KY - Multiple casualties in active shooter situation at Old National Bank in Louisville, Apr 2023 *suspect dead*

[Dotta]

Head-trauma expert raises flags about Louisville shooter's concussions

A head-trauma expert is calling for more to be done to prevent traumatic brain injuries among student athletes as it's revealed that Louisville shooter Connor Sturgeon battled concussion issues.

www.dailymail.co.uk

I’ve read multiple articles that say that he was known in high school as being “the guy who has had so many concussions.” Having a family member who has undergone a slow but major personality change after having had just one, I can’t help but wonder if this was a factor in his actions.

I once watched the American film - a sports biographical drama "Concussion".

I recommend it.
It was eye-opening.

Concussion (2015 film) - Wikipedia

en.m.wikipedia.org

 

[branmuffin]

Neither make sense to me, especially in this day and age of way too many shootings. From all my experiences at various different types of businesses and locations, a fired person is not allowed back in the building. Also, they'd never be given that heads up. Perhaps he perceived he was about to be fired because he failed after being put on notice (things laid out in a doc that you must do, or not do, or else you'll be terminated after X days)? Either way, the last place I worked (High tech) trained managers on how to conduct a firing, or even a warning. One such was as listed in a blogpost below. It's good advice, actually. And usually Security came up after the person was in the room and waited outside and out of sight. It was called The Perp Walk as you got escorted out the door, unable to retrieve any personal belongings. They were boxed up and brought out to you.

Sit Closest to the Door - A chill ran down my spine the first time I heard those words. They were passionately spoken by a former law enforcement officer who vehemently recommended that HR and company management sit closest to the door during all employee termination meetings.I

I think the circumstances referred to in Sit Closest to the Door are a curiously unique aspect of firing an individual in America. I have fired employees, albeit I was forthcoming ahead of time that their performances were being documented and recorded for review so it wasn't a bolt out of the blue for them.

At no time would I have worried I would be physically attacked or assaulted or stalked by an employee. I also worked in an environment where a fired employee or even one with a workplace grudge, regardless of the reason, could have caused catastrophic damage by sabotaging computers.

Perhaps it's the labour laws in place in Canada regarding the termination of an employee that restricts 'perp walks' which in my opinion is a needlessly humiliating experience to put a person through when they are still processing the information they don't have a job anymore. When you have a workplace contract between employer and employee everyone knows what their role is and the expectations attached to it.

The only caveat I would have regarding that contract is when a person's performance is negatively affected by substance abuse. Where I worked the employer could work with the employee to overcome their addiction by providing leave of absences to deal with the issue, instead of firing. Rather than a punitive approach to dealing with the issue, the Canadian Human Rights Act encourages a duty to accommodate. Yeah, I know, that sounds kind of wussy, enabling a drug user or alcoholic, but in reality we have no idea what prompts the issue. Mental health, home life discord including DV, work/home life balance especially for caregivers, etc. I think maybe CS fell within the mental health umbrella.

Plus, in Canada, no one expects a terminated employee to go out and buy an AR-15 as payback. Mainly because our gun laws are much more stringent here.

 

[PrairieWind]

I think the circumstances referred to in Sit Closest to the Door are a curiously unique aspect of firing an individual in America. I have fired employees, albeit I was forthcoming ahead of time that their performances were being documented and recorded for review so it wasn't a bolt out of the blue for them.

At no time would I have worried I would be physically attacked or assaulted or stalked by an employee. I also worked in an environment where a fired employee or even one with a workplace grudge, regardless of the reason, could have caused catastrophic damage by sabotaging computers.

Perhaps it's the labour laws in place in Canada regarding the termination of an employee that restricts 'perp walks' which in my opinion is a needlessly humiliating experience to put a person through when they are still processing the information they don't have a job anymore. When you have a workplace contract between employer and employee everyone knows what their role is and the expectations attached to it.

The only caveat I would have regarding that contract is when a person's performance is negatively affected by substance abuse. Where I worked the employer could work with the employee to overcome their addiction by providing leave of absences to deal with the issue, instead of firing. Rather than a punitive approach to dealing with the issue, the Canadian Human Rights Act encourages a duty to accommodate. Yeah, I know, that sounds kind of wussy, enabling a drug user or alcoholic, but in reality we have no idea what prompts the issue. Mental health, home life discord including DV, work/home life balance especially for caregivers, etc. I think maybe CS fell within the mental health umbrella.

Plus, in Canada, no one expects a terminated employee to go out and buy an AR-15 as payback. Mainly because our gun laws are much more stringent here.

I agree that "perp walk" type of firing is unduly humiliating and I think would rarely be necessary. I've been involved with multiple firings (either at our law firm or assisting clients with it). All were done professionally, typically call them in to the office at the end of the day, discuss it, let them know the job is terminated. I've seen some tears, but no fireworks really. Access codes and passwords were changed immediately. I remember one employee, her husband called after she was let go with some nasty words, but that was all.
If this guy was about to be fired, I'm sure he suspected it was coming. But if that is what pushed him over the edge, I think it is irrelevant. If it hadn't been this, something else would have eventually pushed over the edge anyway.

 

[WingsOverTX]

I think the circumstances referred to in Sit Closest to the Door are a curiously unique aspect of firing an individual in America. I have fired employees, albeit I was forthcoming ahead of time that their performances were being documented and recorded for review so it wasn't a bolt out of the blue for them.

At no time would I have worried I would be physically attacked or assaulted or stalked by an employee. I also worked in an environment where a fired employee or even one with a workplace grudge, regardless of the reason, could have caused catastrophic damage by sabotaging computers.

Perhaps it's the labour laws in place in Canada regarding the termination of an employee that restricts 'perp walks' which in my opinion is a needlessly humiliating experience to put a person through when they are still processing the information they don't have a job anymore. When you have a workplace contract between employer and employee everyone knows what their role is and the expectations attached to it.

The only caveat I would have regarding that contract is when a person's performance is negatively affected by substance abuse. Where I worked the employer could work with the employee to overcome their addiction by providing leave of absences to deal with the issue, instead of firing. Rather than a punitive approach to dealing with the issue, the Canadian Human Rights Act encourages a duty to accommodate. Yeah, I know, that sounds kind of wussy, enabling a drug user or alcoholic, but in reality we have no idea what prompts the issue. Mental health, home life discord including DV, work/home life balance especially for caregivers, etc. I think maybe CS fell within the mental health umbrella.

Plus, in Canada, no one expects a terminated employee to go out and buy an AR-15 as payback. Mainly because our gun laws are much more stringent here.

Very few positions in the U.S. of the type this perp had would be contractual. Generally & commonly, employment here is at-will, meaning you can be fired at any time for any reason, though many employees document & counsel when there are performance issues before termination. Pursuing monetary or other relief in such circumstances is rare & rarely successful.

Such "personnel matters" are increasingly impersonal in the U.S., with perp walks commonplace IMO. Just like the hiring process no longer assures one of any kind of follow up even if interviewed. The cold & uncaring experiences of many, if not most job seekers & employees, in workplaces in the U.S. is a big problem. The old unwritten implied "contracts" of 25-50 years ago are no more. Common courtesy is passe IMO.

Whether CS had a work-related issue or not is still unknown. We have info indicating it could be a pretext for someone who just chose this place, time & people easy to target rather than related directly to whatever his issues were.

So, yeah, whether this outrageous act of mass murder was work-related in the perp's mind is important to know. I hope we find out.

MOO

 

[PrairieWind]

Very few positions in the U.S. of the type this perp had would be contractual. Generally & commonly, employment here is at-will, meaning you can be fired at any time for any reason, though many employees document & counsel when there are performance issues before termination. Pursuing monetary or other relief in such circumstances is rare & rarely successful.

Such "personnel matters" are increasingly impersonal in the U.S., with perp walks commonplace IMO. Just like the hiring process no longer assures one of any kind of follow up even if interviewed. The cold & uncaring experiences of many, if not most job seekers & employees, in workplaces in the U.S. is a big problem. The old unwritten implied "contracts" of 25-50 years ago are no more. Common courtesy is passe IMO.

Whether CS had a work-related issue or not is still unknown. We have info indicating it could be a pretext for someone who just chose this place, time & people easy to target rather than related directly to whatever his issues were.

So, yeah, whether this outrageous act of mass murder was work-related in the perp's mind is important to know. I hope we find out.

MOO

I would disagree. Employment departments and courts often find implied contracts of employment. But there are very big differences in employment situations between very small business, large corporations, and government entities. Larger companies and government entities will have rules and/or policies that pretty much mandate what happens, for better or worse.

 

[YepperBepper]

The kid is legally an adult. Not convinced Dad spending more time with him would have changed anything ever.

His parents knew he had mental health issues & if true, multiple concussions. Did those providing him MH treatment know about the serious head injuries?

How long was he treated for anxiety & depression? Since his teens or ? I believe CS made an outcry somewhere. Probably online if he was successful in hiding his murderous plans from those closest.

His having a weapon or easy access to one is an often-overlooked red flag. But it's difficult to intervene when that person is an adult. I don't believe in invasion of privacy but these cases indicate we have to increase awareness of danger signs & create ways to address them before these events occur. I know, big ask!

JMOO

Louisville bank shooting survivor recalls harrowing experience as police release 911 calls

Old National Bank employee Dana Mitchell told CBS News she was shocked that her co-worker, who at one point she mentored, could carry out such a horrific attack.

www.cbsnews.com

According to this article, he had not been fired from his job, nor was firing him planned.

Bumping the article posted by vls for you.

Evidently, he was not being fired, nor were there any plans to fire him at all.

Paranoia?

Ps. Anyone under 30 is a kid to me. I'm old.

 

[PrairieWind]

The roommate called Sturgeon's Mommy but did roommate call 911 first or the Mommy? Sturgeon really wasn't suicidal or he would have killed himself first. He appeared to me to feel so much rage to kill his co-workers who were about to can him and then waited like 1 1/2 minutes for police to show up and shoot him. I don't think depression or anxiety had anything to do with killings nor being a video gamer. I think Sturgeon probably had so much rage insde of him and maybe he was taught by his parents to be perfect and that failing is not an option...It appears Sturgeon did not know how to process the upcoming or recent termination of employment. If he was fired, why was he greeted at the bank door and allowed to enter prior to bank being open to public which makes me believe that he was still employed by bank. Sturgeon is an empty vessel. I wish he had committed suicide instead of killing 5 humans and injuring 9 more.

I don't any reason to blame his parents. They are victims too.

 

[PrairieWind]

The roommate called Sturgeon's Mommy but did roommate call 911 first or the Mommy? Sturgeon really wasn't suicidal or he would have killed himself first. He appeared to me to feel so much rage to kill his co-workers who were about to can him and then waited like 1 1/2 minutes for police to show up and shoot him. I don't think depression or anxiety had anything to do with killings nor being a video gamer. I think Sturgeon probably had so much rage insde of him and maybe he was taught by his parents to be perfect and that failing is not an option...It appears Sturgeon did not know how to process the upcoming or recent termination of employment. If he was fired, why was he greeted at the bank door and allowed to enter prior to bank being open to public which makes me believe that he was still employed by bank. Sturgeon is an empty vessel. I wish he had committed suicide instead of killing 5 humans and injuring 9 more.

double post, sorry.

 

[avalonisland]

I don't any reason to blame his parents. They are victims too.

I do not blame the parents. I just wonder why roommate did not call 911 first to alert police of depressed employee of National Bank who could have gun and headed to National Bank. Maybe roommate did call 911 first, but media reports are confusing. There are lots of unknowns as to what happened. Sturgeon obviously wanted be shot by police. I wish humans felt more comfortable to call 911 when they feel someone who may be dealing with a mental crisis is threatening to do some sort of potential harm to others.
The minute Sturgeon purchased the gun a week before killings, it just seems to me that is when he was setting his plan in action. I wonder when the last time he worked at the bank? My brother committed suicide in 2019. He was in his 40s but in reading his journals, he wanted to kill himself with a gun as a teenager. Back then in California there was a multi-day wait from ordering a gun and picking it up. He confided in a friend who talked him out of it. But his thoughts stayed with him through the decades. He wrote about the mass murders in schools in his journals- not about his interest in planning one, but wondering why the murders didn't just kill them self first. He died by checking into a really nice hotel suite 25 floors up and jumped out of hotel balcony. He texted his friend all morning. The friend later told me he thought it was my brother just being my brother. My brother ended his life and I am so grateful to him for not taking any humans with him. His 2 hotel room notes were simply, "I love life...yet struggle" and "PTSD is real."
Sturgeon was feeling suicidal...yet chose to not act on suicide impulses...rather, go on a mass murdering spree at his employment of co-workers who greeted him and whom he worked for then waited 90 seconds after mass killings for shooting show with police....He had lots of internal rage at humans that he acted out on and did not want to kill himself; rather, he wanted someone else to be responsible for his death. That is dark.

 

[YepperBepper]

I do not blame the parents. I just wonder why roommate did not call 911 first to alert police of depressed employee of National Bank who could have gun and headed to National Bank. Maybe roommate did call 911 first, but media reports are confusing. There are lots of unknowns as to what happened. Sturgeon obviously wanted be shot by police. I wish humans felt more comfortable to call 911 when they feel someone who may be dealing with a mental crisis is threatening to do some sort of potential harm to others.
The minute Sturgeon purchased the gun a week before killings, it just seems to me that is when he was setting his plan in action. I wonder when the last time he worked at the bank? My brother committed suicide in 2019. He was in his 40s but in reading his journals, he wanted to kill himself with a gun as a teenager. Back then in California there was a multi-day wait from ordering a gun and picking it up. He confided in a friend who talked him out of it. But his thoughts stayed with him through the decades. He wrote about the mass murders in schools in his journals- not about his interest in planning one, but wondering why the murders didn't just kill them self first. He died by checking into a really nice hotel suite 25 floors up and jumped out of hotel balcony. He texted his friend all morning. The friend later told me he thought it was my brother just being my brother. My brother ended his life and I am so grateful to him for not taking any humans with him. His 2 hotel room notes were simply, "I love life...yet struggle" and "PTSD is real."
Sturgeon was feeling suicidal...yet chose to not act on suicide impulses...rather, go on a mass murdering spree at his employment of co-workers who greeted him and whom he worked for then waited 90 seconds after mass killings for shooting show with police....He had lots of internal rage at humans that he acted out on and did not want to kill himself; rather, he wanted someone else to be responsible for his death. That is dark.

I'm so sorry about your brother.

Side note ..I listened to the 2nd 911 call. That call was made just as the shooter entered the bank and took his first shots. In the background, you can hear another 911 operator talking to the Mom and telling her NOT to go to the bank, as there was a situation just reported. It sounds like Mom called at the same time he arrived. I'm wondering how close the shooter lived to the bank building?

 

[PrairieWind]

I do not blame the parents. I just wonder why roommate did not call 911 first to alert police of depressed employee of National Bank who could have gun and headed to National Bank. Maybe roommate did call 911 first, but media reports are confusing. There are lots of unknowns as to what happened. Sturgeon obviously wanted be shot by police. I wish humans felt more comfortable to call 911 when they feel someone who may be dealing with a mental crisis is threatening to do some sort of potential harm to others.
The minute Sturgeon purchased the gun a week before killings, it just seems to me that is when he was setting his plan in action. I wonder when the last time he worked at the bank? My brother committed suicide in 2019. He was in his 40s but in reading his journals, he wanted to kill himself with a gun as a teenager. Back then in California there was a multi-day wait from ordering a gun and picking it up. He confided in a friend who talked him out of it. But his thoughts stayed with him through the decades. He wrote about the mass murders in schools in his journals- not about his interest in planning one, but wondering why the murders didn't just kill them self first. He died by checking into a really nice hotel suite 25 floors up and jumped out of hotel balcony. He texted his friend all morning. The friend later told me he thought it was my brother just being my brother. My brother ended his life and I am so grateful to him for not taking any humans with him. His 2 hotel room notes were simply, "I love life...yet struggle" and "PTSD is real."
Sturgeon was feeling suicidal...yet chose to not act on suicide impulses...rather, go on a mass murdering spree at his employment of co-workers who greeted him and whom he worked for then waited 90 seconds after mass killings for shooting show with police....He had lots of internal rage at humans that he acted out on and did not want to kill himself; rather, he wanted someone else to be responsible for his death. That is dark.

I am very very sorry about your brother. I can't even imagine how that made you feel or what your brother was dealing with. Since the thought he was being fired seems to have been debunked, I'm not sure we will ever really know what Sturgeon was thinking or what his reasons were.

As for the roommate and his actions, I don't think it is too unreasonable that he called the mother first. He maybe wanted to see if this was a joke or just clarify. Certainly in this case, hindsight being 20/20, he should have called 911 first. But, calling 911 puts in motion actions that no one knows how they will end. So I can understand people thinking twice before calling. There is a movement that tries to discourage calling 911 in many circumstances. I do know that Sturgeon's mother did quickly call 911. That couldn't have been easy.

 

[BrownRice]

Bumping the article posted by vls for you.

Evidently, he was not being fired, nor were there any plans to fire him at all.

Paranoia?

Ps. Anyone under 30 is a kid to me. I'm old.

Even though he wasn’t fired, he could have been written up recently or led to believe his job may be in jeopardy. Maybe his mental health issues were causing performance issues. Most people except his superiors and HR would know that.

 

[Dotta]

"Louisville bank shooter Connor Sturgeon shot his mentor who played dead to survive during horrific massacre where five were killed with 'gun he got from his girlfriend."​

"Sturgeon's mother Lisa had earlier called 911 as she frantically tried to avert the tragedy.
'He's never hurt anyone; he's a really good kid. Please don't punish him... He's non violent; he's never done anything wrong,'
she told the dispatcher."

Louisville bank shooter shot mentor who played dead to survive

Dana Mitchell, who has since been released from the hospital, was in the conference room when Connor Sturgeon, 25, began shooting at the bank. She was shot in the back.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[Em-oh-lee]

I'm so sorry about your brother.

Side note ..I listened to the 2nd 911 call. That call was made just as the shooter entered the bank and took his first shots. In the background, you can hear another 911 operator talking to the Mom and telling her NOT to go to the bank, as there was a situation just reported. It sounds like Mom called at the same time he arrived. I'm wondering how close the shooter lived to the bank building?

Lifelong resident of Louisville here. According to reports, he lived in the Camp Taylor neighborhood, which is a roughly 10-15 minute drive from that downtown Old National branch. It could easily be a 20+ minute drive, though, if traffic is backed up on I-65 as it usually is during morning rush hour.

First post ever, by the way....had to chime in now that I can actually give relevant information to something on here

 

[YepperBepper]

Lifelong resident of Louisville here. According to reports, he lived in the Camp Taylor neighborhood, which is a roughly 10-15 minute drive from that downtown Old National branch. It could easily be a 20+ minute drive, though, if traffic is backed up on I-65 as it usually is during morning rush hour.

First post ever, by the way....had to chime in now that I can actually give relevant information to something on here

Thank you.

So, I assume he drove there? I hadn't read how he arrived.

Thanks, again.

 

[chipwhitley]

"Louisville bank shooter Connor Sturgeon shot his mentor who played dead to survive during horrific massacre where five were killed with 'gun he got from his girlfriend."​

"Sturgeon's mother Lisa had earlier called 911 as she frantically tried to avert the tragedy.
'He's never hurt anyone; he's a really good kid. Please don't punish him... He's non violent; he's never done anything wrong,'
she told the dispatcher."

Louisville bank shooter shot mentor who played dead to survive

Dana Mitchell, who has since been released from the hospital, was in the conference room when Connor Sturgeon, 25, began shooting at the bank. She was shot in the back.

www.dailymail.co.uk

Hmmm, so it's confirmed he got the gun from his girlfriend. I thought his mom said in the 911 call he didn't have a gun but maybe he got one from his girlfriend.

 

[Arkark]

Having a family member who has undergone a slow but major personality change after having had just one, ...

Snipped & bolded by me.
May I ask what type of change did you notice? Just curious. If you don't feel comfortable sharing, I understand!

 

[branmuffin]

Sometimes criminals are just plain criminals. Lawlessness doesn't equal mental illness, though it seems to be a scapegoat for TV pundits and journalists. I see the family has said he had "mental health challenges." Without knowing what that means, I'm still not going to call him mentally ill unless we learn more. The research tells us that the majority of mass shooters actually aren't mentally ill, even though they're labeled as such because people don't know any other way to explain them behaving oddly prior to the shootings. Mental illness is defined as having a diagnosable pathology. The only way it's connected to mass shootings is if that pathology caused them to carry out the shootings. Even people who have, say, depression or anxiety can become mass shooters due to their criminal tendencies without it being blamed on mental illness.

Perhaps you can answer a couple of questions I have regarding different conditions regarding mental illness or a syndrome like Tourette's where an individual has uncontrolled motor and vocal tics. For instance, some people with Tourette's have bursts of profanity. I know they have no control over these outbursts but why do they use profanity, why not some other phrase or word that isn't profane? And why do some people with schizophrenia hear voices that tell them to do bad or dangerous things to other people? I knew one man who had schizophrenia but he thought he was the second coming of Christ; he wasn't in any way a danger to others. Ultimately, he committed suicide. What is the ratio of persons afflicted with schizophrenia where auditory hallucinations lead them to self harm rather than externalize their delusions by harming others. I'm not just referring to mass killings since I would think those percentages would be miniscule.

 

[PrairieWind]

Hmmm, so it's confirmed he got the gun from his girlfriend. I thought his mom said in the 911 call he didn't have a gun but maybe he got one from his girlfriend.

Didn't the Police Chief say he bought the gun last week?

 

[Stunned]

Lifelong resident of Louisville here. According to reports, he lived in the Camp Taylor neighborhood, which is a roughly 10-15 minute drive from that downtown Old National branch. It could easily be a 20+ minute drive, though, if traffic is backed up on I-65 as it usually is during morning rush hour.

First post ever, by the way....had to chime in now that I can actually give relevant information to something on here

Welcome aboard!