Malaysia airlines plane may have crashed 239 people on board #8

[Marg from Oz]

not exactly great personal references if your employer and Dad won't vouch for you:scared:

"We can't disclose anything. We want to protect the family's privacy," an official at the company's Malaysian office said.

Khairul, a father of one daughter, had recently bought a house on the outskirts of the Malaysian capital, Kuala Lumpur, and had more than 10 years experience as a flight engineer, his father Selamat Omar told Reuters. He declined to say whether he believed his son could have been involved in any foul play.

I know that where I have worked over a few years and jobs we were never to give out information when asked if someone worked there. So this is not unusual to me.

Also we have seen so much misreporting from Malaysia that I wonder if the father was disgusted with the question and just didn't answer it. JMOO

 

[Phosphor]

Captain Shah was so experienced he might have tried to THWART an attempted hijacking by programming a route far away from land and trying to disable the attackers via the 45,000 ft and de-pressurization.

Maybe he didn't get his mask on time and it backfired. I mean if you're an experienced pilot and you're trying to thwart someone in the cockpit from a Malaysian 9-11 what else do you do? Go high and go out to sea.

Yes, that's the sort of place I go to also. It could so well be a case of the terrorist plot was going one way, but pilots and/or cabin crew and/or passengers may have influenced it somehow, but then not been able to save themselves or follow through and they've ended up in no man's land (so to speak).

What I was wondering is if the plane was turned in an attempt to head back towards Petronus Towers but people managed to avert that, and it all went pear-shaped; so then it's impossible for us to understand the intention/see the hijacking intent that otherwise would have become clear.

I was also thinking about the matter of shutting down engine communications - if we can find the info about precedents so easily now and on investigation shows (including about transponders) then so can terrorists, even aside from specialist inside training... So a terrorist working with that kind of information could force pilot/co pilot to do it, knowing the terminology and general function, or possibly do it themselves. They could be pretty specific by the sounds of it. I'm sure that doesn't cover everything that happened, all the expertise perhaps, but still...look at the level of these conversations. It's all out there...and ironically, more so now than ever. :facepalm:

 

[newone]

A distinguished aviation writer, Geoffrey Thomas, just 'unloaded' on the Malaysian authorities, whom he accuses of wasting a week investigating the wrong area, despite available evidence that the aeroplane changed course and headed well to the west:-

"GEOFFREY THOMAS: Look, unfortunately we have not been told by the Malaysians in a timely fashion about the shutting off of the ACARS (Aircraft Communications Addressing and Reporting System), the shutting off of the transponder, the plane going to the west.

Millions of dollars has been wasted, days have been wasted searching in the wrong area. I think this is, without doubt, one of the most botched aircraft investigations in modern history.

http://www.abc.net.au/worldtoday/content/2014/s3964757.htm

This whole incident has been a HUGE eye-opener to the uneven participation of security measures in international travel. North Americans are heavily screened and scrutinized.

 

[gregjrichards]

If the plane was repainted, new numbers and all, to fly anywhere it would have to enter some country's airspace, and after this, every country is going to be on the lookout for an unknown plane in their airspace, and when the pilot refuses to identify, it will most likely be intercepted and shot down.

I read they could rip out the old transponder equipment put new equipment in and repaint it and nobody would know. I don't know if this is fact though.

 

[aa9511]

Sorry to interrupt the flow of the thread, but am just now trying to catch up.

Does anyone know where Anwar Abrahim is? Could he have been on Malaysian Flight 370? IIRC, I read he is free pending appeal. As he has already spent 5 or 6 years (have heard both numbers) in prison for such a ridiculous conviction, could he have been determined to not go back to prison? There is no way he could be assured of not being convicted again.

That March 7th court date had been set. Does anyone know how far in advance he knew of the court date? The pilot was a strong supporter of Abrahim and there may have been a contingency plan to flee the country should he be convicted again.

The young co-pilot is the son of a Malaysian official and would make for a good hostage (maybe even a willing one). I know it is said that the pilot did not ask to be paired with that young co-pilot for the flight, but we do not know everything. Was this a scheduled flight for the pilot or did he volunteer for this particular flight?

IF the above scenario could have happened, then the plane could have landed safely and the passengers still be alive because it is said that the pilot was not a violent person. To kill 238 (excluding himself) people would not have been his mission or intent. The real hostage would be the co-pilot. The demand could be that the Malaysian officials not retry Abrahim and that the current PM resign or that the conviction be vacated and there be a fair and impartial democratic election.

VERY far-fetched, but this whole thing is far-fetched. The only thing I feel is that it is political in nature. Sorry if any of this has already been suggested. You people are Olympic class posters!

*This is an interesting article although it contradicts one that states Abrahim is free pending appeal.

http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/enter...ticalprotest

**it appears this link is broken, but I copied it just as JerseyGirl posted it. The article was at StandardMedia.

Even as I post this, I know you have to let the facts lead any investigation, but we have so few facts.

The only other thing I have to say is that when I saw the clip of the pilot gong through security, I swear he looked straight up at the camera! I cannot remember where I saw that clip, but it gave me the creeps the way he looked up at it.


MOO

Re: last part...I have been a big "pilots weren't involved" person all day, but yes I caught the seemingly looking towards security camera and yes even I thought it was odd, as we see the pic of the other pilot looking areound very normally.

About your theory, no theory seems to be too far-fetched as u say.

 

[gregjrichards]

This whole incident has been a HUGE eye-opener to the uneven participation of security measures in international travel. North Americans are heavily screened and scrutinized.

I know it is very scary hopefully if one good thing comes from this the safety and security of planes globally will be improved. I would start with ensuring plane transponders cannot be turned off or else some other means is implemented where planes must be visible electronically at all times and cannot be hidden.

 

[Phosphor]

One thing that is confusing to me is why the passengers did not intervene.

That seems to be the big difference these days is that people have smartened up to hijackings and the passengers these days are more apt to take action themselves if needed.

Years ago it was not needed as much since most all hijackings were the old fashioned style where a hijacker would just be the run of the mill hijacker wanting to be flown to the country of their choice and in the end nobody usually died.

But these days it is common knowledge that when hijacked you and everyone else could become a martyr for someone else's belief system.

So if the elapsed time of flight is anywhere close to being accurate of many hours then it seems the passengers must have been taken out by decompression or some other means. I just dont see them not taking action unless they were somehow incapacitated. Especially if the erradic flight height is true. They would have known the plane was going through some sort of hijacking.

With over 200 people on board I dont care what type of weapon a few of them have. They can be overpowered easily. Sure maybe some injuries and maybe even a death or 2 but it sure beats everyone dying.

My understanding about the current thinking is that the passengers were probably rendered unconscious when the plane rose suddenly to 45,000 feet...I don't know how quickly the oxygen was depleted, how the mask situation might have worked (there has been talk about masks earlier, my apologies for not having the time to trawl for the links now), or how the experience of ascending quickly itself may have affected everything...

 

[squeaky]

My son has done no wrong, says father of flight engineer on MH370

Mar. 17 2014 3:17 PM

The father of aviation engineer Mohd Khairul Amri Selamat, who was on board the missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370, refuted the possibility that his son would have anything to do with the plane's disappearance.

...

"No authority contacted me to say they will be searching my son's house.

...

Asked if he knew where his son was employed, Mr Selamat said Mohd Khairul was working with a private company but did not know what it was called.

"My son works on private planes, and has often travelled to places like Sydney, India and the United States to repair planes," he added.

http://www.straitstimes.com/breakin...ng-says-father-flight-engineer-mh370-20140317

 

[Marg from Oz]

I keep hearing the voice of Baghdad Bob (Iraqi Information Minister) in my head when I read what they are saying. :rolling:

Yes.., as the sound of bombs dropping next door and the building shaking he still kept saying that the Americans had been stopped and Irak was in control.

Poor Bob the next time I saw him after the conflict had stopped his hair had turned white. Must have been the shock of finding out he'd lost the war.LOL

 

[Hatfield]

Re: last part...I have been a big "pilots weren't involved" person all day, but yes I caught the seemingly looking towards security camera and yes even I thought it was odd, as we see the pic of the other pilot looking areound very normally.

About your theory, no theory seems to be too far-fetched as u say.

I too noticed that.

One thing that bothered me was how the very fast pat down was just on the outside of the body going down. The pat down was just really fast and really brief and he did not touch any inside the leg area at all.

Think about how LE pat people down on the show COPS. This was nothing like that and would not have caught anything on the inside area of the legs or front or back of the midsection.

 

[momrids6]

oops- old news.. nm

 

[CHERIE.T]

Yes.., as the sound of bombs dropping next door and the building shaking he still kept saying that the Americans had been stopped and Irak was in control.

Poor Bob the next time I saw him after the conflict had stopped his hair had turned white. Must have been the shock of finding out he'd lost the war.LOL

:floorlaugh: I will never forget those reports. We thought Saturday night live interrupted the news.

 

[Soulmagent]

If the plane was repainted, new numbers and all, to fly anywhere it would have to enter some country's airspace, and after this, every country is going to be on the lookout for an unknown plane in their airspace, and when the pilot refuses to identify, it will most likely be intercepted and shot down.

So I guess it has to steal the identity of a known aircraft . Which seems to be easy for a pilot. If what we have been told is true.

 

[momrids6]

I too noticed that.

One thing that bothered me was how the very fast pat down was just on the outside of the body going down. The pat down was just really fast and really brief and he did not touch any inside the leg area at all.

Think about how LE pat people down on the show COPS. This was nothing like that and would not have caught anything on the inside area of the legs or front or back of the midsection.

They went through a metal detector first....I don't see anything up with him in the video below. His eyes aren't clear, so hard to tell exactly where he was looking or what he was looking at. One crew behind him looks up that way also. Don't know what is on the wall with the security camera either that either may have looked at...
ETA: I agree with you about the "patdown". Guess they need to watch "COPS" too. It has made me 150% sure I will not fly that airline when I finally get to book my trip to Australia (one day)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=62VYg-Rc6e8#t=23

 

[Ravynne]

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/17/world...lane-identity-flight-370/index.html?hpt=hp_t1


When an aircraft powers up, the airplane automatically sends a signal logging onto the communications network. Thereafter, the ground station sends "polling signals" to the satellite, which relays them to the aircraft. When the aircraft responds, it is known as a "handshake." The information relayed during the handshake is very limited, but it contains a unique identifying code to identify the aircraft.
The purpose of the hourly "handshakes" is to allow the satellite to know the approximate location of the aircraft so that it can efficiently relay any messages. For this, the satellite needs to know the angle of the aircraft from the satellite.
An aircraft directly under the satellite would be at a 90 degree angle to the satellite; an aircraft at the poles would be at 0 degrees.
In the case of Malaysia Airlines 370, authorities have said, the last message sent was at 40 degrees.

I suppose it kinda answers my initial question.
Interesting article regarding satellite identification of aircraft.
Don't know if it's been posted.

 

[momrids6]

http://www.cnn.com/2014/03/17/world...lane-identity-flight-370/index.html?hpt=hp_t1

Interesting article regarding satellite identification of aircraft.
Don't know if it's been posted.

from the above link:

"There's a reason why Malaysian officials are so confident it was Flight 370 that sent signals to a satellite many hours after the plane disappeared from radar March 8. That's because CNN has learned signals from commercial aircraft to Inmarsat satellites always include a code confirming the identity of the plane."


That's great they are so confident- so no excuse there as to why they waited to tell the rest of the world that was searching in the East?????????:banghead:

 

[tambo]

re: Uighor professor.

http://www.themalaymailonline.com/malaysia/article/uighur-professor-i-was-not-the-one-on-mh370

He was not on the plane. I feel for this man. His name keeps getting caught up in this and it was a mistake made by the media.

 

[Soulmagent]

Sorry to interrupt the flow of the thread, but am just now trying to catch up.

Does anyone know where Anwar Abrahim is? Could he have been on Malaysian Flight 370? IIRC, I read he is free pending appeal. As he has already spent 5 or 6 years (have heard both numbers) in prison for such a ridiculous conviction, could he have been determined to not go back to prison? There is no way he could be assured of not being convicted again.

That March 7th court date had been set. Does anyone know how far in advance he knew of the court date? The pilot was a strong supporter of Abrahim and there may have been a contingency plan to flee the country should he be convicted again.

The young co-pilot is the son of a Malaysian official and would make for a good hostage (maybe even a willing one). I know it is said that the pilot did not ask to be paired with that young co-pilot for the flight, but we do not know everything. Was this a scheduled flight for the pilot or did he volunteer for this particular flight?

IF the above scenario could have happened, then the plane could have landed safely and the passengers still be alive because it is said that the pilot was not a violent person. To kill 238 (excluding himself) people would not have been his mission or intent. The real hostage would be the co-pilot. The demand could be that the Malaysian officials not retry Abrahim and that the current PM resign or that the conviction be vacated and there be a fair and impartial democratic election.

VERY far-fetched, but this whole thing is far-fetched. The only thing I feel is that it is political in nature. Sorry if any of this has already been suggested. You people are Olympic class posters!

*This is an interesting article although it contradicts one that states Abrahim is free pending appeal.

http://www.standardmedia.co.ke/enter...ticalprotest

**it appears this link is broken, but I copied it just as JerseyGirl posted it. The article was at StandardMedia.

Even as I post this, I know you have to let the facts lead any investigation, but we have so few facts.

The only other thing I have to say is that when I saw the clip of the pilot gong through security, I swear he looked straight up at the camera! I cannot remember where I saw that clip, but it gave me the creeps the way he looked up at it.


MOO

LaLaw2000,
I hate to say this but no matter who was on that plane ,nor the motive behind the hijacking .. no one is coming back.Unless this is truely a goverment confirmed issue (plane lane due to malfunction somewhere remote and after
quarantine)

It has to do with world security not just that part of the world . It would be a world security issue to take the people off the plane and return them ,like it never happened. So if your theory is correct , people were naive.

 

[cady]

They are also wearing the same legs!! :floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

LOL well that explains it! For 3 days they were out shopping for twin legs, pants and shoes.......

 

[alioop]

My current theory is the pilot, very angry with the Malaysian government overturning the acquittal spends the next few hours planning how to damage the government.
He reports for duty, gets on the plane and at some point locks the co pilot out of the cockpit. Then by severe manoeuvres he depressurises the plane whilst he is on oxygen. He is now the only person conscious/ alive on the plane and has peace and quiet and a few hours to carry out the rest of his plan. It is a quick and painless death as far as he is concerned which helps overcome his guilt for the innocent passengers.

He deliberately flies low enough to be seen to be a possible threat over 3 military radar hoping to cause trouble. Maybe he was going to have a cat and mouse chase with the aim of being shot down. Imagine that, the Malaysian military forced to shoot down a commercial airliner over their own country. To make it worse it is the country's own airline of which the government owns a majority interest.

However, they don't notice him so he decides it will be international chaos and greatly damage the government if he flies the plane as far into the Indian Ocean as fuel allows. He doesn't care if the plane is ever found, just that he has a plane with passenger nationalities from all around the world. The world will turn its attention to how the Malaysian government let this happen. Which is exactly what is now happening.