Kentucky - Judge killed, sheriff arrested in Letcher County courthouse shooting - Sep. 19, 2024 # 2

[Friday Fan]

protective orders aren't in effect in courthouses because victims often have to testify in court cases against their assailant JMO

They also aren't in effect in jail either!

KY is the second highest tobacco producing state. That said, most public buildings prohibit smoking, so he was likely sneaking.

 

[jlo6161a]

What I also noticed is around the the 14:52:28 second mark, what appears to be a phone on the desk lights up. I don't know whose phone it is. It's closer to where Stines would have been sitting.

It has to be the judge's phone. Stines' phone was found on his person. This is when he takes the final shots and leaves.

 

[Friday Fan]

It has to be the judge's phone. Stines' phone was found on his person. This is when he takes the final shots and leaves.

Thank you!

There also was something that appeared to be a phone next to the judge's laptop. Underneath his cigarette hand. I could not tell if was a phone or not. It appears to have a brownish case if it is a phone. There also appears to be a landline closest to the window. The cord gets caught when the judge falls and the landline tumbles down to the ground. Anyway if the judge has landline and a brown cell phone, would he need another phone? What if the black phone was Stine's and he went back in and retrieved it? (Video doesn't show it) Sorry for the poor quality:

 

[jlo6161a]

Thank you!

There also was something that appeared to be a phone next to the judge's laptop. Underneath his cigarette hand. I could not tell if was a phone or not. It appears to have a brownish case if it is a phone.

View attachment 535819View attachment 535823

I would guess it's the carton for the cigarettes.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Interesting. Can OP cite a case in the last 10-20 years where this happened? Thanks.

I am not OP but here is a thorough article on the topic: Jury Nullification in the United States. Examples are included. It is published in the Oxford Academic (2015), Oxford University Press.

 

[Florida_marlin]

Interesting. Can OP cite a case in the last 10-20 years where this happened? Thanks.

Philip Picone-Texas. Law is absurd and jury said naw, won’t convict.
Taiwanda Moore a few years ago acquitted of recording cops even though she did it. Jury was appalled at government overreach.
Melroy Court, a wheelchair bound man, acquitted of firearms charges because the jury thought the application of the law in his case was ridiculous.

Most case of JN these days are confined to controversial laws (like drug possession laws), government overreach, clear prosecutorial bias.

From HuffPost quoting NYT article
“In Montana last year, a group of five prospective jurors said they had a problem with someone receiving a felony for a small amount of marijuana. The prosecutors were freaked out about the "Mutiny in Montana" and were afraid they were not going to be able convince 12 jurors in Montana to convict. The judge said, in a major New York Times article, "I've never seen this large a number of people express this large a number of reservations" and "it does raise a question about the next case."

I believe it would be much harder to get to JN for crimes that most everyone agrees are crimes and are serious, like murder. In the first place, most reasonable people would agree we are not supposed to kill each other.

This case in particular? Yea, I’ve read some of the rumors and I’ve seen some of the “responses”, ie, I’d do the same thing, etc, etc. I am not going to assume the worst rumors in this case are true until there is evidence to support. I do not support victim bashing in any fashion.

However, if I were to put forward a hypothetical. Assume a family member of a shooter had been the victim of a heinous crime by a deceased, and said shooter decided to take the law into own hands and executed the deceased on his own judgement. If the supposed preexisting crime came out to be true, would there be a juror who ended up on the jury and would say, I won’t convict because I believe this shooter was justified? Maybe one. Maybe a few. They would have to survive voie dire and not get booted by strikes or the judge. The odds all 12 would vote to outright acquit with the execution on tape? Highly unlikely, in my opinion. The possibility one or more jurors could hang the jury? Possible, in my opinion. But again, they would have to survive voie dire, which I believe the prosecution and judge would be loaded for bear to suss that out ahead of time.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Philip Picone-Texas. Law is absurd and jury said naw, won’t convict.
Taiwanda Moore a few years ago acquitted of recording cops even though she did it. Jury was appalled at government overreach.
Melroy Court, a wheelchair bound man, acquitted of firearms charges because the jury thought the application of the law in his case was ridiculous.

Most case of JN these days are confined to controversial laws (like drug possession laws), government overreach, clear prosecutorial bias.

From HuffPost quoting NYT article
“In Montana last year, a group of five prospective jurors said they had a problem with someone receiving a felony for a small amount of marijuana. The prosecutors were freaked out about the "Mutiny in Montana" and were afraid they were not going to be able convince 12 jurors in Montana to convict. The judge said, in a major New York Times article, "I've never seen this large a number of people express this large a number of reservations" and "it does raise a question about the next case."

I believe it would be much harder to get to JN for crimes that most everyone agrees are crimes and are serious, like murder. In the first place, most reasonable people would agree we are not supposed to kill each other.

This case in particular? Yea, I’ve read some of the rumors and I’ve seen some of the “responses”, ie, I’d do the same thing, etc, etc. I am not going to assume the worst rumors in this case are true until there is evidence to support. I do not support victim bashing in any fashion.

However, if I were to put forward a hypothetical. Assume a family member of a shooter had been the victim of a heinous crime by a deceased, and said shooter decided to take the law into own hands and executed the deceased on his own judgement. If the supposed preexisting crime came out to be true, would there be a juror who ended up on the jury and would say, I won’t convict because I believe this shooter was justified? Maybe one. Maybe a few. They would have to survive voie dire and not get booted by strikes or the judge. The odds all 12 would vote to outright acquit with the execution on tape? Highly unlikely, in my opinion. The possibility one or more jurors could hang the jury? Possible, in my opinion. But again, they would have to survive voie dire, which I believe the prosecution and judge would be loaded for bear to suss that out ahead of time.

The article that I posted includes JN for murder, I believe.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Philip Picone-Texas. Law is absurd and jury said naw, won’t convict.
Taiwanda Moore a few years ago acquitted of recording cops even though she did it. Jury was appalled at government overreach.
Melroy Court, a wheelchair bound man, acquitted of firearms charges because the jury thought the application of the law in his case was ridiculous.

Most case of JN these days are confined to controversial laws (like drug possession laws), government overreach, clear prosecutorial bias.

From HuffPost quoting NYT article
“In Montana last year, a group of five prospective jurors said they had a problem with someone receiving a felony for a small amount of marijuana. The prosecutors were freaked out about the "Mutiny in Montana" and were afraid they were not going to be able convince 12 jurors in Montana to convict. The judge said, in a major New York Times article, "I've never seen this large a number of people express this large a number of reservations" and "it does raise a question about the next case."

I believe it would be much harder to get to JN for crimes that most everyone agrees are crimes and are serious, like murder. In the first place, most reasonable people would agree we are not supposed to kill each other.

This case in particular? Yea, I’ve read some of the rumors and I’ve seen some of the “responses”, ie, I’d do the same thing, etc, etc. I am not going to assume the worst rumors in this case are true until there is evidence to support. I do not support victim bashing in any fashion.

However, if I were to put forward a hypothetical. Assume a family member of a shooter had been the victim of a heinous crime by a deceased, and said shooter decided to take the law into own hands and executed the deceased on his own judgement. If the supposed preexisting crime came out to be true, would there be a juror who ended up on the jury and would say, I won’t convict because I believe this shooter was justified? Maybe one. Maybe a few. They would have to survive voie dire and not get booted by strikes or the judge. The odds all 12 would vote to outright acquit with the execution on tape? Highly unlikely, in my opinion. The possibility one or more jurors could hang the jury? Possible, in my opinion. But again, they would have to survive voie dire, which I believe the prosecution and judge would be loaded for bear to suss that out ahead of time.

I think it depends on several factors, not the least of which is the nature of the hypothetical heinous crime. amoo

 

[MollyDDD]

Longer video of shooting here. Shows where judge's hands are likely first raised until Stines leaves the room.

Omg, that poor man! What a way to go. It’s so upsetting to watch how Stine methodically shot him to death, and even made sure he was dead.
Honestly, how can anyone justify his actions? IMO

 

[al66pine]

Blue Sign. Any Relevance?

Longer video of shooting here.....

sbm @Friday Fan Thanks for posting link to the longer vid of shooting.

I noticed the blue SIGN sitting on floor btwn desk & window. It says "Matt Butler" * plus more text that I can't read. At ~16 sec, more of sign is visible.

Can anyone decipher the rest of the sign? Maybe a campaign sign, for previous or future election? Or _______?

Any possible relevance to background or motive of Stine's shooting?

__________________________
* "...Letcher County Commonwealth's Attorney Matt Butler recused himself from the case due to familial ties. Butler and Mullins were once brothers-in-law." *
^ Kentucky sheriff remains behind bars after judge's death as details emerge Sept 25 story notes MATT

 

[worm]

Omg, that poor man! What a way to go. It’s so upsetting to watch how Stine methodically shot him to death, and even made sure he was dead.
Honestly, how can anyone justify his actions? IMO

I don’t see how it could be justified either. At one point the judge turns around almost and Stines fires away.

 

[GoBuckeyes]

Blue Sign. Any Relevance?

sbm @Friday Fan Thanks for posting link to the longer vid of shooting.

I noticed the blue SIGN sitting on floor btwn desk & window. It says "Matt Butler" * plus more text that I can't read. At ~16 sec, more of sign is visible.

Can anyone decipher the rest of the sign? Maybe a campaign sign, for previous or future election? Or _______?

Any possible relevance to background or motive of Stine's shooting?

__________________________
* "...Letcher County Commonwealth's Attorney Matt Butler recused himself from the case due to familial ties. Butler and Mullins were once brothers-in-law." *
^ Kentucky sheriff remains behind bars after judge's death as details emerge Sept 25 story notes MATT

Wow!