JonBenet's Skull Fractures: The Weapon

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We must be careful in what part of the CS we refer to as "staged". Will you be so kind as to expound upon this statement and, in particular, how it is obvious BR was in on "staging"?



Second guessing the GJ is not something I feel comfortable doing but was curious how they managed to overlook; that is, to reconcile, Patsy's incriminating fiber evidence associated with the ligature/garroting/asphyxiation.

BR testified to the GJ. Interestingly, so did BRs teacher. I think she informed them that BR was a quiet child who had difficulty with hand/eye coordination and could not have possible written the RN. Stuff like that...

Many sleuths hold the belief that LHP finding JB w/ BR under the covers was bc they were playing doctor. Perhaps they were looking at the nude pictures in the Dr Seuss adult book.



The only time JonBenét was ever able to signal that she was alive and struggling are by the abrasions on her shoulder and back of her leg. [The neighbor who heard the scream would never be called into trial as a witness.] Her body does not show a physical resistance to the strangulation or to the vaginal injuries or to the head bash or any of her other numerous injuries. Lou Smit said she had herr own DNA in her fingernails and clawed at her throat as she was being strangled but no other official said those red half-moon marks were from her fingernails and they look too high up to be near the nylon cord's placement, to me.



I'm gonna throw a curve ball. I think Patsy misled everyone on the clothing she dressed JB in that night. I think she selected the pink pj bottoms that go to the pink top that JB wore during Christmas morning pictures. JB kept her pjs under her bed pillow. Sometime during the melee, the bathroom drawers where JBs longjohns were kept was opened and not closed. The pink bottoms have never surfaced, iirc.



There are others who share your viewpoint. I am not one of them since, ATT, I hold Patsy Ramsey responsible for everything in the basement, on the kitchen table, on the stairs, in JBs bedroom and bathroom and in JARs bedroom. JR suspected Patsy prior to finding his daughter's body. I think he later protected his wife bc he knew she was ill but did not realize how serious she was until it was too late.



I am unaware of legal eagles planting illegal evidence against 9yo Burke. Casting suspicions away from the two parents turned out not so bad for the Ramsey defense strategy but oh, so hurtful to Burke. I think Patsy helped that myth along by tossing his red Swiss Army knife into the WC.



Yes, to the smokescreen of hiding behind BR and suing on his behalf. Again, it depends on what one considers as staging. Everything at that CS was intentional. Everything. It was planned in advance for Little Miss Christmas to die on Christmas Day. Placing JB on a white blanket in that moldy cement room and placing a RN on the stairs is all the "staging" I see. The rest of it, the open Bible, the page in the dictionary pointing to the word "incest" were all things done by Patsy as she left her funny little clever clues.



The scarf shown in the mystery picture taken on John's camera before the children on Christmas morning shows it being near the writing pads. JB could have been partially strangled until unconsciousness with the silk scarf that also created the red quarter-size abrasion on her neck. The point is she did not resist the sexual encounter. Why not?



It was always going to be revealed in autopsy that JB had been abused no matter what time 911 was dialed. The coroner looked closely. He found a splinter that likely came from the broken paintbrush and birefringent material that likely came from talcum powder on the latex gloves that were stored in JARs bathroom where the drawer is shown pulled out.



Yes, indeed. We just disagree on when the decision was made and who made it.



What exactly do you opine being the first step, or preceding step, if the next step was to whack her on the head by JR, wait, then asphyxiation by Patsy with supplies that were handy?

Personality disordered people asphyxiate their children and whack them on their heads causing their skull to fracture over 8".

It has been written that both of the R children may have been sexually abused due to their enuresis and encopresis. Who was suspected of abusing BR? Was JR was doing that? I think it was Patsy who molested both of her children. However, she did not think about it the same as you and I.

Patsy saw nothing wrong with exploring nor in exploiting her children. Patsy bleached her 5yo daughter's hair platinum blonde. The Paugh's spoke about the size of BRs. Really? He was only 9yo. Patsy wanted JB to be a sexy witch for Halloween. What did JonBenét think a sexy witch did at Halloween? JBs dance instructor did not teach JB those moves she made on stage with shaking her hips, et al. She learned that at her mother's feet.

Forcing her daughter, to sleep on a mattress covered in plastic with only a thin sheet over it, knowing JB would likely wet that bed during the night and remain wet until morning is abusive. JB could go into her bathroom and change her panties and bottoms that were kept in there, but the bed sheet would still be wet. It was nine degrees in Boulder that night. I can't imagine my child laying on wet sheets in wet clothes.

Why not allow her child the comfort of wearing a dry pull up to bed so she could enjoy a good night's sleep? Patsy did not want JB sleeping on any of their other beds because they did not have plastic sheeting under the bed linens. That's why JB likely did not sleep in BRs room on Christmas Eve unless she allowed JB to wear a pull up that night.

DeDee,
We must be careful in what part of the CS we refer to as "staged". Will you be so kind as to expound upon this statement and, in particular, how it is obvious BR was in on "staging"?
JonBenet's bedroom, BR's bedroom, The wine-cellar, and aspects of the basement were all tidied up, objects moved around, and items were removed. BR is all too aware about all this since he was awake during the 911 call, and agreed to return to his bedroom to fake being asleep when the police arrived!

I'm gonna throw a curve ball. I think Patsy misled everyone on the clothing she dressed JB in that night. I think she selected the pink pj bottoms that go to the pink top that JB wore during Christmas morning pictures. JB kept her pjs under her bed pillow. Sometime during the melee, the bathroom drawers where JBs longjohns were kept was opened and not closed. The pink bottoms have never surfaced, iirc.
Patsy appeared to also mislead herself telling investigators she placed a pack of size-12 underwear into JonBenet's underwear drawer. Pink bottoms and possibly size-6 underwear missing is a red flag. Did Patsy originally have JonBenet dressed in something other than what she was found in, but someone else redressed JonBenet, causing Patsy to lie, forget and invent what JonBenet was wearing, e.g. fighting over what to wear to the White's.

It was always going to be revealed in autopsy that JB had been abused no matter what time 911 was dialed. The coroner looked closely. He found a splinter that likely came from the broken paintbrush and birefringent material that likely came from talcum powder on the latex gloves that were stored in JARs bathroom where the drawer is shown pulled out.
The splinter is birefringent material, the question is was the paintbrush used to fake an internal injury to go along with the asphyxiation device wrapped around her neck?

What exactly do you opine being the first step, or preceding step, if the next step was to whack her on the head by JR, wait, then asphyxiation by Patsy with supplies that were handy?
the prior step was when JonBenet was sexually assaulted by a different Ramsey, then had her vagus nerve constricted, probably by someone holding her by the neck, i.e. those marks beneath the ligature.

It has been written that both of the R children may have been sexually abused due to their enuresis and encopresis. Who was suspected of abusing BR? Was JR was doing that? I think it was Patsy who molested both of her children. However, she did not think about it the same as you and I.
Entirely possible, PR may have emotionally neglected BR while she undertook her JonBenet Project.

Allowing JonBenet to consume pineapple just before going to bed cannot have been helpful wrt to JonBenet wetting the bed. Another view here is that JonBenet's bed presented as it was, not due to bedtime wetting, but to removal of items that link to her assault. JonBenet's alleged bedwetting could be explained away as actually one response to the intruder's assault?

I always found it strange that Patsy volunteered the information that JonBenet regularly slept in BR's bedroom.


.
 
We must be careful in what part of the CS we refer to as "staged". Will you be so kind as to expound upon this statement and, in particular, how it is obvious BR was in on "staging"?



Second guessing the GJ is not something I feel comfortable doing but was curious how they managed to overlook; that is, to reconcile, Patsy's incriminating fiber evidence associated with the ligature/garroting/asphyxiation.

BR testified to the GJ. Interestingly, so did BRs teacher. I think she informed them that BR was a quiet child who had difficulty with hand/eye coordination and could not have possible written the RN. Stuff like that...

Many sleuths hold the belief that LHP finding JB w/ BR under the covers was bc they were playing doctor. Perhaps they were looking at the nude pictures in the Dr Seuss adult book.



The only time JonBenét was ever able to signal that she was alive and struggling are by the abrasions on her shoulder and back of her leg. [The neighbor who heard the scream would never be called into trial as a witness.] Her body does not show a physical resistance to the strangulation or to the vaginal injuries or to the head bash or any of her other numerous injuries. Lou Smit said she had herr own DNA in her fingernails and clawed at her throat as she was being strangled but no other official said those red half-moon marks were from her fingernails and they look too high up to be near the nylon cord's placement, to me.



I'm gonna throw a curve ball. I think Patsy misled everyone on the clothing she dressed JB in that night. I think she selected the pink pj bottoms that go to the pink top that JB wore during Christmas morning pictures. JB kept her pjs under her bed pillow. Sometime during the melee, the bathroom drawers where JBs longjohns were kept was opened and not closed. The pink bottoms have never surfaced, iirc.



There are others who share your viewpoint. I am not one of them since, ATT, I hold Patsy Ramsey responsible for everything in the basement, on the kitchen table, on the stairs, in JBs bedroom and bathroom and in JARs bedroom. JR suspected Patsy prior to finding his daughter's body. I think he later protected his wife bc he knew she was ill but did not realize how serious she was until it was too late.



I am unaware of legal eagles planting illegal evidence against 9yo Burke. Casting suspicions away from the two parents turned out not so bad for the Ramsey defense strategy but oh, so hurtful to Burke. I think Patsy helped that myth along by tossing his red Swiss Army knife into the WC.



Yes, to the smokescreen of hiding behind BR and suing on his behalf. Again, it depends on what one considers as staging. Everything at that CS was intentional. Everything. It was planned in advance for Little Miss Christmas to die on Christmas Day. Placing JB on a white blanket in that moldy cement room and placing a RN on the stairs is all the "staging" I see. The rest of it, the open Bible, the page in the dictionary pointing to the word "incest" were all things done by Patsy as she left her funny little clever clues.



The scarf shown in the mystery picture taken on John's camera before the children on Christmas morning shows it being near the writing pads. JB could have been partially strangled until unconsciousness with the silk scarf that also created the red quarter-size abrasion on her neck. The point is she did not resist the sexual encounter. Why not?



It was always going to be revealed in autopsy that JB had been abused no matter what time 911 was dialed. The coroner looked closely. He found a splinter that likely came from the broken paintbrush and birefringent material that likely came from talcum powder on the latex gloves that were stored in JARs bathroom where the drawer is shown pulled out.



Yes, indeed. We just disagree on when the decision was made and who made it.



What exactly do you opine being the first step, or preceding step, if the next step was to whack her on the head by JR, wait, then asphyxiation by Patsy with supplies that were handy?

Personality disordered people asphyxiate their children and whack them on their heads causing their skull to fracture over 8".

It has been written that both of the R children may have been sexually abused due to their enuresis and encopresis. Who was suspected of abusing BR? Was JR was doing that? I think it was Patsy who molested both of her children. However, she did not think about it the same as you and I.

Patsy saw nothing wrong with exploring nor in exploiting her children. Patsy bleached her 5yo daughter's hair platinum blonde. The Paugh's spoke about the size of BRs. Really? He was only 9yo. Patsy wanted JB to be a sexy witch for Halloween. What did JonBenét think a sexy witch did at Halloween? JBs dance instructor did not teach JB those moves she made on stage with shaking her hips, et al. She learned that at her mother's feet.

Forcing her daughter, to sleep on a mattress covered in plastic with only a thin sheet over it, knowing JB would likely wet that bed during the night and remain wet until morning is abusive. JB could go into her bathroom and change her panties and bottoms that were kept in there, but the bed sheet would still be wet. It was nine degrees in Boulder that night. I can't imagine my child laying on wet sheets in wet clothes.

Why not allow her child the comfort of wearing a dry pull up to bed so she could enjoy a good night's sleep? Patsy did not want JB sleeping on any of their other beds because they did not have plastic sheeting under the bed linens. That's why JB likely did not sleep in BRs room on Christmas Eve unless she allowed JB to wear a pull up that night.

EXCELLENT POST DeeDee... I am leaning more and more your direction (I suppose that leans me Blue Bottle's direction, as well).

Thank you for your careful consideration and explanation of how you feel the evidence fits. I have much to rethink.
 
Interesting thought. Wasn't there hair ties found on JB's bed the next morning? And why was there green Christmas garland consistent with the spiral staircase garland caught up in her hair as well. Was this part of the nightly ritual and not a part of the crime?

There are still a lot of errors out there on this case. The "hair ties" on her bed were actually found to be small fabric loops from a potholder loom. The red plastic loom can be seen on her nightstand in the crime photos.

I assume you are being sarcastic when you ask whether the green garland was also part of her nightly ritual.
Those who have followed the case for years know that the spiral staircase was wound around with artificial green garland. Some feel it suggests she may have been carried down those stairs. However, the winecellar she was found in was also a storage room for the family's artificial trees and other decorations. The floor of that room likely had lots of that artificial garland as well. The trees were brought up from that room just weeks before, likely scattering the artificial needles through the basement floor. JB was also lain on the living room rug under the family's artificial Christmas Tree. I am sure that area of the rug had green fake needles too.
Having the green garland pieces from her hair tested against any of the artificial greens in the house might have provided a clue as to how they got there, however I do not believe the needles in her hair were tested against anything in the home. My own thought is that they got in her hair from lying on the floor of the living room or the winecellar and not the stairs. Even though she was placed on the white blanket, her head was exposed - the blanket was pulled around her torso only, leaving her head and lower legs exposed.
 
DeDee,

JonBenet's bedroom, BR's bedroom, The wine-cellar, and aspects of the basement were all tidied up, objects moved around, and items were removed. BR is all too aware about all this since he was awake during the 911 call, and agreed to return to his bedroom to fake being asleep when the police arrived!

Hiya, UKGuy, your description of the staging was that aspects of the basement were tidied; objects were moved; items were removed. Thank you but your report lacks specificity. However, I am with understanding. You have been here a decade sharing your thoughts. Responding with details must grow tiresome.

If Patsy screamed for John early morning on the 26th, it woke Burke. He could hear the refrigerator hum from his bedroom so we know he could hear his parents talking whether he heard their exact words or not is doubtful but he knew enough to know something big had happened. He appears on the first floor to check it out only to find his mom on the phone to 911. He was instructed to go to his room and stay. BR quietly remained upstairs for almost two hours or until he left with FW. I fail to see the CS staging in that.

Patsy appeared to also mislead herself telling investigators she placed a pack of size-12 underwear into JonBenet's underwear drawer. Pink bottoms and possibly size-6 underwear missing is a red flag. Did Patsy originally have JonBenet dressed in something other than what she was found in, but someone else redressed JonBenet, causing Patsy to lie, forget and invent what JonBenet was wearing, e.g. fighting over what to wear to the White's.

Things were done to propel this into the Crime of the Century. Just as the unique and unusual RN, the oversized panties garnered much attention. My thoughts are that they were purchased in November for the purpose that they were used on December 25.

Read Patsy's interesting description of how she prepared JonBenét for bed. The pink pj bottoms PR claims she could not find are the pj bottoms I think Patsy dressed her in that night. TMK, the pink pj bottoms have never surfaced.

PR was evasive to LE with her answers unless it promoted her image. The strategy of "I don't know and I can't remember" was adopted early on by PRs legal defense team.

The splinter is birefringent material, the question is was the paintbrush used to fake an internal injury to go along with the asphyxiation device wrapped around her neck?

ME Meyer stated in the AR that it was birefringent material. It's been referred to as talcum powder and as a speck of paint. ST referred to it as cellulose and as a splinter. Likely, it could be a cotton fiber or a piece of plastic glove which are both high in cellulose content. I am not convinced the material was only one tiny speck of something and not material such as talcum powder and a tiny splinter.

OT: According to his interesting AR, Michael Jackson had birefringent particles in his lungs. http://www.scribd.com/doc/37663074/Michael-Jackson-Autopsy-Report-Complete

the prior step was when JonBenet was sexually assaulted by a different Ramsey, then had her vagus nerve constricted, probably by someone holding her by the neck, i.e. those marks beneath the ligature.

You're suggesting 9yo BR kept a choke hold around JBs neck that led to vagal constriction while he was molesting his sister only her body displays little to no traumatic injuries associated with self-defense or resistance to being strangled.

Entirely possible, PR may have emotionally neglected BR while she undertook her JonBenet Project.1

There was definitely emotional trauma in the Ramsey household. PR may have lacked empathy brought on from being raised by a Narcissistic Mother.

Allowing JonBenet to consume pineapple just before going to bed cannot have been helpful wrt to JonBenet wetting the bed. Another view here is that JonBenet's bed presented as it was, not due to bedtime wetting, but to removal of items that link to her assault. JonBenet's alleged bedwetting could be explained away as actually one response to the intruder's assault?

The pineapple and cream happiness was part of Patsy's blessing, kinda of a delicious last meal, if you will.

"Sandy Stranger had a feeling at the time that they were supposed to be the happiest days of her life, and on her tenth birthday she said so to her best friend Jenny Gray who had been asked to tea at Sandy's house. The specialty of the feast was pineapple cubes with cream, and the specialty of the day was that they were left to themselves. To Sandy the unfamiliar pineapple had the authentic taste and appearance of happiness and she focused her small eyes closely on the pale gold cubes before she scooped them up in her spoon, and she ... Both girls saved the cream to the last, then ate it in spoonfuls." ~ TPOMJB

We know it was not JonBenét's favorite blanket that was found wrapped around her but it quite simply was the white blanket from her bed. A kidnapper walking out of the house with a stolen child wrapped in a white blanket might catch a bit of attention. I think it was chosen by Patsy because it was the color white, the color of purity.

I always found it strange that Patsy volunteered the information that JonBenet regularly slept in BR's bedroom.

I didn't realize JB slept in her brother's room often. I seem to recall Patsy saying she preferred JB not to sleep on that extra twin bed in Burke's room since it did not have plastic protection over the mattress.
 
:bump:

I posted something at FFJ that may be useful for some, so I’m going to re-post it here (I know some still do not read there.). I’m not in the medical field, and I don’t claim any special understanding along that line. In fact, when I read some of the stuff written by professionals, my eyes start to glaze over after a while, and I struggle to try and understand it. So many big words I’m not familiar with, that by the time I look them up, I’ve usually forgotten why I needed to know what they meant and I’ve lost my train of thought. Then trying to put it all together and understand what I’m actually reading is just too much.

So what I did is take the portion of the AR detailing the skull and brain injuries and separate it into sections. Then I translated it into plain, simple English (with only a few big words thrown in for reference to what it is addressing.).

My doing this stemmed from a discussion at FFJ about coup vs. contrecoup injuries. It is my contention that there is nothing in Dr. Meyer’s report that would indicate a contrecoup injury. While it is possible that there was some not mentioned, there is nothing in the AR indicating that there was.

Also, after reading reviews at Amazon of James Kolar’s book, I see that people are still referring to the “little amount of bleeding (1-1/2 Tsp)” that Dr. Wecht mentions in his book. But this was only one area of bleeding. There were also two other areas of bleeding within other layers of the brain, as well as the blood that engorged the tissue manifesting itself as bruising.

The following is graphic and (unfortunately at times) brutal-sounding in order to describe the autopsy procedure. So take a deep breath and prepare yourself if you want to understand the brain injuries.

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For reference:


Illustration-1:

500px-Cranial_bones_en.svg.png

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Illustration-2:

Meninges-en.svg


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Illustration-3:


500px-Gray769-en.svg.png

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I've copied the words of the AR in blue first, then my translation in black and indented. I also added additional notes and comments [within brackets] and in bold green which may help.

===================================================================

Skull and Brain:
The head:
Upon reflection of the scalp there is found to be an extensive area of scalp hemorrhage along the right temporoparietal area extending from the orbital ridge, posteriorly all the way to the occipital area. This encompasses an area measuring approximately 7x4 inches.
After cutting her scalp down to the bone, from ear to ear, across the top of her head, and then pulling the two parts of her scalp down to expose her skull, there is found to be a large area of bleeding from the scalp along the top/right side of her skull which goes from the bone just above her right eye socket, going all the way back to the back part of her skull. This covers an area that measures about 7” long (front to back) by 4” wide (side to side).
This grossly appears to be fresh hemorrhage with no evidence of organization.
Without taking into consideration any other evidence, and without benefit of having already examined the blood with a microscope, this looks like recent bleeding without any indication that it has begun the clotting process (coagulation). [IOW (and this gets pretty complicated here and beyond my complete understanding), there are microscopic things (mostly having to do with the platelets and fibrin in blood) that should be happening within the exposed blood in the area Dr. Meyer is talking about here -- if it had not happened recently. If these microscopic processes had occurred, this blood would appear to be thicker than it is because it had begun coagulating. I have read others’ opinions that this meant it had to have occurred very close to the TOD (time of death). If true, this would contradict the opinion of Dr. Lucy about TOD, but I’ll leave it at that for you decide what it means. If you care to read more about this process, and if you can keep your eyes from glazing over, this, and this are good sources, and then there’s always this.
At the superior extension of this area of hemorrhage is a linear to comminuted skull fracture which extends from the right occipital to posteroparietal area forward to the right frontal area across the parietal skull.
At the upper portion of this area of bleeding is a crack in her skull which includes both a linear crack and a hole which has broken pieces of bone punched out [The word “comminuted” directly contradicts what Dr. Spitz said about there being a single hinged piece of bone within the “hole”, and makes me wonder where he was getting his information and doubt everything else in his analysis.] which goes from the right side of the back of her skull, over the top, and forward to just above her right eye socket.
In the posteroparietal area of this fracture is a roughly rectangular shaped displaced fragment of skull measuring one and three-quarters by one-half inch.
At the back of her skull (refer to Illustration-1 above) [posteroparietal means the back of the parietal bone], there is a somewhat rectangular hole of broken skull bone which is 1.75” long by 0.5” wide. [I dispute, of course, the rectangular description of the depressed fracture. It could be that at the point in the autopsy that Dr. Meyer was at here, he had not yet removed the thin membrane (the pericranium) covering the skull --only the scalp without this membrane. If this membrane completely covered the hole and it was bruised as it appears to be where we can see only the back portion of it in the only photo we have available, it may have looked to be “roughly rectangular” at this point in the autopsy. That’s the only way I can imagine that it would have looked to be rectangular instead of oval.]
The hemorrhage and the fracture extend posteriorly just past the midline of the occipital area of the skull.
The bleeding and the fracture go back to just past the center of a line drawn down the middle of the occipital bone at the back of her head (refer to Illustration-1).
This fracture measures approximately 8.5 inches in length.
The entire length of the fracture is about 8.5”, from end to end.
On removal of the skull cap there is found to be a thin film of subdural hemorrhage measuring approximately 7-8 cc over the surface of the right cerebral hemisphere and extending to the base of the cerebral hemisphere.
After using a saw to cut off the top portion of her skull, there is a thin layer of bleeding which lies within the space between the outermost meningeal layer (the dura mater -- which adheres to the skull), and the arachnoid, which envelops the brain (refer to Illustration-2). [This is usually what results from tears in the bridging veins that cross through the subdural space. In contrast, epidural hematomas are usually caused by tears in arteries, resulting in a build-up of blood between the dura mater and the skull.] The amount of bleeding here would probably be about 7 to 8 cubic centimeters (7 cc = 1.4 teaspoons; 8 cc = 1.6 teaspoons. So 7 to 8 cc is the equivalent of about 1.5 teaspoons.) if it was collected and placed into a measuring device. This thin layer of blood is spread out over the entire right half of her brain and goes all the way down to the bottom of the right half of her brain.
The 1450 gm brain has a normal overall architecture.
The brain weighs 1450 grams (about 3 lbs. and 3oz.) and looks pretty normal in its shape. [IOW, it’s not larger in any one area than another -- meaning there is not a noticeable amount of swelling in any one area.]


[I should mention here that 1450 gm seems to me rather large for a 6 year old female, but Meyer makes no additional mention of it. For more information on brain weights, see notes below.]
Mild narrowing of the sulci and flattening of the gyri are seen.
Even though I (Meyer) just said there was no noticeable uneven swelling, there must be a small amount of swelling because of what is seen in the ridges and grooves of the surface of the brain.
No inflammation is identified.
I (Meyer) don’t see where this small amount of swelling is coming from.
There is a thin film of subarachnoid hemorrhage overlying the entire right cerebral hemisphere.
In addition to the thin layer of subdural bleeding mentioned earlier, there is also another thin layer of blood in the area between the arachnoid and the pia mater (refer to Illustration-2, and Illustration-3) that covers all of the right half of the brain. [This is the type of bleeding that usually occurs during a brain aneurysm.]
On the right cerebral hemisphere underlying the previously mentioned linear skull fracture is an extensive linear area of purple contusion extending from the right frontal area, posteriorly along the lateral aspect of the parietal region and into the occipital area. This area of contusion measures 8 inches in length with a width of up to 1.75 inches.
On the right half of the brain underneath the linear fracture is a large area of purple bruising of the outer portion of the brain. This bruising goes from above her eye socket to the back, along the right side of the top of her skull, all the way back to the back of her skull. This bruised area is 8” long by 1.75” wide (It coincides with the length and the location of the linear fracture.)
At the tip of the right temporal lobe is a one-quarter by one-quarter inch similar appearing purple contusion. Only very minimal contusion is present at the tip of the left temporal lobe. This area of contusion measures only one-half inch in maximum dimension.
[This is difficult for me to explain with my limited understanding, but the “tips” of the two temporal lobes are not truly distinguishable as physically identifiable parts of the brain. They are general areas that are theoretically divided regions of a portion of the brain -- so divided because the function of that portion of the brain. The tip is located at the back of the brain. It is probably better to simply see an animation of exactly where it is located here.]

[What Meyer is saying in the above sentences is that there is a very small area of bruising on the back of the brain. This is probably (IMO) because of the initial force from the head blow itself toward the back of her head. Meyer does make note here that the bruising is more dominant on the right tip over the left, but the total area is only one-half inch in maximum size.]
The cerebral vasculature contains no evidence of atherosclerosis.
The blood veins and arteries of her brain show no signs of hardening. [I’m not sure why Meyer would state this, unless it is just a standard notation made during an autopsy. I don’t know of a reason that it could be related to the injuries associated with her head wound.]
Multiple coronal sections of the cerebral hemispheres, brain stem and cerebellum disclose no additional abnormalities.
With a carving knife, multiple sections of each of the two upper halves of the brain were cut, as well as sections of the two lower parts of the brain (as is the standard autopsy practice), and nothing else unusual or abnormal was noted.
The areas of previously described contusion are characterized by purple linear streak-like discolorations of the gray matter perpendicular to the surface of the cerebral cortex. These extend approximately 5mm into the cerebral cortex.
Once the sections were cut, a cross-section of the bruises noted before on the outer surface of the brain could be seen. These bruises went about 5 millimeters (about 0.2”) deep [essentially, not very deep].

[My question here (and this goes to the issue of the length of time between the head blow, the strangulation, and the actual TOD) is when did the good doctor do the tissue fixation, and how good were his medical practices? I won’t spend a great deal of time on it in this post, but this has been nagging at the back of my mind for a long time. Organs are preserved with a solution called formalin. Body tissue (including brain) will continue “rotting” until it is fixed (“fixed” in this sense of the word means stabilized). Formalin is a mixture of formaldehyde (which is actually a gas), water (which is what makes the formaldehyde a liquid, as we think of it), and methanol. The liquidized formulation of formaldehyde comes in different percentages of gas to liquid. Different percentages of the gas result in a different calculation of the desired ratio of methanol. There are conflicting opinions as to the different percentages of each that should be used. There are commercial mixtures available, but many pathologists still mix their own. If too much methanol is used, it can contribute to necrosis of the very tissue it is intended to preserve. If the least amount of artificially caused necrosis is present, it will throw off the estimation of TOD making it seem to be longer than it actually is between injury to the organ and actual death. So you can see that the proper fixation of brain tissue is critical to the estimation of the length of time between injury and actual death. Dr. Lucy was not present at the autopsy and has no knowledge of the precision used in the preservation of the brain sections. Her opinion is based on the assumption that it was all done correctly and efficiently. How much faith do you have in the ability of a small town coroner to take this all into consideration? There is also another factor that I don’t believe Dr. Lucy considered because her specialty is brain pathology -- but I’ll save that for another time.]
Examination of the base of the brain discloses no additional fractures.
[This would only be significant if there were fractures at the base. Much more force is required to cause basilar fractures, and therefore they are relatively rare -- accounting for less than 5% of severe head injuries. Also, basilar fractures have particular, specific signs: blood in the sinuses, a clear fluid called cerebrospinal fluid leaking from the nose or ears, “black-eyes” (often called raccoon eyes), and other less common symptoms.]

[Notice in this that most of the bleeding is from the breaking of veins and arteries and associated capillaries within the layers of the skull, and that they mostly follow along the linear fracture. This indicates to “Dr. otg” that the breaking and tearing of them was due to the damage done in the separation of the skull along the linear fracture -- not the moving of the brain within the skull from front to back or vice versa. (Illustration-3 shows the distribution of veins, but not the arteries.) As I stated before, I am not trained in the medical field, so I claim no expertise. If someone who does have the expertise will speak up and explain to me where there is any indication of contrecoup bruising indicated in this AR, I would sincerely welcome the information. As it is, and as I read it, there is none.]
===================================================================


Additional Notes:

The human adult skull bone has three layers (or tables) the outer layer is the hardest. It is thick and tough. The inner table is thinner, denser, and more brittle, and therefore is more likely to shatter or break. It is not terribly unusual that after a blow to the head, the inner table (also called the vitreous table) will sometimes break off without apparent or severe damage to the outer table. In the center, between these two layers is what is called the Diploe. But at six years, this diploic layer has not yet developed, and therefore, a child’s skull is much thinner than that of an adult.

Weight of the Human Brain:
The average normal mass of an adult male human brain is approximately 1300 to 1400 grams (2.87 to 3.1 pounds).
The average Male's brain weighs 1360 grams (3 pounds)
The average Female's brain weighs 1250 grams (2.8 pounds)
A newborn human brain is about 350 to 400 grams (0.77 to 0.88 pounds).
A human’s brain grows quickly in the first years and reaches its full size by around the age of six.

The brain weights of some well known people:
The brain of Albert Einstein weighed a mere 1230 grams (2.71 pounds)
The brain of the German mathematician Carl Friedrich Gauss weighed 1492 grams (3.29 pounds)
The brain of the leading poet of the Russian Revolution Vladimir Vladimirovich Mayakovsky weighed a whopping 1700 grams (3.75 pounds)

Dura mater means literally “tough mother” (think of dura as in durable -- meaning strong and tough). This layer is what cushions the inside of the skull bone from the other layers that protect the brain.
Pia mater means literally “soft mother”, because this layer of the brain is a soft, pliable membrane right next to the delicate tissue of the brain (cortex).
Arachnoid means “spider-like”, and is so-named because of the interwoven fibers within the arachnoid layer.

===================================================================

Translation in its entirety
(without the original, and without my additional comments)
:


The head:

After cutting her scalp down to the bone, from ear to ear, across the top of her head, and then pulling the two parts of her scalp down to expose her skull, there is found to be a large area of bleeding from the scalp along the top/right side of her skull which goes from the bone just above her right eye socket, going all the way back to the back part of her skull. This covers an area that measures about 7” long (front to back) by 4” wide (side to side).

Without taking into consideration any other evidence, and without benefit of having already examined the blood with a microscope, this looks like recent bleeding without any indication that it has begun the clotting process (coagulation).

At the upper portion of this area of bleeding is a crack in her skull which includes both a linear crack and a hole which has broken pieces of bone punched out which goes from the right side of the back of her skull, over the top, and forward to just above her right eye socket.

At the back of her skull, there is a somewhat rectangular hole of broken skull bone which is 1.75” long by 0.5” wide.

The bleeding and the fracture go back to just past the center of a line drawn down the middle of the occipital bone at the back of her head.

The entire length of the fracture is about 8.5”, from end to end.

After using a saw to cut off the top portion of her skull, there is a thin layer of bleeding which lies within the space between the outermost meningeal layer (the dura mater -- which adheres to the skull), and the arachnoid, which envelops the brain.

The amount of bleeding here would probably be about 7 to 8 cubic centimeters (7 cc = 1.4 teaspoons; 8 cc = 1.6 teaspoons. So 7 to 8 cc is the equivalent of about 1.5 teaspoons.) if it was collected and placed into a measuring device. This thin layer of blood is spread out over the entire right half of her brain and goes all the way down to the bottom of the right half of her brain.

The brain weighs 1450 grams (about 3 lbs. and 3oz.) and looks pretty normal in its shape.

Even though I (Meyer) just said there was no noticeable uneven swelling, there must be a small amount of swelling because of what is seen in the ridges and grooves of the surface of the brain.

I (Meyer) don’t see where this small amount of swelling is coming from.

In addition to the thin layer of subdural bleeding mentioned earlier, there is also another thin layer of blood in the area between the arachnoid and the pia mater (refer to Illustration-2, and Illustration-3) that covers all of the right half of the brain.

On the right half of the brain underneath the linear fracture is a large area of purple bruising of the outer portion of the brain. This bruising goes from above her eye socket to the back, along the right side of the top of her skull, all the way back to the back of her skull. This bruised area is 8” long by 1.75” wide (It coincides with the length and the location of the linear fracture.)

There is a very small area of bruising on the back of the brain

The blood veins and arteries of her brain show no signs of hardening.

With a carving knife, multiple sections of each of the two upper halves of the brain were cut, as well as sections of the two lower parts of the brain (as is the standard autopsy practice).

Once the sections were cut, a cross-section of the bruises noted before on the outer surface of the brain could be seen. These bruises went about 5 millimeters (about 0.2”) deep.

Examination of the base of the brain discloses no additional fractures.
 
Thanks Otg, for the amazing work and effort you have put into this thread.
Very interesting and informative read :)

I lean more towards a moving and swinging heavy and small object (smaller area, higher pressure )without sharp edges hitting on JB's head rather than her head crashing on a sharp object or a wide flat surface .
 
I might imagine that the intruders put the tire iron or crowbar back in their burglary kit, perhaps along with the duct tape, and the cord, and whatever other burglary tools they brought with them that evening.

These intruders were apparently very careful not to leave behind a lot of forensic evidence that could be traced back to them, just as surely as they were apparently very careful about making absolutely certain that JonBenet was dead. It would have been odd for them to have not taken the crowbar with them when they left.


What's even more odd is that they also left a ransom note without taking the body. I don't think this is a case involving "intruders".
 
In the annals of crime history, the number of burglaries that evolved into homicide is incalculable.



Once again, it appears that you are badly misinformed.



Actually, in this case, it is. Indeed, it is the only explanation for it, considering the body being left in the basement.



In a botched burglary turned child murder, the intelligent thing to do is not take anything that could finger you as having ever been present in the Ramsey home should you ever be suspected of the crime.



No discovered evidence of a break-in does not equate to there having been no intruders intent on burglary. While there might not have been much reason for the average patrol officer to consider that an unlawful entry had occurred, a competent detective would know better and would not rule out the possibility. The fact is that evidence of forceful entry is not always present in a burglary, particularly a home burglary where the residents are not fastidious about maintaining home security.

then why not just take the ransom note with them? assuming that this is indeed a burglary gone wrong and taking a body would be a risk, why not just take the ransom note and be gone? i think the intruder theory is a weak probability and one which doesn't hold weight. The killer(s) attempted to make it look like an intruder had come in but failed, and that failure comes through via weak evidence (suitcase by window etc). Luck and money has kept the truth away and instead we get a dance in circles around every minute detail in this case.
 
Nice detective work otg. Haven't read this whole thread but saw your post from the link you posted earlier. One more thing...on the subject of phones, throw me in with the group who think the 911 call likely happened in the basement.

Us sleuthers could've solved this case back then. otg, you dig for the murder weapon, we'll put superdave on Patsy like white on rice, have uk interview Burke, I'll tear holes in John and Fleet's basement sequence, maybe fly out and have a nice chat with JAR, and we'd have wrapped this thing up in three shakes of a lamb's tail.

I'm gonna read more of this thread tonight. Thanks for linking it.

edit:

The pineapple and cream happiness was part of Patsy's blessing, kinda of a delicious last meal, if you will.

"Sandy Stranger had a feeling at the time that they were supposed to be the happiest days of her life, and on her tenth birthday she said so to her best friend Jenny Gray who had been asked to tea at Sandy's house. The specialty of the feast was pineapple cubes with cream, and the specialty of the day was that they were left to themselves. To Sandy the unfamiliar pineapple had the authentic taste and appearance of happiness and she focused her small eyes closely on the pale gold cubes before she scooped them up in her spoon, and she ... Both girls saved the cream to the last, then ate it in spoonfuls." ~ TPOMJB

We know it was not JonBenét's favorite blanket that was found wrapped around her but it quite simply was the white blanket from her bed. A kidnapper walking out of the house with a stolen child wrapped in a white blanket might catch a bit of attention. I think it was chosen by Patsy because it was the color white, the color of purity.
Wow....I cant believe this TPOMJB theory is still around. Talk about muddying the waters. It used to be laughed at but I guess a few started taking it seriously for whatever reason.

Is that one part about Jonbenet being religiously sacrificed on an altar and posed still in that theory or did its believers remove that due to its complete absurdity?
 
Still reading through this thread...this is the first time I've read a theory that Jonbenét was attacked while she was sitting down.

Someone pointed out she might have been teasing Burke during the Pinapple snack leading up to the head blow. It's really interesting I must say...it would place all emphasis on the kitchen (and the reason why Patsy denied feeding them the Pinapple, and the reason they denied she was awake upon arrival) and would deter any particular event originating in her bedroom. Or not? on one had she might have gone to sleep and Burke woke her up to go to the kitchen to eat the snack. Or she may have joined him if she woke up by herself and heard him down there OR Patsy witnessed the whole thing unfold right from the start...
 
Still reading through this thread...this is the first time I've read a theory that Jonbenét was attacked while she was sitting down.

Someone pointed out she might have been teasing Burke during the Pinapple snack leading up to the head blow. It's really interesting I must say...it would place all emphasis on the kitchen (and the reason why Patsy denied feeding them the Pinapple, and the reason they denied she was awake upon arrival) and would deter any particular event originating in her bedroom. Or not? on one had she might have gone to sleep and Burke woke her up to go to the kitchen to eat the snack. Or she may have joined him if she woke up by herself and heard him down there OR Patsy witnessed the whole thing unfold right from the start...

FrankieB,
James Kolar thinks it all started in the breakfast bar and ended down in the basement, now for all those who entertain some RDI theory the main questions regarding the breakfast bar as the genesis of JonBenet's demise are these: if JR or/and PR are aware it all began in the breakfast bar, why did they not clean it up? Similarly for any BDI, if BR undertook some basic staging, then left the murder scene why did he not cleanup the breakfast bar too?

I would suggest neither parent was aware of the breakfast bar pineapple snack otherwise they would have recognized there might be incriminating forensic evidence available, and instituted a clean up?

.

.
 
FrankieB,
James Kolar thinks it all started in the breakfast bar and ended down in the basement, now for all those who entertain some RDI theory the main questions regarding the breakfast bar as the genesis of JonBenet's demise are these: if JR or/and PR are aware it all began in the breakfast bar, why did they not clean it up? Similarly for any BDI, if BR undertook some basic staging, then left the murder scene why did he not cleanup the breakfast bar too?

I would suggest neither parent was aware of the breakfast bar pineapple snack otherwise they would have recognized there might be incriminating forensic evidence available, and instituted a clean up?

.

.

I had a post a couple of weeks ago to this effect. Patsy denies even SERVING pineapple; had either parent been aware of the pineapple in JonBenet's digestive tract they'd have obviously incorporated this into their version of events. This suggests that they did not know that whatever happened to JonBenet began in the breakfast bar.
 
I had a post a couple of weeks ago to this effect. Patsy denies even SERVING pineapple; had either parent been aware of the pineapple in JonBenet's digestive tract they'd have obviously incorporated this into their version of events. This suggests that they did not know that whatever happened to JonBenet began in the breakfast bar.

AndHence,
ITA. Patsy's flat out denial regarding the pineapple snack was likely inspired by legal advice, that's just how its done, i.e. we will worry about the details if it ever hits the court room.

Patsy not only denied serving pineapple she denied some of the table items were Ramsey property!

Similarly with the size-12's except Patsy was caught out, so invented some legend regarding JonBenet wanting those size-12's, and not a pack Patsy could have ordered over the phone direct from Bloomingdales for delivery three days hence!

These points along with JR grandstanding about aspects of the basement, i.e. JARs suitcase, the SEO does housework but hires LHP as a general maid. All suggest the parents were working with a limited knowledge of JonBenet's homicide and forced to do a lot of backtracking.

When you add in the GJ decision to charge the parents as accomplices to a homicide then its a pretty safe bet that the case is BDI.

.
 
I read through this one but I'm no math wiz, it was lost on me. Y'all sounded really smart though. Can someone put it in baseball terms for me? Like at the games there's cages with machines that tell you how fast you throw a ball. When my brother was around 10 he could throw a ball close to 60 mph. Let's say Burke threw the flashlight at 60 mph, would that be hard enough to do the skull damage that was done to Jonbenet? Some boys could throw harder at that age. It wouldn't necessarily have had to be thrown it could have been swung, I'm just trying to figure out the force needed to do the damage with my limited math skills. And it doesn't have to be the flashlight.

Sent from my XT830C using Tapatalk
 
FrankieB,
James Kolar thinks it all started in the breakfast bar and ended down in the basement, now for all those who entertain some RDI theory the main questions regarding the breakfast bar as the genesis of JonBenet's demise are these: if JR or/and PR are aware it all began in the breakfast bar, why did they not clean it up? Similarly for any BDI, if BR undertook some basic staging, then left the murder scene why did he not cleanup the breakfast bar too?

I would suggest neither parent was aware of the breakfast bar pineapple snack otherwise they would have recognized there might be incriminating forensic evidence available, and instituted a clean up?
The one problem I have with Kolar's theory is that it appears Patsy never went to bed that night (as evidenced by her clothing). If she was still awake and in her street clothes, wouldn't she have noticed the kids eating pineapple in the kitchen and/or fighting? How was BR able to do all this if PR was awake?
 
I read through this one but I'm no math wiz, it was lost on me. Y'all sounded really smart though. Can someone put it in baseball terms for me? Like at the games there's cages with machines that tell you how fast you throw a ball. When my brother was around 10 he could throw a ball close to 60 mph. Let's say Burke threw the flashlight at 60 mph, would that be hard enough to do the skull damage that was done to Jonbenet? Some boys could throw harder at that age. It wouldn't necessarily have had to be thrown it could have been swung, I'm just trying to figure out the force needed to do the damage with my limited math skills. And it doesn't have to be the flashlight.
Math isn't necessary to understand how easily tragic accidents can happen with kids. Without the cognitive skills of an adult to realize how dangerous something might be, kids do things that adults will say was "stupid." But kids just don't have the ability to objectively think (based on their limited experience) about the possible consequences of their actions.

As to whether a child is capable of delivering a blow powerful enough to have caused JonBenet's skull fracture, the answer is yes, assuming the bludgeon too has the potential. Here is a story of another child tragically killed by an accidental injury from a 7-year-old child wielding a child's golf club:
http://www.tctimes.com/news/holly-a...cle_4a2ca18d-6f67-5013-b98d-3dd5e253827f.html

Personally, I don't think it was the Maglite, but I realize why so many attach such significance to it (location, fingerprints, Ramsey denials, etc.). I used to think it was a golf putter because of the description in the AR of the "hole" being "rectangular," and because of several other things. But when the photo was leaked showing the actual injury, I could see that description was incorrect. That's part of what I tried to show earlier in this thread.

Also, there are some who believe the skull damage was caused by her having been shoved/slammed/dropped into a stationary object. I think that's possible, but I don't think that's what caused JonBenet's injuries so I'll let those proponents make their own case (BOESP? :biggrin:).

The math I used upthread was to try and figure the probable shape and size of the bludgeon (or object that her head hit), because I think the depressed fracture tells us that. I think the investigators missed the object that was used (mostly because they didn't know what they were looking for and because they were misled by Werner Spitz), and I think I've seen it in videos and photos taken after the house had been vacated and BPD finished their search. But that's another story you'll find in this thread somewhere...
 
WARNING: graphic descriptions follow in the response to otg's quote below.

Math isn't necessary to understand how easily tragic accidents can happen with kids. Without the cognitive skills of an adult to realize how dangerous something might be, kids do things that adults will say was "stupid." But kids just don't have the ability to objectively think (based on their limited experience) about the possible consequences of their actions.

As to whether a child is capable of delivering a blow powerful enough to have caused JonBenet's skull fracture, the answer is yes, assuming the bludgeon too has the potential. Here is a story of another child tragically killed by an accidental injury from a 7-year-old child wielding a child's golf club:
http://www.tctimes.com/news/holly-a...cle_4a2ca18d-6f67-5013-b98d-3dd5e253827f.html

Personally, I don't think it was the Maglite, but I realize why so many attach such significance to it (location, fingerprints, Ramsey denials, etc.). I used to think it was a golf putter because of the description in the AR of the "hole" being "rectangular," and because of several other things. But when the photo was leaked showing the actual injury, I could see that description was incorrect. That's part of what I tried to show earlier in this thread.

Also, there are some who believe the skull damage was caused by her having been shoved/slammed/dropped into a stationary object. I think that's possible, but I don't think that's what caused JonBenet's injuries so I'll let those proponents make their own case (BOESP? :biggrin:).

The math I used upthread was to try and figure the probable shape and size of the bludgeon (or object that her head hit), because I think the depressed fracture tells us that. I think the investigators missed the object that was used (mostly because they didn't know what they were looking for and because they were misled by Werner Spitz), and I think I've seen it in videos and photos taken after the house had been vacated and BPD finished their search. But that's another story you'll find in this thread somewhere...

You rang? :facepalm:

Basically, I think JonBenet's injury appears to be a low velocity+high pressure wound. I think she possibly was slung into a doorknob (in her bedroom?) or pushed onto some fixture in her bathroom adjoining her bedroom, or was dragged by the shirt collar then heaved into some immovable object. This could possibly also involve a person falling on her in conjunction with the push or shove. Keep in mind these are speculations only.

My favorite opinion is that Patsy tied JonBenet while still alive to make it easier for Patsy to clean JonBenet after JonBenet soiled herself. That the ropes prevented JonBenet from flailing around and then Patsy pushed her backwards onto a fixture in the bathroom, Patsy creating pressure with her hands as she pushed. Then Patsy tried to shake JonBenet awake (or some version of similar events).

After seeing the train room and door knob and table in the Clemente video clip, I see several options for it happening in the train room too.

Low velocity would exclude a projectile such as a bullet, dart, etc. Now a baseball bat, maglite, iron bar, etc., could still produce a relatively low velocity wound but sufficient pressure applied in a specific way would be needed to create such a long fracture that runs in two directions from the relatively small depression left in JonBenet's skull.

Iirc, there was also a contre-coup effect seen in the brain. This is basically a concussion type injury as seen in shaken-baby syndrome, auto injuries where a car traveling at any speed suddenly halts (such as a head-on collision with an immovable object) yet the internal organs are still propelled against the bony structures of the skeleton. In other words, the internal organs keep moving even if the vehicle and entire body have stopped. Similar effects are also seen in injuries other than auto accidents.

If I am wrong and I may very well be, otg's idea of an iron bar or iron tube of some type (am I right on my assumption of this as the weapon???) seems more logical to me than the maglite or a golf club.
 
She might have been upstairs wrapping the last few presents and packing and then after that found ...
 
WARNING: graphic descriptions follow in the response to otg's quote below.



You rang? :facepalm:

Basically, I think JonBenet's injury appears to be a low velocity+high pressure wound. I think she possibly was slung into a doorknob (in her bedroom?) or pushed onto some fixture in her bathroom adjoining her bedroom, or was dragged by the shirt collar then heaved into some immovable object. This could possibly also involve a person falling on her in conjunction with the push or shove. Keep in mind these are speculations only.

My favorite opinion is that Patsy tied JonBenet while still alive to make it easier for Patsy to clean JonBenet after JonBenet soiled herself. That the ropes prevented JonBenet from flailing around and then Patsy pushed her backwards onto a fixture in the bathroom, Patsy creating pressure with her hands as she pushed. Then Patsy tried to shake JonBenet awake (or some version of similar events).

After seeing the train room and door knob and table in the Clemente video clip, I see several options for it happening in the train room too.

Low velocity would exclude a projectile such as a bullet, dart, etc. Now a baseball bat, maglite, iron bar, etc., could still produce a relatively low velocity wound but sufficient pressure applied in a specific way would be needed to create such a long fracture that runs in two directions from the relatively small depression left in JonBenet's skull.

Iirc, there was also a contre-coup effect seen in the brain. This is basically a concussion type injury as seen in shaken-baby syndrome, auto injuries where a car traveling at any speed suddenly halts (such as a head-on collision with an immovable object) yet the internal organs are still propelled against the bony structures of the skeleton. In other words, the internal organs keep moving even if the vehicle and entire body have stopped. Similar effects are also seen in injuries other than auto accidents.

If I am wrong and I may very well be, otg's idea of an iron bar or iron tube of some type (am I right on my assumption of this as the weapon???) seems more logical to me than the maglite or a golf club.
Yup, yup, yup. I knew you could explain it better than me, my friend.

Yeah, I had decided before I saw the video screenshot of Smit standing right there in the basement with it in the background that it was probably about a foot-and-a-half long section of 1/2" diameter iron pipe that caused the skull fracture. When I saw that screenshot, it was like, "Holy... uhhhh... cow, there it is, and it wasn't even noticed by the cops."

For those who don't know what we're talking about::

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Math isn't necessary to understand how easily tragic accidents can happen with kids. Without the cognitive skills of an adult to realize how dangerous something might be, kids do things that adults will say was "stupid." But kids just don't have the ability to objectively think (based on their limited experience) about the possible consequences of their actions.

As to whether a child is capable of delivering a blow powerful enough to have caused JonBenet's skull fracture, the answer is yes, assuming the bludgeon too has the potential. Here is a story of another child tragically killed by an accidental injury from a 7-year-old child wielding a child's golf club:
http://www.tctimes.com/news/holly-a...cle_4a2ca18d-6f67-5013-b98d-3dd5e253827f.html

Personally, I don't think it was the Maglite, but I realize why so many attach such significance to it (location, fingerprints, Ramsey denials, etc.). I used to think it was a golf putter because of the description in the AR of the "hole" being "rectangular," and because of several other things. But when the photo was leaked showing the actual injury, I could see that description was incorrect. That's part of what I tried to show earlier in this thread.

Also, there are some who believe the skull damage was caused by her having been shoved/slammed/dropped into a stationary object. I think that's possible, but I don't think that's what caused JonBenet's injuries so I'll let those proponents make their own case (BOESP? :biggrin:).

The math I used upthread was to try and figure the probable shape and size of the bludgeon (or object that her head hit), because I think the depressed fracture tells us that. I think the investigators missed the object that was used (mostly because they didn't know what they were looking for and because they were misled by Werner Spitz), and I think I've seen it in videos and photos taken after the house had been vacated and BPD finished their search. But that's another story you'll find in this thread somewhere...
Thank you, I've always wondered about the flashlight. I kind of think it may have been put out only as a prop to make it appear as if an intruder had been there, not as a murder weapon stand-in. I too think Burke did it, I've just always wondered how hard he had to have hit her. But what you said makes sense, the shape and size of the weapon would have a lot to do with it.
 

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