Madeleine McCann: German Prisoner Identified as Suspect, #37

[Lyall0814]

Is there a nice way of saying, "We've investigated all the evidence available to us and it indicates that we suspect you of murder".
I really don't know where the notion comes from that out of all suspects in custody in Germany awaiting trial, this is the case that people are safeguarding as a possible miscarriage of justice.

You do know. But we're certainly not allowed to discuss that here (and quite right too probably)

 

[frank-cole]

The only images they’ve referred to are rose found at the box factory. IMO, these are the images they have.

It’s listed! “eigene bilder” (own pictures) was amongst the evidence seized in 2018. In reality I can’t imagine a bunch of USB sticks and CD-Roms that didn’t contain pictures. I could create ideas to contrary, but given they’ve found ‘own pictures’, USB’s & CD-Roms, & have also collected thousands of imagines beforehand, IMO doesn’t make sense to suggest they didn’t.

 

[Lyall0814]

I have never deviated from the presumption of innocence. Nor have I deviated from the fact that guilt is decided or not as the case may be, after all the evidence for and against is heard and judged in open court.

FF has been equally as vocal in the media in defence of his client. Lyall has indicated at least one occasion in which he expressed real anger. I did not see it so I'm no judge but it does smack a little of pot and kettle.

He's not quite as furious as I had remembered but it's this interview. (some might say he's not at all furious. I think he is)

 

[Denis R Tandib]

I have never deviated from the presumption of innocence. Nor have I deviated from the fact that guilt is decided or not as the case may be, after all the evidence for and against is heard and judged in open court.

FF has been equally as vocal in the media in defence of his client. Lyall has indicated at least one occasion in which he expressed real anger. I did not see it so I'm no judge but it does smack a little of pot and kettle.

It’s completely unnecessary for FF to defend CB in the media but the location for the argument was decided by the prosecutor.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

It’s listed! “eigene bilder” (own pictures) was amongst the evidence seized in 2018. In reality I can’t imagine a bunch of USB sticks and CD-Roms that didn’t contain pictures. I could create ideas to contrary, but given they’ve found ‘own pictures’, USB’s & CD-Roms, & have also collected thousands of imagines beforehand, IMO doesn’t make sense to suggest they didn’t.

We know that they collected pictures from AB’s apartment. There are pictures of the Tiffen Allegro parked right outside it! Like I said before, it could be a meaningless coincidence.

I can imagine CB leaving a few pictures of a motor home… raping, torturing and infanticide are find more unlikely.

 

[Lyall0814]

It’s listed! “eigene bilder” (own pictures) was amongst the evidence seized in 2018. In reality I can’t imagine a bunch of USB sticks and CD-Roms that didn’t contain pictures. I could create ideas to contrary, but given they’ve found ‘own pictures’, USB’s & CD-Roms, & have also collected thousands of imagines beforehand, IMO doesn’t make sense to suggest they didn’t.

But if he hadn't been there for around ten years finding pictures doesn't necessarily mean they were his pictures. Doesn't mean any of those found were illegal either.

 

[Lilly b]

CB was in prison in 2006, obviously without that phone. Maybe he never got it back after his release.

Why would he not get it back? Don't they store your personal items until release?

 

[Lilly b]

Why would he not get it back? Don't they store your personal items until release?

Or could a friend looked after it ?

 

[Davieson]

Why would he not get it back? Don't they store your personal items until release?

You know for sure he had it in his possession when arrested ? I certainly don't

 

[RichardKimble]

Thanks to the mods for starting number 37, how about we refresh ourselves into what is known about the possible involvement of CB in Madeleine disappearance.

1:No forensics.
2:No body
3:No photograph or video of the suspect and victim together
4: phone number registered to CB used the night of 3/05/2007 prior to the reported disappearance.
Anymore.?

 

[onemoremiletogo]

A 2 parter. The first part was around funding for somebody like CB. My view on funding people like that is irrespective of whether he’s guilty or not.
The second part, I can’t imagine CB is innocent because the German’s have announced they have concrete evidence. They’d only make that statement if they were sure. If they had a jury system I’d still think the same way but would see slightly more relevance in the counter argument you’re making.

If he is innocent....
I can’t imagine CB is innocent because the German’s have announced they have concrete evidence. They’d only make that statement if they were sure.
Totally aligned with this.

Again and again, one thing is if BKA will be able or not to charge CB in relation to MM.
Another thing is if he might "still" be innocent. IMO immensely improbable.

 

[G-Unit]

Is there a nice way of saying, "We've investigated all the evidence available to us and it indicates that we suspect you of murder".
I really don't know where the notion comes from that out of all suspects in custody in Germany awaiting trial, this is the case that people are safeguarding as a possible miscarriage of justice.

I think ir's acceptable to name a suspect, but that's not what Wolters did. He announced that his suspect was guilty of murder. How many times has that happened in Germany? It is a breach of a suspect's human rights.

 

[Mex]

I think ir's acceptable to name a suspect, but that's not what Wolters did. He announced that his suspect was guilty of murder. How many times has that happened in Germany? It is a breach of a suspect's human rights.

I'm not sure you've got that example quite right G-Unit.

As far as I know in Germany it is illegal to name a suspect. Thus CB is known only by his forename and the first initial of his surname.

The presumption is that the prosecutor knows the law and has never named him. I have only ever seen HCW using the legal form of the suspect's name. So unless you can provide an instance which I have missed, if the suspect's human rights have been breached it was not by dint of him being named by the prosecutor or anyone in his office.

My opinion

 

[Niner]

This is the recent charge.

Anklageschrift wg. Vergewaltigung, sex. Missbrauchs eingegangen | Landgericht Braunschweig

2 KLs 213 Js 52790/18 (15/22)

The bracket addition (15/22) indicates, that at least two investigations had been put together. So the charge includes investigations from 2018 and some investigations from 2022.

No further info availabe for the investigation with the number 2KLs 213 JS 13865/18. It must include other possible charges, maybe it's the MM case itself. Maybe a totally different investigation.

After the allotment raid in Hannover, FF has been asked if he knows, what has been found or if there will be something to find there. As far as i remember, FF gave an answer like "Nothing in relation to MM.". Maybe some other investigations have been kept successfully under the carpet at the moment. Maybe the Hannover raid was related to the Monika Pawlak case?!

Who knows!

Thank you! I shall keep the other case # handy in my notes. It might pop up later.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

But if he hadn't been there for around ten years finding pictures doesn't necessarily mean they were his pictures. Doesn't mean any of those found were illegal either.

I am almost certain the image below is CB’s Tiffin parked outside AB’s apartment. Finding pictures like this qualify for the search documents but doesn’t add much weight to a murder charge.

 

[Mex]

It’s completely unnecessary for FF to defend CB in the media but the location for the argument was decided by the prosecutor.

I quite agree.
There is no necessity for legal cases to be conducted on MSM: which is why I have said "pot and kettle" or words to that effect.

 

[Lilly b]

You know for sure he had it in his possession when arrested ? I certainly don't

Like many many things, we don't know either way

 

[Lyall0814]

I am almost certain the image below is CB’s Tiffin parked outside AB’s apartment. Finding pictures like this qualify for the search documents but doesn’t add much weight to a murder charge.

Parked outside AB's apartment in 2018? Or 2008?

 

[Denis R Tandib]

I'm not sure you've got that example quite right G-Unit.

As far as I know in Germany it is illegal to name a suspect. Thus CB is known only by his forename and the first initial of his surname.

The presumption is that the prosecutor knows the law and has never named him. I have only ever seen HCW using the legal form of the suspect's name. So unless you can provide an instance which I have missed, if the suspect's human rights have been breached it was not by dint of him being named by the prosecutor or anyone in his office.

My opinion

Yeah, Christian B, who lived in this house, on this street, drove this car and this camper van,,, surname sounds like preuckner.

If this is German law, forgive me but it’s a touch silly if his human rights are protected by giving all his details but not his full surname.

 

[Denis R Tandib]

Parked outside AB's apartment in 2018? Or 2008?

I think 2007.