Madeleine McCann: German prisoner identified as suspect - #23

[mrjitty]

The recent documentaries still mention that CB “ confessed “ in a German bar in 2017 , but as discussed here previously , are reports CB “ confessed “ involvement in 2008 at Orgiva and in 2017 HB contacted police about that 2008 event .
Maybe CB said something in 2008 and 2017..? Not too clear..

I agree - this appears to be very unclear.

Maybe these are different events? We've seen reporting that he discussed the MM case on multiple occasions - e.g at his german kiosk? and in a bar when it came on TV

But given he lived in the PdL area at the time of abduction - i don't read too much in to that of itself.

 

[Sharkbite]

Seeing as CB was known to frequent the Lagos bar scene I thought that this list of the 'in' bars in 2007 could be useful if anyone is sleuthing them on FB, Myspace, Waybackmachine ect.

Three Monkeys
Casa Rosa
Stones Bar
Rosko's
Eddie's Bar
Redeye Bar
Zanzibar
Whyte's Bar
Joe's Garage - Known hangout of the OC club nannies.
The Jam
Bom Vivant
Mullens
Shaker Bar
Lounge
Inside Out
The Old Tavern
Bahia Beach Bar
Grande Café
Pheonix
Hideaway

The list is from this site, created Dec. 2007
Bars Lagos Portugal: Bars in Lagos Portugal

These 3 I've added myself.
Taberna Da Lagos - CB's old workplace
Metro Bar - The bar where CB beat his former girlfriend NYE 2004/5
Lazy Jack's - Had a bartender named Chris in 2007

 

[misty48]

Apologies for going off at a tangent here but can anyone tell me what prompted the German police raid on CB's Braunschweig apartment in 2014 during which the footage of him abusing his (ex) girlfriend's daughter was found?

 

[SuperdadV8]

Apologies for going off at a tangent here but can anyone tell me what prompted the German police raid on CB's Braunschweig apartment in 2014 during which the footage of him abusing his (ex) girlfriend's daughter was found?

Some reports claimed, the origin has been a case of domestic violence. Some other reports stated, that CB became violent, when one of his girlfriends found child *advertiser censored* on his computer. Maybe both is related and the police seized the hardware due to this?!

 

[Sharkbite]

Apologies for going off at a tangent here but can anyone tell me what prompted the German police raid on CB's Braunschweig apartment in 2014 during which the footage of him abusing his (ex) girlfriend's daughter was found?

Some reports claimed, the origin has been a case of domestic violence. Some other reports stated, that CB became violent, when one of his girlfriends found child *advertiser censored* on his computer. Maybe both is related and the police seized the hardware due to this?!

There was also this from page#16
SuperdadV8 said: ↑
In a federal investigation that included the whole federal republic of germany one year later, child *advertiser censored* and pictures of children at portugese playgrounds have been found on his computer. His kiosk-friends didn't know about that at the time.

There was no exact date given for this raid but it is believed to have been late 2014, early 2015

 

[misty48]

There was also this from page#16
SuperdadV8 said: ↑
In a federal investigation that included the whole federal republic of germany one year later, child *advertiser censored* and pictures of children at portugese playgrounds have been found on his computer. His kiosk-friends didn't know about that at the time.

There was no exact date given for this raid but it is believed to have been late 2014, early 2015

TY.

 

[Sharkbite]

DBM

 

[Anxala]

At best, the phone evidence is going to place him in PdL

There has been such bad reporting on this - that it places him "at the crime scene". There is simply no way for that to be true - given the time of the call. But all these pieces of circumstantial evidence add up

Oh I agree. I don't see how it helps at all unless CB has claimed to be nowhere near PdL on that evening at the time of the call.

It's all a bit moot anyway since the caller, as far as we're aware, hasn't come forward. And isn't likely to.

 

[Lilly b]

I'm going to admit that I did change a little bit my mind over CB/MM and I do want to trust that HCW and BKA do have solid indications that CB is involved on MM case now. With that in mind I'm going to state that I do think that BKA might have way more than just one "secret evidence" that CB did kill/took MM.

I think that what BKA do have is several pieces of secret evidences / information that they are not sharing with the public and all of those pieces together make the "puzzle" complete, meaning that individual each piece might not mean much but all together they can lead CB to jail for the MM crime. Goes without saying that i might be completly wrong but i do want to trust BKA. I don't think they would go public with something like this if they didn't had something relevant that could indeed indicate that CB is involved on MM case.

Could be more that they aren't allowed to say, could jepodise the case

 

[Lilly b]

Some information relating to the badge on the red swimming costume found in Brückner’s Winnebago.
https://www.german-way.com/swimming-in-germany/

In the discovery programme, they was mentioned, but again they couldn't say if anyone has come forward or not

 

[Trivento]

Was intrigued to see in Discovery doc HCW response to query about “ blue building allotment “ not being searched.
He felt “ low probability of anything interesting there as someone else would probably have reported it by now “ .
Maybe fair enough , but if you consider the millions of £/€'s spent on this case so far and considerable time / effort put in across the globe , over many years , I still find it curious that they wouldn’t search at a place that must be just up the road from Braunschweig Police HQ ?!
CB used it for a time and it’s reported the owner would be happy for a search .
Doesn’t seem to match the obvious attention to detail that the police are making otherwise .

 

[Sharkbite]

Was intrigued to see in Discovery doc HCW response to query about “ blue building allotment “ not being searched.
He felt “ low probability of anything interesting there as someone else would probably have reported it by now “ .
Maybe fair enough , but if you consider the millions of £/€'s spent on this case so far and considerable time / effort put in across the globe , over many years , I still find it curious that they wouldn’t search at a place that must be just up the road from Braunschweig Police HQ ?!
CB used it for a time and it’s reported the owner would be happy for a search .
Doesn’t seem to match the obvious attention to detail that the police are making otherwise .

However as discussed earlier, it was reported in the German press in 2016 that an apartment and an allotment garden was also searched in Braunschweig in connection with the 2016 Neuwegersleben box factory search.
Maybe this was referring to a different location than the garden with the blue roofed house (Am Fullerkam) but this was where CB was known to have been staying at this time.
Großeinsatz in der Börde:Kinderporno-Razzia auf vermülltem Fabrikgelände

 

[Trivento]

However as discussed earlier, it was reported in the German press in 2016 that an apartment and an allotment garden was also searched in Braunschweig in connection with the 2016 Neuwegersleben box factory search.
Maybe this was referring to a different location than the garden with the blue roofed house (Am Fullerkam) but this was where CB was known to have been staying at this time.
Großeinsatz in der Börde:Kinderporno-Razzia auf vermülltem Fabrikgelände

German police asked to search a second allotment rented by Madeleine McCann suspect

Attached another article talking about this place..
So the question becomes is the Bild article correct ?..and if so why do the parties involved not seem to know about the search..?
Unless it was a very superficial search that seems to have gone relatively unnoticed..? Was it done at the correct place..? Did they find something at correct place that HCW is keeping secret by denying a search..?
Well...hopefully someone knows the real story and that something possibly important is not being overlooked .

 

[mrjitty]

Oh I agree. I don't see how it helps at all unless CB has claimed to be nowhere near PdL on that evening at the time of the call.

It's all a bit moot anyway since the caller, as far as we're aware, hasn't come forward. And isn't likely to.

It was interesting looking back into some of the detail of the first weeks of the case, on a random whim, how much the investigation was derailed by the Murat fiasco - PJ believed they had their man - yet the "evidence" against him was basically that he was identified by multiple members of the Tapas group ....

This plus the media fiasco at the time (think of the global search) tends to be left out of the narrative.

Yet all of it was a 100% distraction for PJ if CB is guilty.

 

[Sharkbite]

German police asked to search a second allotment rented by Madeleine McCann suspect

Attached another article talking about this place..
So the question becomes is the Bild article correct ?..and if so why do the parties involved not seem to know about the search..?
Unless it was a very superficial search that seems to have gone relatively unnoticed..? Was it done at the correct place..? Did they find something at correct place that HCW is keeping secret by denying a search..?
Well...hopefully someone knows the real story and that something possibly important is not being overlooked .

Judging by the historical Google Earth images and the amount of digging/landscaping that has gone on over the years at this property, plus the fact that it has been reported that CB was digging out/expanding the basement here and according to CB's friend Bjorn R. that he wanted to build a dungeon ala Josef Fritzl, one would think it would be an obvious place to search.

Although not connected to Fritzl the cases have similarities and this newspaper was found at the Neuwegersleben site.


Location - Am Füllerkamp
Google Maps

 

[Lilly b]

Judging by the historical Google Earth images and the amount of digging/landscaping that has gone on over the years at this property, plus the fact that it has been reported that CB was digging out/expanding the basement here and according to CB's friend Bjorn R. that he wanted to build a dungeon ala Josef Fritzl, one would think it would be an obvious place to search.

Although not connected to Fritzl the cases have similarities and this newspaper was found at the Neuwegersleben site.
View attachment 286890

Location - Am Füllerkamp
Google Maps

That's a bit spooky

 

[Chiatos]

Judging by the historical Google Earth images and the amount of digging/landscaping that has gone on over the years at this property, plus the fact that it has been reported that CB was digging out/expanding the basement here and according to CB's friend Bjorn R. that he wanted to build a dungeon ala Josef Fritzl, one would think it would be an obvious place to search.

Although not connected to Fritzl the cases have similarities and this newspaper was found at the Neuwegersleben site.
View attachment 286890

Location - Am Füllerkamp
Google Maps

Another newspaper item found in Neuwegersleben concerned the murder of a German IT-expert in January 2012.
He was captured, gagged, beaten up and killed by five Lithuanians. Three of them were brothers.

From Sexta9: Sexta às 9 - RTP on Facebook Watch

The IT-expert who's name was Ulf, was on his way to his parents. He had sold all his belongings and was bringing the left-overs to his parents' house as he was planning to take off to Cambodia.
Ulf M. hat einen straffen Zeitplan: Hoch in den Norden, Ankunft später Abend. Am nächsten Tag Behördengänge in Trittau, Rückgabe des Mietwagens in Hamburg-Bergedorf, mit dem Zug zurück nach München. Dort Wohnungsübergabe und Abschiedsfeier mit Freunden. Anschließend wieder hoch nach Trittau, von Hamburg aus will er nach Kambodscha fliegen, Asien erkunden, ein Jahr Auszeit vom Alltag nehmen.
Raubmord an Ulf M.: Tod auf dem Heimweg

Must all be a coincidence though ..... probably unrelated ....

 

[peanutJelly]

It was interesting looking back into some of the detail of the first weeks of the case, on a random whim, how much the investigation was derailed by the Murat fiasco - PJ believed they had their man - yet the "evidence" against him was basically that he was identified by multiple members of the Tapas group ....

This plus the media fiasco at the time (think of the global search) tends to be left out of the narrative.

Yet all of it was a 100% distraction for PJ if CB is guilty.

I believe it was journalist Lori Campbell who first brought RM to the PJs attention

Sunday Mirror journalist covering Maddy disappearance reports 'suspicious' man to police - Press Gazette

 

[mrjitty]

I believe it was journalist Lori Campbell who first brought RM to the PJs attention

Sunday Mirror journalist covering Maddy disappearance reports 'suspicious' man to police - Press Gazette

Yes

But we also know he was positively identified by JT as "tannerman" in a PJ organised walkby and also was seen loitering around by 3 of the Tapas group. How did this happen?

Three members of the Tapas Seven—FP, ROB and RO—said they had seen Murat outside apartment 5A shortly after the disappearance, as did an Ocean Club nanny and two British holidaymakers. This would not have been surprising considering how close Murat lived to 5A, but he and his mother said he had been at home all evening

FP, ROB and RO were even brought back to portugal when RM was made an arguido

 

[peanutJelly]

Yes

But we also know he was positively identified by JT as "tannerman" in a PJ organised walkby and also was seen loitering around by 3 of the Tapas group. How did this happen?



FP, ROB and RO were even brought back to portugal when RM was made an arguido

IMO this could have been down to the power of suggestions, once the PJ starting asking questions about him his actions seemed suspicious to them. JT didn’t identify him from seeing him around, she was asked if it could have been him.