Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #2

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zwiebel said:
'#MH17 1/2 OSCE say #Donetsk fighting a "crucial development" and warned could affect removal of bodies by rail from near crash site.'

https://mobile.twitter.com/fergalkeane47
Click to expand...

We knew that was going to happen!

Why can't they just let us bring home our people? Right now, that's what matters most. Why do they need to obstruct that? We don't really care who started it or the politics of it. Our people just need to be laid to rest.
 
Dutchnews.nl Tuesday 22 July 2014
"Dutch foreign minister Frans Timmermans is in New York on Monday to gather UN support
for a united international approach to bringing the bodies of those killed in the
Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 crash back from Ukraine."
"The Netherlands will take the lead in identifying victims of flight MH17,
brought down over Ukraine with the loss of 298 lives, prime minister
Mark Rutte told a news conference on Sunday."
http://www.dutchnews.nl/news/archives/2014/07/dutch_foreign_minister_lobbies.php


More Dutch News MSM -
http://www.telegraaf.nl/binnenland/mh17/22880189/__Trein_vertrekt_om_19_uur__.html
"ma 21 jul 2014, 16:39
Trein vertrekt om 19 uur
CHARKOV -
De trein met lichamen van de slachtoffers van vlucht MH17 vertrekt maandagavond
om 19 uur naar Charkov. Dat zeggen de Oekraïense autoriteiten.
Alle lichamen worden daarna zo snel mogelijk overgebracht naar Nederland."
News Automatic - 'Google' translation:
"Mon 21 Jul 2014, 16:39
Train departs at 19 pm
KHARKIV -
The train with bodies of the victims of flight MH17 departs Monday at 19 am from Kharkov.
That is, the Ukrainian authorities. All bodies are then transferred to the Netherlands as soon as possible."
 
SouthAussie said:
This photo of a looter stealing a gold ring is circulating the internet. I have finally found a news source with the pic and (very) roughly translated info ... makes me think that there may be many photos among the journalists of the looting and of the damage to the plane, and the crash zone, that will be available to authorities.

600x422.jpg


Russian fighters steal valuables from the bodies of passengers downed "Boeing"

http://www.newsfiber.com/p/s/h?v=Ebx4Xwt1/EB0=+6ED72s+UrlI=&y=&tr=google-|eng#googtrans(auto|en)
http://translate.google.ru/translat...//fakty.ictv.ua/ru/index/read-news/id/1521723
Click to expand...

That picture IMO does not look like this man is stealing.
Firstly, I cannot identify the object he is holding as a ring, could be many things. Secondly, he seems to be putting it into a paper bag.
To me it looks more like he is collecting personal belongings to preserve them and to give them back later.. If he was looting, wouldnt he just put it into his pockets? And, probably not right in front of reporters with camers?
I dont know, could be true, could be a lie, to shed even more bad light on the fighters.
IMO releasing this picture and saying this man is a looter is wrong.

I cant help but the Kuwaiti baby story always jumps into my mind when reading news about delicate topics like this one. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nayirah_(testimony))

Criticism not directed to you, of course :seeya:
 
—He He—the recordings of them discussing the black box were at times humorous. I loved it when he said maybe they are disguised. Well, clearly , and this good(!) terrorists are not familiar with aviation! Who would try to “disguise” and instrument , that, in aviation disaster other than this type (catastrophic disintegration at allude) hard to find! HA

They are in for a delightful surprise. Unlike MAL 370, the boxes will provide totally nothing. At cruise, 4 hours into a tranlantc flight of 11 hours folks in the cockpit are doing little. We may learn that one of them was having an affair(!) but not much else.
Pretty clearly (we know it was shot down)malfunction did not have any impact of what happened. IMO flight data recorder will show flight humming along beautifully at 33 thousand feet, in normal fight.

Since they can’t steal heavy parts (in this scenario) that is where the , pardon use of words, smoking gun resides. They can get exact type of explosive used , points where explosion hit first, how the plane disintegrated, a more precise point of the beginning of the disaster (by debris path on ground) .


In reality the recording only informs, that contrary to all their BS about wanting to cooperate, that there is proof of their intent to impact investigation, to in their beliefs about value in boxes and not cooperating

In TWA 800, where there was no clue whatsoever about what caused to explode midair, both instruments ceased immediately . But in TWA case the CVR provided the entire clue.Millseconds before stopping a “click” was heard, which was the circuit breaker popping out – the cause of the explosion was an arc (hence circuit breaker pop)in the electrical wiring related to the fuel tank! Pretty cool huh!

In Pan AM 103, (the flight data recorder provided nothing - it ceased instantly) the closest accident to MAL 0017 it was the wreckage that proved that a bomb , was placed aboard. NTSB was able to determine , out of the dozens, exactly which baggage container held the bomb. This facilitated them narrowing it down (bomb placed in Germany- connecting flight - . This was the crash that resulted in not taking off if baggage and passenger are not on together(!) on a flight.

The CVR did it again! On Silk Air! Same way . Suicidal pilot, but in reverse – the mystery deepens at first. They wanted to figure at what voltage would make the CVR quit. So they kept tripping the circuit breaker. Low and behold, again the pop of the circuit breaker could be heard on the experiments after the crash BUT (big music here!) on the accident flight no click heard.

They then did it when they pulled the breaker and the sound of it being pulled manually resulted in no sound on cvr.Which could ONLY mean that (More exciting music) someone in the cockpit the pulled the breakers (suspensful music) but who?

CVR to the rescue again ,They later figured out (don’t remember pilot or copilot) by hearing one of flight crew unbuckling his seat belt and leaving cockpit, which means that only one left in the (more music) cockpit was the person who put the plane in the fatal dive!


Case solved – pretty amazing huh!
 
More Dutch News MSM - Algemeen Dagblad a Dutch daily newspaper:
"Eerste trein met slachtoffers om 19.00 uur naar Charkov."
"
News Automatic - 'Google' translated:
"By: editors
21-7-14 - 16:50 Source: Reuters First train with victims at 18.00 to Kharkov.
"Internationally, there is broad agreement to bring the bodies. Netherlands to about
The necessary documents are received from the Netherlands, according to the Deputy Prime
Minister which the transfer is sought. An expert is flown from Kiev to Kharkov to arrange.
Actual transfer all bodies are on board two trains with cool cars.
It is according to Groysman 282 bodies and body parts of 87 to 16 people.
With the rebels agreed that both trains at 19.00 local time (18.00 hours Dutch time) can go away by destination Kharkov. "
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/31544/Neerge...-slachtoffers-om-19-00-uur-naar-Charkov.dhtml



Algemeen Dagblad news Automatic - 'Google' translated:
http://www.ad.nl/ad/nl/31544/Neerge...-enkele-raket-waargenomen-in-buurt-MH17.dhtml
"Rusland: 'Geen enkele raket waargenomen in buurt MH17'"
Dutch MSM article 'Google' translated:
"Russia: "No rocket observed near MH17 '"
"The Russian Defense Ministry has "no rocket detected 'near the flight path of the Malaysian flight disaster, according
to a statement released today."
 
Olav Koens reports:

Olaf Koens ‏@obk 19 min.

De trein met de lichamen vertrekt vanavond 19:00 naar Charkov. De Nederlandse experts beloofden eerder mee te zullen reizen.

Olaf Koens ‏@obk 16 min.

Ga er maar vanuit dat de lichamen vanuit Charkov direct worden doorgevlogen naar Nederland.
Click to expand...

Translation (both tweets)

The train carrying the bodies will depart tonight 19:00 for Kharkov. The Dutch experts have promised previously that they will travel on this train.
Safely assume that the bodies will be it flown directly from Kharkov to The Netherlands .

===============

IMHO The Netherlands will repatriate all human remains for identification.
 
italianWSfan said:
That picture IMO does not look like this man is stealing.
Firstly, I cannot identify the object he is holding as a ring, could be many things. Secondly, he seems to be putting it into a paper bag.
To me it looks more like he is collecting personal belongings to preserve them and to give them back later.. If he was looting, wouldnt he just put it into his pockets? And, probably not right in front of reporters with camers?
I dont know, could be true, could be a lie, to shed even more bad light on the fighters.
IMO releasing this picture and saying this man is a looter is wrong.

I cant help but the Kuwaiti baby story always jumps into my mind when reading news about delicate topics like this one. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nayirah_(testimony))

Criticism not directed to you, of course :seeya:
Click to expand...


I understand, thanks :) ..... but I do think that it could be him taking the ring out of a bag of things he had gathered, and showing it to the woman who seems to be looking at it with him. And I think the cameramen would be way back at the road and using telephoto lenses.

There also seems to be the arm of another woman in the pic, the blue sleeve. These are very poor people. They would know that looting was wrong, but I imagine that the temptation must have been incredibly strong.

It is a very sad situation all the way around.
 
After the Crash - The New Yorker

Geography, motive, communications intercepts, and all manner of circumstantial evidence suggest that the likeliest suspect in the horrific deaths of two hundred and ninety-eight people aboard Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 was the curiously well-armed and well-coördinated military outfit loyal to Moscow in eastern Ukraine. Various government and intelligence officials...

e6yjuju4.jpg



Continue reading at http://www.newyorker.com/news/daily-comment/after-the-crash

----
This detailed piece was written on July 17th, but I wanted to bring it to the thread.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
While in my car, I heard a report on the Dutch radio from a journalist at the location. I did not catch hs name, but he was introduced as a correspondent.

He was asked about the trains with the bodies and if it was true that the cooling system had been turned of.
He said, yes indeed, this has happened. if it happens for a short while, this should not be a problem.
The train operator has told us that he cannot keep the cooling system running at all times.
Nor is he able to keep the trains at a temperature that is low enough to stop decomposition.
Therefore, it is important that we leave soon, and our departure is scheduled for this evening.
 
Folks,
Be sure to include links with tweets... please and thank you!
 
CNN Breaking News @cnnbrk · 19m

Burden is on Russia to allow investigators full access to #MH17 site and stop separatists' tampering, Obama says. http://cnn.it/1rDGIxu

CNN Breaking News @cnnbrk · 15m

If it keeps backing separatists in Ukraine, Russia's costs internationally will only increase, Obama says. http://cnn.it/1rDGIxu



CNN Breaking News @cnnbrk · 1h

Russia says records indicate Ukrainian warplane was flying within 5 km of #MH17 on day of crash. http://cnn.it/1rDGIxu

https://twitter.com/cnnbrk
 
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