Malaysia Flight MH17 shot down in Ukraine. 298 aboard. 7/17/2014 - #3

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ZaZara said:
Deutsche Wirtschafts Nachrichten
http://deutsche-wirtschafts-nachric...-von-satelliten-bildern/#.U86QgfUW52A.twitter


Abschuss MH17: USA zögern mit Veröffentlichung von Satelliten-Bildern
Deutsche Wirtschafts Nachrichten | Veröffentlicht: 22.07.14, 13:36 |
Die für das Wochenende angekündigte Veröffentlichung der Satellitenbilder vom Abschuss von MH17 ist einem US-Medienbericht zufolge bisher unterblieben, weil die Amerikaner festgestellt haben sollen: An der Buk-Raketenbasis hantierten möglicherweise betrunkene Soldaten in ukrainischen Uniformen, und nicht Rebellen. '

....

Die Quelle sagte, dass die CIA-Analysten noch nicht ausschließen wollten, dass es sich um Rebellen aus der Ostukraine handelt, die ähnliche Uniformen tragen. Doch die ursprüngliche Einschätzung war, dass es sich um ukrainische Soldaten handelt. Es gab auch die Vermutung, dass die die betreffenden Soldaten undiszipliniert und möglicherweise betrunken waren. Die Satellitenbilder zeigten am Boden verstreute Bierflaschen auf dem Gebiet, sagte die Quelle.

Translation:

Shooting down MH17: United States hesitate with release of satellite images
German economic news | Published: 22.07.14, 13:36.

The publication of satellite images from the shooting down of MH17 that was announced for the weekend has not been published so far according to an US media report, because Americans alledgedly have determined: on the Buk missile base possibly drunken soldiers in Ukrainian uniforms were involved, and not rebels.

....

The source said that the CIA analysts still do not wanted to exclude involvement of rebels from the Eastern Ukraine, who wear similar uniforms. But the initial assessment was that these are Ukrainian soldiers. It was also suggested that the soldiers were undisciplined and possibly drunk. The satellite pictures showed scattered beer bottles on the ground of the location, the source said.

-----

IMHO this is a strange story. If it is true, what were those Ukrainian soldiers doing in the region controlled by rebels?
Click to expand...

That is just TOO convenient. It spotted beer bottles. Not hard spirits. So every Russian and Eastern Ukrainian will know it it couldn't have been the pro-Russian rebels who left them.

I do not believe there were any Ukrainian Govt troops in the area. The rebels and Russians were boasting just before that they'd all been driven out. I don't think this report can be correct.

To me, US reluctance to publically release all the information it gleaned has an obvious cause - it will provide Russia with a lot of information about US intelligence in the area, if they do.
 
Trident said:
Thing is, there was/is so much confusion and propoganda, that we don't really know there were any national team waiting to get in. I've read post here that wondered where all these "teams" were. I don't know, I wasn't there, but I don't remember seeing anyone but the journalists, and later on, days later, some officials.

Can you give me a url, with proof, that there were "national teams", with credentials turned away?

Thanks.
Click to expand...

I find it odd since journalists were given free range...

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/entertainment-arts-28416029

Sky News reporter Colin Brazier has admitted he was wrong to handle victims' belongings at the MH17 crash site in Ukraine.

Writing in The Guardian, the journalist said the site was unchecked and he was "free to walk around at will".

...Writing his version of events following a vociferous backlash on social media, Brazier said other journalists were acting on the freedom they had on the crash site, and "foolishly took that as a precedent".

...He described the Ukraine site as a lawless warzone where journalists where not kept at bay.
 
gia2 said:
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28416973#TWEET1190635
Dutch officials say that 200 bodies, not 282 have been returned.

If correct that is a massive discrepancy. I wonder if 282 was counting the parts sent back, it doesn't make much sense though.
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In the Pan Am Lockerbie crash, which is maybe comparable? Only 10 passengers were never recovered. Eight of them were sitting directly above the blast. So 82 does seem like a large number of people to simply vapourize. Especially as the Lockerbie blaze and impact was so fierce, seven residents on the ground were never recovered either.
 
Hardly believably, two passengers on the Lockerbie plane were still alive when found by rescuers, after falling through the air for nearly two minutes. They died after about ten minutes though. There were questions asked about if help had got to them sooner, if they could have survived. Neither were conscious.
 
zwiebel said:
In the Pan Am Lockerbie crash, which is maybe comparable? Only 10 passengers were never recovered. Eight of them were sitting directly above the blast. So 82 does seem like a large number of people to simply vapourize. Especially as the Lockerbie blaze and impact was so fierce, seven residents on the ground were never recovered either.
Click to expand...

It's good to have something in the way of a comparison, thanks. There are reports that there are still bodies (well, I think parts would be more accurate) on site. I wonder if the bodies loaded on to the train were from the main sites, with more spread over the wider area.

From what I read in several articles it sounded like 282 bodies were being sent back. In addition to that number, body parts would also be sent back. So why have only 200 bodies been returned. Where was the error, with the reporting? With the translation? Was the information provided about body numbers wrong? How could a miscalculation of such a size be made.

I wonder if it meant 200 bodies plus 82 parts. Strange.
 
zwiebel said:
Hardly believably, two passengers on the Lockerbie plane were still alive when found by rescuers, after falling through the air for nearly two minutes. They died after about ten minutes though. There were questions asked about if help had got to them sooner, if they could have survived. Neither were conscious.
Click to expand...

I've always found that incredibly disturbing. I think one of them only had a badly broken leg (or something like that) and it was probably blood loss that caused death. I can't get my head around how it could have been survivable for anyone. So sad for them and their families.
 
zwiebel said:
That is just TOO convenient. It spotted beer bottles. Not hard spirits. So every Russian and Eastern Ukrainian will know it it couldn't have been the pro-Russian rebels who left them.

I do not believe there were any Ukrainian Govt troops in the area. The rebels and Russians were boasting just before that they'd all been driven out. I don't think this report can be correct.

To me, US reluctance to publically release all the information it gleaned has an obvious cause - it will provide Russia with a lot of information about US intelligence in the area, if they do.
Click to expand...

I leafed through the digital pages of Deutsche Wirtschafts Nachrichten:
http://deutsche-wirtschafts-nachric...e-wirtschaft-zittert-vor-russland-sanktionen/


Jedes vierte deutsche Exportunternehmen leidet unter den Sanktionen gegen Russland. Heimische Firmen, die Geschäfte mit Russland und den USA pflegen, sind doppelt betroffen, so die DIHK.

Transaltion:

Every fourth German exporter suffers from the sanctions against Russia. Domestic companies that maintain business with both Russia and the United States, are doubly affected, according to the DIHK (*).


(* DIHK: Association of German Chambers of Industry and Commerce)

No wonder they keep hoping that Russia is not involved.
 
zwiebel said:
Hardly believably, two passengers on the Lockerbie plane were still alive when found by rescuers, after falling through the air for nearly two minutes. They died after about ten minutes though. There were questions asked about if help had got to them sooner, if they could have survived. Neither were conscious.
Click to expand...

I've always found that incredibly disturbing. I think one of them only had a badly broken leg (or something like that) and it was probably blood loss that caused death. I can't get my head around how it could have been survivable for anyone. So sad for them and their families.
 
zwiebel said:
BBC journo at crash site (one who was handed a Dutch passenger's wallet by a miner) says that just from yesterday 'the site has changed tremendously.....there is no doubt it has been tampered with.'

She said that just before the Inspectors arrived XXyesterday(when they had to stand some distance Away)XX TODAY, the pro Russian military brought in cranes which lifted large parts of wreckage into a truck, and took them away. No-one knows where.

I'll link her name in just a sec from the BBC site.

ETA:
The BBC correspondent is Natalie Antelava.
https://mobile.twitter.com/antelava/status/491552536537468928
Click to expand...

Unforgiveable
 
Tweet from @CNN - 15m

The 298 victims from #MH17 were more than names on a list. See photos and stories here: http://t.co/ozLbeFFwJa
9unu3asa.jpg

http://t.co/J7UxOlkAxq

http://twitter.com/CNN/status/491655957127000066




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
gia2 said:
It's good to have something in the way of a comparison, thanks. There are reports that there are still bodies (well, I think parts would be more accurate) on site. I wonder if the bodies loaded on to the train were from the main sites, with more spread over the wider area.

From what I read in several articles it sounded like 282 bodies were being sent back. In addition to that number, body parts would also be sent back. So why have only 200 bodies been returned. Where was the error, with the reporting? With the translation? Was the information provided about body numbers wrong? How could a miscalculation of such a size be made.

I wonder if it meant 200 bodies plus 82 parts. Strange.
Click to expand...

I saw tweets about this but hadn't found a MSM link yet. This is so sad :cry:


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Russia Today Faces UK Investigation Over MH17 News Coverage

Several viewers have complained to Ofcom about the Kremlin-backed TV channel breaking strict British rules on impartiality in news.
Posted on July 22, 2014, at 10:32 a.m.

Russia Today, the Kremlin-backed news channel, has attacked the "impartiality and factuality of the mainstream media" after learning it could itself be investigated for breaking broadcasting regulations on accuracy and impartiality during its coverage of the MH17 air crash.

Ofcom, which ensures TV channels with a UK broadcasting licence provide broadly impartial news coverage, said it was considering whether to investigate Russia Today following complaints from viewers about the tone of its coverage of the Malaysia Airlines disaster.

More@Link

http://www.buzzfeed.com/jimwaterson/russia-today-faces-uk-investigation-over-mh17-news-coverage


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