JonBenet's Skull Fractures: The Weapon

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Agree - very hard - but there is no evidence to say her fractures were caused by the hardest surfaces in the house, particularly given her age and skull development.
THere's no evidence to lean in any specific direction as far as what caused the head wound. It might be the most critical issue in the case. Depending on what caused the fracture, it can create a different scenario.

If its the toilet, sink, end of a table, or an object in that area of the basement otg was digging into a year ago, she wasn't hit with anything. She was pushed/thrown into it.

Good to see you back.
 
Was Cottonstar, the blogger and WS member, involved in any other pages on that site?

Who is Juror 13? I don't need a name just hoping to learn whether or not the Juror 13 was actually from the Grand Jury. Thank you, in advance, for anyone who can answer, or clarify, that the Juror 13 is from the GJ panel.

By happenstance, I ran across shakedown and bookmarked the following pages a couple of weeks ago while I was researching Simon, the photographer.

https://shakedowntitle.com/2016/12/21/our-message-to-the-media/

https://shakedowntitle.com/cases/jonbenet/
 
Juror13 wasn't on the GJ. It's one of the people running that site that promotes a ton of their own books. I thought the site was going to be something else when I first saw it last year. When I realized it was more of a promotional tool to push books on the trendy crimes, I stopped checking it. It's also skewed towards BDI although that's not a shock....their books are BDI(the recent books anyways).

They do have a lot of great photographs though.
 
Was Cottonstar, the blogger and WS member, involved in any other pages on that site?

Who is Juror 13? I don't need a name just hoping to learn whether or not the Juror 13 was actually from the Grand Jury. Thank you, in advance, for anyone who can answer, or clarify, that the Juror 13 is from the GJ panel.

By happenstance, I ran across shakedown and bookmarked the following pages a couple of weeks ago while I was researching Simon, the photographer.

https://shakedowntitle.com/2016/12/21/our-message-to-the-media/

https://shakedowntitle.com/cases/jonbenet/

Hi, DeDee,

I wasn’t involved in the pages that you had bookmarked.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
This is when I wish I'd not fallen asleep in my physics lessons.

I've done a little bit of digging, not much admittedly. The first thing I came up with is a baseball weighs approx 5 ounces. The Magic 8 Ball (thanks Tadpole) weighs approx 10 nearly 11 ounces.

I found an account of a 4 year old child whose skull was fractured by a baseball hitting the side of his head. http://www.espn.co.uk/mlb/hof09/columns/story?columnist=garber_greg&id=4353486

I suppose it depends on whether the dimensions of the curved ball could create the size and shape of JonBenet's skull depression.

How much does a brass giraffe weight? https://www.pinterest.com/pin/65794844530044313/

The shape of the injury fits with the brass object in this picture.
 

Not sure but I though it was a set of 3 giraffes. Somewhere on the internet FWIW, it was mentioned that the kids would play with them and pretend to be making them eat and drink , Also it was mentioned they were in the stuff that was donated to the goodwill . I have searched for a while for where that information was at but have not found it. Someone more knowledgable about this case then me might be able to find it but I have not been able to relocate that sniplett .
 
An oval shaped hairbrush smashed down on an uncoperative child head by a deliriously tired mom.

Patsy is getting JonBenet ready to go to bed. She dresses her in what she wants JonBenet to wear on the plane (to save her time) in the morning. Patsy tries brushing her daughters hair so again its done for the next morning. She wants JonBenet to be as presentable as possible without the hassles of an early morning start.

JonBenet doesn't want to SIT. She wants to PLAY. She knows Burke is up playing and she hasn't seen her Christmas toys since 5pm when they left the house to attend the White's Christmas party. She also knows she wont be playing with them because they are leaving for Charlevoix the next morning. She is DETERMINED to play NOW.

Patsy still has packing to do and is exhausted from the evenings partying and the mornings events being Christmas.

She strikes out at JonBenet in a moment of pure frustration and an attempt to keep her still. Patsy may have done this before with JonBenet but not with such force. This time it knocked her unconscious/brain dead.
 
An oval shaped hairbrush smashed down on an uncoperative child head by a deliriously tired mom.

Patsy is getting JonBenet ready to go to bed. She dresses her in what she wants JonBenet to wear on the plane (to save her time) in the morning. Patsy tries brushing her daughters hair so again its done for the next morning. She wants JonBenet to be as presentable as possible without the hassles of an early morning start.

JonBenet doesn't want to SIT. She wants to PLAY. She knows Burke is up playing and she hasn't seen her Christmas toys since 5pm when they left the house to attend the White's Christmas party. She also knows she wont be playing with them because they are leaving for Charlevoix the next morning. She is DETERMINED to play NOW.

Patsy still has packing to do and is exhausted from the evenings partying and the mornings events being Christmas.

She strikes out at JonBenet in a moment of pure frustration and an attempt to keep her still. Patsy may have done this before with JonBenet but not with such force. This time it knocked her unconscious/brain dead.

Not a bad theory, in my opinion -- although I think it all started that night (not in the morning). Perhaps PR already had to change her over night due to bed-wetting; changed her into new clothes she meant for JBR to wear the next morning, then started combing her hair. JBR became upset, wanted to go play, etc., and purposefully wet herself again to enrage PR; which caused PR to flip out.
 
"She wants JonBenet to be as presentable as possible without the hassles of an early morning start" so yes the night before.
 
Okay, I misread because this line is written oddly to where it seems like you are saying PR dressed her in the morning, as you don't include "in the morning" within the parenthesis:

"She dresses her in what she wants JonBenet to wear on the plane (to save her time) in the morning."

Revised: "She dresses her in what she wants JonBenet to wear on the plane (to save her time in the morning)."
 
It was 100% that flashlight. She grabbed a piece of pineapple out of her brothers bowl, making him mad, and he hit her with the flashlight fracturing her skull. The parents covered it up to protect him.

He had already hit her with a golf club before, so I don’t see any reason he wouldn’t have grabbed that flashlight on the counter, and hit her while having a tantrum.

The fracture matches perfectly with the end of the flashlight.
 
I had an e-mail conversation with the lead detective on this case (ST) and asked about the head wound because I suspected a hockey puck that ricocheted around after being struck. He stated to me that the weapon was, in fact, the flashlight - it was a perfect fit to the wound.

Why did I suspect a golf club/hockey puck? Because Stine's boy played hockey, HR forbid BR from playing it or owning a hockey stick. But, Stine Boy gave an old taped-up puck to BR and it was just too odd of a detail that was addressed in the parents' book.

I had always thought that the head wound happened at the Stine's because that whole visit was shrouded in mystery and the fact that the Stines weren't called to the house in the morning, but rather left for their own vacation. Yes, I am well aware of the professionals opinions about the pineapple, etc. and the estimated time of death, but played with the notion that the head wound did not cause immediate unconsciousness, there was swelling and hence the pineapple and tea to reduce swelling. Then add the lies about the events after getting home, the fuzzy timeline, the whole web of deception and my amateur detective brain came up with 'injured at the Stines, with a hockey puck and the stick which BR was forbidden to touch". I've been over that theory for years.

But, I would have been willing to bet that PR called Nedra that night and it was she that dictated the RN and told PR about the tea and pineapple. I do not for a second believe that JBR went straight to bed when they got home. I think she was up and being fed tea and pineapple by momma to get the swelling down. The note is soo Nedra.

I do not think anything of the child BR hitting the child JBR with a play golf club. Kids hit each other all the time.
 
I had an e-mail conversation with the lead detective on this case (ST) and asked about the head wound because I suspected a hockey puck that ricocheted around after being struck. He stated to me that the weapon was, in fact, the flashlight - it was a perfect fit to the wound.

Why did I suspect a golf club/hockey puck? Because Stine's boy played hockey, HR forbid BR from playing it or owning a hockey stick. But, Stine Boy gave an old taped-up puck to BR and it was just too odd of a detail that was addressed in the parents' book.

I had always thought that the head wound happened at the Stine's because that whole visit was shrouded in mystery and the fact that the Stines weren't called to the house in the morning, but rather left for their own vacation. Yes, I am well aware of the professionals opinions about the pineapple, etc. and the estimated time of death, but played with the notion that the head wound did not cause immediate unconsciousness, there was swelling and hence the pineapple and tea to reduce swelling. Then add the lies about the events after getting home, the fuzzy timeline, the whole web of deception and my amateur detective brain came up with 'injured at the Stines, with a hockey puck and the stick which BR was forbidden to touch". I've been over that theory for years.

But, I would have been willing to bet that PR called Nedra that night and it was she that dictated the RN and told PR about the tea and pineapple. I do not for a second believe that JBR went straight to bed when they got home. I think she was up and being fed tea and pineapple by momma to get the swelling down. The note is soo Nedra.

I do not think anything of the child BR hitting the child JBR with a play golf club. Kids hit each other all the time.

If the flashlight was indeed the weapon used, why would it be placed in the kitchen afterwards? I'm not discounting ST, I'm simply curious. Was there a point in placing the flashlight there? Was it perhaps washed in the kitchen sink and wiped down after the murder, then simply left on the counter by accident in all the chaos (instead of being hidden and/or disposed)?
 
If the flashlight was indeed the weapon used, why would it be placed in the kitchen afterwards? I'm not discounting ST, I'm simply curious. Was there a point in placing the flashlight there? Was it perhaps washed in the kitchen sink and wiped down after the murder, then simply left on the counter by accident in all the chaos (instead of being hidden and/or disposed)?

Userid,
Everyone has their own theory on this aspect. The last person to admit to using the flashlight is JR via Dr Phil's lips on his Burke interview.

So how did the flashlight travel from upstairs back down to kitchen? Or is all that smoke and mirrors from JR and it was used during the staging of the wine-cellar, then cleaned up and relocated to the kitchen, just like JonBenet's bloodstained barbie nightgown was left in the wine-cellar and not the place she expired?


The flashlight is a dead-ringer for a staged crime-scene, particularly if the stager intended to stage JonBenet being bludgeoned to death, but if it never worked out, maybe they just moved on to asphyxiation by ligature?

The flashlight might be part of a prior crime-scene that JR revised, moving the flashlight to the kitchen, since JonBenet had been kidnapped, and not whacked mafioso style.

i.e. why whack your kidnapee?

.
 
I had an e-mail conversation with the lead detective on this case (ST) and asked about the head wound because I suspected a hockey puck that ricocheted around after being struck. He stated to me that the weapon was, in fact, the flashlight - it was a perfect fit to the wound.

Why did I suspect a golf club/hockey puck? Because Stine's boy played hockey, HR forbid BR from playing it or owning a hockey stick. But, Stine Boy gave an old taped-up puck to BR and it was just too odd of a detail that was addressed in the parents' book.

I had always thought that the head wound happened at the Stine's because that whole visit was shrouded in mystery and the fact that the Stines weren't called to the house in the morning, but rather left for their own vacation. Yes, I am well aware of the professionals opinions about the pineapple, etc. and the estimated time of death, but played with the notion that the head wound did not cause immediate unconsciousness, there was swelling and hence the pineapple and tea to reduce swelling. Then add the lies about the events after getting home, the fuzzy timeline, the whole web of deception and my amateur detective brain came up with 'injured at the Stines, with a hockey puck and the stick which BR was forbidden to touch". I've been over that theory for years.

But, I would have been willing to bet that PR called Nedra that night and it was she that dictated the RN and told PR about the tea and pineapple. I do not for a second believe that JBR went straight to bed when they got home. I think she was up and being fed tea and pineapple by momma to get the swelling down. The note is soo Nedra.

I do not think anything of the child BR hitting the child JBR with a play golf club. Kids hit each other all the time.

TeaTime,
Sure the head injury could have happened at the Stines, including JonBenet eating pineapple there. So why was the staging such a mess as both parents would know what to do, no telepathy required and Burke, well he seems to have played his allotted role OK?

One unrelated thought on BR: All this talk about BR and his tech job, his degree and retirement fund etc. Makes him appear reasonably intelligent.

Yet on Dr Phil he never came across as any of the above, e.g. he never batted the difficult questions, instead offering his smirking and dumb answers about JonBenet flaunting herself. BR just did not match what JR has claimed about BR.

Maybe I'm biased and have confused BR's coached interview with his real life persona?

.
 
TeaTime,
Sure the head injury could have happened at the Stines, including JonBenet eating pineapple there. So why was the staging such a mess as both parents would know what to do, no telepathy required and Burke, well he seems to have played his allotted role OK?

One unrelated thought on BR: All this talk about BR and his tech job, his degree and retirement fund etc. Makes him appear reasonably intelligent.

Yet on Dr Phil he never came across as any of the above, e.g. he never batted the difficult questions, instead offering his smirking and dumb answers about JonBenet flaunting herself. BR just did not match what JR has claimed about BR.

Maybe I'm biased and have confused BR's coached interview with his real life persona?

.

The torch was not part of the original crime scene at 5:52am. Someone placed it there intentionally, wiped of all prints sometime in the later morning hours.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk Pro
 
The physical appearance of the head wound and the long forward fracture just looked to me as if there was a high velocity force from a projectile. After reading about JR forbidding BR from playing hockey, the taped up hockey puck gift and the Stine boy's hockey playing, I imagined BR hitting a puck in the house and it flew into JBR's head. A golf club would make that puck lift in flight and the force of a golf swing would give it the velocity and force I imagine it would take to fracture the skull and cause the depressed injury.

But, then the whole Stine house visit amnesia puzzled me. Who stands at the door in the cold chatting after delivering gifts for 15 minutes, never going in to the house. JBR and JR stayed in the car? PR didn't think JBR went in to the house. What? It was all too weird. Then the whole living with the Stines and the Stines moving to Atlanta with the Ramseys. Something was strange there and I can't put my finger on it.

But, ST said no it was the flashlight and he was there, I was not. He knows how well the flashlight fit and I take his word over my imagination.
 

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