Madeleine McCann: German Prisoner Identified as Suspect, #33

[Malleux]

Huntley admitted contact with the girls and claimed they were killed “accidentally“. Of course if CB admitted contact with Madeleine then that would put a different complexion on things, however in the absence of any other evidence linking him directly he could always claim to have downloaded the video or been sold/given it by a.n. other and the prosecution would need concrete evidence that he’d actually filmed it himself.

Another example (again) is the Cannan/Lamplugh case. There was quite a lot of circumstantial evidence against him and her DNA was even found in a car that Cannan had been using at the time (as well as his DNA). But because the CPS were unable to prove the pair had been in the car at the same time as one another, they had to drop the case .

 

[Mex]

The dogs walked around the complex and all ended at carpark opposite the reception entrance

I think the dog handlers carried out these difficult searches in the most difficult circumstances and did indeed raise some pertinent issues which I don’t think were taken advantage of as perhaps they should have been.



However, in spite of it not being a normal situation for tracking, it could be attempted, whilst the operation should be carried out as quickly as possible and not directed towards one but to all the apartments in the resort, it being appropriate for the handler not to know which apartment was chosen, so as not the be conditioned. PJ Files
P.J. POLICE FILES: G.N.R SNIFFER DOGS REPORTS (mccannpjfiles.co.uk)



Rex was given clothes to sniff and marked the McCann apartment with a change in behaviour and some intensity.
Rex also marked apartment 5J where he reacted by becoming “more agitated than before as if there were a very strong strange odour there.”

This method of search was repeated using the dog Zarus which reacted as Rex had done by showing the same behaviour in the same places Rex had.



However, in spite of it not being a normal situation for tracking, it could be attempted, whilst the operation should be carried out as quickly as possible and not directed towards one but to all the apartments in the resort, it being appropriate for the handler not to know which apartment was chosen, so as not the be conditioned. PJ Files
P.J. POLICE FILES: G.N.R SNIFFER DOGS REPORTS (mccannpjfiles.co.uk)




On 8th May during the morning four teams returned to search all the areas around Vila, following some indications from local people who had frequently gone to the GNR Command post saying they had seen something suspicious related to the disappearance but no sign of her presence was ever found. PJ Files
P.J. POLICE FILES: G.N.R SNIFFER DOGS REPORTS (mccannpjfiles.co.uk)

One wonders who these locals were and if the information they gave was ever reported in the police files as we know them.

 

[Janosch]

It may be a difference between "manta" in Portuguese and "manta" in Spanish, the latter means "blanket".

 

[G-Unit]

It sounds like there were two different GNR dog searches according to the files. One that took place in the early hours using MM's blanket which finished around 7am. Then another around 11pm on the 4th using her bath towel.

There were. Initially some local dog handlers came, but specialist dogs came later from near Lisbon. Although the first dogs were given the pink blanket and the second dogs were given a bath towel both sets of dogs followed the same route. Left from the front door of 5A towards Block 4, down between Blocks 4 and 5 to the alley between the blocks and the swimming pool complex and stopping at the car park behind Block 6. One dog went and sniffed at the entrance to the swimming pool complex (secondary reception)

 

[Consider Dudley]

There were. Initially some local dog handlers came, but specialist dogs came later from near Lisbon. Although the first dogs were given the pink blanket and the second dogs were given a bath towel both sets of dogs followed the same route. Left from the front door of 5A towards Block 4, down between Blocks 4 and 5 to the alley between the blocks and the swimming pool complex and stopping at the car park behind Block 6. One dog went and sniffed at the entrance to the swimming pool complex (secondary reception)

Does this mean we can rule out Smithman as the abductor?

 

[G-Unit]

Does this mean we can rule out Smithman as the abductor?

Judging by the direction, it would seem so. However. The first dog wasn't a trained tracking dog, although it was given the best source of scent; the pink blanket. A bath towel could have been used by more than one person in my opinion. Was it possible that the specially trained dogs followed the path taken by the first dog? I don't know, but I don't see the dog's findings as definitive.

What does seem clear is that the blanket didn't disappear until at least 3-4 hours after MM did.

 

[Consider Dudley]

You’d have to hope that specially trained dogs wouldn’t simply follow the trail of another dog. I wonder what the police did with the pink blanket once they’d finished with it?

 

[G-Unit]

You’d have to hope that specially trained dogs wouldn’t simply follow the trail of another dog. I wonder what the police did with the pink blanket once they’d finished with it?

I would have hoped not, but I find it difficult to make sense of the route. Parking in the car park behind Block 6 was extremely risky and was opposite the entrance to the Tapas complex where not just the T9 were entering and exiting regularly, but others were too. Going left from 5A there were the Block 5 and Block 4 car parks and other places to park a car too.

 

[Consider Dudley]

I would have hoped not, but I find it difficult to make sense of the route. Parking in the car park behind Block 6 was extremely risky and was opposite the entrance to the Tapas complex where not just the T9 were entering and exiting regularly, but others were too. Going left from 5A there were the Block 5 and Block 4 car parks and other places to park a car too.

Carrying an unconcealed abducted child (dead or alive) through the centre of town whilst making no effort to disguise onself is similarly risky imo

 

[Denis R Tandib]

Carrying an unconcealed abducted child (dead or alive) through the centre of town whilst making no effort to disguise onself is similarly risky imo

It only works in a burglary with opportunistic abduction scenario. In this scenario the perp was incredibly lucky not to have been seen. It doesn’t fit the planning MO of DM and possibly HB. IMO, this is an unlikely scenario but possible.

Regarding the GNR dogs. Let’s remember that MM had been at the OC all week. How could any dog detect the most recent scent above all the others MM had left while on holiday. If the dogs had tracked her scent to a different location then it may have been useful but given they tracked it to the location she was staying at, how can it be useful?

 

[G-Unit]

It only works in a burglary with opportunistic abduction scenario. In this scenario the perp was incredibly lucky not to have been seen. It doesn’t fit the planning MO of DM and possibly HB. IMO, this is an unlikely scenario but possible.

Regarding the GNR dogs. Let’s remember that MM had been at the OC all week. How could any dog detect the most recent scent above all the others MM had left while on holiday. If the dogs had tracked her scent to a different location then it may have been useful but given they tracked it to the location she was staying at, how can it be useful?

She crossed that car park every day at least 4 times going to and from the kid's club. She never used the alleyway, although her father said the three children ran away down there once 'between Monday and Wednesday'. She turned right after leaving 5A far more times than she turned left during those days I would have thought.

 

[RichardKimble]

Another example (again) is the Cannan/Lamplugh case. There was quite a lot of circumstantial evidence against him and her DNA was even found in a car that Cannan had been using at the time (as well as his DNA). But because the CPS were unable to prove the pair had been in the car at the same time as one another, they had to drop the case .

Bit of misinformation there, not by you I'll add, head over to the lamplugh thread and read back through to see where that came from.

 

[Consider Dudley]

It only works in a burglary with opportunistic abduction scenario. In this scenario the perp was incredibly lucky not to have been seen. It doesn’t fit the planning MO of DM and possibly HB. IMO, this is an unlikely scenario but possible.

Regarding the GNR dogs. Let’s remember that MM had been at the OC all week. How could any dog detect the most recent scent above all the others MM had left while on holiday. If the dogs had tracked her scent to a different location then it may have been useful but given they tracked it to the location she was staying at, how can it be useful?

Who are DM and HB?

 

[Consider Dudley]

It only works in a burglary with opportunistic abduction scenario. In this scenario the perp was incredibly lucky not to have been seen. It doesn’t fit the planning MO of DM and possibly HB. IMO, this is an unlikely scenario but possible.

Regarding the GNR dogs. Let’s remember that MM had been at the OC all week. How could any dog detect the most recent scent above all the others MM had left while on holiday. If the dogs had tracked her scent to a different location then it may have been useful but given they tracked it to the location she was staying at, how can it be useful?

The interesting thing about the tracker dogs (to me anyway) is the point up to where they tracked the scent away from 5a. Why not all the way to the kids club or another known destination if they were following an old scent?

 

[Hygge]

Who are DM and HB?

The American lady who was raped and the Irish woman CB is accused of raping

 

[Lyall0814]

Who are DM and HB?

DM is the rape conviction CB is currently serving sentence for. HB is the rape charge he faces, that was apparently about to come to trial until the jurisdiction issue arose a couple of weeks ago. See Niner's post on page 1 of Thread 32.

Madeleine McCann: German Prisoner Identified as Suspect #32

 

[mrjitty]

It only works in a burglary with opportunistic abduction scenario. In this scenario the perp was incredibly lucky not to have been seen. It doesn’t fit the planning MO of DM and possibly HB. IMO, this is an unlikely scenario but possible.

This is why i don't buy into the 'MO' idea, and the claim by HCW that a conviction in the HB case helps with the MM case.

The expert burglar theory fits better - somehow it was opportunistic or maybe a burglary gone wrong. After all, he didn't kill any of his other victims as far as we know - so why now?

 

[Mex]

Does this mean we can rule out Smithman as the abductor?

My opinion is that Smithman can be ruled out based on the following,
(a) his existence was not reported until a fortnight after the event

16 May 2007
Martin Smith reports his sighting to the Portuguese Police
Martin Smith says that he gets a telephone call from his son, Peter. He says: “We were home two weeks [actually 13 days] when my son rang up and asked was he dreaming or did we meet a man carrying a child the night Madeleine was taken. We all remembered that we had the same recollection. I felt we should report it to the police".

At this time, no information about the possible sighting by Jane Tanner has yet been announced.

Martin Smith claimed in one interview that it was his son, Peter, who prompted him to call the Portuguese police about the family’s claimed ‘sighting’ of a man carrying a child. He said: “We were home two weeks when my son rang up and asked was he dreaming or did we meet a man carrying a child the night Madeleine was taken. We all remembered that we had the same recollection. I felt we should report it to the police".

26 May 2007
The Portuguese Police, having very few leads, ask Martin Smith and his two children Peter and *advertiser censored**** to comes to Portimao to make a statement. They do so secretly on 26 May

Martin Smith – A Timeline from 3 May 2007 onwards

Martin Smith – A Timeline from 3 May 2007 onwards 3 May 2007 7pm-9pm approx: The Smiths say they were dining in Dolphins Restaurant, Pra...

whathappenedtomadeleinemccann.blogspot.com

(b) I don't see any definitive confirmation from anyone not in the family party about a large family out for a meal followed by drinks in a bar on the way home. The staff on duty that night did not remember them and I think the till receipts in the PJ files for Kelly's bar are ambiguous.
12 Processos Vol XII Pages 3276 to 3280

P.J. POLICE FILES: MARTIN SMITH & FAMILY STATEMENTS

 

[Tekno]

Who are DM and HB?

Diana Menkes and Hazel Behan.

 

[Tekno]

Who are DM and HB?

Diana Menkes and Hazel Behan.