Madeleine McCann: German Prisoner Identified as Suspect, #35

[Malleux]

Maybe the gun and video camera weren't actually disposed of and returned to CB? Report of CB scaring the residents of Foral by carrying a gun back in 2007 is here
Christian Brueckner 'terrorised residents of Portuguese village
How many crooks would throw away goods they could sell on?

Well I suppose it's possible but I mentioned earlier about how "facts" can become distorted through assumption or speculation and IMO I think this article could well be an example of that. The headline makes the claim the investigators were looking for the gun and camera but when you read down to what their source actually says, they don't claim anything that even suggests that:


A source close to the investigation told MailOnline:'Both men have told the BKA (German investigation police) they broke into Brueckner's home.

'They had all been part of a network of petty criminals in the Algarve back in the early 2000s around the time Madeleine went missing but then fell out.

'Seyferth has told police that he and Busching found a video camera and a gun at the house after they broke in.

'When the video camera was played that said it showed a masked man carrying out a sex attack on a woman and the voice they heard was Brueckner's.

'Seyferth said a gun was also found and that after finding the video camera they panicked, drove off and later threw both items in the lake.

'Seyferth has told investigators the material on the video tape was evil and if this can be found will be vital to building a case against Brueckner.

'Now another witness has come forward to confirm the story of the first two men and this has prompted intensification of the investigation.'


So what the "source" appears to be saying is the BKA now appear to have a third witness who has corroborated elements of MS and HB's story. And it's perhaps this same person who has also given them (separate) information that led to the searches in Arade, but I highly doubt it's anything to do with looking for the camera there IMO. This seems more like the Mail putting 2 and 2 together and getting 5.

 

[misty48]

Well I suppose it's possible but I mentioned earlier about how "facts" can become distorted through assumption or speculation and IMO I think this article could well be an example of that. The headline makes the claim the investigators were looking for the gun and camera but when you read down to what their source actually says, they don't claim anything that even suggests that:


A source close to the investigation told MailOnline:'Both men have told the BKA (German investigation police) they broke into Brueckner's home.

'They had all been part of a network of petty criminals in the Algarve back in the early 2000s around the time Madeleine went missing but then fell out.

'Seyferth has told police that he and Busching found a video camera and a gun at the house after they broke in.

'When the video camera was played that said it showed a masked man carrying out a sex attack on a woman and the voice they heard was Brueckner's.

'Seyferth said a gun was also found and that after finding the video camera they panicked, drove off and later threw both items in the lake.

'Seyferth has told investigators the material on the video tape was evil and if this can be found will be vital to building a case against Brueckner.

'Now another witness has come forward to confirm the story of the first two men and this has prompted intensification of the investigation.'


So what the "source" appears to be saying is the BKA now appear to have a third witness who has corroborated elements of MS and HB's story. And it's perhaps this same person who has also given them (separate) information that led to the searches in Arade, but I highly doubt it's anything to do with looking for the camera there IMO. This seems more like the Mail putting 2 and 2 together and getting 5.

CB was seen in Foral with a gun in 2007 - that post-dates any disposal by MS/HB in 2006. A video camera was stolen from one of the OC apartments in 2007 before Madeleine disappeared. Different gun, different camera, confused journalists? Don't know - just speculation but searching for those items makes sense.

 

[Malleux]

I see the Mirror are already citing the Mail's story on the camcorder and gun. There is a statement from the PJ in the article too though:


The force's full release reads: "Following the statement of May 22, 2023, the Judiciary Police informs that the steps requested by the German authorities, through a request for international cooperation, have been fulfilled, which resulted in the collection of some material that will be subject to the competent expertise. The operation was coordinated by the Judiciary Police, which involved investigators, criminal experts and security personnel.

"The works had the participation of the German authorities (BKA) and were attended by British authorities (MPS).

"It also had the collaboration of the Faro Command of the National Republican Guard in various aspects, as well as the Regional Command of Emergency and Civil Protection of the Algarve and the Municipality of Silves, with regard to the logistics necessary for the development of the works.

"Safeguarding the interests of the investigation still underway in Portugal, the collected material will be delivered to the German authorities."

Madeleine McCann cops release new update as reservoir search called off

Investigators collected "some material" during the three-day search for Madeleine McCann at the Barragem do Arade in Portugal and these findings will now be analysed

www.mirror.co.uk

 

[Pixie Child]

Maybe the gun and video camera weren't actually disposed of and returned to CB? Report of CB scaring the residents of Foral by carrying a gun back in 2007 is here
Christian Brueckner 'terrorised residents of Portuguese village
How many crooks would throw away goods they could sell on?

I was just reading another DM article with the same info. Lia Silva said he was ‘an ugly man who always wore a black leather jacket’.

Owner of villa where McCann suspect lived tells police to search area

EXCLUSIVE: Lia Silva said she would fully cooperate with British and Portuguese police if they suspected the toddler's body could be buried somewhere on her land.

www.dailymail.co.uk

 

[RichardKimble]

The point of searching for a random gun would be? un less CB had used it and are looking to match ballistics , no reports of shootings are there ?

 

[Lyall0814]

Some comments from HCW in the article:

Meanwhile German proscutor Hans Christian Wolters told MailOnline:'We will see how successful we were after the search is complete.

'If necessary, we will then issue a short press release in the coming week. But that also depends on the result of the action.

'If we don't find anything, we will certainly tell you quickly.. If there were any finds, this would probably not be possible.'

Expert spin from HCW there. We'd expect nothing less than the best from him.

 

[SuperdadV8]

Something of interest must have been found!

No need to take pictures, especially wearing gloves, if there was nothing that was worth of being pictured IMHO....

 

[Anxala]

Expert spin from HCW there. We'd expect nothing less than the best from him.

I just wonder why he continues to do this ridiculous tabloid-pleasing?

All he has to say is that the search is now complete and the investigation continues. The end.

Always with this 'We don't know what we've found but it might be something or maybe it might not be something but we'll tell you if it's nothing but we won't tell you if it's something...'

Exhausting.

 

[Mex]

But that is for abduction, alibi for murder?

At this stage of proceedings I don't know if abduction and murder are sides of the same coin. I rather think they may be and the same perpetrator was responsible for both.

At the moment an alibi for murder would be an irrelevance because we don't know the time and place. But we do know the place and the approximate time of MM's disappearance.

Which may indicate why some insist there was no abduction.
My opinion

 

[frank-cole]

Something of interest must have been found!

No need to take pictures, especially wearing gloves, if there was nothing that was worth of being pictured IMHO....

View attachment 424578

Im starting to think that this may be a first step in a process. Perhaps the job was to look for any traces, collect samples & run them back for testing. Instead of digging the entire site they look to see if there are traces & if there are they come back & lockdown the area & dig it to pieces.

Guns, camera, OG on standby to call the McCann’s may all be speculation that made its way to the press.

IMO the methods they used weren’t indicative of looking for remains. No ground penetrating radar, no diggers & no major deforestation. Im starting to think this was about finding samples & then initiating a full search if anything was found

 

[Malleux]

I just wonder why he continues to do this ridiculous tabloid-pleasing?

All he has to say is that the search is now complete and the investigation continues. The end.

Always with this 'we don't know what we've found but it might be something or maybe it might not be something but we'll tell you if it's nothing but we won't tell you if it's something...'

Exhausting.

Part of the job of a media spokesman is to "fill the void". The media will print any wild speculation they fancy so it is often necessary to provide enough information to "please" them in order to avoid the tabloids filling the void (the thirst for news in a case with high public appeal) themselves, with even worse speculations. Saying nothing and no comment to everything isn't the answer to managing public relations.

I know many people have issues with a lot of things HCW has said or done and I'm not defending him here, but it just seems pointless to go over the topic endlessly, critiquing every thing he says, every time he talks. The thread is meant to be about CB, not the media spokesman for the investigation. There's actually something going on in the investigation to discuss for a change. JMO.

 

[Lyall0814]

Part of the job of a media spokesman is to "fill the void". The media will print any wild speculation they fancy so it is often necessary to provide enough information to "please" them in order to avoid the tabloids filling the void (the thirst for news in a case with high public appeal) themselves, with even worse speculations. Saying nothing and no comment to everything isn't the answer to managing public relations.

I know many people have issues with a lot of things HCW has said or done and I'm not defending him here, but it just seems pointless to go over the topic endlessly, critiquing every thing he says, every time he talks. The thread is meant to be about CB, not the media spokesman for the investigation. There's actually something going on in the investigation to discuss for a change. JMO.

Some people might say until we actually know anything for certain evidence-wise HCW's choice of words over the years is all we can talk about.

 

[Anxala]

Part of the job of a media spokesman is to "fill the void". The media will print any wild speculation they fancy so it is often necessary to provide enough information to "please" them in order to avoid the tabloids filling the void (the thirst for news in a case with high public appeal) themselves, with even worse speculations. Saying nothing and no comment to everything isn't the answer to managing public relations.

I know many people have issues with a lot of things HCW has said or done and I'm not defending him here, but it just seems pointless to go over the topic endlessly, critiquing every thing he says, every time he talks. The thread is meant to be about CB, not the media spokesman for the investigation. There's actually something going on in the investigation to discuss for a change. JMO.

There is filling the void and there is doing what HCW has done from the off, which is gone out of his way to give interviews and statements to sources that he knows are going to milk and rinse them for every last bit of sensation, not to mention misinterpretation, they can manufacture out of them for clicks. That's on him, not me. And it's why he's had to spend so much time over the years back-tracking and trying to correct tabloid claims.

And no one is suggesting that HCW should say nothing, just that a more guarded, measured and less people-pleasing approach would have stood him in so much better stead and made him less of the target for scrutiny/criticism that he's become over the 3 years since he made his claim. All his own doing.

I'll continue to criticise HCW where I see fit. If you have an issue with that, fine, but HCW is as much the subject of this thread as CB is since HCW is the one accusing him of abducting and murdering MM. With, to date, nothing to back up that accusation.

 

[dotr]

Madeleine McCann: Portugal reservoir search ends after three days

Material recovered from the area 30 miles from where Madeleine went missing will be analysed, say police.

www.bbc.com

''All the work carried out around the reservoir was on a peninsula jutting out into the Arade dam from its Western shore - 31 miles (50km) from where Madeleine went missing in Praia da Luz 16 years ago.
Officers were seen using rakes and hoes, strimmers and a small excavator to clear paths through the scrub on a nearby slope - the sound of machinery at work audible in the remote area.
Police also dug a number of smaller holes, leaving huge piles of soil and broken rock next to the 160 sq ft (14 sq m) excavation area.
The spit of land has a small car park on it, which is often used as an unofficial campsite.
Brueckner, a 45-year-old German national, is thought to have stayed there often in his Volkswagen T3 camper van.

He is also known to have visited the picturesque spot around the time Madeleine, who would now be 20, went missing.
White tents were set up on the site and sniffer dogs were used. However, no divers were seen going under the water.''

 

[SuperdadV8]

Madeleine McCann: Portugal reservoir search ends after three days

Material recovered from the area 30 miles from where Madeleine went missing will be analysed, say police.

www.bbc.com

View attachment 424590
''All the work carried out around the reservoir was on a peninsula jutting out into the Arade dam from its Western shore - 31 miles (50km) from where Madeleine went missing in Praia da Luz 16 years ago.
Officers were seen using rakes and hoes, strimmers and a small excavator to clear paths through the scrub on a nearby slope - the sound of machinery at work audible in the remote area.
Police also dug a number of smaller holes, leaving huge piles of soil and broken rock next to the 160 sq ft (14 sq m) excavation area.
The spit of land has a small car park on it, which is often used as an unofficial campsite.
Brueckner, a 45-year-old German national, is thought to have stayed there often in his Volkswagen T3 camper van.

He is also known to have visited the picturesque spot around the time Madeleine, who would now be 20, went missing.
White tents were set up on the site and sniffer dogs were used. However, no divers were seen going under the water.''

Sounds like, as if they dug more than just two or three holes. Maybe the most interesting things might have happened, not in straight focus of the livestream.

 

[C.greek]

"One 10 metre squared patch of land appeared to have been the focus of the investigation. The slope of the bank had been cleared of wood and cut into. A series of deep pot holes had been scoured into the ground and soil samples had evidently been removed."

Madeleine McCann: material found in Portugal search sent for analysis

Police spent three days scouring reservoir after request by German authorities hoping to prove case against convicted rapist

theguardian.com

Soil samples from a limited area. This indicates a very precise tip off and the fact they have dug holes would tell me the sniffer dogs found something of interest there at these precise spots. Maybe the idea of burning remains or clothes and digging them afterwards is not so off? Jmo

 

[Mex]

Im starting to think that this may be a first step in a process. Perhaps the job was to look for any traces, collect samples & run them back for testing. Instead of digging the entire site they look to see if there are traces & if there are they come back & lockdown the area & dig it to pieces.

Guns, camera, OG on standby to call the McCann’s may all be speculation that made its way to the press.

IMO the methods they used weren’t indicative of looking for remains. No ground penetrating radar, no diggers & no major deforestation. Im starting to think this was about finding samples & then initiating a full search if anything was found

I never thought that one through to where you have taken it and I don't think there could be any argument with your logic.

Explains why two days was deemed sufficient if they expect they may be back on site when tests are complete.

 

[SuperdadV8]

"One 10 metre squared patch of land appeared to have been the focus of the investigation. The slope of the bank had been cleared of wood and cut into. A series of deep pot holes had been scoured into the ground and soil samples had evidently been removed."

Madeleine McCann: material found in Portugal search sent for analysis

Police spent three days scouring reservoir after request by German authorities hoping to prove case against convicted rapist

theguardian.com

Soil samples from a limited area. This indicates a very precise tip off and the fact they have dug holes would tell me the sniffer dogs found something of interest there at these precise spots. Maybe the idea of burning remains or clothes and digging them afterwards is not so off? Jmo

The position of the pictured stones looks kind of interesting to me.

 

[frank-cole]

The position of the pictured stones looks kind of interesting to me.

My worry is why on Earth would they allow the scene to be accessible!

 

[C.greek]

The position of the pictured stones looks kind of interesting to me.

Good spotting These are clean stones (no soil on them). Could they have been some kind of marker??