Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #13

[JerseyGirl]

Bill Nye was on CNN telling them to do this on like day 3!
Why oh why does no one listen to Bill? :facepalm:

O/T- I love Bill Nye!

Pakistan hasn't been ruled out, they just something like, "No, we don't have the plane, we wish we could come up with that idea."

 

[ilovepierre]

Granted, I only skim the headlines on this lately and I only check the thread a few times a day, but I thought the various types of communication appeared to be manually cut off--and at different times, at that. Is there new information contradicting that?

No.
The OP was asking if there would be any other way for communications to be cut that didn't involve human involvement/tampering.

Such as a mechanical failure or malfunction.

 

[CARIIS]

Yeh I'm still not sold on how the plane has flown for 7hrs after an event so catestrophic and intense that it has disabled a good deal of the communications and reporting systems, incapacited everyone on board and disabled the autopilot (sending the plane to the reported 45,000 before stalling, somehow recovering and possibly even relighting the engines (which would require someone to apply the igniters and manage the turbine spool back to satisfactory operations from a air start) and then somehow re-engage the autopilot which took the plane back to FL35 and flew it on like a ghost ship for 7hrs...

and with some sheer stroke of tragic circumstance, whatever made the atmosphere in the aircraft so toxic that life was unsupportable within what appears to be a very short period of time, possibly less than 30mins has died off to a point where the aircraft was completely airworthy like nothing had happened.



OR there was no system failures -- it was a takeover , and the climb was a result of a wrestle in the cockpit media has given the sense that the decent back to 27 was like dodging , wherein it could clearly indicate that whoever wanted to take control , knew the plane was way above it cert ceiling as far as altitude goes (its 43 for the triple 7),and was approaching stall and knew he had better dive or he would stall o OR the stall had to began.

the leveling out at 27 could mean that a skilled flyer was able to stablize and recover from a stall and you and I know that stalling an aircraft cause your exceeding limit , just in and of itself. could reslut in total destruction if the climb was not immed haulted

Only way out of a stall D I V E ! and fast!

And if you think about it falling 2.5 miles, as a result of stall in those circumstances sounds about right

 

[ILikeToBendPages]

Are there any upcoming World/World Leader/Western major events planned in the near future that anyone is aware of?

The anniversary of Osama bin laden death May 2, 2011 in Pakistan, is coming up, and Passover is April 14 -22, and there will be a blood red moon.

 

[cady]

Yes, that's very well put. Each ATC has a specific territory in which it controls traffic.

ATC's job is to organize traffic in its area. If a plane stops talking and vanishes off ATC radar, ATC can't do anything beyond keep calling for it, alerting nearby planes, and notifying the airline it has no contact.

MH-370 vanished from both Malaysian and Vietnamese ATC radar. It stopped talking.

At that point, it was up to the pilots and the pilots alone to save the plane.

Now, entirely separately, if Thai/Malaysian military radar watchers had been more alert, maybe they could have scrambled fighter jets to try to approach the wandering plane and see what was up.

The evidence released so far says each failed to do so.

Maybe they were afraid of an international "incident"

 

[ilovepierre]

So there's this new TV show called "Crisis." I have no idea what it's about as I only caught bits and pieces of the first episode. But someone remotely crashed a plane from a laptop. They changed satellite (ones on the ground) information and direction, causing the plane to be "lost" on radar. Once the satellites were positioned accordingly, a button was pushed on the laptop, and the plane's engines stopped, and it dropped out of the sky.

This isn't really out of the realm of possibility for MH370. It's an "out there" theory, but what isn't at this point?!

 

[Nymeria]

Bill Nye was on CNN telling them to do this on like day 3!
Why oh why does no one listen to Bill? :facepalm:

O/T- I love Bill Nye!

Pakistan hasn't been ruled out, they just something like, "No, we don't have the plane, we wish we could come up with that idea."

Did you mean to quote me JerseyGirl?

 

[Tiepos]

Oh, oh, I have a question!

First, let me say that I’m pretty sure I understand what the transponder does. I only sort of understand the ACARS pieces though.

Obviously it is still possible for the pilot to communication with ATC if ACARS is disabled. We know this because ACARS was disabled before the pilot sent his last voice transmission, yes?

Here is my question:

If ACARS hadn’t been disabled in some fashion - would someone have been able to tell if voice communications were also disabled, or if they were still functional, but the crew just wasn’t responding?

 

[ArianeEmory]

Oh, lordy people. Technology on TV is about as accurate/realistic as the medicine on Grey's Anatomy.

(Satellites...on the ground?)

 

[CARIIS]

Not what I am trying to ask, I know this much, but thank you.

I am asking:

What could go wrong with the plane to make that happen? Not pilots making it happen, or news saying pilots made it happen.

Its an amazing aircraft than has one of the best safety histories in the history o aviation! The notion that , that close to an airport , that whatever it was completly ran over all the reducnacy built in

the only real explaination is INTRUSION - fire no -just the size of the machine would require this like flashover or something to just overcome all the supresion stuff , crew interactins, cabin crew , and 239 people that would particpate in trying to put it out!

Intruder is the only thing imo, that as a "cohesive whole" that points to the way everything played out!

AND it could be "pilot" or "pilots"

 

[Forensics]

Growing numbers of nations are assisting Australia to search the southern ocean. Beijing has deployed five ships, three ship-bourne helicopters and three Chinese aircraft , Japan is sending two P-3 Orion search aircraft and the British warship HMS Echo is also heading to the vast region.


Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/mh370-s...trong-leads-20140322-hvlha.html#ixzz2we4KFFU2

 

[HMSHood]

I just don't buy the "lithium batteries" angle......seem to me, if that were the cause of all this it would have been such a catastrophic incident that we would all know where it happened, when it happened and it would be a sad day in history. But the families would at least KNOW and be able to grieve.

If the lithium batteries are just sitting there unplugged, than no chance for the, to go up in flames. Not sure why that was brought up.

Hopefully, the passengers will be found alive, but looks unlikely.

 

[ilovepierre]

YES! THANK YOU!

Can those things also cause an immediate diversion in flight path, before pilots can notice? Mess up the path system in some way?

If there was a fire, the pilots would divert the plane and fly to the nearest airport for an emergency landing. I don't know if any sort of malfunction would cause a pilot to not notice, though. Alarms go off when there are system failures. I also don't know if any of those things would mess up the flight path, either.

A pilot would notice some sort of malfunction and would divert the plane to attempt a landing somewhere-whether it be an airport, open land, or water.

The news is going with intentional disabling of all communications, because a pilot would/should notice technical problems and would try to make contact with someone, or to land.

 

[Holly G. Lightly]

Frankly, there's no evidence Gen. McInerney knows any more than the rest of us.

He's retired. He states he's basing his theories on rumors from unnamed contacts and sources he can't reveal. That sounds like speculation and hearsay to me.

The silence of the US government is normal for an ongoing investigation of a foreign airplane disappearing in foreign territory. It doesn't necessarily signify anything at all.

Likewise, in a situation of a possible terrorist event unfolding, Israel would have beefed up its security whether it knows extra info or not.

The plane may well be on land somewhere in unfriendly hands, but none of the afore-mentioned acts are evidence for it.

As of now, the complete mystery of MH-370's final fate endures.

Huh?

He *points out* that there is much more information than what is being released publicly, along with *pointing out* some other very interesting points. He is speculating as well, and says so, but he is a Lt General, and he does have many more contacts within the intelligence community than the average Joe. I'm saying that you don't want to toss out information just because you don't trust where it's coming from. We can't really trust much of the information we're getting. That's all.

 

[ilovepierre]

Oh, lordy people. Technology on TV is about as accurate/realistic as the medicine on Grey's Anatomy.

(Satellites...on the ground?)

Yeah, like the old fashioned satellite dishes people use to have in their yards before they were made small enough to fit on a roof. They do still have those kinds of satellites. They're ground control satellites.

 

[CARIIS]

Lets not forget its really late -- fatigue how did he sleep how many segments had he flown in the past two weeks fight with wife stress

- he repeated his altitude

just like the goodnight piece means nothing

means nothing IMO

If this had been sorry to put it like this normative accident NTSB would not make mention of a handoff that includes a nicety nor on a quite frequency repeating intentions status of flight at that point etc seems like it would just be cautious flying .......

 

[ToutCa]

As a former Navy wife whose husband sailed these very waters the USS Kidd is not the only ship in the area and honestly I believe it was pulled from the search for 2 reasons-there are other Navy assists that are better suited to this kind of search and the other has to do with Russia and the timing of redirecting the Kidd...

I think whatever happened the fact that neither Malaysia or Vietnam noticed that the plane was missing for hours is why we are still looking and chasing out tails.

Thank you for your insight on the military angle, both US and foreign. Yes, a shoot-down by someone is possible (but the 7.5 hrs in the air makes it tricky).

It's not true, however, that neither Malaysia nor Vietnam noticed the plane was missing for hours. Vietnam ATC knew it was missing right away:

1:19am: "Alright goodnight" spoken to Malaysian ATC.
1:21am: MH-370 Transponder goes off.
1:22-1:30am: Vietnam ATC attempts to reach MH-370, fails. Vietnam ATC asks nearby flight to contact MH-370.
1:30am: Nearby flight reports to Vietnam ATC MH-370 reply is only mumbling.
2:40am: Vietnam ATC notifies Malaysian Airlines it can't contact MH-370.

Vietnam ATC did take 1hr 10min to notify the airline. There was that delay.

But nothing much could have been done at that point. No one had a clue where the plane had gone. An earlier notification by Vietnam ATC would not have changed matters.

It's also normal in airplane disasters for airlines and countries to wait for announcements until a plane would have run out of fuel. The final hope is that the plane perhaps had major communication failure (radio/transponder), but may well turn up at the destination airport or another airport in its range.

 

[popsicle]

Lets not forget its really late -- fatigue - he repeated his altitude

absol just like the goodnight piece means nothing

means nothing

Earlier on CNN it was speculated the co-pilot kept repeating his alt because he wanted to increase it.... and since he didn't get clearance to do that before being switched to the next ATC, that may be why he just said "Alright, Goodnight."

 

[ilovepierre]

For some reason now, I can't quote...

But yes, the satellites on the TV show were Seti/SETI type satellites.

 

[cady]

Not what I am trying to ask, I know this much, but thank you.

I am asking:

What could go wrong with the plane to make that happen? Not pilots making it happen, or news saying pilots made it happen.

I can't post a link, but there are pilot forums {that I lurk) which DO discuss mechanical/computer possible problems. They are very technical, but informative. They seem to be as perplexed as the rest of us, and clearly, with pilot perspective, try in every way to assign the incident to plane malfunction.