LIVE MSM COVERAGE on BABY LISA - 24 OCTOBER 2011

[LancelotLink]

Well, I can't locate the JJP from last night, however, I know that WildBS was the first one who said both kids were in her bed. Then JT said both boys. Maybe these videoes will show up somewhere...like I said, I don't know if these two hucksters just get so would up and ready to shout others down that they don't think through what they are saying, or WildBS pulled a Todd Black.
Time will tell.

 

[Karmaa]

BBM

I'm not convinced of that. In one of the interviews (MK, I think), the interviewer asks JI if LE ever suspected him of doing anything to Lisa. His reply was that they asked him if he might have had an accident with Lisa in the 2 hours he was home and maybe DB found out about it later. So were these 2 hours before of after he left for work. Well, let's take a look at that.

1. LE has a surveillance tape of DB in the grocery store smiling and buying wine at 5pm. I doubt LE would think DB already knew about her child being dead and then skipping off to buy wine.

2. Jeremy tells us he left for work at 5:20 pm that evening.

3. Surely the boys, the neighbor, or the little girl saw or heard Lisa at some point after Jeremy left for work. But even if they didn't, are we to believe that Debbie somehow covered up a fatal accident and then sat out on the stoop getting drunk with the neighbor afterwards?

So...I have to ask what time jeremy Irwin did get home from work that night. He tells us it was 3:30 am. I've seen absolutely nothing to support that. Nor would I see anything, because I'm not LE. But LE does know whether or not JI can prove when he was and wasn't at work...and according to JI, they ask him about the 2 hours he was home.

So...:waitasec:

I understand what you are saying, but my understanding is that his alibi is pretty solid. I remember hearing that there is video surveillance of the Starbucks where he was working, and I believe that his colleagues say he was there.

Now, the "two hours" were apparently before he left for work (because the question suggested that Debbie found out about it later). Do we know where he was earlier in the day? Didn't I read that he had worked that day, and then was working again that night (which he had never done before)? Maybe that's the two-hours that he was home, between jobs?

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I think she's saying, forgive me if I'm wrong, that she would definitely remember something about killing her kid and trying to hide the remains. While DB, may have had a fragmented/partial blackout, she would have remembered some part of all that. MOO

Oh, I think DB remembers the cover up. I just don't think she knew about the accident until JI came home and woke her up.

MOO

 

[cluciano63]

I think unless LE find Lisa's body or have some very strong evidence that
she is dead, perhaps her DNA on burnt or bloody clothing, there will never
be an arrest. I just joined this site and havent followed cases like this before, but has there been any previous cases where a child has never been found and the parents have been charged with killing them?

I can't think of a case.

 

[Emeralgem]

But there is no evidence that there were accomplices. And who would be an accomplice to that anyway? The only likely one would be Jeremy, and there is nothing indicating that he was there. Who else would you go to to ask a favor like "could you help me hide my baby that I just killed?" Especially if you were slobbering drunk.

Anything is possible, but there is no reason to imagine that there was an (or several) accomplice(s).

Just wondering IF you have ever followed the Haleigh Cummings case? JMHO

 

[MamaK]

Let me ask you all this-If DB realized she hurt Lisa or Lisa was dead and it scared the daylights out of her-do you think the shock of that would sober her up pretty quickly and try to do the cover up-and remembers it all,but is using the blackout as an excuse for a defense?

I just don't see how she could hide the body so well drunk or sober without help. Then, it begs the question of who in the world is going to help her out with that one. Surely, if she was having an affair, it would've come out by now. Her brother? What would he get out of it??? KWIM?

We can't come up with a motive so then we're left with an accident theory. I really don't believe that parents hide accidents. MOO

 

[Cakesies]

It's basic. Mom was drunk. Maybe she was a MEAN drunk with a total personality change (combined with the antidepressants). Some people are happy drunks, some are mean drunks. A person can't discount she may have lost her temper and over corrected her "fussey" baby leading to Baby Lisa's death.

 

[ClaireNC]

I think I could say that with confidence, Mountain_Kat. There's an old saying about how drunks act "how drunk would you have to be to have sex with your mother?". Meaning, there is no amount of alcohol that would make you do something you don't want to do sober, so you couldn't get drunk enough to have sex with your mother. I could say with confidence, that while I've been drunk I haven't harmed (on purpose or accidentally) one of my children and then hidden their remains, whether I remembered all the details of the evening or not.

Jeanna, Great point! I have worked with alcoholics a lot during the past 10 years and I firmly believe that old saying. While there is a preconceived notion that all alcoholics are evil enough to commit such a crime, that simply is not true.

If we were talking about people addicted to certain other drugs (meth, crack, heroin, etc.), which enable the user to loose all sense of reality, it would be another story.

 

[In da Middle]

BBM

I'm not convinced of that. In one of the interviews (MK, I think), the interviewer asks JI if LE ever suspected him of doing anything to Lisa. His reply was that they asked him if he might have had an accident with Lisa in the 2 hours he was home and maybe DB found out about it later. So were these 2 hours before of after he left for work. Well, let's take a look at that.

1. LE has a surveillance tape of DB in the grocery store smiling and buying wine at 5pm. I doubt LE would think DB already knew about her child being dead and then skipping off to buy wine.

2. Jeremy tells us he left for work at 5:20 pm that evening.

3. Surely the boys, the neighbor, or the little girl saw or heard Lisa at some point after Jeremy left for work. But even if they didn't, are we to believe that Debbie somehow covered up a fatal accident and then sat out on the stoop getting drunk with the neighbor afterwards?

So...I have to ask what time jeremy Irwin did get home from work that night. He tells us it was 3:30 am. I've seen absolutely nothing to support that. Nor would I see anything, because I'm not LE. But LE does know whether or not JI can prove when he was and wasn't at work...and according to JI, they ask him about the 2 hours he was home.

So...:waitasec:

LE has stated that he was observed on surveillance video on the job site for the time he has stated. No I don't have a link it was one of the press conferences at the command center though.

 

[jstwondering]

Not me! Cause I know there ain't no stinkin woods there!:rocker:

I think it would be of great value to just keep reposting this every couple of pages today. Thanks.
(I get so frustrated by the MSM's headlines.)

 

[MamaK]

Oh, I think DB remembers the cover up. I just don't think she knew about the accident until JI came home and woke her up.

MOO

But, then JI would've had to help with the cover up and LE stated that he has an alibi. Was the KCPD lying to the public about that? :waitasec: MOO

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I understand what you are saying, but my understanding is that his alibi is pretty solid. I remember hearing that there is video surveillance of the Starbucks where he was working, and I believe that his colleagues say he was there.

Now, the "two hours" were apparently before he left for work (because the question suggested that Debbie found out about it later). Do we know where he was earlier in the day? Didn't I read that he had worked that day, and then was working again that night (which he had never done before)? Maybe that's the two-hours that he was home, between jobs?

But then LE would have been asking JI if Debbie might have found out about a horrific accident PRIOR to 5:20 pm. And Debbie finds out about this and just parties all night with her neighbor? Uh uh.

 

[ClaireNC]

I just don't see how she could hide the body so well drunk or sober without help. Then, it begs the question of who in the world is going to help her out with that one. Surely, if she was having an affair, it would've come out by now. Her brother? What would he get out of it??? KWIM?

We can't come up with a motive so then we're left with an accident theory. I really don't believe that parents hide accidents. MOO

While this kind of contradicts what I said in my last post, the children of alcoholic's do tend to stick together and get pretty good at lying or make excuses for their parents. So DB's brother could very well lie for her without even thinking twice about it.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

But, then JI would've had to help with the cover up and LE stated that he has an alibi. Was the KCPD lying to the public about that? :waitasec: MOO

I never heard KCPD state what time JI came home, have you? :waitasec:

 

[BritsKate]

I think unless LE find Lisa's body or have some very strong evidence that
she is dead, perhaps her DNA on burnt or bloody clothing, there will never
be an arrest. I just joined this site and havent followed cases like this before, but has there been any previous cases where a child has never been found and the parents have been charged with killing them?

BBM
It's a rarity but it has indeed happened.

http://www.nobodymurdercases.com/no_body2.pdf

 

[Emeralgem]

Let me ask you all this-If DB realized she hurt Lisa or Lisa was dead and it scared the daylights out of her-do you think the shock of that would sober her up pretty quickly,she then tries to do the cover up-and remembers it all,but is using the blackout as an excuse for a defense?

Thus far I'm thinking her memory has been quite selective..IMHO she is claiming she knows quite alot yet claiming she doesn't remember too much of anything.. IMHO...I do believe she is using the blackout as a defense..But what do i know? JMHO

ETA..IF the next door neighbor did not leave until 10:30 or 11:00 pm that night where was her 4 year old and what was this child doing the whole time they were drinking wine on the stoop.. Same applies to the two sons who were in the house that night..

 

[ExpectingUnicorns]

How?
What do you do once the neighborhood has been exhausted?
Do you just walk on foot, door to door across the whole US?
Once an initial search has been done, how else does a parent physically search for a baby?

Just using a common lost item as an example: My DH often loses his keys and/or wallet. We look everywhere in the house and can't find them. It is often the second or third or more extended (sometimes frantic) search through the house, in exactly same places ~ that we do finally find them. Sometimes in odder places that we hadn't thought to look the first couple of times.

If keys and wallets rate this effort, there's no question in my mind that it should be hugely greater for a missing child who is in danger.

(As a matter of fact, I felt I could sometimes empathize with George Anthony driving around that big sign, looking everywhere. If he had only taken a short walk down the street from his own home. . . . )

Yep, I stand by it. Anywhere and everywhere!

 

[daisy7]

ABC, NBC, we all went through this on the last case when we learned how these networks work. They won't pay for an interview, but they will pay a liscencing fee for pictures and videos. And pay handsomely. We did not find out for certain until her lawyer ended up on the receiving end of the SA office under oath and he had to admit it.
I believe ABC, in their altruistic manner, paid CA $200,000 for pictures and videoes of her murderd daughter. Seems like I just read that Lisa's parents are asking for their hard drive back so they can have pics and videoes for the MSM.

BBM. Link, please?

 

[MamaK]

But then LE would have been asking JI if Debbie might have found out about a horrific accident PRIOR to 5:20 pm. And Debbie finds out about this and just parties all night with her neighbor? Uh uh.

Wouldn't the neighbor who came over at 5:30 say whether or not she saw the baby? If Lisa didn't go to her crib until 6:40pm and neighbor was there at 5:30pm (based on the people article), then the neighbor saw Lisa that night. I don't think the neighbor would be in on it. MOO

 

[In da Middle]

I have a question I have been wanting to ask you. Did you live in the neighborhood when JI was with the mother of his son? If so, was he as stoic and quiet with her as he seems to be with DB?

There was a tweet by a man who claims the FBI has called him in on this case. He is also on FB. He goes into depth regarding JI's demeanor. In this You-Tube video if anyone is interested.
Lisa Irwin Parents New Interview - My Body Language Analysis. MUST SEE. GMA. CJB - YouTube

I guess what I am asking In Da Middle, is this man always this quiet and reserved as what we have seen so far in this case.

TIA. If you don't know, sorry for bothering you, but I am, as my name says, "curious."

No problem with being curious I would be. I did not know him but am 'familiar' with them as we are out and about a lot around here. I think in the 9 years he has lived here all I have ever heard from him is 'HI'. He in no way was unfriendly. Just would look up as we were passing and a simple acknowledgement was all we ever got. So no he demeanor is in no way shocking to me at all.