Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #3

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Wednesday July 23 Day of National Mourning in The Netherlands

http://www.rijksoverheid.nl/nieuws/2014/07/22/woensdag-23-juli-dag-van-nationale-rouw.html

Woensdag 23 juli dag van nationale rouw

Nieuwsbericht | 22-07-2014

Minister-president Rutte heeft woensdag 23 juli 2014 tot dag van nationale rouw verklaard. Op deze dag komen de eerste slachtoffers van de vliegramp met vlucht MH17 aan in Eindhoven.

Dat zal gebeuren in aanwezigheid van nabestaanden. Daarnaast zullen aanwezig zijn Hunne Majesteiten Koning Willem-Alexander en Koningin Máxima, minister-president Rutte en vice-minister-president Asscher, vertegenwoordigers van landen waarvan slachtoffers te betreuren zijn en andere hoogwaardigheidsbekleders.

Na de landing van de twee militaire vliegtuigen zal de aankomst in Nederland worden gemarkeerd met een trompetsignaal. Daarna zal er een minuut stilte in acht worden genomen. Iedereen kan zich hierbij aansluiten.

In verband met deze dag van nationale rouw heeft minister-president Rutte een bijzondere vlaginstructie uitgegeven om morgen van alle gebouwen van de rijksoverheid de Nederlandse vlag halfstok te voeren. Gemeenten, provincies en Nederlandse diplomatieke vertegenwoordigingen in het buitenland wordt verzocht dienovereenkomstig te handelen. Verder kunnen op verschillende momenten van deze dag klokken worden geluid. Dit laatste geldt met name gedurende 5 minuten voor aankomst van de vliegtuigen. Deze aankomst is voorzien om 16.00 uur.

Translation:

Wednesday 23 July Day of National Mourning
News release | 22-07-2014

Prime Minister Rutte has declared Wednesday 23 July 2014 as a day of national mourning. On this day the first victims of the air crash with flight MH17 will arrive in Eindhoven.

That will happen in the presence of relatives. In addition will be present their Majesties King Willem-Alexander and Queen Máxima , Prime Minister Rutte and Deputy Prime Minister Asscher, representatives of countries that suffered losses and other dignitaries.

After the landing of the two military aircraft the arrvial in The Netherlands will be marked with a trumpet signal. Then there will be a minute of silence. Everyone is invited to join in this minute of silence.

Related to this day of national mourning Prime Minister Rutte has issued a special flag instruction and tomorrow all buildings of the Central Government will carry the Dutch flag at half mast. Municipalities, provinces and Dutch diplomatic missions abroad are requested to act accordingly. Furthermore, during different times of this day bells will be rung. The latter will be the case especially for the 5 minutes prior to arrival of the aircraft. This arrival is scheduled at 4 pm.
 
NOS-Journaal:
http://nos.nl/artikel/678121-kritiek-ovse-op-berging-mh17.html

OSCE critical of recovery MH17


De berging van de slachtoffers van vlucht MH17 verloopt nog steeds niet zoals het zou moeten. Er liggen nog menselijke resten tussen de wrakstukken, maar niemand lijkt zich daar meer om te bekommeren, zegt een woordvoerder van de Organisatie voor Veiligheid en Samenwerking in Europa, OVSE.

Een groep OVSE'ers heeft vandaag een bezoek gebracht aan het gebied waar vlucht MH17 neerstortte. Volgens een woordvoerder leek het er niet op dat er nog bergingswerkzaamheden bezig waren.
Tas met resten

"We zagen een aantal kleinere lichaamsdelen liggen", zei de woordvoerder tijdens een persconferentie in Donetsk. Zo lag er volgens hem een plastic tas met menselijke resten in het gebied. Vanwege de indringende geur ter plekke, vermoedt hij dat er nog meer resten lagen.

"We hebben nooit gezien dat mensen systematisch het gebied hebben uitgekamd, door arm in arm te lopen", aldus de woordvoerder. Hij hekelde ook het feit dat de wrakstukken niet worden beveiligd.

Vanmorgen kwam een koeltrein met stoffelijke overschotten aan in Charkov, in het door Oekraïne beheerste gebied. Daar zijn Nederlandse experts begonnen de resten klaar te maken voor transport naar Hilversum, waar ze geïdentificeerd zullen worden. Voor het transport zullen de lichamen in grafkisten worden geplaatst.

Hoeveel lichamen er precies in de trein zitten, is niet bekend. De leider van het onderzoek heeft van de mensen die de trein geladen hebben gehoord dat het om zeker 200 slachtoffers gaat. Het getal van 282, dat in internationale media rondzingt, kon hij niet bevestigen, omdat nog niet alle wagons zijn bekeken.

Translation:

The recovery of the victims of flight MH17 is still not as it should be. There still are human remains among the wreckage, but no one seems to be bothered, says a spokesman for the Organization for security and cooperation in Europe, OSCE.

A team of OSCE has visited today the area where flight MH17 crashed. According to a spokesperson nothing indicated that a rescue operatrion was ongoing.
"We saw a number of smaller body parts", the spokesman said at a press conference in Donetsk. Also, according to him, a plastic bag with human remains was left in the area. Because of the penetrating odor in the area, he suspects that more remains are still there.

"We have never seen that people have scoured the area systematically, by walking arm-in-arm," the spokesman said. He also denounced the fact that the wreckage has not been secured.
This morning a cool train with human remains arrived in Kharkov, in the area controlled by Ukraine. Dutch experts have started to prepare the remains for transport to Hilversum, where they will be identified. Before transport, the bodies will be placed in coffins.

How many bodies are exactly in the train, is not known. The leader of the investigation has heard from the people who loaded the train, that there are at least 200 victims . He could not confirm the number of 282, that circulates in international media, because not all wagons have been inspected.

BBM
 
BUZZ FEED & Max Seddon:

http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/locals-say-rebels-moved-missile-launcher-shortly-before-mala

Locals Say Rebels Moved Missile Launcher Shortly Before Malaysian Plane Was Downed

Local accounts undermine the rebels’ argument that they do not own such weapons.

TOREZ, Ukraine — Its white metal shutters are down and business is slow, but this nondescript home improvement store in a decaying rebel-controlled east Ukrainian industrial town could be key to establishing who downed Malaysia Airlines Flight 17.

Several locals near the StroiDom store in Torez, about 10 miles from where the plane crashed, said Tuesday that they had seen what appeared to be a missile launcher driving through their town a few hours before the plane was shot down last Thursday. Their story appears to corroborate Ukrainian claims that the separatist rebels had a sophisticated missile launcher and drove it to the site that Ukrainian and U.S. intelligence say was used to fire on the Boeing 777 jet, killing all 298 on board.

(...)

While the locals’ accounts do not prove that the rebels fired the missile, they do undermine their denials of ever owning such a system. The entire area around Torez is rebel-controlled, and there are rebel checkpoints on all the entrances to town.

More info, pictures, video at link:
http://www.buzzfeed.com/maxseddon/locals-say-rebels-moved-missile-launcher-shortly-before-mala
 
This 14-Year-Old Caller Perfectly Sums Up Our Issues With Russia | LBC

dera3amy.jpg


http://www.lbc.co.uk/this-14-year-old-caller-perfectly-sums-up-our-issues-with-russia-94193

-----

Contains a SoundCloud of a 14 year old on the air who is wise beyond his years :moo:

Worth a listen! :earson:




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The "thanks" button just does not do your translations :justice: ZaZara!

:loveyou:
:tyou:



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ZaZara said:
Wednesday July 23 Day of National Mourning in The Netherlands

http://www.rijksoverheid.nl/nieuws/2014/07/22/woensdag-23-juli-dag-van-nationale-rouw.html

Woensdag 23 juli dag van nationale rouw

Nieuwsbericht | 22-07-2014

Minister-president Rutte heeft woensdag 23 juli 2014 tot dag van nationale rouw verklaard. Op deze dag komen de eerste slachtoffers van de vliegramp met vlucht MH17 aan in Eindhoven.

Dat zal gebeuren in aanwezigheid van nabestaanden. Daarnaast zullen aanwezig zijn Hunne Majesteiten Koning Willem-Alexander en Koningin Máxima, minister-president Rutte en vice-minister-president Asscher, vertegenwoordigers van landen waarvan slachtoffers te betreuren zijn en andere hoogwaardigheidsbekleders.

Na de landing van de twee militaire vliegtuigen zal de aankomst in Nederland worden gemarkeerd met een trompetsignaal. Daarna zal er een minuut stilte in acht worden genomen. Iedereen kan zich hierbij aansluiten.

In verband met deze dag van nationale rouw heeft minister-president Rutte een bijzondere vlaginstructie uitgegeven om morgen van alle gebouwen van de rijksoverheid de Nederlandse vlag halfstok te voeren. Gemeenten, provincies en Nederlandse diplomatieke vertegenwoordigingen in het buitenland wordt verzocht dienovereenkomstig te handelen. Verder kunnen op verschillende momenten van deze dag klokken worden geluid. Dit laatste geldt met name gedurende 5 minuten voor aankomst van de vliegtuigen. Deze aankomst is voorzien om 16.00 uur.

Translation:

Wednesday 23 July Day of National Mourning
News release | 22-07-2014

Prime Minister Rutte has declared Wednesday 23 July 2014 as a day of national mourning. On this day the first victims of the air crash with flight MH17 will arrive in Eindhoven.

That will happen in the presence of relatives. In addition will be present their Majesties King Willem-Alexander and Queen Máxima , Prime Minister Rutte and Deputy Prime Minister Asscher, representatives of countries that suffered losses and other dignitaries.

After the landing of the two military aircraft the arrvial in The Netherlands will be marked with a trumpet signal. Then there will be a minute of silence. Everyone is invited to join in this minute of silence.

Related to this day of national mourning Prime Minister Rutte has issued a special flag instruction and tomorrow all buildings of the Central Government will carry the Dutch flag at half mast. Municipalities, provinces and Dutch diplomatic missions abroad are requested to act accordingly. Furthermore, during different times of this day bells will be rung. The latter will be the case especially for the 5 minutes prior to arrival of the aircraft. This arrival is scheduled at 4 pm.
Click to expand...

Tears my heart out to know what pain the loved ones will suffer for a very long time.
 
PoirotryInMotion said:
Has this been posted yet? (Sorry, haven't caught up on all the thread, yet...):

"Cockpit of MH17 found sawed in half at crash site"

http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/07/22/ukraine-mh17-bodies-russia/12981325/
Click to expand...


:tyou: for posting this!

-------

Cockpit of MH17 found sawed in half at crash site

Filip Warwick and Doug Stanglin, USA TODAY
53 minutes ago


HRABOVE, Ukraine — International monitors who have finally gained full access to the Malaysia Airlines crash site in eastern Ukraine said Tuesday the Boeing 777's cockpit inexplicably had been sawed in half while under the control of Russian-backed separatists.

More@Link posted by @PoirotryInMotion.....


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Eindhovens Dagblad, liveblog:
http://www.ed.nl/algemeen/binnenland/live-lichamen-mh17-woensdagochtend-richting-nederland-1.4459451

First plane departs for Charkov


22:00 Eerste vliegtuig onderweg naar Charkov om lichamen slachtoffers op te halen

Het eerste militaire vliegtuig dat lichamen zal ophalen in Charkov, is dinsdagavond vanaf Eindhoven vertrokken naar Oekraïne. Dat bevestigde een woordvoerder van het ministerie van Veiligheid en Justitie. Een tweede vliegtuig vliegt pas woensdagochtend vroeg naar Charkov.


Translation:

22: 00 First airplane on the way to Kharkov to pick up victims' bodies.

The first military airplane that will pick up the remains of the victims up in Kharkiv, has departed Tuesday evening from Eindhoven for Ukraine. This was confirmed a spokesman for the Ministry of Security and Justice. A second plane will fly to Kharkov on Wednesday morning .
 
Tweet from @AmbassadorPower (Samantha Power - Verified Twitter Feed) - 2h:

POTUS msg to Dutch ppl after signing condolence book: "Will not rest until we're certain that justice is done." #MH17
8e2a7ema.jpg

http://t.co/BcmSqvqwJU

http://twitter.com/AmbassadorPower/status/491678636349849600

--------

I truly hope :justice: is attainable, but my overriding concern remains with how it will be achieved. The families have already suffered immeasurably, with the loss of their loved ones. In addition, they've been made to wait far too long - further compounding insult to injury. The (apparent) cover up is also criminal, IMVHO.

:sigh:


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Centre for Research and Globalization GlobalResearch.ca/GlobalResearch.org published an interesting article 22.7.2014.:
http://www.globalresearch.ca/is-the...-did-us-spy-satellites-see-in-ukraine/5392743
"The U.S. media’s Ukraine bias has been obvious, siding with the Kiev regime and bashing ethnic Russian rebels and Russia’s President Putin. But now –

with the scramble to blame Putin for the Malaysia Airlines shoot-down – the shoddy journalism has grown truly dangerous.

In the heat of the U.S. media’s latest war hysteria – rushing to pin blame for the crash of a Malaysia Airlines passenger jet on Russia’s President

Vladimir Putin – there is the same absence of professional skepticism that has marked similar stampedes on Iraq, Syria and elsewhere – with key

questions not being asked or answered.

The dog-not-barking question on the catastrophe over Ukraine is: what did the U.S. surveillance satellite imagery show?"


"Yes, there are limitations to what U.S. spy satellites can see. But the Buk missiles are about 16 feet long and they are usually mounted on trucks or

tanks. Malaysia Airlines Flight 17 also went down during the afternoon, not at night, meaning the missile battery was not concealed by darkness.

So why hasn’t this question of U.S. spy-in-the-sky photos – and what they reveal – been pressed by the major U.S. news media? How can the Washington

Post run front-page stories, such as the one on Sunday with the definitive title “U.S. official: Russia gave systems,” without demanding from these

U.S. officials details about what the U.S. satellite images disclose?"



Just MOO, very relevant questions in this article: Why can't the MSM Media disclose all satellite images related to the flight path and
crash area and time, from both USA and Russia ?
 
So catching up, things look a little muddier today, if that's possible.

As I've suspected, the truth lies somewhere in between the Russian spinning, the rebels' spinning, Ukraine's spinning, and the US/allies spinning.

It would also appear that finding the truth will be a long way off, after an investigation. If ever.


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I've been lurking here for the last five days, but I wanted to come out of the shadows long enough to thank our European posters, Zwiebel & ZaZara, for their translations & postings to keep us abreast of what's happening over there, & Kimi for your tireless efforts in trawling the Internet for all of the information you can find. I can't spend much time lurking elsewhere so I come here. I appreciate all of your unflagging dedication to bring any small amount of clarity to this fugue of madness. If I've forgotten anyone, lo siento, it's lagunas mentales, old woman, old brain.

Lambchop, thank you for your efforts to keep this thread on the straight & narrow. It's so easy to get trapped into dialectic for something like this. At the end of the day, it's still about 298 people, many of whom were children. They were killed, & their bodies left in the hot summer sun. This is an egregious horror. Send them home.
 
More analysis on the movement of the BUK Missile launcher moving into Ukraine then back to Russia

http://pressimus.com/Interpreter_Mag/press/3503

Over the last day or so I've heard a number of analysts start referring to the fact that it's not so much that Putin is supporting the rebels, but more the fact that the rebels are really just Russian military ..

JACK SQUIER: My personal suspicion is that this is actually a Russian military operation. There's considerable evidence that the leadership is GRU officers and not people from Donetsk.

Just to give one example, they speak with central Russian accents, not with Donetsk region accents.

It also seems obvious that they were given surface to air missiles with a crew to operate them and that, for some reason, this airline got targeted. It's not clear to me why they would do this; it was probably some sort of mistake.

The discussions seem to indicate that they thought that it was a military transport.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-07-22/un-security-council-resolution-wont-guarantee/5614832

Regardless, although I think there is little chance of prosecution, I do think the place other countries could have the most impact on Putin is economic ..

Russian Billionaires in ‘Horror’ as Putin Risks Isolation

http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2014-...aires-in-horror-as-putin-risks-isolation.html

Does Putin care about any of this?

http://www.abc.net.au/radionational/programs/latenightlive/masha-gessen/5612432

Masha Gessen is the author of The Man Without A Face: the Unlikely Rise of Vladimir Putin. She gives us her assessment on the ground in Moscow about President Putin's reaction to the MH17 disaster and it's aftermath for the Ukraine and Russia.

Sorry, there's no transcript to the last one, but when asked if Putin cared what any other country thought the guest nearly laughed the host off the air. He lives in an environment he has absolute control over. She says he looks like a 'cornered bully' trying to buy time and get away from his critics .. she also says it is more accurate to simply call the separatists 'the Russians'.

Host: Putin must do something to constrain the rebels
Guest: That's not true. He doesn't care what the world has to say.

There isn't a group of people running Russia, there is one man, with a group of advisers. He doesn't want to have the kind of conversations he's been having with western leaders, he just wants people to leave him alone.

Short interview, interesting.
 
REUTERS:

France tells UK look to London oligarchs before damning #Mistral
http://t.co/fLJncxfirA #Ukraine #MH17

-------

:sigh:


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Donamena said:
I've been lurking here for the last five days, but I wanted to come out of the shadows long enough to thank our European posters, Zwiebel & ZaZara, for their translations & postings to keep us abreast of what's happening over there, & Kimi for your tireless efforts in trawling the Internet for all of the information you can find. I can't spend much time lurking elsewhere so I come here. I appreciate all of your unflagging dedication to bring any small amount of clarity to this fugue of madness. If I've forgotten anyone, lo siento, it's lagunas mentales, old woman, old brain.

Lambchop, thank you for your efforts to keep this thread on the straight & narrow. It's so easy to get trapped into dialectic for something like this. At the end of the day, it's still about 298 people, many of whom were children. They were killed, & their bodies left in the hot summer sun. This is an egregious horror. Send them home.
Click to expand...

:grouphug:



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Paul Sonne ‏@PaulSonne 1h

Crash site in Rozsypne, day six. Almost want to put caution tape around it myself. #MH17

 
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