MA - Vanessa Marcotte, 27, murdered, Princeton, 7 Aug 2016 #4

[Kickoff61]

They will be testing everything to know the method.

 

[Kickoff61]

I posted to this yesterday but it must have went off into cyberspace. Being from New England I have been through Princeton many times. I do not think this was a stranger but of course there is always the possibility it could be.
I will go along the lines that this was someone somewhat local. Knew how to get it done and get away. Most likely knew her or of her. Seen her jogging over a period of time. As she put up a fight and the perp possibly has scratches/marks he was able to afford to hide out for awhile, maybe even out of state and away.
I honestly thought there would be some good pertinant leads by now made public. I was hoping anyway.

Hopefully there will be more known soon.

 

[Kickoff61]

I posted to this yesterday but it must have went off into cyberspace. Being from New England I have been through Princeton many times. I do not think this was a stranger but of course there is always the possibility it could be.
I will go along the lines that this was someone somewhat local. Knew how to get it done and get away. Most likely knew her or of her. Seen her jogging over a period of time. As she put up a fight and the perp possibly has scratches/marks he was able to afford to hide out for awhile, maybe even out of state and away.
I honestly thought there would be some good pertinant leads by now made public. I was hoping anyway.

In fact the killer really knows what he is doing for this to be going on like this. Prayers they catch him very soon.

 

[tlcya]

:bump: to call attention to update per Tricia - the police calls are in.

Some questions have been posed about how far speculation and sleuthing can go. I will answer the main ones now:

1) Regarding an automobile crash fatality that occurred not long after Vanessa was murdered: Until or unless LE connects the wreck/suicide to Vanessa's case it is not open for speculation/theorizing as related to this murder. Happening in the same general time frame as this murder and social media or other internet rumors are not enough to warrant it's entry into this discussion.

2) Regarding police blotter reports in the days before and after Vanessa was killed: UPDATE: Per Tricia on 10-2-16 the police blotters are up for discussion. Make sure you provide a main stream link and please, avoid tunnel vision by getting too invested in any one call being tied to this case. It is entirely possible that none are. But on the off chance one is, you may link and discuss them.

If anyone has a question about what is or what is not allowed please private message a mod or an admin. If anyone feels the discussion has entered an area that is not allowed please alert on the post or posts so a moderator can evaluate the situation.

Finally, part of what makes this one of the largest true crime forums on the web is that a certain level of respect can be expected from fellow members. Lots of differing life experiences, professions, opinions and skills come to the table here from all walks of life. That makes for a lot of varied viewpoints and ideas. This is a good thing and makes for a lively discussion enabling all of us to see things from other perspectives than our own. Turning the case over and viewing it from all angles.

It should be expected that not everyone will agree. What a boring conversation that would be if we all sat around agreeing all day. That said - Disagree respectfully. Agree to disagree when you must.

On those rare occasions where someone simply rubs you wrong no matter what scroll and roll or make use of your ignore feature accessed via your settings.

thank you for caring about Vanessa,

tlcya

 

[ThinkHard]

If he lived nearby and attacked her on her running route, he more than likely would want to avoid adding evidence of her being in his vehicle

That's assuming he planned to attack her. If on the off chance she knew him and he wasn't planning to kill her but rather somehow snapped, he wouldn't be thinking about that kind of evidence ahead of time. Just as an alternative.

 

[Steleheart]

:bump: to call attention to update per Tricia - the police calls are in.

Thank you for that tlcya.
I have tossed around the car discussion and remembered that when the police asked for anyone who knew of a vihicle in that area that is when they extended the timeline to 3 :00 PM

<snipped>
"We know that Marcotte was last spotted here on Brooks Station Road around 1 p.m. on Aug. 7, and police say they&#8217;re looking for a male who may have been spotted driving or parked there between 1 and 3 p.m. that afternoon."
http://www.necn.com/news/new-englan...ssa-Marcotte-Investigation-DNA-390735071.html


Then on Aug 9 a caller to the police department called in a tip that a car was seen parked on BSR @ 3:00 on Sunday the 7th;

"Tuesday, August 9
5:49 a.m. Caller reports seeing a white vehicle parked on side
of Brooks Station Rd. on Sunday around 3 p.m."
http://www.thelandmark.com/news/2016-08-18/Fire_(and)_Police/Police_Notebook.html

 

[rosesfromangels]

Here's some basic info on fire investigations, specifically pertaining to accelerants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detection_of_fire_accelerants
http://www.interfire.org/res_file/aec.asp
http://www.tcforensic.com.au/docs/article5.html
https://www.asdk12.org/staff/mason_brian/CALENDAR/96447_Ch_12-2_Arson.pdf

 

[Kickoff61]

His actions point to him trying to cover up his connection to the crime and it appears those close with him are covering up things they know are wrong...at least initially....if not longer..if they haven't called in by now.

 

[Kickoff61]

Here's some basic info on fire investigations, specifically pertaining to accelerants:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detection_of_fire_accelerants
http://www.interfire.org/res_file/aec.asp
http://www.tcforensic.com.au/docs/article5.html
https://www.asdk12.org/staff/mason_brian/CALENDAR/96447_Ch_12-2_Arson.pdf

Thanks for adding this info. I think it was discussed here earlier re: fire dept. called to the scene. so they are thoroughly investigating from all angles.

 

[Kickoff61]

They are scared and the district attorney says they should be.
&#8220;They should be scared to death,&#8221; Mr. Early said Tuesday afternoon, adding that police are working diligently to try to solve the case.

Telegram.com

****For a DA to use words like that...it shows they have a serious killer on the loose and clearly will work diligently to stop him.

 

[Tempura]

They are scared and the district attorney says they should be.
&#8220;They should be scared to death,&#8221; Mr. Early said Tuesday afternoon, adding that police are working diligently to try to solve the case.

Telegram.com

For a DA to use words like that...it shows they have a serious killer on the loose and clearly will work diligently to stop him.

Who is he referring to? The public?

 

[Kickoff61]

This is no amateur.

 

[Kickoff61]

Who is he referring to? The public?

Yes:
Up until Sunday, the biggest concerns for people living on Brooks Station Road were &#8220;break-ins and bears,&#8221; one resident said Tuesday.
Now, they worry about a killer. They said they hope that state police detectives will be able to find the person who killed Ms. Marcotte but they won&#8217;t feel safe for a long, long time.
They are scared and the district attorney says they should be.
&#8220;They should be scared to death,&#8221; Mr. Early said Tuesday afternoon, adding that police are working diligently to try to solve the case.

The Telegram August 9th

 

[rosesfromangels]

Yes:
Up until Sunday, the biggest concerns for people living on Brooks Station Road were &#8220;break-ins and bears,&#8221; one resident said Tuesday.
Now, they worry about a killer. They said they hope that state police detectives will be able to find the person who killed Ms. Marcotte but they won&#8217;t feel safe for a long, long time.
They are scared and the district attorney says they should be.
&#8220;They should be scared to death,&#8221; Mr. Early said Tuesday afternoon, adding that police are working diligently to try to solve the case.

The Telegram

I interpreted the DA's remarks as being directed to the killer, not the public. As in, "we're coming after you, and we'll get you". MOO

 

[JEF]

Maybe I've been mispeaking. The cart path I'm referring to is the path off BSR where the body was found. It's overgrown and stops a little ways in. It's not connected to the path at the end of Connor Lane.

The cart path is the end if Connors lane that us no longer used as a road and has grown over, it directly leads to private property. Where the driveway of the house at the end if the cart path starts, is where the paved part of Connors lane begins. Connors lane us therefor a dead end.

This picture shows were the paved part of Connors lane ends

 

[JEF]

I don't believe police logs are complete. They're holding some things back.

Could the white car at 3 have been someone searching for Vanessa? If my daughter usually ran for an hour and wasn't back in 2, wasn't answering her cell and had recently been diagnosed with Crohn's, I might be out looking for her, especially if she had to leave for NYC at 4 to catch a bus. Whatever the case, I don't see the killer nabbing her in his car at 1ish and hanging around for two hours. I also don't see the killer nabbing her, driving to a second location, killing her, returning to a half mile of her home, pulling onto private property, removing the body, gathering kindling, starting a fire, and leaving in such a short time frame. But the biggest question is this - if he's got her in his car, why stay any length of time in that area? Once she's in that car, he can drive onto any path in town (there are many) and extend the search for hours/days/even years. Better yet, he can drive out of town and bury the body. No DNA, nothing at all to tie him to the crime.

The cart path where the body was found off BSR has always troubled me. What if it's a diversion? He leaves her there so everyone thinks a car pulled in there. It's the first thing anyone would think. So the police, neighbors, etc, are looking for a car on BSR on Sunday afternoon when in fact there was never a car on BSR to look for at all.

Just a theory.

 

[JEF]

There is one huge contradiction to my last post though, which is that on this thread, early on, a witness stated he/she saw VM running near a car driving slowly. When he/she went back she was gone.

Does anyone remember what thread that was on?

 

[Steleheart]

I don't believe police logs are complete. They're holding some things back.

Could the white car at 3 have been someone searching for Vanessa? If my daughter usually ran for an hour and wasn't back in 2, wasn't answering her cell and had recently been diagnosed with Crohn's, I might be out looking for her, especially if she had to leave for NYC at 4 to catch a bus. Whatever the case, I don't see the killer nabbing her in his car at 1ish and hanging around for two hours. I also don't see the killer nabbing her, driving to a second location, killing her, returning to a half mile of her home, pulling onto private property, removing the body, gathering kindling, starting a fire, and leaving in such a short time frame. But the biggest question is this - if he's got her in his car, why stay any length of time in that area? Once she's in that car, he can drive onto any path in town (there are many) and extend the search for hours/days/even years. Better yet, he can drive out of town and bury the body. No DNA, nothing at all to tie him to the crime.

The cart path where the body was found off BSR has always troubled me. What if it's a diversion? He leaves her there so everyone thinks a car pulled in there. It's the first thing anyone would think. So the police, neighbors, etc, are looking for a car on BSR on Sunday afternoon when in fact there was never a car on BSR to look for at all.

Just a theory.

You are right, the logs are only as complete as given to the paper. There is a note to that effect under Aug 7;

"Princeton Police responded to two burglar alarms
Editor’s note: Logs are complete as given to the paper. A
call regarding a missing jogger on Aug. 7 did not appear in
the Princeton Police logs given to The Landmark."

http://www.thelandmark.com/news/2016-08-11/Fire_(and)_Police/Police_Notebook.html

 

[rosesfromangels]

I decided to improve my understanding of blow torches so did some research.

I learned there are mini-torches that are small enough to fit in cargo pants pockets. There are small models that can easily be carried in student-sized backpacks. I can see the perp routinely having this item on his person. A blow torch could serve many uses: Intimidation, control, weapon, and means to destroy DNA evidence. Easier to explain than a concealed gun if the carrier is questioned by police. In addition to plumbers and welders, jewelers and chefs use the smaller varieties. It's not like the guy needs to carry around a tank. Really easy for him to subdue her and start a controlled fire, I believe.

And roofers use them.

 

[Kickoff61]

I don't believe police logs are complete. They're holding some things back.

Could the white car at 3 have been someone searching for Vanessa? If my daughter usually ran for an hour and wasn't back in 2, wasn't answering her cell and had recently been diagnosed with Crohn's, I might be out looking for her, especially if she had to leave for NYC at 4 to catch a bus. Whatever the case, I don't see the killer nabbing her in his car at 1ish and hanging around for two hours. I also don't see the killer nabbing her, driving to a second location, killing her, returning to a half mile of her home, pulling onto private property, removing the body, gathering kindling, starting a fire, and leaving in such a short time frame. But the biggest question is this - if he's got her in his car, why stay any length of time in that area? Once she's in that car, he can drive onto any path in town (there are many) and extend the search for hours/days/even years. Better yet, he can drive out of town and bury the body. No DNA, nothing at all to tie him to the crime.

The cart path where the body was found off BSR has always troubled me. What if it's a diversion? He leaves her there so everyone thinks a car pulled in there. It's the first thing anyone would think. So the police, neighbors, etc, are looking for a car on BSR on Sunday afternoon when in fact there was never a car on BSR to look for at all.

Just a theory.

Good points! Yes they are looking for tips to do with a car, but no evidence provided yet of a car used in the crime.