Laura Babcock: Dellen Millard & Mark Smich charged w/Murder in the First Degree #1

[Variant]

OTOH, LE knew of LB from the incident with DA in mid March. Cocaine, ecstacy, pot, booze, shoplifting, assault, online sex trysts, prostitution, sleeping in parks. LE can't force anyone to do rehab. Often, the more people force someone to clean up, the more ties they break, until they sever ties with everyone they used to know in their sober life. The individual has to realize that this is a bad life and elect to seek rehab for themselves. From LE's perspective, LB was making the common descent into drugs, and as an adult, there was nothing they could do for her.

There has been no indication that Sgt. Woodhouse already knew or had accessed any such knowledge about LB when LB was reported missing.

 

[KinseyWannabe]

I think that part of the difference is that Tim Bosma had an Everyman quality that allowed many to identify with him immediately (regardless of one's gender by the way).

Also, the activity that he was engaged in prior to his disappearance--trying to complete an online transaction in person--is one that many have shared. It made me realize that this could have been the fate of anyone who's done this, myself included.

Plus, TB looked so darn sweet. But then did so did LB... :sigh:

 

[SnooperDuper]

There has been no indication that Sgt. Woodhouse already knew or had accessed any such knowledge about LB when LB was reported missing.

Well there was very bad optics.

Her family did not report her missing.
Her friends did not report her missing.
Her co-workers did not report her missing.

Her ex-boyfriend reported her missing, and he blamed her new boyfriend.

Lots of people use LE to harass their exes, and LE has to be careful that they are not playing into that.

 

[Snoofo]

Yes both TB and LB had sweet looks. Kind faces.

The contrast being drawn is not how LE treated the missing persons, but how LE is treating the families of the deceased and/or one allegedly deceased. That part should be no different.

I am sickened by the lack of info LB's family has received. They should be bending over backwards with apologies and overcompensating for their previous errors.

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[JPC]

Very interesting article with a lot of new information about Laura in today's Toronto Star

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2...ck_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

LB sounds like she was very seriously troubled before she went missing. It is sad that her alleged mental illness went untreated. In the months leading up to her disappearance it sounds like she caused a lot of drama for family, friends and LE which explains to me the lack of supporters demanding to know where she was and to try to bring her home safely. It is no excuse for not being stronger advocates on her behalf. I feel badly for her ex who didn't get any traction to help find her.

 

[Juballee]

No no no, think of the circumstances of each person's disappearance.

TB set out on a test drive. How long does that take? Overnight? Days? No, SB gave him one hour and then called LE. LE immediately called the circumstances suspicious: At the May 8 presser, they said:



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OTOH, LE knew of LB from the incident with DA in mid March. Cocaine, ecstacy, pot, booze, shoplifting, assault, online sex trysts, prostitution, sleeping in parks. LE can't force anyone to do rehab. Often, the more people force someone to clean up, the more ties they break, until they sever ties with everyone they used to know in their sober life. The individual has to realize that this is a bad life and elect to seek rehab for themselves. From LE's perspective, LB was making the common descent into drugs, and as an adult, there was nothing they could do for her.

If LB had been able to make contact with social services, there might have been some help for her. But shelters have early curfews and demand that you don't bring in drugs or alcohol. LB found the park more appealing. Welfare will accept addiction as a disability and give you $1k a month towards food, shelter and drugs. However, you have to admit you are an addict, and the system will try and encourage you towards rehab if you admit that's what brought you to it.

It is not LE's job to be social services. They don't rehab people. Being an addict is not illegal. And that's what seems to have happened here: LB became an addict and dropped off the grid.

So when did LB become missing? Within an hour? The next morning? No, it was almost 2 weeks before anyone was concerned enough to call police.

Within 1 hour, SB was absolutely certain something had gone terribly wrong.

After about 2 weeks, SL asked LE to find LB, still assuming that she was still alive.

That is why TB's case gained immediate, massive attention, and LB's case remained a vague mystery.

Are you saying that SB's brother is not LE?

Does anyone really, really think that if LB had had LE in her immediate family that they would still be so in the dark about the circumstances causing LE to charge two people in her murder?

It is easy to blame the victim and say that it is her fault for having mental issues that she tried to soothe with drugs, but in reality two people went missing and one got attention and the other was swept under the rug. One's family gets the full support of LE, the other is still waiting for the most basic of information.

If TB had ever had a history of drugs, do we think that would have changed the fact that he had a brother in law in LE who did everything that they can to publicize the case? No, I doubt that. But I do think that if LB had had LE in her family, her family wouldn't still be wondering how police have come to the conclusion that she is dead.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Are you saying that SB's brother is not LE?

Does anyone really, really think that if LB had had LE in her immediate family that they would still be so in the dark about the circumstances causing LE to charge two people in her murder?

It is easy to blame the victim and say that it is her fault for having mental issues that she tried to soothe with drugs, but in reality two people went missing and one got attention and the other was swept under the rug. One's family gets the full support of LE, the other is still waiting for the most basic of information.

If TB had ever had a history of drugs, do we think that would have changed the fact that he had a brother in law in LE who did everything that they can to publicize the case? No, I doubt that. But I do think that if LB had had LE in her family, her family wouldn't still be wondering how police have come to the conclusion that she is dead.

TB left the house with two strange men, and said he would be right back. He wasn't back within an hour, and did not answer his phone. Both SB and LE were immediately afraid for his safety.

SL reported LB missing because he had loaned her his iPad three weeks previously, and she had not returned it and cut of contact with him. He asked LE to trace the iPad.

He last saw her June 26, 2012
She last used her phone July 3, 2012
He reported LB and the iPad missing on July 14, 2012

SL says LB went missing as of June 26, 2012 because that's when HE last saw her. The phone bill shows that she was interacting with other people for at least a week afterwards, though. LB didn't go missing on June 26. She disappeared July 3. The iPad went missing on June 26.

Perhaps she got a new phone and number, so her parents and ex-boyfriend could stay out of her business?

Of course LE are not going to treat the case of a man reported as having been abducted an hour ago, the same as the case of an iPad not returned after 3 weeks.

That has nothing to do with drugs or relatives in law enforcement. If you lose your iPad, LE will do up a report for insurance purposes, but they aren't in the business of chasing after people's lost electronics. LB was an adult, and LE can't force her to make contact with anyone either.

LE could have chased down that iPad, but then they'd have to go after every cell phone and any other device that anyone has ever lost, too, to be fair.

 

[Alethea Dice]

Does it help to have LE in the family? Sure, how can it not help. But in fairness to LE, what are they supposed to do? If someone chooses to couch surf or live on the street, how do you know when or if they're actually missing? Without any evidence of foul play, all they are is someone who has not kept you informed of their whereabouts. If LE found her, they wouldn't be able to force her to get help, wouldn't be able to make her go home or call, and due to privacy laws, they wouldn't even be able to tell you where she was. Only that they found her and she's okay. They need some kind of evidence that deems it suspicious to even know where to begin an investigation. Even the phone calls, without something more, don't mean a lot. I don't find it that unusual that someone would have called the person they're intimate with 8 times in 2 days, especially when most of those calls were only 1 minute in duration.

JMO

 

[cansleuther]

They need some kind of evidence that deems it suspicious to even know where to begin an investigation.

It is a little surprising that LE didn't find it suspicious that LB had filed assault and theft charges four months before she was reported missing, regardless of whether the accusations were false or not.

Two officers at Toronto’s 22 Division were working on two separate Babcock investigations the summer she disappeared — Woodhouse on her disappearance and Det. Lester Wright on the assault and theft charges against Austerweil.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2014/06/07/dellen_millard_murder_of_laura_babcock_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

 

[newone]

Frustrating that the videos from the hotel have long been recorded over

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/20...or_police.html

 

[Alethea Dice]

It is a little surprising that LE didn't find it suspicious that LB had filed assault and theft charges four months before she was reported missing, regardless of whether the accusations were false or not.



http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2014/06/07/dellen_millard_murder_of_laura_babcock_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

That's true. I'm not sure how that works, cross-referencing a missing person case with an assault case, but you would think if they had even entered her name into the system, the assault report would have come up. And that alone should have prompted looking into it further.

Two officers at Toronto’s 22 Division were working on two separate Babcock investigations the summer she disappeared — Woodhouse on her disappearance and Det. Lester Wright on the assault and theft charges against Austerweil.

JMO

 

[Sillybilly]

LB's Elle Ryan FB page has a connection to Austerweil's FB on one of the pics of her pup.

Nothing really jumps out as being noteworthy.

 

[cansleuther]

Nothing really jumps out as being noteworthy.

One thing that kind of jumps out (which could be completely meaningless) is that DA told the Toronto Star that LB bought him the husky for his birthday.

Since the charges against DA were laid in March 2012, a month after the alleged theft and assault, it suggests the puppy was gifted to him sometime in February or even as early as January - yet his FB says his birthday is in May.

Austerweil told the Star that things started to fall apart after Babcock surprised him with his own puppy, a purebred Siberian husky, as a present for his birthday. Within weeks, the dog had a life-threatening stomach infection that racked up $4,000 in vet bills.

http://www.thestar.com/news/crime/2014/06/07/dellen_millard_murder_of_laura_babcock_leaves_lingering_questions_for_police.html

 

[Snoofo]

TB left the house with two strange men, and said he would be right back. He wasn't back within an hour, and did not answer his phone. Both SB and LE were immediately afraid for his safety.

SL reported LB missing because he had loaned her his iPad three weeks previously, and she had not returned it and cut of contact with him. He asked LE to trace the iPad.

He last saw her June 26, 2012
She last used her phone July 3, 2012
He reported LB and the iPad missing on July 14, 2012

SL says LB went missing as of June 26, 2012 because that's when HE last saw her. The phone bill shows that she was interacting with other people for at least a week afterwards, though. LB didn't go missing on June 26. She disappeared July 3. The iPad went missing on June 26.

Perhaps she got a new phone and number, so her parents and ex-boyfriend could stay out of her business?

Of course LE are not going to treat the case of a man reported as having been abducted an hour ago, the same as the case of an iPad not returned after 3 weeks.

That has nothing to do with drugs or relatives in law enforcement. If you lose your iPad, LE will do up a report for insurance purposes, but they aren't in the business of chasing after people's lost electronics. LB was an adult, and LE can't force her to make contact with anyone either.

LE could have chased down that iPad, but then they'd have to go after every cell phone and any other device that anyone has ever lost, too, to be fair.

I believe SL filed a missing persons report, not a stolen iPad report. He may not have known she was contacting others and for how long until after he reported her missing.

 

[Snoofo]

That's true. I'm not sure how that works, cross-referencing a missing person case with an assault case, but you would think if they had even entered her name into the system, the assault report would have come up. And that alone should have prompted looking into it further.



JMO

Now if they didn't question DA when she was reported missing, then that's the worst detective work I've ever heard of! I wonder if Liam Casey and Jennifer Pagliaro asked him that.

If TPS didn't interview him and then his charges were dropped mysteriously by September, I can see how TPS would do just about anything to not have to speak about the LB investigation.

 

[Juballee]

TB left the house with two strange men, and said he would be right back. He wasn't back within an hour, and did not answer his phone. Both SB and LE were immediately afraid for his safety.

SL reported LB missing because he had loaned her his iPad three weeks previously, and she had not returned it and cut of contact with him. He asked LE to trace the iPad.

He last saw her June 26, 2012
She last used her phone July 3, 2012
He reported LB and the iPad missing on July 14, 2012

SL says LB went missing as of June 26, 2012 because that's when HE last saw her. The phone bill shows that she was interacting with other people for at least a week afterwards, though. LB didn't go missing on June 26. She disappeared July 3. The iPad went missing on June 26.

Perhaps she got a new phone and number, so her parents and ex-boyfriend could stay out of her business?

Of course LE are not going to treat the case of a man reported as having been abducted an hour ago, the same as the case of an iPad not returned after 3 weeks.

That has nothing to do with drugs or relatives in law enforcement. If you lose your iPad, LE will do up a report for insurance purposes, but they aren't in the business of chasing after people's lost electronics. LB was an adult, and LE can't force her to make contact with anyone either.

LE could have chased down that iPad, but then they'd have to go after every cell phone and any other device that anyone has ever lost, too, to be fair.

Thanks for the recap, but this still doesn't explain why LB's family are still so far out of the loop at this point in time when it comes to information and TB's family is not. Sure, their lifestyles and the circumstances of their disappearances might have been different, but are they not both equally murder victims now? Do both families not deserve the same support? And when I say support, I include providing information as support.

They don't have a tiny box, they don't even have enough information to be sure one way or the other, and I wonder if, to them, it feels like her case is continuing to be fumbled even now. How long will they have to wait to discover how LE came to the conclusion that their daughter was murdered, will they have to wait until trial to hear about it the way the rest of us will?

 

[Miranda]

After Christmas, Babcock went to a friend’s party on the lakeshore in Etobicoke. There, David Austerweil noticed her from across the room. Within weeks they were dating and Babcock quickly moved in with him. In many ways, Austerweil was the opposite of Lerner: he was unemployed, doing drugs and living in his father’s basement.

So she hooked up with this guy a few weeks after Christmas, moved in to his father's basement, bought him a purebred husky (not cheap), covered a $4000 vet bill (3 weeks after the vet bill), moved out and pressed charges (a month later) all within 2 months? That's scary. Her shoplifting breakdown also falls in this timeframe.

Also did anyone else notice:

Babcock and Lerner stayed in touch by text until July 2.

That was 2 days after she'd dropped off her dog and box of cash and the day after her high school friend told her to seek help. I'd thought their last known contact had been the night of June 26th (dinner/ipad/hotel). So where was she on July 1st and 2nd? Did her friend or SL ask her?

 

[Snoofo]

So she hooked up with this guy a few weeks after Christmas, moved in to his father's basement, bought him a purebred husky (not cheap), covered a $4000 vet bill (3 weeks after the vet bill), moved out and pressed charges (a month later) all within 2 months? That's scary.

Also did anyone else notice:



That was 2 days after she'd dropped off her dog and box of cash. I'd thought their last known contact had been the night of June 26th (dinner/ipad/hotel). So where was she on July 2nd? That was 2 days after she'd dropped off her dog and box of cash.

I noticed that too and wondered weather she told him she dropped off the dog at her mom's as she told her old school friend.

Her last calls to DM (most of which don't appear to have been answered) but also many calls and texts to others it seems.

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[Snoofo]

Thanks for the recap, but this still doesn't explain why LB's family are still so far out of the loop at this point in time when it comes to information and TB's family is not. Sure, their lifestyles and the circumstances of their disappearances might have been different, but are they not both equally murder victims now? Do both families not deserve the same support? And when I say support, I include providing information as support.

They don't have a tiny box, they don't even have enough information to be sure one way or the other, and I wonder if, to them, it feels like her case is continuing to be fumbled even now. How long will they have to wait to discover how LE came to the conclusion that their daughter was murdered, will they have to wait until trial to hear about it the way the rest of us will?

I agree with you 100%.

@liamdevlincasey:
Thomas Ryan, Laura Babcock's uncle, has filed a complaint about how cops treated the Babcocks. "They treated us like ****," he says.

... and looks like they continue to do so! Shame on TPS.

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[swedie]

Thanks for the recap, but this still doesn't explain why LB's family are still so far out of the loop at this point in time when it comes to information and TB's family is not. Sure, their lifestyles and the circumstances of their disappearances might have been different, but are they not both equally murder victims now? Do both families not deserve the same support? And when I say support, I include providing information as support.

They don't have a tiny box, they don't even have enough information to be sure one way or the other, and I wonder if, to them, it feels like her case is continuing to be fumbled even now. How long will they have to wait to discover how LE came to the conclusion that their daughter was murdered, will they have to wait until trial to hear about it the way the rest of us will?

Well they've got a lot of explaining to do as to why they did not question those on LB's cell phone record and the lack of further investigative work. I would imagine at this juncture they are very reluctant to "give away" any information surrounding these cases involving DM regardless of who you are. Leaks happen and they need to keep everything sealed in order for there to be a fair trial. One slip of information could jeopardize the case. This is the exact reason why PBs are put into place.

Yes it is very disheartening to know LB's immediate family is not privy to the information as to how LE came to the conclusion Laura was deceased, but truthfully if it were my daughter, I would take LE on their word, and wait for the information to come out in the trial instead of risking the case. I would want justice so desperately I would be more than willing to wait for answers. Sadly there may be no remains to give her family as was in TB's case. I suspect there isn't as LE would have given them to Laura's family, just as they did for the Bosma family. There would be no reason as to why they wouldn't release her to her family. Evidence may be just traces of her DNA. LE would not be telling the Babcocks their daughter is deceased without definitive evidence. JMO.