Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #24

[CARIIS]

[FONT=&quot]http://www.aviationtoday.com/av/air...on-Track-for-2016-IOC_81690.html#.U3lv-yhTb6B

http://www.faa.gov/nextgen/
[/FONT]

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I was in the ocean industry for many years. That plane is crushed flat on the bottom of the ocean and will never be found. It is the force of water at depth. Sad but true.

 

[CARIIS]

A few to me, is 3 or more.

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ring ring ring ring!!

The number 20 is ringing for me!!!!

 

[CARIIS]

They are following bees electronically! Bees!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

They are following ants! Ants!

A 775,000 lb aircraft - poof!

In this day and age the MSM "presentation" to the world that there is one set of data is, IMO, ludicrous. There are so many countries that saw what happened that night . Its allies and secrets about capabilities I think!@!

This headline in and of itself indicates there is so much info out there that has nothing to do with Imersat:
Thailand gives radar data 10 days after plane lost

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KAL007 (1983) was fascinating and back then what slowly emerged in terms of what every country really knew (years later) was unreal.

30 years ago! Imagine before cell phones, internet etc. How on earth does MSM (and it is working) want the world to believe that one can find a McDonalds in India from Idaho (!) with GPS and only Inmarsat has info - that is just so incredible or to put it a more accurate way NOT credible. Just that simple!

During really neat intense thunderstorms it is neat to watch them come in. I can get them down to my street level on radar. ME, little ole dumb me , sitting here, on an old PC I can track storm down to my street. Right above my roof ! …To the second…………

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Korean_Air_Lines_Flight_007……………….

http://www.gizmag.com/honeybees-rfid-tags/30477/

http://www.nature.com/news/tracking-whole-colonies-shows-ants-make-career-moves-1.12833

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/world/missing-malaysia-airlines-plane-thailand-gives-radar-data-10-days-after-plane-lost-20140319-hvk7i.html#ixzz32KVOMFy

 

[CARIIS]

and it is scary in a way

At this point, MH370 can re-appear out of nowhere. That is a scary thought.

My gut feeling is it was in the area the oil rigger saw something. Maybe tge data is correct but opposite direction which would put it closer to Papau New Guinea? IDK.

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[margarita25]

I haven't kept up with this thread, but admire all of you for still being here.

The other day I was talking with a gentleman who is receiving his degree in Aviation Mechanics. He was in the military, and has ten years experience as an aircraft mechanic.

I asked what his thoughts were on M370. He said there are only 2 reasons an aircraft would turn around / go off course: 1) Electrical failure, or 2) Mechanical failure. He explained why the plane would not turn around in a hijack situation (something about the plane remaining on course, while engaging some sort of hijack notification). Anyway, not saying he's right, just saying what his opinion was. He also said one of 2 things likely happened to the plane. Because it was either mechanical or electrical failure, in his opinion, the pilot would have tried to make an emergency landing on water. The condition of the plane would then be dependent upon the pilot's skill, how he was able to make the water landing. Depending on how he hit the water, the plane would either have broken into a few large pieces (tail, wing, etc), or virtually disintegrated. And if it is in large pieces, it will likely never be found because it is now deep deep in the abyss of the ocean where subs can't even go.

As I said early on, all of this is way above my head. I'm just repeating what this man said.

 

[Soulmagent]

I haven't kept up with this thread, but admire all of you for still being here.

The other day I was talking with a gentleman who is receiving his degree in Aviation Mechanics. He was in the military, and has ten years experience as an aircraft mechanic.

I asked what his thoughts were on M370. He said there are only 2 reasons an aircraft would turn around / go off course: 1) Electrical failure, or 2) Mechanical failure. He explained why the plane would not turn around in a hijack situation (something about the plane remaining on course, while engaging some sort of hijack notification). Anyway, not saying he's right, just saying what his opinion was. He also said one of 2 things likely happened to the plane. Because it was either mechanical or electrical failure, in his opinion, the pilot would have tried to make an emergency landing on water. The condition of the plane would then be dependent upon the pilot's skill, how he was able to make the water landing. Depending on how he hit the water, the plane would either have broken into a few large pieces (tail, wing, etc), or virtually disintegrated. And if it is in large pieces, it will likely never be found because it is now deep deep in the abyss of the ocean where subs can't even go.

As I said early on, all of this is way above my head. I'm just repeating what this man said.

If either of those thing happened ,something would have been found.

I know other planes went missing (years before all our dishwashers were made) but stuff floats... planes dont stay intact when slamming the ocean from free fall.

Had it been on fire ,it would have crashed long before the 7 hour flight to the deepest part of ocean on the planet. JMO.

 

[CARIIS]

Cracked me up: all of you for still being here. the key word being "still"!! That is funny!

I haven't kept up with this thread, but admire all of you for still being here.

The other day I was talking with a gentleman who is receiving his degree in Aviation Mechanics. He was in the military, and has ten years experience as an aircraft mechanic.

I asked what his thoughts were on M370. He said there are only 2 reasons an aircraft would turn around / go off course: 1) Electrical failure, or 2) Mechanical failure. He explained why the plane would not turn around in a hijack situation (something about the plane remaining on course, while engaging some sort of hijack notification). Anyway, not saying he's right, just saying what his opinion was. He also said one of 2 things likely happened to the plane. Because it was either mechanical or electrical failure, in his opinion, the pilot would have tried to make an emergency landing on water. The condition of the plane would then be dependent upon the pilot's skill, how he was able to make the water landing. Depending on how he hit the water, the plane would either have broken into a few large pieces (tail, wing, etc), or virtually disintegrated. And if it is in large pieces, it will likely never be found because it is now deep deep in the abyss of the ocean where subs can't even go.

As I said early on, all of this is way above my head. I'm just repeating what this man said.

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I don't mind people spending money trying to find this plane but this plane will never be found IMO. That part of the ocean has never even been explored nor do we know the exact depth. Anything that sinks in those depths are crushed flatter than flat including anything that included air such as a flotation device...Gone.

 

[Soulmagent]

<modsnip>


I do begrudge the constant nagging about the cost of the search. Really because I believe they know what happened to this plane.

So they are wasting millions of dollars ,and I wouldn't know exactly how much except they keep telling me, to find a plane that they know isn't lost.

 

[CARIIS]

with the part about it not being found............in water!!!!!

I don't mind people spending money trying to find this plane but this plane will never be found IMO. That part of the ocean has never even been explored nor do we know the exact depth. Anything that sinks in those depths are crushed flatter than flat including anything that included air such as a flotation device...Gone.

 

[CARIIS]

!!!!!!!!!!!

I do begrudge the constant nagging about the cost of the search. Really because I believe they know what happened to this plane.

So they are wasting millions of dollars ,and I wouldn't know exactly how much except they keep telling me, to find a plane that they know isn't lost.

 

[ElleElle]

IMO, before resuming to expensive searches, they need to go back to square one and analyse the data with other companies that are offering assistance.

In my firm belief, I don't care where a huge 777 crashed, there would be some debris either floating or washed up on shore.

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[Amee]

Media Release
19 May 2014&#8212;pm
Joint Agency Coordination Centre

It was agreed that the Chinese survey ship Zhu Kezhen will conduct the bathymetric survey of the areas provided by the Australian Transport Safety Bureau.

Zhu Kezhen is scheduled to sail for the survey area on Wednesday, weather permitting.

http://www.jacc.gov.au/media/releases/2014/may/mr046.aspx


Hopefully the weather is kind to the searchers in WA today

 

[2rose]

I don't mind people spending money trying to find this plane but this plane will never be found IMO. That part of the ocean has never even been explored nor do we know the exact depth. Anything that sinks in those depths are crushed flatter than flat including anything that included air such as a flotation device...Gone.

I respect that you have previously said you have some experience in the field of oceanography. I don't know much about it but have heard of the Mariana Trench as being one of the deepest areas in the ocean with strange animal life there. Can you help explain how there have been some underwater vehicles that have visited the trench without being crushed flat ?

Remotely Operated Vehicle KAIKO reached the deepest area of Mariana trench and made the deepest diving record of 10,911 m on March 24, 1995 ... The fourth [descent] was made by Canadian film director James Cameron in 2012. On 26 March, he reached the bottom of the Mariana Trench in the submersible vessel Deepsea Challenger

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mariana_Trench"]Mariana Trench - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

 

[Momoffourboys]

One can see that the more answers Hishammuddin gives, the more questions arise.

By Lam Choong Wah
Frankly, I nearly fell off my chair when I read the news quoting Defence Minister Hishammuddin Hussein saying &#8220;If you want to apportion blame, you have to apportion blame to nearly the whole world&#8221; when he was asked about the MH370 tragedy in a press conference recently.

Being the defence minister, which is the highest rank of administrator, he should show us how a responsible man behaves and administers such an important ministry.
But, he often let us down whenever he is confronted with questions related to MH370.
Instead of blaming the whole world, it would be better to give more convincing answers to address the still unanswered questions.

The air force and Hishammuddin keep on insisting MH370 was not intercepted because it was not identified as a hostile target.

But, how did they conclude the blips that appeared on military primary radar were not a hostile target? What are the criteria used by them to make such conclusion?

http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/ca...5/21/address-the-unanswered-questions-hisham/

 

[Archangel7]

I haven't kept up with this thread, but admire all of you for still being here.

The other day I was talking with a gentleman who is receiving his degree in Aviation Mechanics. He was in the military, and has ten years experience as an aircraft mechanic.

I asked what his thoughts were on M370. He said there are only 2 reasons an aircraft would turn around / go off course: 1) Electrical failure, or 2) Mechanical failure. He explained why the plane would not turn around in a hijack situation (something about the plane remaining on course, while engaging some sort of hijack notification). Anyway, not saying he's right, just saying what his opinion was. He also said one of 2 things likely happened to the plane. Because it was either mechanical or electrical failure, in his opinion, the pilot would have tried to make an emergency landing on water. The condition of the plane would then be dependent upon the pilot's skill, how he was able to make the water landing. Depending on how he hit the water, the plane would either have broken into a few large pieces (tail, wing, etc), or virtually disintegrated. And if it is in large pieces, it will likely never be found because it is now deep deep in the abyss of the ocean where subs can't even go.

As I said early on, all of this is way above my head. I'm just repeating what this man said.

BBM

The transponder(which was quickly turned off or damaged) IS the mechanism by which pilots alert ATC to emergencies, such as comms loss and or terrorist attack.

A fully fueled triple 7 changing course drastically should have set off alarms like no tomorrow and would have anywhere, except a third world, amateurish, banana republic.

There's a reason an ICAO FLIGHT PLAN is required and filed prior to leaving sovereign air space and entering someone else's sovereign air space OR returning to your own sovereign air space after you have left it.
If you don't, in most places, you are guaranteed to see your tax dollars at work with a fighter escort(yes civilian pilots are trained on how to read military fighter pilot hand signals)

 

[Hatfield]

BBM

The transponder(which was quickly turned off or damaged) IS the mechanism by which pilots alert ATC to emergencies, such as comms loss and or terrorist attack.

A fully fueled triple 7 changing course drastically should have set off alarms like no tomorrow and would have anywhere, except a third world, amateurish, banana republic.

There's a reason an ICAO FLIGHT PLAN is required and filed prior to leaving sovereign air space and entering someone else's sovereign air space OR returning to your own sovereign air space after you have left it.
If you don't, in most places, you are guaranteed to see your tax dollars at work with a fighter escort(yes civilian pilots are trained on how to read military fighter pilot hand signals)

Exactly.

The nerve of the guy to blame the entire world. When the plane deviated course, lost all communication, and even another country knew enough to try to contact the plane on VHF emergency frequencies, there should have been more immediate reaction from Malaysia during the event.

It seems to me that Malaysia just waited around for the arrival time and only after the plane did not land at scheduled place (i think Beijing) and scheduled time that Malaysia finally took it seriously.

So please dont go blaming the whole world as most of us were sound asleep and have no airport of airline connections at all.

OMG. This handling of this crisis by their spokespersons is beyond belief. And its pretty obvious if there is any blame to go around this early, we all know where the blame is falling. Its falling on the guy who is trying to deflect it to the whole world. And their coordinators who seem to want to keep a lot of secrets and have not been forthcoming with releasing details.

Let us never forget the 2 guys with the same legs.

Good Grief.

 

[Hatfield]

I was in the ocean industry for many years. That plane is crushed flat on the bottom of the ocean and will never be found. It is the force of water at depth. Sad but true.

JMO
I politely disagree that all the metal parts and debris would be crushed totally flat. Solid steel parts like the wheel rims I dont believe would be crushed flat. There is other steel parts too that I doubt the pressure would turn flat.

So depending on whether the plane hit with speed or just belly flopped will make a big difference in the debri field and how it may be able to be found.

If the plane sunk relatively in tact and did not hit the water with tremendous speed, then
If the plane is on the bottom of even the deepest parts of our oceans, there are many pieces of solid steel in that plane that would allow sonar capabilities to find the plane. There is enough steel, titanium, plastics, fabrics, wires, rubber, and lots of other larger parts and pieces that would make it noticeable on the bottom.

Many parts such as any solid steel parts I dont think would be crushed flat IMO. I do agree that things maybe deformed and the pressures would have extreme effect but there is such a large quantity of different materials on the plane that it would make it a noticeable pile of debris on bottom off the surface of ocean floor.

The sheer mass of materials is great. Think what happens even when a car is crushed in a crusher. It still becomes a tight mass of junk. The mass of junk does not disappear as the mass of stuff is still there and would be noticeable by sonar. I really doubt it would be all flat as a pancake on bottom.

Now if the plane hit the water very fast then there is a chance the parts were very small to begin with as it exploded on impact and mostly smaller parts would float to bottom. But even in that case, the wheel rims and stuff like that would be able to be spotted but much harder to find of course. In that case it would be very hard to find the smaller parts that would be noticeable.

All JMO of course.

 

[Archangel7]

IMO, before resuming to expensive searches, they need to go back to square one and analyse the data with other companies that are offering assistance.

In my firm belief, I don't care where a huge 777 crashed, there would be some debris either floating or washed up on shore.

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I agree. Surely there is some way for the intelligence community to get someone reputable but removed, to either hint, plant, leak, or otherwise insinuate where the search needs to be, if it went down.

On the debris....IIRC many of the major ocean crashes resulted in at least the large tail stabilizer staying afloat for a relatively long time. Things that may you go hmmm.......

As you say, odd nothing is floating, no oil slick, nothing washed up, none of 4 ELTs transmitted or transmitting.....

If the Malay Def. minister thinks he's got Public Relations problems now, what if that plane reappears and is used as a weapon?