if the attack was contained in Travis' bedroom, she could lock the door and the roommates would never go in there anyway.

 

[SunDawnn]

Although interesting (and don't begrudge the debate but....) I think all these 'what came first' discussions in this case, are silly. To me it's such an open and shut case and what happened in the middle, is unimportant.

Here's the story in a nutshell:
Jodi drives stealthily to Arizona to kill Travis with a stolen gun, gets there early June 4th.....things happen (that are incidentals to the end result) and executes an innocent man in his bathroom.

She then goes on her merry way later that evening (still on June 4th) to visit her next possible potential future victim but.... gets caught a month later by a gentle mannered detective named, Mr Flores.

The End.

 

[Smelly Squirrel]

Yes, it has no bearing on guilt or punishment. It's really academic purposes only.

 

[Beccaboo]

okay, I will go first

I think he was stabbed in the chest first right after the last alive picture.

I think he went forward and she started stabbing his back and the back of his head (the camera is still in her hand, at this point... her right had which was pointed out in testimony). He sustains most of the defensive wounds at this point while is he is bent forward guarding his head.

The ceiling picture (which in testimony was taken right side up from waist height) was taken on accident somewhere here..after which the camera drops.

Travis comes out of the shower area and she stabs him again (maybe the stomach stab) that leaves blood on the floor by the toilet and where the scale was moved to.

He moves to the sink and bleeds over the sink coughing and spraying blood on the back of the mirror.

He moves down the closet side of the hall (waist high drag marks on the wall so he could be crouched over at this point) and ends up by the carpet area.

He collapses and his throat is slashed there on the carpet area.

She drags him back along the other side of the wall to the shower area.

she puts him into the shower (which is still running most likely).

She then goes to her purse to get the gun (some small amounts were found near the dresser) and she shoots him in the head.

I am still not sure if the water on the floor came from the running shower and Travis who had been in the shower or if she splashed some around for effect. The rug and the scale both showed signs of being moved.

:moo:

I agree with this except I think the water was her lame attempt to clean away evidence. I think the gun shot was almost an after thought.

 

[suepitzl]

My question is, why was he sitting in the shower? People don't sit in showers. IMO, she pulled the gun on him, told him to sit down then shot him in the head. I do not see how she could have possibly stabbed him first.

 

[Lulu67]

My question is, why was he sitting in the shower? People don't sit in showers. IMO, she pulled the gun on him, told him to sit down then shot him in the head. I do not see how she could have possibly stabbed him first.

I LURVE your avatar!!! lol :giggle:

 

[molly333]

My understanding he had two roommates. One being relatively new. Like only a few week tenancy by June 4th.

This was a big house. 5-bedrooms. 3-baths. I've heard Travis' portion of the house referred to as 'a wing'.

These 3 roommates weren't close friends and pretty much stayed to themselves. I read they never once ate a meal together in the house so it gives the impression it was more a flop house for the two roommates. A place to sleep, eat and bathe and not necessarily hangout.


What hasn't been mentioned that I can find is, did Jodi have their routines memorized? It appears she knew she's have this window of opportunity to kill Travis and make her escape without being found out by the two other men. Pretty risky if you ask me unless she knew for sure, they'd be out.

Did she know? There were calls to Travis leading up to the late night/early morning visit. Of course she would know.

Or do you think it was just a coincidence that one roommate was away altogether, for a few days?

IMO

 

[Applejack]

Maybe JA just thought the knife would be quieter. She only used the gun after realizing how loud the attack ended up being and yet nobody came running. Who knows, who cares what her reasoning was. It doesn't change anything.

In The Ninja story, the gun jammed. My thoughs are either that part was true, or the gun was onky used to allow her the means to overpower him and go crazy with the knife.

 

[Applejack]

As for why JA says she shot first.... She could explain the presence of the knife through the rope/sex. But if she were to claim stabbing first and then going into a "fog" or blacking out then she would not be able to explain where the gun miraculously came from and ended up in her hands.

Sure she could have. "I dont own a gun but Travis did and he kept it in his closet, I must have ran in there."

 

[Applejack]

If she picked up the casing, why was it spotless other than the bottom portion where it landed? Why no blood or even fingerprints?

Why would it not be spotless? Blood already on the floor. It fell directly into the blood without rolling. Either falling from the gun or from her accidentally dropping it.

As for fingerprints, i didnt know that. Has that been expliciteky stated?

 

[Smelly Squirrel]

Why would it not be spotless? Blood already on the floor. It fell directly into the blood without rolling. Either falling from the gun or from her accidentally dropping it.

As for fingerprints, i didnt know that. Has that been expliciteky stated?

Well she would probably have bloody hands. Sure, it's possible that after stabbing she picked it up, got no blood on it and somehow dropped it without knowing, or even kicked it with her bloody socks without knowing and without getting blood on it, but it's not as likely an explanation as that it simply landed there from the gunshot. Occam's razor.