Laura Babcock: Dellen Millard & Mark Smich charged w/Murder in the First Degree #1

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SL has also filed a complaint regarding TPS conduct with the Office of the Independent Police Review Director according to the Help us find Laura FB page.
 
@liamdevlincasey: The police search for Babcock was the exact opposite of the search for Tim Bosma. 100s of cops looked for Bosma. Laura, 2 cops (if that).

Yes it seems those two didn't even look for Laura. Didn't ask the hotel, didn't interview the last person she contacted (even as of last week according to Casey)... it is anyone's guess what "thorough investigation" Carbone was talking about. After that, Swedie or anyone, could you really say you would take LE on their word? Would you fully trust LE after that terrible work PLUS their blatant disregard for your family? It's no wonder they are skeptical.

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Miranda said:
SL has also filed a complaint regarding TPS conduct with the Office of the Independent Police Review Director according to the Help us find Laura FB page.
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I just saw that on the family's FB page and I am very pleased that SL contacted the OIPRD and that the OIPRD have accepted SL's complaint.

This takes it out of the hands of Bill Blair who as we know from past experience is inclined to cover-up for his rogue / incompetent officers.

This gives me hope that the officers who completely botched the investigation will be held accountable. If it were up to me I would fire them all along with Bill Blair. There can be little doubt that had they been doing their job TB (and possibly WM) would be alive today.
 
Snoofo said:
I noticed that too and wondered weather she told him she dropped off the dog at her mom's as she told her old school friend.

Her last calls to DM (most of which don't appear to have been answered) but also many calls and texts to others it seems.

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Although there were calls made a minute or two in length, doesn't mean DM didn't answer her calls IMHO. He may have told her he was going to meet up with her or pick her up, deliver drugs or what have you, short and to the point. Personally I don't know very many guys who like long winded phone conversations. A lot can be said in a minute or two IMO. Remember when SL met up with DM? DM was in a hurry. Maybe that was DM's way of dealing with many people. Not even enough time for SL to get a coffee? Does this sound like SL may have said "I'm gonna grab a coffee and we'll sit and talk" and DM said he didn't even have an extra minute or two for SL to do that? If that's the case, yes I can see DM making very short conversations with LB. But that's just my perspective and opinion.

Mr. Millard was waiting on the patio when Mr. Lerner arrived at the Starbucks in a Chapters across from Square One mall in Mississauga on July 27, 2012. He was clearly in a hurry; there was no time to engage in small talk or for Mr. Lerner to get a coffee.

http://www.theglobeandmail.com/news/national/what-if-game-haunts-babcock-friend/article18832997/
 
Snoofo said:
@liamdevlincasey: The police search for Babcock was the exact opposite of the search for Tim Bosma. 100s of cops looked for Bosma. Laura, 2 cops (if that).

Yes it seems those two didn't even look for Laura. Didn't ask the hotel, didn't interview the last person she contacted (even as of last week according to Casey)... it is anyone's guess what "thorough investigation" Carbone was talking about. After that, Swedie or anyone, could you really say you would take LE on their word? Would you fully trust LE after that terrible work PLUS their blatant disregard for your family? It's no wonder they are skeptical.

Sent using Tapatalk 2
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As to them recently telling LB's parents she is deceased...yes. I do not condone their actions prior to this (lack of investigation) but as I stated in my last sentence from my post above, LE would not be telling the Babcocks their daughter is deceased without definitive evidence.

And especially now that they are under the microscope for botching LB's missing investigation.
 
Miranda said:
So she hooked up with this guy a few weeks after Christmas, moved in to his father's basement, bought him a purebred husky (not cheap), covered a $4000 vet bill (3 weeks after the vet bill), moved out and pressed charges (a month later) all within 2 months? That's scary. Her shoplifting breakdown also falls in this timeframe.

Also did anyone else notice:



That was 2 days after she'd dropped off her dog and box of cash and the day after her high school friend told her to seek help. I'd thought their last known contact had been the night of June 26th (dinner/ipad/hotel). So where was she on July 1st and 2nd? Did her friend or SL ask her?
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The narsty bit about texting is that someone else's fingers could be tapping out messages pretending to be you......no proof she's alive IMOO
 
Juballee said:
Thanks for the recap, but this still doesn't explain why LB's family are still so far out of the loop at this point in time when it comes to information and TB's family is not. Sure, their lifestyles and the circumstances of their disappearances might have been different, but are they not both equally murder victims now? Do both families not deserve the same support? And when I say support, I include providing information as ?
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IMHO, LB's family and friends were not as vocal and did not mobilise in the same way that TB's did. His friends and family very quickly engaged with LE, social media and MSM to aid in the search. He came from a community where many people pitched in and helped with the search. It was obvious that he was an "every man" and people cared about him. Leaving for long periods of time without contacting anyone was out of character for him. LE would not get a free pass by not acting on the information.

I find it sad that LBs family was more passive in their approach. I can see how they would want to believe that she would just come home and may have felt uncomfortable making her story too public. Maybe they felt embarrassed that her mental illness and alleged drug use and prostitution should be made public. LE may have felt that if her family didn't seem to make any demands in them maybe she wasn't worth looking for? After all it sounds like her parents were trying the "tough love" approach. SL could be written off as a disgruntled ex boyfriend of a prostitute. The FB page didn't seem to have a lot of traction and until her case was associated with TB and DM there was no MSM involvement.

I am trying to be optimistic that perhaps in future there will be some sort of standardised protocol and level of support in missing persons cases. Perhaps this is too simplistic but my feeling is that DM and MS could have been stopped.
 
I am trying to be optimistic that perhaps in future there will be some sort of standardised protocol and level of support in missing persons cases. Perhaps this is too simplistic but my feeling is that DM and MS could have been stopped.
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There already is a standarised protocol. The problem is that it almost certainly was not followed. I tried to address this in my Grid article but it's tricky as it gets into Major Case Management, which is very bureaucratic:

In early June 2013, shortly after he was put in charge of the Babcock and Wayne Millard cases, homicide detective Mike Carbone spoke at a press conference. He made no mention of the major case management (MCM) system, which was implemented in Ontario in the late ’90s in response to the policing and communications failures revealed in the wake of the Paul Bernardo case. According to the TPS Policy and Procedure manual, the relevant pages of which were obtained through a freedom of information request, in any missing-persons case where foul play is suspected, the officer in charge must ensure that “a Major Case Manager is assigned to conduct the investigation in compliance with the Ontario Major Case Management Manual.” Police appeared to have not suspected foul play in the disappearance of Babcock, despite the fact she’d been missing for months, had left her passport with her parents, and had not made any financial transactions nor used her health card or phone since June 2012.
To the astonishment of reporters at the news conference, Carbone said that officers had only become aware of Babcock’s phone records in May 2013 as a result of the arrest of Millard for Bosma’s murder. Carbone later contradicted himself, saying that “at some point [during the investigation into Babcock’s disappearance] the officers from 22 Division would have conducted searches on her telephone and discovered those records.” When a reporter then asked if officers had ever spoken to Millard, Carbone replied: “I don’t believe the police interviewed Millard at the time.” I contacted Carbone a few weeks after the news conference and asked him to clarify this point, but he declined to comment due to the ongoing nature of the investigation.
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http://www.thegridto.com/city/local-news/the-mystery-of-dellen-millard/

In short, given all the characteristics, the Babcock case should have had a major case manager and it almost certainly didn't. Toronto Police will simply not discuss any aspect of the case, as the Star reported, which means they won't even answer yes or no as to whether there was a major case manager.
 
sillybilly said:
No, I meant MS is not charged with FC in Tim's case (the only case where a FC charge has been laid solely against DM). IOW, what special circumstance would constitute the laying of the 1st degree murder charge against MS in Tim's case (if not premeditation)?
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Could be MS was the one who did the actual murder. Articles state MS got into the back seat of the Dodge and DM was driving therefore DM and MS decided it would be easier for MS to do the killing. Maybe CN was driving the Yukon and MS got out of TB's truck at the end of the laneway to tell her to drive to a certain location where they would meet up with her or call her when they needed a ride. Could this have also been the time MS retrieved the gun from the Yukon? Of course assuming TB was shot.

Sillybilly I won`t be surprised at the preliminary hearing, the Crown has tacked more charges onto both or all three jail birds. I had brought this up way back, recalling the VS case, MR had an additional charge of sexual assault causing bodily harm added to the other two charges; kidnapping and first degree murder. Because of the PB, we the public did not find out until it went to preliminary.

I wonder what became of the mischief charges against MS. Did he have his day in court yet or have they dropped them because he is now facing more serious charges. MOO.
 
Snoofo said:
I agree with you 100%.

@liamdevlincasey:
Thomas Ryan, Laura Babcock's uncle, has filed a complaint about how cops treated the Babcocks. "They treated us like ****," he says.

... and looks like they continue to do so! Shame on TPS.

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That twitter account says LE has still never questioned DM as of last week. I realize that he probably wouldn't talk, but wouldn't you think they'd at least try by now??

JMO
 
Alethea Dice said:
They need some kind of evidence that deems it suspicious to even know where to begin an investigation.

JMO
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I agree with what you are saying with the report "initially". But..when SL persisted, I feel a simple check (for no other reason than to humour SL and get him off their back), they would have found that none of her banking, credit card, health cards, passports, etc had been used and that in itself would have been more than enough reason to give merit to his concerns.

JMO
 
Snoofo said:
Now if they didn't question DA when she was reported missing, then that's the worst detective work I've ever heard of! I wonder if Liam Casey and Jennifer Pagliaro asked him that.

If TPS didn't interview him and then his charges were dropped mysteriously by September, I can see how TPS would do just about anything to not have to speak about the LB investigation.
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Agreed! I too am wondering if LE even to this day have spoken to DA or the friend NM. If The Star could find them, can't see why LE couldn't! I am also intrigued about the comment about her "new boyfriend" taking her traveling as recalled by her uncle.
 
JPC said:
IMHO, LB's family and friends were not as vocal and did not mobilise in the same way that TB's did. His friends and family very quickly engaged with LE, social media and MSM to aid in the search. He came from a community where many people pitched in and helped with the search. It was obvious that he was an "every man" and people cared about him. Leaving for long periods of time without contacting anyone was out of character for him. LE would not get a free pass by not acting on the information.

I find it sad that LBs family was more passive in their approach. I can see how they would want to believe that she would just come home and may have felt uncomfortable making her story too public. Maybe they felt embarrassed that her mental illness and alleged drug use and prostitution should be made public. LE may have felt that if her family didn't seem to make any demands in them maybe she wasn't worth looking for? After all it sounds like her parents were trying the "tough love" approach. SL could be written off as a disgruntled ex boyfriend of a prostitute. The FB page didn't seem to have a lot of traction and until her case was associated with TB and DM there was no MSM involvement.

I am trying to be optimistic that perhaps in future there will be some sort of standardised protocol and level of support in missing persons cases. Perhaps this is too simplistic but my feeling is that DM and MS could have been stopped.
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Respectfully bolded by me.. I find this a very sad situation as well for her family. Its very hard to say what anyone would do in that situation as people are different. Myself Ive been there, and would have fought until my dying breath, luckily it didnt get to that but I did consider the toughlove, it doesnt work well with addictions. Worked well to prove my point. Then toughlove teaches them to hide when they need help, or actually admit to wanting it. Its a very hard thing to go through if your children get caught up and its running rampant right now here in ontario. Bad situation all around.
 
Alethea Dice said:
That twitter account says LE has still never questioned DM as of last week. I realize that he probably wouldn't talk, but wouldn't you think they'd at least try by now??

JMO
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If they have the evidence they needed, which they must, I dont think they need to ask him anything at this point imo. They must have someone else providing that information. Perhaps for some kind of a "deal"
 
KEVINinTO said:
Headline story in the Star today:

"What happened to Laura"

http://www.thestar.com/news/gta/201...ry_leaves_family_in_a_horrible_situation.html
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was really happy to see this as lead story today

from your link

"“If they had a body or knew where the body was, that is something they would not withhold from the family,” said Bryan, who has investigated murders in which no body was recovered during his 30-year policing career. “Doesn’t happen, wouldn’t happen, I’ve never seen it happen, I can’t see circumstances where it would happen.”
 
Ont said:
In a way this is OT but Id like to ask a couple of things & I believe by now you would know the answers to, ( I havnt been able to access the forum much lately, just come in & read when I can) 1./ how do we access our own previous posts, and 2./ which year was it VS disappeared/ was murdered?
/08 or /09? I Believe /08.. anyhow Brantford area had a big part to play I thought in all that went on but was kept quiet for some reason, is there a casino there? And more so a reserve? We have both in Tbay. I would like to know who owned that property in 2008 where Bosmas remains were found, if not the man who said he sold the property to him. There is ALOT of real estate business surrounding all of this DMs stuff & another case, and a connection to a dance school of some sort but its down the chain. Thanks if anyone can help:seeya:
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2. By VS, do you mean Victoria Stafford? What angle are you getting at with this case?

Is it 2008 or 2009 that you want to know who owned the property? What happened then?

What is your theory on the dance studio and Millard?
 
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