Found Deceased KS - Lucas Hernandez, 5, Wichita, 17 Feb 2018 #4 *Arrest*

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I've been lurking for quite a while, but this case and Cherish Perrywinkle's really pushed me to join.

As for why the description of the pull ups - consider that perhaps the description of what he was/is wearing is true. Pullups, no shoes. There is usually a kernel of truth in these things, it keeps the story straight in the teller's mind - descriptions of clothing and places - solid, vivid things you can draw from to use as anchors to make your story emotive and believable.
But the timeline doesn't have to be the truth, because time isn't linear when you are retelling a story. Especially if you're lying.
Ok, I think I get what you are saying;
that it may have been normal for Lucas to wear pull ups during naptime and therefore she used the pull ups in her description of what he had been wearing that afternoon even though
it may have never happened?

If he had been ill with strep, perhaps he was more tired than usual what with the illness and antibiotics and she was having him nap again. I wonder how detailed her explanation was to the police. That would all make sense.
Of course, I'm sure LE checked for the presence of antibiotics in the home.

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As the days keep going by without any info on poor Lucas, the more ticked off I get. We all are ticked off. Majority of us our mothers, fathers, uncles, aunts, grandparents- I think we all sit back and picture our own child going through what poor Lucas went through and what he thought to himself every damn day! He probably pondered why his step mom hated him and tortured him. Why didn’t she love him behind closed doors like she pretended to in public? Why was he not good enough for her? That kills me to know he probably thought like that! No child deserves this!!! The country as a whole needs to do better. Child and family services needs to do better. There needs to be more action taken when abuse is reported. Drugs have turned good people into crazed idiots and they lash out their children. We don’t know if EG was on anything, but statistics show a lot of dead/murdered children is due to the girlfriend/boyfriend or drug addict parents! We have to do more! We have failed too many kids in this country!
 
What I was thinking after I signed off last night was this...

There was some confusion over what was said about the search for Lucas at the home when it said the sniffer dogs couldn't find a trail and they couldn't find him in the home. I think it was bad reporting grammar and they meant that the dogs couldn't find a trail and the officers doing an eyeball search, checking under beds, cupboards, etc couldn't find Lucas in the home or garden.

Then, I think the day before yesterday someone said that LE had gone back to the current address to do checks there? I kind of suspect that the return to that address was the full forensic and cadaver dog search. As far as I know sniffer dogs don't go into the home to check for a person's scent, something is brought out of the home for the dog to sniff and the dog starts at the last known location for the person, not inside the home but outside the front door or wherever they were last seen.

At the point of the return to the address, that roughly coincides with the arrest of EG, though I don't know if it was before or after (maybe they needed the arrest to get the warrant for the full forensics/cadaver dog check?) the LE activity seems to have changed focus. I fear they might actually have found something concerning in the home, in the car, at the old address (if they were going back and forth during the move)? It could be the weather that has caused no reports of LE outside activity recently, but it could also have changed for this reason if they're trying to switch to an intelligence-led investigation based on tips, talking to people, and what they found during those higher-level forensic searches.

The parks searching didn't seem like it was ping based or anything like a trail or sighting because they went from one park to another, and then to a third in a totally different area of town. Maybe someone overhearing that she went to the park could have caused those searches, or the FBI team might have suggested to start in those places, but I see it more like in the Mariah searches where LE were focused on bridges over creeks and small ponds for nearly a week before they hit on the right creek.

If it's something like EG claims to LE that on Saturday morning she took the kids to the park, maybe they'd check the parks, but then why would Lucas' shoes be at home? If he only has the green shoes that fit him at the moment, then something must have happened in the home (if EG is responsible) because he was only in socks and not in shoes.

I've also been trying to consider that if something happened in the home there might have been a re-dressing (a pm re-dressing).. Or that Lucas might not have been wearing those clothes when he went missing and they're a part of the alibi and have simply been thrown into a dumpster? But if the latter was the case, why the socks and not the shoes? This is partly why I want to know if it was common for Lucas to wear socks inside the home? There's one picture of him in the house that I saw with his feet showing and he had bare feet, so when does Lucas wear socks but not shoes? Did something happen while he was getting ready for bed and he wears socks to bed? Did something happen when they were getting ready to go out and he had his socks on but not his shoes? If EG wanted things to appear that Lucas had wandered off, why didn't she put the shoes on or throw them in a dumpster, why leave them in the home yet say Lucas was wearing socks?

I don't have any potential answers to these questions, but they stand out to me, and I wonder if anyone else here might be able to work with them and come up with some ideas?

All thoughtful ideas, comments, questions, Amonet...:thumb:

However...
IIRC... Cadaver dogs DID "hit" on a place inside Little Lisa Irwin's home...
Indicating there had been some kind of deceased bio matter there...

But it was explained away by "soiled diapers".... Menstrual blood... Or some such hogwash...

Someone please correct me if I am wrong...

(That was the case that brought me to Websleuths...:websleuther: )
 
I also wondered about the pull ups.
That was a detail I found interesting.
Why use the pull ups description if it wasn't true? Especially during the middle of the day. I can't quite articulate why this bugs me.

I'm sure they checked current trash for used pull ups. Was there a box of them in his room?


He probably wore pull-ups at night, like many kids his age do. She probably mentioned it as a way to reinforce that he was supposed to be napping.
 
All thoughtful ideas, comments, questions, Amonet...:thumb:

However...
IIRC... Cadaver dogs DID "hit" on a place inside Little Lisa Irwin's home...
Indicating there had been some kind of deceased bio matter there...

But it was explained away by "soiled diapers".... Menstrual blood... Or some such hogwash...

Someone please correct me if I am wrong...

(That was the case that brought me to Websleuths...:websleuther: )
I see some similarities between this case and baby Lisa's. I do remember the cadaver dog hit in the Mom and Dad Irwin's bedroom. Baby Lisa Irwin had been ill and there was speculation she may have inadvertently overdosed on cold medication and died all while Momma was on the front porch drinking a box of wine.

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I definitely thought about this, but the rational side of my brain says if this was the case, I feel like she would talk, know what I mean? Thinking, "Well, I didn't kill him, so I can't be charged with murder, so maybe I'll just talk and they'll let me off easy..."

But then again, she may not KNOW anything legally, so she may think that talking will still get her prison time, so she's just choosing to remain quiet.

Gah. I just don't know with this girl.

Well....maybe she found him after he had been passed for quite awhile from complications of strep, when it would be obvious to anyone she had neglected to care for him for a long time, not just during naptime.

IDK...just considering a possibility. Speculation only.

jmo
 
I see some similarities between this case and baby Lisa's. I do remember the cadaver dog hit in the Mom and Dad Irwin's bedroom. Baby Lisa Irwin had been ill and there was speculation she may have inadvertently overdosed on cold medication and died all while Momma was on the front porch drinking a box of wine.

Sent from my REVVLPLUS C3701A using Tapatalk

Lisa was ill and then missing? It's possible (not confirmed) Lucas was ill too.

Overdose of medication is a possibility.

jmo, speculation, not fact
 
Has there been any mention of this possible strep/10 days missing of school in any msm article? I keep seeing it here but I don't recall seeing it anywhere else.

Also, the next time I decide to go reading the madness on FB about a missing child, someone please bonk me on the head first? :gaah:
 
Back on Day 1, a news article said that when "the adults" woke up from their nap Lucas was gone. Someone said the other adult was EG's sister. But what if it was actually another man? Maybe she had a side piece that got angry and hurt Lucas, but she can't tell the truth without admitting she was cheating?
 
Has there been any mention of this possible strep/10 days missing of school in any msm article? I keep seeing it here but I don't recall seeing it anywhere else.

Also, the next time I decide to go reading the madness on FB about a missing child, someone please bonk me on the head first? :gaah:

Not confirmed. Speculation only at this point - as we're pointing out.

jmo
 
Back on Day 1, a news article said that when "the adults" woke up from their nap Lucas was gone. Someone said the other adult was EG's sister. But what if it was actually another man? Maybe she had a side piece that got angry and hurt Lucas, but she can't tell the truth without admitting she was cheating?

That's another possibility! My tiny brain can't handle another possibility. :dunno:

Many ideas on the table now, right? (And one person who knows the truth. imo)

jmo
 
Back on Day 1, a news article said that when "the adults" woke up from their nap Lucas was gone. Someone said the other adult was EG's sister. But what if it was actually another man? Maybe she had a side piece that got angry and hurt Lucas, but she can't tell the truth without admitting she was cheating?

This may be a thought. Since JH got custody of Lucas, maybe she's afraid he will get custody of their daughter too, if she admits she was cheating. Fear that he will go after her.
 
Regarding the pull-up, how many times have we seen on here that a precious baby was murdered \abused for potty accidents? Isn't it common in abuse cases for the abused child to wet the bed, etc? I feel like the dumpster idea so many have mentioned is very likely, IMO
 
I'm not thinking revenge against the bio-mom, but perhaps resentment about having to take care of little Lucas. The school incident could've been a trigger for an escalation in resentment and abuse, though. I mentioned upthread that EG's reaction at the school looks like how a user/addict/alcohol acts. They lash out, are defensive, and are irrational. They can get irrational to the point of violence that they feel is justified.

In a sober situation, anyone forgetting to pick up a child at school would be apologetic, embarrassed, and thankful that someone was there to help. They would reassure everyone, especially the child, that it won't happen again. Instead, she was angry at others even though she was a fault. Irrational.

By not showing up at school pick-up (because she was "napping"), her problems were out in the public for the school employees, other parents, etc to see. Plus, she had to face the fact herself that she screwed up - people using drugs/alcohol can't handle that. They lash out instead of taking responsibility.

The school incident indeed could've been what started worse treatment of innocent Lucas, caught up in her storm. But I don't think SM hurt Lucas to get back at bio mom. I think her behavior was selfishness cranked up to the level of violence. JMO.

The irrational anger and the "napping" looks like drug/alcohol abuse, in my opinion, which is not a professional opinion but one based on life experience. I don't know much about drugs, but I do have experience dealing with alcoholics, though none as ugly as this person.

jmopinion

I agree with your well thought out theories here...

Except...
I believe part of the motive could INCLUDE lashing out at bio mom...
In ADDITION to the other reasons you listed...

Very complex, irrational behavior often has complex roots...

All JMO...:thinking:
 
What I was thinking after I signed off last night was this...

There was some confusion over what was said about the search for Lucas at the home when it said the sniffer dogs couldn't find a trail and they couldn't find him in the home. I think it was bad reporting grammar and they meant that the dogs couldn't find a trail and the officers doing an eyeball search, checking under beds, cupboards, etc couldn't find Lucas in the home or garden.

Then, I think the day before yesterday someone said that LE had gone back to the current address to do checks there? I kind of suspect that the return to that address was the full forensic and cadaver dog search. As far as I know sniffer dogs don't go into the home to check for a person's scent, something is brought out of the home for the dog to sniff and the dog starts at the last known location for the person, not inside the home but outside the front door or wherever they were last seen.

At the point of the return to the address, that roughly coincides with the arrest of EG, though I don't know if it was before or after (maybe they needed the arrest to get the warrant for the full forensics/cadaver dog check?) the LE activity seems to have changed focus. I fear they might actually have found something concerning in the home, in the car, at the old address (if they were going back and forth during the move)? It could be the weather that has caused no reports of LE outside activity recently, but it could also have changed for this reason if they're trying to switch to an intelligence-led investigation based on tips, talking to people, and what they found during those higher-level forensic searches.

The parks searching didn't seem like it was ping based or anything like a trail or sighting because they went from one park to another, and then to a third in a totally different area of town. Maybe someone overhearing that she went to the park could have caused those searches, or the FBI team might have suggested to start in those places, but I see it more like in the Mariah searches where LE were focused on bridges over creeks and small ponds for nearly a week before they hit on the right creek.

If it's something like EG claims to LE that on Saturday morning she took the kids to the park, maybe they'd check the parks, but then why would Lucas' shoes be at home? If he only has the green shoes that fit him at the moment, then something must have happened in the home (if EG is responsible) because he was only in socks and not in shoes.

I've also been trying to consider that if something happened in the home there might have been a re-dressing (a pm re-dressing).. Or that Lucas might not have been wearing those clothes when he went missing and they're a part of the alibi and have simply been thrown into a dumpster? But if the latter was the case, why the socks and not the shoes? This is partly why I want to know if it was common for Lucas to wear socks inside the home? There's one picture of him in the house that I saw with his feet showing and he had bare feet, so when does Lucas wear socks but not shoes? Did something happen while he was getting ready for bed and he wears socks to bed? Did something happen when they were getting ready to go out and he had his socks on but not his shoes? If EG wanted things to appear that Lucas had wandered off, why didn't she put the shoes on or throw them in a dumpster, why leave them in the home yet say Lucas was wearing socks?

I don't have any potential answers to these questions, but they stand out to me, and I wonder if anyone else here might be able to work with them and come up with some ideas?
I agree with your theory that this is likely now an intelligence-gathering focus. I've felt that way for a while, due to LE continually telling people not to search, and their pleas for any tips/information.

The socks indoors thing is standard in my family. My boots usually hit the floor on the mat just inside the front door before the door is even fully closed. That part, or the potential change of clothes for him, doesn't strike me as unusual at all.

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When collecting evidence at a residence which is thought to be a crime scene, is crime scene tape always used?

Other than MSM reports stating that WPD checked out both addresses, have there been MSM reports of searches at the home which included crime scene tape and evidence being collected? Any reports of their car(s) being taken by LE? I don't recall seeing this. Does that mean we're simply not aware of that having occurred or does that point to the crime NOT taking place or having anything to do with the old residence, the new residence or in the vehicle(s)? And if so, then where DID something occur?
 
I see some similarities between this case and baby Lisa's. I do remember the cadaver dog hit in the Mom and Dad Irwin's bedroom. Baby Lisa Irwin had been ill and there was speculation she may have inadvertently overdosed on cold medication and died all while Momma was on the front porch drinking a box of wine.

Sent from my REVVLPLUS C3701A using Tapatalk

I see many similarities between the two cases here too!

:(

ETA... And Thank you for helping to refresh my memory regarding the cadaver dog "hit" at the Irwin home.
 
Back on Day 1, a news article said that when "the adults" woke up from their nap Lucas was gone. Someone said the other adult was EG's sister. But what if it was actually another man? Maybe she had a side piece that got angry and hurt Lucas, but she can't tell the truth without admitting she was cheating?

Thank you for this....

I still am trying to find a way to discover the "they" (as in "the adults woke up" )
that was mentioned at the beginning of this case...

But I can find no MSM link to it in my notes...:dunno:
 
Back on Day 1, a news article said that when "the adults" woke up from their nap Lucas was gone. Someone said the other adult was EG's sister. But what if it was actually another man? Maybe she had a side piece that got angry and hurt Lucas, but she can't tell the truth without admitting she was cheating?
Interesting speculation. I have found it somewhat odd that all of the initial reports included her sister being there, but now that's not mentioned at all. And it could explain the "nap".

To be fair, though, it could also be a case of mis-information in the beginning when news was moving too fast to vet everything.

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