MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #1

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Okay...having another wild speculation.

LE said today the perp might have an injury to his eye, IIRC. How would they know that?

Perhaps a broken eyeglass lens was found??

Is anyone missing his glasses?

speculation only

I'm looking for a link to the eye comment, and not finding one. Did I read it here? Anyone have a link? No use considering this speculation if it really wasn't stated the perp might have an eye injury.

Please share a link if you got it. tia
 
I'm looking for a link to the eye comment, and not finding one. Did I read it here? Anyone have a link? No use consider this speculation if it really wasn't stated the perp might have an eye injury.

Please share a link if you got it. tia

I believe someone here mentioned they heard it on a radio interview with a LEO or DA, don't hold me to this though lol
 
Okay...having another wild speculation.

LE said today the perp might have an injury to his eye, IIRC. How would they know that?

Perhaps a broken eyeglass lens was found??

Is anyone missing his glasses?

speculation only
The LE did go back to the crime scene, and left with something(s) in a brown bag. So, if it's true that the perp possible sustained an eye injury, he very well may have lost his glasses. Good thinking:)

I think LE most likely have their guy. They don't usually let the public know they've taken DNA samples, unless (IMO), it's substantial. Maybe whoever they took DNA from, had an eye injury (along with scratches), and for some reason(?) he didn't have his glasses, which led them back to the crime scene??? Just speculation.
 
Many self defense courses teach you to gouge at the attacker's eyes if you can.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
D

Also my mom mentioned that she heard they had to ask the father to stop help searching for his daughter because it was throwing off the search dogs. Not sure if she heard that on a local radio station or through the town rumor mill but I can find out.
That was in one of the early news articles.
 
I may be wrong, but I thought the eye injury was mentioned in one of the press sources re-reporting the Daily Mail's tale of an injured motorcyclist at Wachusett Mt that turned out to be unconnected to this case. I can't find a link anywhere that mentions an eye injury so it is possible the story was taken down after it was found to be unrelated.
Seems like an eye injury described/predicted by police would feature more heavily in the search for a man with "scratches, scrapes and bruises" if this detail has been released?
 

Just some observations. Serial killer Anthony Kirkland murdered 5 females in Cincinnati and then set fire to their bodies to conceal evidence of rape. His final victim was 13yo Esme Kenney who went jogging in a park across from her house. Kirkland had been living in a halfway house after being released from prison, but was evicted for fighting with another resident. Kirkland claimed he became enraged when Kenney accidentally bumped into him in the park, although she was apologetic. Her body was also found in a wooded area. Kirkland has been sentenced to death and is in prison where he belongs
:jail:. But IMO there's a lot we can learn from observing his MO and motives. There is a WS thread for Kirkland:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...Cincinnati-2006-09&highlight=anthony+kirkland

And a thread for another one of his victims, 14yo Casonya 'Sharee' Crawford:

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...vondale-9-May-2006&highlight=anthony+kirkland

While there are striking similarities especially between the Kenney murder and the murders of VM and/or KV, I think the motive for the VM murder, at least, may be very different. One thing consistent regarding serial killers/rapists is their crimes are motivated by anger. But, VM's killer seems to have a different motive for burning her body than Kirkland had for burning the bodies of his victims. Only certain areas of VM's body were burned and those are areas that could most easily ID her, so it appears the killer was trying to delay identification of the body. The face is obviously the most identifiable, and then the hands because of the potential of matching fingerprints from the body to a missing person. Footprints, I think, can also be used to ID people. I think it's common any more for hospitals to obtain footprints of newborns. I assume the pattern of those prints remain constant into adulthood?

If VM's killer was counting on a delay in the recovery of her body and an additional delay IDing her, this suggests the killer knows he/she can be traced to VM and so not likely a random murder. IMO. While the similarities between VM and KV are extremely intriguing, I'm not entirely convinced their murders are connected because there appears to be a difference in MO. KV's killer didn't attempt to conceal her identity by setting fire to her body. Even crimes that are not linked can share similarities due to 1.) mere coincidence and 2.) similar MO's used by different perps.

MOO
:cow:
 
Here's a transcript of Nancy Grace 08/11/16

http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1608/11/ng.01.html

Thanks ~

O/T LAWL Sounds like the MURDERER JA is trying to get married 

The LE did go back to the crime scene, and left with something(s) in a brown bag. So, if it's true that the perp possible sustained an eye injury, he very well may have lost his glasses. Good thinking:)

I think LE most likely have their guy. They don't usually let the public know they've taken DNA samples, unless (IMO), it's substantial. Maybe whoever they took DNA from, had an eye injury (along with scratches), and for some reason(?) he didn't have his glasses, which led them back to the crime scene??? Just speculation.

RBBM

Hi Paulas88

It was mentioned in a previous thread and I found where it was talking about the brown bag, it is on the Nancy Grace transcripts :) HTH

jmo :moo:
 
This is just a wild speculation - only saying it because I'm watching one America news and they are talking about wiki Leaks then they talked about Some political guy killed to keep him quiet??

Was her job with Google a threat somehow?

I know far fetched but thought I'd Toss it out there

I used to watch scandal a couple of years ago
It reminds of some of the episodes of scandal
 
This is just a wild speculation - only saying it because I'm watching one America news and they are talking about wiki Leaks then they talked about Some political guy killed to keep him quiet??

Was her job with Google a threat somehow?

I know far fetched but thought I'd Toss it out there

I used to watch scandal a couple of years ago
It reminds of some of the episodes of scandal
Don't think so. She was a health-care account mgr. with Google:

In January 2015, she started a new job as a health-care account manager at Google in New York City.

A Google spokesman confirmed Marcotte’s employment in an emailed statement to The Washington Post.
<<snipped>>

https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...ng-family-went-for-a-jog-and-never-came-back/
 
I believe that this murder is related to Karina Vetrano's murder in NY. Way too many coincidences. They both jogged, it happened roughly at the same time of day, they both looked a like and were more than just pretty...these girls were specifically targeted.

It also looks like the perp (we all know its a he) is escalating quickly. He seems to be conflicted and either thought he would be caught soon, and quickly moved onto the next crime but is unsure of what the police know so he is trying to cover up the second time around.
He also probably had a lot more time to think at the second location.

These girls were both fit and runners. I believe that he used a more simplistic approach to get them close and calm. I am thinking he either knew them directly/indirectly through friends or watched them closely on social media...
Lets assume he knew that she would be there running at some point either from facebook or someone she used to know. What if she ran by him and he simply says "Hey, aren't you that girl from twitter" or "Hey Vanessa, don't I know you from the gym in NYC?"
Even if she doesn't know him, she's going to slow down/stop and approach him until she remembers.

I think we are looking for a white male (possibly Italian), who is big/strong and can easily over power fit women with punches, who is either someone she recognized from back in NYC or someone decent looking/trustworthy enough to stop jogging for (Ted Bundy), aged 27-45 and will have some connection to these two either directly through friends, the gym or indirectly through social media. Regarding the inconsistencies of the first and second murder, I think that he is relatively new at killing but due to the violent nature of knocking someones teeth out and then burning the second body, I think we are looking for someone with an extensive violent past via either first fights, domestic violence, assault, rape, etc.

This case is very sad and I feel awful for everyone except the guy who did this. This also reminds me a lot of the Chelsea King murder which also was a jogger that happened in my home town where I grew up. Chelsea's killer also target girls that reminded him of his first love who left him.
 
I get the impression that the perp isn't all that experienced with starting fires. I think he may have tried to start a big enough fire to destroy the evidence completely, and either gave up, or left the scene thinking it would catch better than it did. Maybe he was hoping it'd be easier considering the drought.

I don't get the impression they were trying to start a big fire at all. It would have drawn too much attention and was too close to the road. I don't think the fire was used to cover evidence at all. I think the fire was part of the sick perps plan/game from the beginning. The fact it's specificall at her face, hands, and feet, shows to me more of a controlled flame than a failed attempt to conceal evidence. Just my two cents.
 
SO horrific to imagine what took place at this crime scene :(


Not to be insensitive but:

Seems like there is no blood to be seen at the crime scene, so that might, IMHO, point to that Vanessa's cause of death was strangulation or suffocation.

And...lots of broken wooden sticks there.
I wonder if Vanessa got hold of a stick and punched it into the killers eye ? I sure hope so!

I was thinking this because in one news report, that I read today, it was stated, I think it was by a police officer, that the killer possibly had an injury to one of his eyes (that is unless I have missunderstod what was stated in that news report, anyone else read that?)
Unfortunately I can not remember which news report it was :( .

Maybe the forensic pathologist /medical examiner found something on Vanessa's body that indicated that the killers eye was injured, and is that why detectives went back to the crime scene too look for something? a possible item/weapon Vanessa used to injure the killers eye with?
And... was it a wooden stick they found, with his blood on it ? was that what was in that brown evidence paper-bag?


And, I still believe the killer is a stalker, a psychopathic stalker, and that there IS some kind of connection between Vanessa Marcotte and Karina Vetrano's case.
If it's not the same killer, then I believe that Vanessa's killer is either a Karina Vetrano killer copycat, or that the two killers are some kind of really sick
game-team-killers who planed to commit to similar murders.

I know this thoughts seems far out, so why do I believe this ?

Because IMHO it is statistically not likely that two SUCH brutal murders, two SO similar crimes happen SO few days apart, AND on top of that, both victims have SO many similarities / things in common.



Here is a copy of a Post I posted on the Karina Vetrano thread a couple of days ago:


The two victims KV and VM lived not far apart, KV in Queens and VM in New York City (VM vas just visiting her mother in Princeton, Massachusetts when she was murdered, only 2-3 hours drive from NY city) and we don't know yet where in New York City VM lived, she could, for all we know, have lived close to KV, and/or who knows if they had some social circles in common where the killer might be a part, at least in the periphery?

IF the killer is the same man in both murders, then I believe he is the kind of killer I suspect, a psychopathic sexual predator, whom in high speed is evolving into a serial killer and who sees his killings as a deadly "game", a "project" an "artwork".
And if that is the case I think it is not unlikely that he stalked both woman and eventually followed VM to Princeton, he might have gotten info about her trip to Princeton from her social media (a stalker both in real life and on the internet/social media).

Here is a copy of a post that show how much thise two victims have in common, could that really be a coincident?
Yes of course it can, but it's not very likely IMHO:

Karina Vetrano and Vanessa Marcotte have a LOT in common IMO:


Both KV and VM have:
Long brown hair
Brown eyes
athletic bodies
seem to be very petite
Italian names

Both KV and VM are:
Out jogging when murdered
Murdered within same week, Tuesday and Sunday
Murdered in broad daylight, in the afternoon
Murder scene ca 1/2 a mile from their parents homes
Left residential areas to jogg and bodies found in nature area
Both found within a few hours of their disappearance
Both raped, well, KV was gruesomely raped, both vaginal and anal (sorry to be so graphic bur we need to get ALL the facts to be able to possibly get the puzzle together)
(we still don't know for sure concerning VM, but it is indeed very likely that Vanessa was raped, or at least that, that was part of the killers plan )
Live in ca. same area Queens and NY City
Are ca. same age 30 and 27
Stunning beauties.
No boyfriends
Successful young woman
Athletic girls
Cause of death: KV strangulation... VM, still pending, but due to apparently no blood at the crime scene strangulations is a probable
cause of death.

A couple things. One broken sticks in the woods means nothing. Not sure if you've spent a lot of time hiking in the woods or not but as someone who grew up here and have hiked lots of woods trails in the area and practically grew up playing in these woods, the only thing that looks suspicious about that area is the dark spot on the ground where it looks possibly charred. Other then that broken sticks are a common iccurance in woods like that, not indication of a struggle....though perhaps police found other evidence to point to that. But the broken sticks alone is not reason to think that they all got broke during a struggle.

Second though I agree there are lots of similarities btw the two cases, and their certainly is a possibility they could be related, I don't follow your profile of the killer 100%. i can't really imagine someone following her from NYC when she took a bus to get home, the hanging out in the area for a few days and finally attacking.

It seems too much to
Me like someone who would have to know the area. It seems to me if they are related Vanessa might have been the target and Karina was practice? Still the manner of their deaths and state of their bodies, and locations just seems like the chances they are related are slim despite some truly eerie similarities.
 
Never heard of that test, but to my knowledge 24-72 hours is or was the norm. I know in different states some departments have labs within and some have to send out to state. Also depends if they have the latest and greatest equipment. Latest and greatest=faster results.

ETA: can you give me info on the "akut" test? I'd like to look into it more or perhaps you can explain what it is exactly. Like I said never heard of it but happy to learn new things &#128522;

Here you go, and actually it is possible in only 4 hours, and this report is from 2010, so maybe it has been developed even further:

https://www.acs.org/content/acs/en/...cts-dna-with-crime-samples-in-four-hours.html

Fast forensic test can match suspects DNA with crime samples in four hours
 
As a former volunteer firefighter, I can say confidently, most ff would know a body would not burn in a patch of gas, even with accelerant. JMO. The fire was most likely to attempt to destroy evidence or the body, but not likely was done by someone bright enough to know a body doesn't just burn like wood does.

I don't think the burning was an attempt to cover anything. I think the fire was part of their game. And I think it's possible they used something like a blow torch. To me it sounds more like someone who liked to
Play with fire, which could also be someone whom join the FD as a volunteer.
 
Of serious interest is IMHO to find out if the killer used gasoline or other substances, that you have to buy etc in advance, to set poor Vanessa 's body on fire, because if the killer used such a substance, well then it is almost certyn that the killer had planed the murder in advance,

Possibly but around here it wouldn't be weird at all for someone to have a can of gasoline or a blow torch in the bed of a truck for example.
 
The LE did go back to the crime scene, and left with something(s) in a brown bag. So, if it's true that the perp possible sustained an eye injury, he very well may have lost his glasses. Good thinking:)

I think LE most likely have their guy. They don't usually let the public know they've taken DNA samples, unless (IMO), it's substantial. Maybe whoever they took DNA from, had an eye injury (along with scratches), and for some reason(?) he didn't have his glasses, which led them back to the crime scene??? Just speculation.

Maybe not eye glasses....but perhaps a contact? I think that would give them DNA evidence too.
 
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