MA MA - Phillip Markoff, Craigslist Killer

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This article has some further quotes from the attorney, as well as video of the fiancee arriving and departing. Thought this quote was particularly interesting:

"She's done it now, and I think she feels good about coming up and seeing him," Honecker said. "But now it's time to move on with other things in her life.

"She's going to take up her life with her friends and her family in New Jersey. I don't expect her to return in the near future."

Thursday morning Honecker confirmed that "moving on" included the cancellation of their planned summer wedding.
 
Whoa... Quote from this article:

"A law enforcement source told ABC News Wednesday that police found 16 pairs of women's panties in the home of Philip Markoff, the Boston University Medical student charged with the murder of a sex worker who was shot dead in an upscale hotel room.

The panties were hidden under Markoff's bed in the Quincy home he shared with his fiancee. Along with the panties was a large bag with roughly 60 pairs of plastic flex-cuff restraints, the law enforcement source said."
 
LoisDenominator said:
Whoa... Quote from this article:

"A law enforcement source told ABC News Wednesday that police found 16 pairs of women's panties in the home of Philip Markoff, the Boston University Medical student charged with the murder of a sex worker who was shot dead in an upscale hotel room.

The panties were hidden under Markoff's bed in the Quincy home he shared with his fiancee. Along with the panties was a large bag with roughly 60 pairs of plastic flex-cuff restraints, the law enforcement source said."
Click to expand...

:eek: Uh oh!
 
"She's done it now..."
Does this mean she needed to see him to begin to have closure? (I can understand that...those prison orange jumpsuits have a way of making the most attractive person look like a criminal)
Geez, I hope she is beginning to get over this so she can move on with her life...(and help police, if possible).
 
Wow! I saw this today and after reading everything, I'm totally behind Megan's decisions. I'll even pray for her strength and healing as she deals with this tragic end of her dreams and renewal of the rest of her life.

I just saw Megan's attorney appear on GMA. He stopped short of saying she thinks he may be guilty and he also danced around her waiting for her former betrothed and some day the wedding ever happening at all.

She's a 'strong and articulate' young woman.

IMHO, it was just a matter of time for the obvious to sink in.

:(

fran
 
Columbo said:
I hope you are right and I think you may be. The fact that she apparently hasn't visited him in jail speaks volumes.
If she knows deep down that he did this, she may be afraid of him, afraid to speak against him, too.
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That's sort of what I was thinking but couldn't figure out such a succint way to say it. I can't proclaim to know what's going through her mind but I can't fathom she's just hoping for the best, planning to support him until he is proven guilty or admits it. I really think she is just shellshocked and traumatized and probably hounded by the media so probably felt if she said something they'd leave her alone, I'm not sure....unless I was terrified of him, I would just keep quiet and stay away from him and not support him, or knowing me I would issue a statement expressing my sorrow for the victims and outrage against the person I thought I knew.

I do know from a little too personal of an experience with a guy who was similar in many ways to PM....trust me, it was the worst thing I have ever been through in my life...you DO see signs that feel hinky to you but you DON'T see ANY of the nasty side of these people. PM is a sociopath, I'm sure of it. That word is tossed around a lot these days and applied to all murderers basically (Casey Anthony, Melissa Huckaby) but I am telling you, the guy I was involved with ADMITTED to me that he thinks he is a sociopath, he tried to hide but after what went down, went down, he admitted to me "I just am not sorry. I can't make myself feel anything. I know I am not like other people, I don't understand other people, I recognize that I don't have feelings, I don't even really feel anything for my grandparents, I could care less if they died tomorrow". It was chilling......I had a REALLY bad experience with this person and he did some hurtful things and yes he victimized me although I refuse to let myself be that victim, I was very young, and this guy forced himself on me (and there was no friend to save me). I was just so young, and sort of in denial, and everyon thought he was such a great catch...I thought he was nice at first....I was shocked in the end, and very traumatized- do you know how it feels to have had a relationship with someone that breaks down into what happened, how violated you feel in the first place, but how CREEPY it feels to know the person is not capable of caring? You were with someone who didn't care because he COULDN'T? And that he does not care about anyone???

I am lucky I got out with just what I did....so is PM's ex fiance. And I can tell you from experience that you'd have no understanding of who these people really are or what they are capable of until it's too late in some way or other- they hurt you or you find out something else they've done. But looking back, ABSOLUTELY, there are red flags. 20/20 hindsight, nothing that would make you think they could ever be capale of what they are, but looking back I did see signs, I did notice that the guy involved with me didn't seem to care about me like I cared about him but you explain that to yourself as he has stress from work and is just tired, or you question yourself and wonder if he just isn't as attracted to you- but then he changes and pushes himself on you- then withdraws...in my case, I thought I was being manipulated- I was getting ready to go with my gut feeling and just get out- I thought the guy was just a jerk and it was starting to show...JERK, not sociopath yet.....I was a teenager- then, when he forced himself on me, and I saw the AFTERMATH of that I realized what a truly scary monster he must be inside.

I don't really like dredging up these memories as I am in my 30s now and this guy was about PM's age and looked very similar actually....this happened to me when he was around PM's age and I was a few years younger. We met at CHURCH. His family, it turns out, feared there was something wrong with him and helped try to push him on a "nice girl". :furious: They DID see something was wrong with him and I will NEVER forgive them for that. Because of what he ended up doing to me....it tore my life into pieces......I recently did some searching for this guy and found he's gotten some profiles up like PM's, not on those weird sites as I don't even WANT to go looking there....but I have found a Friendster and one or two other social accounts that I am 100% sure are him and they have a lot of gay oriented S&M stuff on them. And I also want to point out that a yougn guy who is gay but in denial or afraid to come out and ends up hurting someone in the process until he's able to become free to be who he truly is---is COMPLETELY different from a sociopath, who has a confused orientation along with ZERO feelings for any human at all anyway. I fully believe the guy I know, is capable of doing thins like PM- you can't just call the cops and report a psycho....but looking back I saw MANY signs that this guy liked to be around vulnerable people and now as a male in his 30s I feel sick to think, but am sure, he probably tries to meet up with younger confused males, etc- God only knows who he's hurt since me...I would not want to know the skeletons in his closet. His family told mine after the fact, because I told mine what happened and they actually confronted them about his behavior because they wanted me to press charges..his family admitted to mine that they thought there was something wrong with him and that THEY were sorry for what he did. They did not support him but they were also not willing to fully admit he was a sociopath- they sort of acted like they were just afraid he was gay. This guy was and is a SOCIOPATH and his sexual orientation had nothing to do with it. I bet to this day his family still tries to put on a normal rapprt with him, and he still has zero feelings. I bet he still stays away from his family as much as he can. :furious:
 
Sorry for the long post and jeez I HATED going down memory lane as I try to keep those blocked out, but in regards to PM's fiance I can say pretty much, she WILL move on, she will have a good life, she will NEVER get over this though, it will haunt her forever no matter how good her life goes on to be, and she will still always wonder what it was about her that drew him to HER and also she will always wonder why she did not pick up on it sooner and why she didn't leave. I believe 100% there's no way she could have known what he was doing, she DID know something was not right. None of this is her fault. But you can't expect her to sort through it all right away, heck, it's been over15 years for me and I still have nightmares about my experience and I still wish I could go back in time with full knowledge, and get away before he hurt me.

I would NEVER have made ANY statement even the slightest supportive of him if he'd come out to hurt or kill someone before he hurt me, when I didn't know what he was.....and in my case, yes, after he did that to me and admitted he has no feelings, I was TERRIFIED...I was scared he was going to go further and hurt me because I exposed him and told others what he had done to me. I figured- he's TELLING me he doesn't care and has no feelings- so he could be capable of anything!

And finally----the guy I am talking about is a commerical PILOT now. I am obviously not going to name him. No way. I am still scared of him. And to my knowledge he's never committed any crimes...I bet you anything he's hurt a lot more people though. Including men or boys. I also fully believe he had hurt other girls before me.
 
LoisDenominator said:
Whoa... Quote from this article:

"A law enforcement source told ABC News Wednesday that police found 16 pairs of women's panties in the home of Philip Markoff, the Boston University Medical student charged with the murder of a sex worker who was shot dead in an upscale hotel room.

The panties were hidden under Markoff's bed in the Quincy home he shared with his fiancee. Along with the panties was a large bag with roughly 60 pairs of plastic flex-cuff restraints, the law enforcement source said."
Click to expand...

Sixteen pairs?? oh dear.
 
Columbo said:
Sixteen pairs?? oh dear.
Click to expand...

I REALLY hope that more of his victims will come forward, or if anyone knows ANYTHING they will talk to police. Sixteen pairs of panties. Not good.
 
LoisDenominator said:
This article has some further quotes from the attorney, as well as video of the fiancee arriving and departing. Thought this quote was particularly interesting:

"She's done it now, and I think she feels good about coming up and seeing him," Honecker said. "But now it's time to move on with other things in her life.

"She's going to take up her life with her friends and her family in New Jersey. I don't expect her to return in the near future."

Thursday morning Honecker confirmed that "moving on" included the cancellation of their planned summer wedding.
Click to expand...

OMG. I so know how she feels...you DO need to see them to get closure and even then you don't get it, but you're trying to validate yourself by getting answers from the person, such as WHY did they do this? And why didn't they just leave you? etc....you WANT to hear them say they're sorry and to believe that, but you know if they were capable of this, they are not sorry, and you also start to remember all the things that should have been warning signs, you blame yourself....seeing PM would be an attempt for this girl to give him a piece of her mind, try to find something to help her get closure, and also probably to try to find out why he was with her, yet doing all this. How could you DO that, that type of thing..it is easier to accept someone doing horrible things than it is to try to reconcile WHY THEY WERE WITH YOU TRYING TO PUT ON A SHOW.

PM would have ended up victimizing this poor girl further, I guarantee it. Not to be too blunt, sorry, but he WOULD have victimized her sexually, I know it. I feel this way because of the similarities to my experience. He would have snapped on her. She is lucky.

ETA- in my case I felt crazy...I was traumatized...very depressed...and even thought I fully believed he had no feelings, it HAD hit home for me....I STILL wanted to HEAR him say he was sorry even though I KNEW he wasn't. I still wanted/needed to hear him say it. He didn't. He said a whole bunch of things, mostly trying to play on MY sympathy and get me to feel sorry for HIM! I can't even explain why I would want to have someone say they are sorry when I knew they had no feelings after what they did....being victims of sociopaths, true sociopaths....is just something you can't describe and your mind can never really process. I still have not gotten over it...I just had to move on and put it out of my mind but it forever changed me and it took away a lot of my trust in people, I didn't date for years after this happened, even guys I knew and knew to be nice...I just couldn't...
 
Hermione said:
OMG. I so know how she feels...you DO need to see them to get closure and even then you don't get it, but you're trying to validate yourself by getting answers from the person, such as WHY did they do this? And why didn't they just leave you? etc....you WANT to hear them say they're sorry and to believe that, but you know if they were capable of this, they are not sorry, and you also start to remember all the things that should have been warning signs, you blame yourself....seeing PM would be an attempt for this girl to give him a piece of her mind, try to find something to help her get closure, and also probably to try to find out why he was with her, yet doing all this. How could you DO that, that type of thing..it is easier to accept someone doing horrible things than it is to try to reconcile WHY THEY WERE WITH YOU TRYING TO PUT ON A SHOW.

PM would have ended up victimizing this poor girl further, I guarantee it. Not to be too blunt, sorry, but he WOULD have victimized her sexually, I know it. I feel this way because of the similarities to my experience. He would have snapped on her. She is lucky.

ETA- in my case I felt crazy...I was traumatized...very depressed...and even thought I fully believed he had no feelings, it HAD hit home for me....I STILL wanted to HEAR him say he was sorry even though I KNEW he wasn't. I still wanted/needed to hear him say it. He didn't. He said a whole bunch of things, mostly trying to play on MY sympathy and get me to feel sorry for HIM! I can't even explain why I would want to have someone say they are sorry when I knew they had no feelings after what they did....being victims of sociopaths, true sociopaths....is just something you can't describe and your mind can never really process. I still have not gotten over it...I just had to move on and put it out of my mind but it forever changed me and it took away a lot of my trust in people, I didn't date for years after this happened, even guys I knew and knew to be nice...I just couldn't...
Click to expand...

Thank you for all of your excellent posts. Wow.
 
Lovejac said:
Well thank the Lord. Hopefully now she can begin the loooooong process of healing. I can't magine how hard that must have been.

Interesting that she wasn't wearing her engagement ring. I hope the reports of the wedding being off is correct. I wish her the very best, it will not be easy for her to learn to trust again.
Click to expand...

Yup - wedding is off but she still supports him?!? I have no reason to bash her. This is all so very 'fresh' and still new in her mind.

I can only hope she will sit in the trial and it will eventually sink in. OR better yet, I hope her family can slowly help her come to realize the truth about him. It would be such a waste of life if she dedicated herself to him forever. :(

Can you imagine sleeping next to someone who is capable of the level of violence this man seems to be?? Utterly shocking.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/story?id=7467571&page=1

"The fiancee of the accused Craigslist killer visited him in jail and told him that their wedding is off, law enforcement sources told ABC News. "
 
LoisDenominator said:
This article has some further quotes from the attorney, as well as video of the fiancee arriving and departing. Thought this quote was particularly interesting:

"She's done it now, and I think she feels good about coming up and seeing him," Honecker said. "But now it's time to move on with other things in her life.

"She's going to take up her life with her friends and her family in New Jersey. I don't expect her to return in the near future."

Thursday morning Honecker confirmed that "moving on" included the cancellation of their planned summer wedding.
Click to expand...

I wonder exactly what PM told her during the visit.
 
EmMomma said:
I REALLY hope that more of his victims will come forward, or if anyone knows ANYTHING they will talk to police. Sixteen pairs of panties. Not good.
Click to expand...

When the SA had his original press conference, he was practically begging any other victims to come forward -- with no chance of prosecution. I wondered then what they had that made them so sure there were other victims... It sure is clear now!

Totally agree, EM -- hopefully the victims will find the strength to assist in the investigation. It can't be easy for them to decide to come forward, but the corroboration would help immeasurably.
 
Columbo said:
I wonder exactly what PM told her during the visit.
Click to expand...

Of course I'm not certain, but IMHO, he most likely told his fiance the same thing he told his brother and his wife. Move to California (and change your name, I believe). There's more to come out.

When she saw him yesterday, she most likely already knew of the SIXTEEN pairs of women's underware found underneath their bed. She'd probably already resigned herself to the fact, he's most likely going to be found guilty with what we know of to date. Of course she'll maintain he's 'innocent UNTIL proven guilty,' but...........................

We already knew about at least two pairs of underware found under the bed. Just imagine if she knew about SIXTEEN!?:eek:

Poor thing.........She really didn't HAVE to personally visit him, but she did the right thing and she can now walk away with her head held high. She seems like a very decent and nice person. She showed her loyalty at first, but like I said in previous posts, once the 'evidence' starts coming out, PM's supporters will be dropping off one-by-one.

JMHO
fran
 
Hermione

Thank you for sharing your story. Thank goodness you were able to get out of such a horrifying situation.

I have four daughters and have seen two of them go through similar type situations, where there were warning bells that they tried to justify but by the time the break-up occurred, it was still terrifying to see who they had really been with. It even effected us as parents, to see who we'd allowed into our family circle.

Thank goodness time heals!

{hugs}
:blowkiss:
fran
 
I'm wondering why she never found any of this stuff: 16 pr of panties (not hers) and a bag of 60 of those plastic tie-up thingies. Maybe she never vacuumed under the bed? I guess if she went to school in St. Kitts she might not have been in the apartment enough to do any cleaning or look under the bed.
 
According to this PM's fiancee has not (yet?) been asked to testify in front of the Grand Jury; additionally, she has taken her personal items out of the apartment and has gone back to New Jersey today. (THAT had to be a spooky situation -- I'm glad her Mum was with her.)
 
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