John Andrew Ramsey

[SunnieRN]

ok, so he had a few years to ponder on it, lol.

In the same email, he mentioned Stewart 'getting his information' when in the car with him, Fleet, and his dad outside the house just after JBR's body was found, and them driving to the Fernies house.

Do you know what "information" he was referencing?

Is there a place this email can be found where it can be read in context in its entirety? Thanks for posting it. I had not seen it.

When Stewart, JAR and John entered the van, Stewart stated that John said to them that he had found JonBenet in the basement at 11:00. If I am not mistaken, an officer from BPD may have also heard the statement.

 

[cynic]

ok, so he had a few years to ponder on it, lol.

In the same email, he mentioned Stewart 'getting his information' when in the car with him, Fleet, and his dad outside the house just after JBR's body was found, and them driving to the Fernies house.

Do you know what "information" he was referencing?

Is there a place this email can be found where it can be read in context in its entirety? Thanks for posting it. I had not seen it.

When Stewart, JAR and John entered the van, Stewart stated that John said to them that he had found JonBenet in the basement at 11:00. If I am not mistaken, an officer from BPD may have also heard the statement.

Unexpectedly, a witness stepped forward and broke both his silence and John Ramsey’s story about the timing of the discovery of JonBenét’s body.

In a telephone interview, Stewart Long, the boyfriend of John Ramsey’s daughter Melinda, recounted for me the sudden rush to reach Colorado that he, Melinda, and her brother, John Andrew, had made on the morning of December 26. When they arrived at the Ramsey home shortly after 1 P.M., they were unaware of anything more than that JonBenét had been kidnapped.

Long said that John Ramsey climbed into a van with him and John Andrew and told them that JonBenét “was with Beth now.” The father and son broke down in tears as John Ramsey described how he had discovered the body around eleven 3’clock that morning.

I almost dropped the telephone as I reached to make sure the “record” button was pressed on my tape recorder. “When you say eleven o’clock that morning, are you assuming that was Mountain time or Eastern time?”

“I’m assuming that was Mountain time. He said eleven o’clock, so I’m assuming he was speaking of his own time reference.”

I was blown away. We had just found a credible witness who heard John Ramsey say he’d discovered the body two hours earlier than we previously believed. That punched a big hole in the generally accepted timeline. Eleven o’clock would have been just about the time John Ramsey temporarily vanished from the sight of Detective Arndt, when she thought he had gone out to get the mail. I recalled how Arndt described the marked change in his behavior after he came back, silent, brooding, and nervous.

JonBenet: Inside the Ramsey Murder Investigation

 

[RTC]

yeah, JR ......, im sure him stating that to SL and a LE officer had its reason.
Im sure he wasnt wearing the israeli fibered sweater the day JB was found. he was all showered and clean.
On the theory that JB was strangled outside the WC door because of the urine stain found and carpet fibers on JB, then whoever moved her into WC should have some traces of urine on the clothes? was she picked up and moved in WC or was she dragged? I also think that the description of how JR carried a dead JB by her waist etc seemed odd. Maybe he carried her that way because he remembered her being wet.

 

[Steely]

I've wondered if PR was involved, if she put the Dr. Seuss book into that suitcase of JAR's with his blanket and carried it down to the basement to point the finger at her stepson. Also, since JAR was the one who gave his Dad that flashlight, I'm suspicious it was thoroughly cleaned but left out for the same reason.

 

[KariKae]

I have never been comfortable with idea of John being the person to inflict the sexual abuse. Statistically, children are much more likely to be abused by a non biological authority figure than a biological parent. I can see JAR as the one to inflict the chronic abuse, especially if he was in the "testing the waters" phase (seeing what he could get away with).

I still don't see how he could have been the killer. If JAR was abusing JBR, I can see that as a catalyst for the murder. BUT that doesn't fit with PR covering it up, or John finding the body at 11 (earlier than reported).

The kidnapping for ransom theory fits - If JAR hired a college friend to do the kidnapping an covered it up. Especially an international student who wouldn't be missed on Christmas by their family and who has now left the county. And the kidnapping really did go bad. JAR saying, "I could pay $118,000" could be distancing himself. He could have been saying that amount was nothing to him, so he wouldn't kidnap for it. But again, it doesn't fit with PR assisting in the cover-up.

I think he could very easily be a piece of the puzzle, but I just can't make it fit.

 

[pistolina]

eileenhawkeye,

In the context of JAR's obsession. Can I mention his stuff being dumped into the basement and the collection of photographs discovered in the basement whose subject was JonBenet.

Could there be a link? I reckon there might be.


.

I have never heard anything about the photos. Link please - I would like to know more. Thank you!

 

[DeeDee249]

The R's later gave Mike their plane. I have no idea if it was because they could no longer afford it, or if it was for services rendered.

I think "services rendered". These same "services" may have contributed to the breakup of Mike's marriage, which happened after the crime.

 

[UKGuy]

I have never heard anything about the photos. Link please - I would like to know more. Thank you!

pistolina,
Here is the part of the interview where Patsy is questioned on the photos.

Underlying the police interviewers assumptions may be that the person who so avidly photographed JonBenet alive may also have taken nude photographs which are located somewhere else? And that this same person wished to photograph her deceased wearing her Barbie Nightdress. I mention this for completeness with reference to Johns perverted remarks.

Paranthetically: Consider JonBenet's posing skills, her use of makeup, her ease in front of the camera. e.g. was she coached and by whom, did someone other than the photographer have access to her pageant photos or were these custom made?




Patsy's 1998 BPD Interview Excerpt

21 THOMAS HANEY: Did you take some

22 photographs of JonBenet in the basement laundry

23 room?

24 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

25 TRIP DeMUTH: You had presents in

0186

1 the basement laundry room, right?

2 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

3 TRIP DeMUTH: So you wrapped

4 presents in the basement laundry room, right?

5 PATSY RAMSEY: Right.

6 TRIP DeMUTH: So you were down in

7 the basement laundry room pretty often?

8 PATSY RAMSEY: Depending on what

9 time of year it was, yeah, uh-hum.

10 TRIP DeMUTH: And do you remember

11 photographs being -- photographs of JonBenet

12 being in there?

13 PATSY RAMSEY: Taken of her in the

14 laundry room?

15 TRIP DeMUTH: No, no. Photographs

16 of her located in the laundry room?

17 PATSY RAMSEY: Oh, in the laundry

18 room, oh. I don't know, there was a bunch of

19 stuff, I mean wrapping stuff and everything. I

20 don't remember any photographs.

21 TRIP DeMUTH: Is there any reason

22 why there would be photographs of JonBenet

23 located in the laundry room?

24 PATSY RAMSEY: No. Were there --

25 I mean, did somebody find them there?

0187

1 TRIP DeMUTH: If there were, would

2 that be out of place for you?

3 PATSY RAMSEY: It would seem to be

4 out of place. I kept wrapping materials and

5 sometimes I worked, wrapping station, Christmas

6 paper and --

7 TRIP DeMUTH: Would -- who else had

8 access to the laundry room, who else would go in

9 there? I know everybody would have access, but

10 who else would use it? Would the boys play in

11 there? Would John go down there?

12 PATSY RAMSEY: I mean anybody

13 could, but I mean the boys could come down and

14 go in the train room, we had the train set up.

15 In the far back in through there, you know. Not

16 in the laundry, really, area.

17 TRIP DeMUTH: Did anybody besides

18 you use that laundry room?

19 PATSY RAMSEY: Sometimes Linda

20 would wash, if we were washing comforters or

21 something, because those were big heavy-duty

22 laundry machines, she'd take the things in

23 there, rugs and things, and wash them down

24 there.

25 TRIP DeMUTH: Okay.

0188

1 THOMAS HANEY: So you don't recall

2 taking a photo of her down there?

3 PATSY RAMSEY: (Shaking head.)

4 THOMAS HANEY: If she was doing

5 something really cutesy or something, would you

6 maybe run and get the camera, take one of her?

7 PATSY RAMSEY: Of her in the

8 laundry room?

9 THOMAS HANEY: Uh-hum.

10 PATSY RAMSEY: No.

Patently they have the photos, and want to eliminate Patsy and query if they would normally be located in the laundry room?


.

 

[MurriFlower]

pistolina,
Here is the part of the interview where Patsy is questioned on the photos.

Underlying the police interviewers assumptions may be that the person who so avidly photographed JonBenet alive may also have taken nude photographs which are located somewhere else? And that this same person wished to photograph her deceased wearing her Barbie Nightdress. I mention this for completeness with reference to Johns perverted remarks.

Paranthetically: Consider JonBenet's posing skills, her use of makeup, her ease in front of the camera. e.g. was she coached and by whom, did someone other than the photographer have access to her pageant photos or were these custom made?




Patsy's 1998 BPD Interview Excerpt


Patently they have the photos, and want to eliminate Patsy and query if they would normally be located in the laundry room?


.

That quote is confused. He seems to be asking her if there were any "prints" of JBR in the basement, NOT if PR or anyone else photographed JBR in the basement.

13 PATSY RAMSEY: Taken of her in the

14 laundry room?

15 TRIP DeMUTH: No, no. Photographs

16 of her located in the laundry room?

17 PATSY RAMSEY: Oh, in the laundry

18 room, oh. I don't know, there was a bunch of

19 stuff, I mean wrapping stuff and everything. I

20 don't remember any photographs.

IOW, did the R's put photos of her down there or did the IDI take them there.

 

[KariKae]

You're right. In the beginning, it seems he is asking if any prints of JBR were kept in the laundry room. Then the question seems to be whether JBR was ever photographed in the laundry room.

Also, remember JBR was murdered pre-digital camera. Somebody would have had to take the (nude) photos to be developed which is very risky.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

You're right. In the beginning, it seems he is asking if any prints of JBR were kept in the laundry room. Then the question seems to be whether JBR was ever photographed in the laundry room.

Also, remember JBR was murdered pre-digital camera. Somebody would have had to take the (nude) photos to be developed which is very risky.

What makes you think the pictures were nude? If I'm reading it correctly, In the police interview, they are described as "cutesy" and that doesn't seem like the right word to use to describe those types of pictures. It sounds like they were pictures of JBR taken in the basement, which is strange, since their basement wasn't finished so I doubt they spent a lot of time down there.

 

[KariKae]

Underlying the police interviewers assumptions may be that the person who so avidly photographed JonBenet alive may also have taken nude photographs which are located somewhere else? And that this same person wished to photograph her deceased wearing her Barbie Nightdress. I mention this for completeness with reference to Johns perverted remarks.

Sorry, I don't know how to quote just a part of a post. This is what I was referring to. If someone did take nude photos of JBR, they would have to take them somewhere to be developed which (I feel) would be a risky move for such a carefuly intruder.

 

[joeskidbeck]

Underlying the police interviewers assumptions may be that the person who so avidly photographed JonBenet alive may also have taken nude photographs which are located somewhere else? And that this same person wished to photograph her deceased wearing her Barbie Nightdress. I mention this for completeness with reference to Johns perverted remarks.

Sorry, I don't know how to quote just a part of a post. This is what I was referring to. If someone did take nude photos of JBR, they would have to take them somewhere to be developed which (I feel) would be a risky move for such a carefuly intruder.

They would not have to be taken for developing if the person used one of Polaroid's instant cameras which have been around at least since the seventies. I remember getting one for my birthday in the mid seventies.

 

[UKGuy]

That quote is confused. He seems to be asking her if there were any "prints" of JBR in the basement, NOT if PR or anyone else photographed JBR in the basement.


IOW, did the R's put photos of her down there or did the IDI take them there.

MurriFlower,

How can the quote be confused. The quote is electronic ink. Its a verbatim account.

BPD simply want to know if photographs of JonBenet were ever taken or stored in the laundry room. They want to eliminate Patsy nothing confused about that.

Do not forget all the Ramsey properties were explicity searched for child *advertiser censored* and the results from Atlanta were sealed.

That is the police were making assumptions about the collection of photographs discovered in the laundry room.



.

 

[UKGuy]

Underlying the police interviewers assumptions may be that the person who so avidly photographed JonBenet alive may also have taken nude photographs which are located somewhere else? And that this same person wished to photograph her deceased wearing her Barbie Nightdress. I mention this for completeness with reference to Johns perverted remarks.

Sorry, I don't know how to quote just a part of a post. This is what I was referring to. If someone did take nude photos of JBR, they would have to take them somewhere to be developed which (I feel) would be a risky move for such a carefuly intruder.

KariKae,

Well its likely the ones in the collection were posed pageant photographs, lets say cutesy?


.

 

[KariKae]

Do we know anything about John and John Andrew's relationship in the years following the murder?

 

[eileenhawkeye]

Do we know anything about John and John Andrew's relationship in the years following the murder?

When the Grand Jury was going on, John and Patsy signed something so if they went to jail, John Andrew would become Burke's legal guardian. John Andrew lives in Denver and John lives in either Charlevoix or Atlanta (or both) so I don't know how often they see each other. John mentioned his grandchildren (JAR and Melinda both have kids) on an episode of Larry King Live back in 2006 so I'm going to assume they are still close.

 

[Toltec]

When the Grand Jury was going on, John and Patsy signed something so if they went to jail, John Andrew would become Burke's legal guardian. John Andrew lives in Denver and John lives in either Charlevoix or Atlanta (or both) so I don't know how often they see each other. John mentioned his grandchildren (JAR and Melinda both have kids) on an episode of Larry King Live back in 2006 so I'm going to assume they are still close.

It was John's brother Jeff who was made guardian in case the Ramseys were arrested.

Let's not forget that the Grand Jury was convened because they were looking into Burke being the main suspect.

 

[DeeDee249]

It was John's brother Jeff who was made guardian in case the Ramseys were arrested.

Let's not forget that the Grand Jury was convened because they were looking into Burke being the main suspect.

Which could be the REAL reason the GJ didn't return an indictment and gave no reason nor made no statement.
Could also be the real reason why the NEW investigation doesn't seem to be going anywhere either, and why LW won't allow his client (BR) to speak to police.

 

[SunnieRN]

In discussing this with a friend recently, we were talking about the pictures River Rat had of JAR at JonBenets graveside. The discussion entailed that JAR seemed to be the one that truly showed true emotion at her grave, vs the 'staged' pictures that Patsy took a photographer with her to take. (The pictures with her hands crossed, on her chest, not her arms, her hands.)

Believe me, I thought this act by Patsy was bizarre to say the least. I just don't understand the actions of this family a lot of the time. JAR on the other hand seemed truly emotionally upset.