MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #1

[observation]

My observation was more in response to earlier posts asking why cops responding to the 1:45 motorcycle accident didn't connect it to the murder. My observation was that when they responded to the accident, they weren't yet aware that VM was missing, let alone deceased.

I just watched the 6 pm local (Boston) news and there's nothing new.

Yes, I see that now and sorry about my own misunderstanding. I thought you were asking about the time line, so just trying to help from what I read here and in the media. [emoji106]


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[ThinkHard]

What makes you wonder that?

Seeing the picture of the charred grass. It made me think perhaps it was someone who enjoyed setting fires and was familiar with them....perhaps like a fire fighter.

Every year all the town local FD compete in this FD competion called the firemans muster....they do a bunch of different "events" but each team is made up of full time FD people but also because the towns are small in large part they are added by volunteers FD people. Mostly these are 20-30 year old townies with other full time jobs.

Anyway I was just thinking that perhaps someone associated with a local FD could be involved because it would point to knowledge and perhaps interest of fires, as well as knowing the local area, and even perhaps having access to a CB radio and knowing where the tow cops where.

 

[borndem]

It's such a true statement. This is why, IMHO WS will always surpass FB and other SM sites. Too many rumors become fact way too quickly and it's a lot of wasted hours and rabbit holes to explore only to come up empty handed. We thank you for keeping this forum straight. That said, I love hearing from the locals in the area and appreciate your birds eye view.


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Good post, observation -- I second everything you said. And we do appreciate the local Sleuthers -- it's always so helpful to have that inside info -- the lay of the land, the little place on the corner, the weather that night, the dark dangerous path, etc., etc., all of which outsiders would never know.

We are a good bunch of folks -- Mods most certainly included for all they do, day-in, day-out. It's a good place to be.

 

[Inthedetails]

Yes, I believe this is the exact location of the trail (cart path).
If you enter the following coordinates into Bing maps you will find an even more recently captured street view than Google - complete with the broken yellow and black reflector as shown in news reports:
42.437811, -71.888749
https://www.bing.com/mapspreview
Image of street view from Bing:
View attachment 99743

Thank you! Here it the same place, using Google maps (I'm loyal to my Google map guy):
https://www.google.com/maps/place/4...m5!3m4!1s0x0:0x0!8m2!3d42.4378056!4d-71.88875

 

[borndem]

No, rape kit was mentioned and was going to be used BUT no results were shared. Again, they announced yesterday it's a male perp who would have cuts and bruises. I was just speculating that maybe the rape kit was positive, clearly indicating a male perp.


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When I heard on the presser that it was a male perp, I assumed they had found evidence that appeared to be rape and/or semen and based the comment on that. I guess we'll find out something a bit more concrete sooner or later. (Hope so...) Who knoze??

 

[Tempura]

Seeing the picture of the charred grass. It made me think perhaps it was someone who enjoyed setting fires and was familiar with them....perhaps like a fire fighter.

Every year all the town local FD compete in this FD competion called the firemans muster....they do a bunch of different "events" but each team is made up of full time FD people but also because the towns are small in large part they are added by volunteers FD people. Mostly these are 20-30 year old townies with other full time jobs.

Anyway I was just thinking that perhaps someone associated with a local FD could be involved because it would point to knowledge and perhaps interest of fires, as well as knowing the local area, and even perhaps having access to a CB radio and knowing where the tow cops where.

I get the impression that the perp isn't all that experienced with starting fires. I think he may have tried to start a big enough fire to destroy the evidence completely, and either gave up, or left the scene thinking it would catch better than it did. Maybe he was hoping it'd be easier considering the drought.

 

[Theforeigner]

FOX25 is saying this image is of the location VM was found. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CpsMWDOWAAANs5X?format=jpg&name=large

*WARNING* singed grass and clearing in woods

SO horrific to imagine what took place at this crime scene


Not to be insensitive but:

Seems like there is no blood to be seen at the crime scene, so that might, IMHO, point to that Vanessa's cause of death was strangulation or suffocation.

And...lots of broken wooden sticks there.
I wonder if Vanessa got hold of a stick and punched it into the killers eye ? I sure hope so!

I was thinking this because in one news report, that I read today, it was stated, I think it was by a police officer, that the killer possibly had an injury to one of his eyes (that is unless I have missunderstod what was stated in that news report, anyone else read that?)
Unfortunately I can not remember which news report it was .

Maybe the forensic pathologist /medical examiner found something on Vanessa's body that indicated that the killers eye was injured, and is that why detectives went back to the crime scene too look for something? a possible item/weapon Vanessa used to injure the killers eye with?
And... was it a wooden stick they found, with his blood on it ? was that what was in that brown evidence paper-bag?


And, I still believe the killer is a stalker, a psychopathic stalker, and that there IS some kind of connection between Vanessa Marcotte and Karina Vetrano's case.
If it's not the same killer, then I believe that Vanessa's killer is either a Karina Vetrano killer copycat, or that the two killers are some kind of really sick
game-team-killers who planed to commit to similar murders.

I know this thoughts seems far out, so why do I believe this ?

Because IMHO it is statistically not likely that two SUCH brutal murders, two SO similar crimes happen SO few days apart, AND on top of that, both victims have SO many similarities / things in common.



Here is a copy of a Post I posted on the Karina Vetrano thread a couple of days ago:


The two victims KV and VM lived not far apart, KV in Queens and VM in New York City (VM vas just visiting her mother in Princeton, Massachusetts when she was murdered, only 2-3 hours drive from NY city) and we don't know yet where in New York City VM lived, she could, for all we know, have lived close to KV, and/or who knows if they had some social circles in common where the killer might be a part, at least in the periphery?

IF the killer is the same man in both murders, then I believe he is the kind of killer I suspect, a psychopathic sexual predator, whom in high speed is evolving into a serial killer and who sees his killings as a deadly "game", a "project" an "artwork".
And if that is the case I think it is not unlikely that he stalked both woman and eventually followed VM to Princeton, he might have gotten info about her trip to Princeton from her social media (a stalker both in real life and on the internet/social media).

Here is a copy of a post that show how much thise two victims have in common, could that really be a coincident?
Yes of course it can, but it's not very likely IMHO:

Karina Vetrano and Vanessa Marcotte have a LOT in common IMO:


Both KV and VM have:
Long brown hair
Brown eyes
athletic bodies
seem to be very petite
Italian names

Both KV and VM are:
Out jogging when murdered
Murdered within same week, Tuesday and Sunday
Murdered in broad daylight, in the afternoon
Murder scene ca 1/2 a mile from their parents homes
Left residential areas to jogg and bodies found in nature area
Both found within a few hours of their disappearance
Both raped, well, KV was gruesomely raped, both vaginal and anal (sorry to be so graphic bur we need to get ALL the facts to be able to possibly get the puzzle together)
(we still don't know for sure concerning VM, but it is indeed very likely that Vanessa was raped, or at least that, that was part of the killers plan )
Live in ca. same area Queens and NY City
Are ca. same age 30 and 27
Stunning beauties.
No boyfriends
Successful young woman
Athletic girls
Cause of death: KV strangulation... VM, still pending, but due to apparently no blood at the crime scene strangulations is a probable
cause of death.

 

[Paulas88]

I get the impression that the perp isn't all that experienced with starting fires. I think he may have tried to start a big enough fire to destroy the evidence completely, and either gave up, or left the scene thinking it would catch better than it did. Maybe he was hoping it'd be easier considering the drought.

There was a profiler on NG who said, lighting a NAKED body on fire is not easy.

 

[eucalyptuz]

Surprisingly few land packages along that section of Brooks Station rd:
http://www.cmrpc.org/GIS/princeton/Princeton_Assessor_Maps_36x23_5_12.pdf

 

[Theforeigner]

They probably did a buccal swab, should take 1-3 days, and they can't hold them just because they are waiting for results. There has to be extenuating circumstances to hold the person.

Actually don't hold me to the last part of that, don't know Mass laws very well. They may be able to hold them for 24 hours if nothing else evidence wise could keep them there but would have to let them go after that.

A DNA test can be done within 5-6 hours if the police ask for an "akut" test.

 

[Theforeigner]

Seeing the picture of the charred grass. It made me think perhaps it was someone who enjoyed setting fires and was familiar with them....perhaps like a fire fighter.

Every year all the town local FD compete in this FD competion called the firemans muster....they do a bunch of different "events" but each team is made up of full time FD people but also because the towns are small in large part they are added by volunteers FD people. Mostly these are 20-30 year old townies with other full time jobs.

Anyway I was just thinking that perhaps someone associated with a local FD could be involved because it would point to knowledge and perhaps interest of fires, as well as knowing the local area, and even perhaps having access to a CB radio and knowing where the tow cops where.

Karina Vetrano's father was a fire fighter (NOT that I, in any shape or form, are insinuating that he had anything to do with any crime whatsoever)

 

[Dockins]

Seeing the picture of the charred grass. It made me think perhaps it was someone who enjoyed setting fires and was familiar with them....perhaps like a fire fighter.

Every year all the town local FD compete in this FD competion called the firemans muster....they do a bunch of different "events" but each team is made up of full time FD people but also because the towns are small in large part they are added by volunteers FD people. Mostly these are 20-30 year old townies with other full time jobs.

Anyway I was just thinking that perhaps someone associated with a local FD could be involved because it would point to knowledge and perhaps interest of fires, as well as knowing the local area, and even perhaps having access to a CB radio and knowing where the tow cops where.

As a former volunteer firefighter, I can say confidently, most ff would know a body would not burn in a patch of gas, even with accelerant. JMO. The fire was most likely to attempt to destroy evidence or the body, but not likely was done by someone bright enough to know a body doesn't just burn like wood does.

 

[Theforeigner]

I get the impression that the perp isn't all that experienced with starting fires. I think he may have tried to start a big enough fire to destroy the evidence completely, and either gave up, or left the scene thinking it would catch better than it did. Maybe he was hoping it'd be easier considering the drought.

Of serious interest is IMHO to find out if the killer used gasoline or other substances, that you have to buy etc in advance, to set poor Vanessa 's body on fire, because if the killer used such a substance, well then it is almost certyn that the killer had planed the murder in advance,

 

[borndem]

FOX25 is saying this image is of the location VM was found. https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CpsMWDOWAAANs5X?format=jpg&name=large

*WARNING* singed grass and clearing in woods

What an awful scene -- it makes me sad, but it make me angry even more than sad. Damn it. SMH. Inhuman. No words.

But we see this for her and her hurting, grieving family.

 

[Tempura]

Of serious interest is IMHO to find out if the killer used gasoline or other substances, that you have to buy etc in advance, to set poor Vanessa 's body on fire, because if the killer used such a substance, well then it is almost certyn that the murder had planed the murder in advance,

I think if the person was familiar with those woods and the cart path, they may do some four wheeling or snowmobiling. That could mean that they'd have gasoline in a truck, or if home was not far, they could have gone back to the scene shortly after to try to destroy evidence. It could have also been something like lighter fluid. Still pretty perplexed why only those areas were burned unless the perp had a limited amount of accelerant.

 

[Paulas88]

Very curious if LE ever recovered VM' phone or clothes.

 

[threelittlebirdies]

Did the girls belong to any running associations or running clubs ?

 

[Lawdini01234]

A DNA test can be done within 5-6 hours if the police ask for an "akut" test.

Never heard of that test, but to my knowledge 24-72 hours is or was the norm. I know in different states some departments have labs within and some have to send out to state. Also depends if they have the latest and greatest equipment. Latest and greatest=faster results.

ETA: can you give me info on the "akut" test? I'd like to look into it more or perhaps you can explain what it is exactly. Like I said never heard of it but happy to learn new things 😊

 

[Inthedetails]

I think if the person was familiar with those woods and the cart path, they may do some four wheeling or snowmobiling. That could mean that they'd have gasoline in a truck, or if home was not far, they could have gone back to the scene shortly after to try to destroy evidence. It could have also been something like lighter fluid. Still pretty perplexed why only those areas were burned unless the perp had a limited amount of accelerant.

Or a weird fetish or fixation?
A moment of self-disgust and he wanted to erase what is most characteristic of a person so not to face what he did?
Criminal experience and knew to get rid of identifying features?
Torture?

The burned feet are a real puzzle within the puzzle and make me think of a fetish. Or, the fire was started around her, at her feet and head and her arms where tied by her head?

Oh geez....it's absurd to try to figure this out. Sane minds can't do it.

jmopinion at the moment

 

[Inthedetails]

Okay...having another wild speculation.

LE said today the perp might have an injury to his eye, IIRC. How would they know that?

Perhaps a broken eyeglass lens was found??

Is anyone missing his glasses?

speculation only