Members' Theories

[zOOmz]

Hi I am new to the forums. I haven't followed the JonBenet case because it depressed me. A couple of weeks ago I watched the movie "Perfect Murder, Perfect Town" and then read a lot about it and I have formed my own theory.

I pretty much agree with Steve Thomas' theory about what happened.

I think that someone living inside the house killed JonBenet in a moment of rage. I think it involved the stress of the holidays, and JonBenet's bedwetting. I do not think that John Ramsey killed her or was abusing her. I think that the killer is now also dead, Patsy Ramsey. She was about to turn 40, that can be a scary age for an ex-beauty queen. She seemed to be a perfectionist, and was punishing JonBenet and only exacerbated the problem. It must be difficult to have a child who is in the public light, and who is not potty trained at six. No matter how perfect a family the Ramsey's seemed, there are always things that even best friends and relatives don't know about the internal family dynamics. About how they are dysfunctional.

First of all, I try to pay attention to only the initial reports and not a lot of speculation that came after the fact that muddies perspectives. I think it is clear that the family tried to cover up the murder. The staging seems apparent to me. Loose cord on wrists. The attempt to sully the murder scene by moving her, covering her, inviting many people in to contaminate the site as much as possible. The avoidance to be interviewed. Keeping evidence away, in some cases, forever. Money talks, pure and simple. You and I would have been in jail. End of game.

The biggest question that I find is this...
Why would a kidnapper who fumbles a kidnapping attempt by murdering the child, leave the ransom note, when the mere act of taking it with them shifts the blame onto the family and away from a kidnapping attempt? It would be silly to leave the note. The Ramseys wanted to divert attention away from themselves and the note did that for them. Pretty simple. They NEEDED that note to clear themselves.

The only other alternatives for me would be that the son killed her and then hid her until later, but was found out by the parents who in a panic covered him with an elaborate staging. But I think the evidence points to Patsy.

I read in a couple of articles that Patsy allegedly gave her attorney a letter to be read after her death that JonBenet committed suicide because she felt too fat for her new designer dress. If that is true, Patsy was a scary deluded person even to the end.

z

 

[zOOmz]

This is kind of interesting and makes you wonder..
Do six year old girls commit suicide?

http://www.koinlocal6.com/mostpopul...ath-ruled-suicide/slx1QvtylU6dReFLH2WYlA.cspx

Perhaps the Ramsey's didn't want this known and attempted to cover it up with the kidnapper story. Does the evidence fit this theory?

 

[DeeDee249]

I strongly disagree with that coroner's findings. A child that young can accidentally strangle themselves, but suicide? That stinks of a coverup as badly as this case does.

JB did not commit suicide. Cannot imagine why her parents would cover that up, anyway. She couldn't read or write, so it's not like she left a note blaming them.

 

[zOOmz]

I strongly disagree with that coroner's findings. A child that young can accidentally strangle themselves, but suicide? That stinks of a coverup as badly as this case does.

JB did not commit suicide. Cannot imagine why her parents would cover that up, anyway. She couldn't read or write, so it's not like she left a note blaming them.

That was my first inclination.

I would say, take all the evidence and work it through with the idea that she did strangle herself before eliminating it as a cause. Has this been explored here before? I haven't read the entire forum.

I thought that the similarities between the two cases were remarkable. I looked up the statistics and these kinds of suicides are extremely rare, but it is possible under the right set of circumstances.

 

[DeeDee249]

Are you that opposed to considering a family member as being responsible that you'd have to suggest a 6-year old girl killed herself? She had vaginal injuries- NOT self inflicted. She was assaulted, strangled and bashed on the head hard enough to nearly split her skull in half. THAT cannot be self-inflicted. Read here: http://www.acandyrose.com

Read it ALL. Read the autopsy report and LOOK at the photos. Anyone posting here should be able to do that.

 

[cynic]

This is kind of interesting and makes you wonder..
Do six year old girls commit suicide?

http://www.koinlocal6.com/mostpopul...ath-ruled-suicide/slx1QvtylU6dReFLH2WYlA.cspx

Perhaps the Ramsey's didn't want this known and attempted to cover it up with the kidnapper story. Does the evidence fit this theory?

I remember the following case from a recent 48 Hours Mystery:

36-year-old Hugues De La Plaza’s family and friends refuse to believe he killed himself… de La Plaza, a French-American citizen, was stabbed three times after coming home from a neighborhood bar… His door was locked, no signs of a struggle, no weapon was found.
Let’s think about this, you stab yourself several times and then dispose of the weapon???
Local law enforcement deemed this to be a suicide, further investigation by French investigators classed it as a homicide.
Moral of the story: Law enforcement can make dumb mistakes.

I certainly hope that police took a long, hard look at the family in the case of this little girl.
Accident possibly, homicide probably, suicide using a blanket and belt??? – not likely, bordering on preposterous, IMO.

 

[zOOmz]

Are you that opposed to considering a family member as being responsible that you'd have to suggest a 6-year old girl killed herself? She had vaginal injuries- NOT self inflicted. She was assaulted, strangled and bashed on the head hard enough to nearly split her skull in half. THAT cannot be self-inflicted. Read here: http://www.acandyrose.com

Read it ALL. Read the autopsy report and LOOK at the photos. Anyone posting here should be able to do that.

I read the autopsy. I looked at the photos. I read several books. I try to be objective. To see the truth, not just what I want to fit, or what others want to have fit.

The head injury and the vaginal injury could have come from the staging, to make it look like an attack, post mortem. Part of the vaginal injuries (the word chronic, if you will) could come from punishment for bedwetting. Vigorous wiping, for one thing. I know someone that went through that with their mother when they were small, so I know it can happen when a parent is extremely frustrated. I read that JonBenet was completely potty trained before her mother got cancer, and started wetting the bed again after.

I am not concluding anything. I am merely asking the question, is it possible? If it is not, then things eliminated make it easier to see what can not be eliminated. I just don't know if suicide or even accidental strangulation have been discussed here. Not any that I could find.

Sometimes a person just needs to follow their gut feeling. Mine says that these parents weren't bad people. Horrible things can happen to good people, when they are under stress. Things can get bad really fast.

I still believe that whatever happened happened within the family unit and outsiders had nothing to do with it. That is my gut feeling.

z

 

[DeeDee249]

I totally agree that these parents weren't bad people. And this wasn't a deliberate murder. But good parents can do bad things. And rough wiping doesn't erode a hymen or cause bruising IN the vagina. Yes, staging could have done the injuries. But not the erosion, and the coroner classifying some of the injuries as "chronic" indicate they happened well before the death.
SOMEONE was abusing her. Was her death in some way related to that? Probably.
These parents did a bad thing. They pointed a finger at innocent people to hide what they knew about their daughter's death. AND they staged her death to look like something it wasn't.

 

[Tadpole12]

So DeeDee.

Hiya.

http://zyberzoom.com/JonBenet.html

Q: So ... the marks around her neck, back of neck, right shoulder, how are they not handprints?

I was discussing this with Ravyn, after having reviewed photos of child abuse.

 

[DeeDee249]

So DeeDee.

Hiya.

http://zyberzoom.com/JonBenet.html

Q: So ... the marks around her neck, back of neck, right shoulder, how are they not handprints?

I was discussing this with Ravyn, after having reviewed photos of child abuse.

They do not look like handprints to me. The coroner has not identified them as handprints. There is a bruise on her shoulder. Could have happened if she was manhandled or shoved around but however it happened, she was alive because bruises do not form in a dead person. The small marks on her neck above and below the garrote are petechial hemhorrhages, though they are very often mistaken for scratch marks. Whatever we think of the coroner's handling of the autopsy, we have to assume he would not mislead about such basic indications. Nothing I have seen in the photos looks like a handprint to me.
Don't be confused or misled by the OPINIONS posed as questions on that site. The striated (striped) appearance of her back are the livor mortis patters caused by the folds of her shirt pressing into her back, formed when her blood stopped circulating.

 

[yosande]

That was my first inclination.

I would say, take all the evidence and work it through with the idea that she did strangle herself before eliminating it as a cause. Has this been explored here before? I haven't read the entire forum.

I thought that the similarities between the two cases were remarkable. I looked up the statistics and these kinds of suicides are extremely rare, but it is possible under the right set of circumstances.

Q. Is it possible that JBR, during strangulation, had a seizure, causing the head trauma?

Q. Where was the head trauma, the side or back of her head?

Q. How many times was her head hit?

Q. Did the (I assume cement) floor cause the trauma, or was something else used? Is it known what was used, if the damage was not done by the floor?

Q. Was the trauma a closed head trauma?


tia

 

[BBB167893]

Q. Is it possible that JBR, during strangulation, had a seizure, causing the head trauma?

Doubtful.

Q. Where was the head trauma, the side or back of her head?

Closer to the top.

Q. How many times was her head hit?

Only once that we know of.

Q. Did the (I assume cement) floor cause the trauma, or was something else used? Is it known what was used, if the damage was not done by the floor?

Seems like every person has a different idea.

Q. Was the trauma a closed head trauma?

Most definitely yes.

 

[DeeDee249]

Take a look at the autopsy photos. It will make things much clearer for you. I'd recommend it for anyone who follows this case and posts. They are graphic, but not garish.

 

[cynic]

Take a look at the autopsy photos. It will make things much clearer for you. I'd recommend it for anyone who follows this case and posts. They are graphic, but not garish.

http://crimeshots.com/CrimeScene1.html

 

[sherlockh]

It was only recently I learned more about the oversized panties Jonbenet was found in. Before that I always thought the ransom note made it clear that either Patsy or Burke were involved.

It is now my opinion that the oversized panties show what happened, when it happened and who did it. Patsy used the oversized panties for Jonbenet to wear over the diapers. Some people do this and I can certainly imagine Patsy would do this. Jonbenet went to bed not wearing the oversized panties and no diaper, but then she wet her bed.

Patsy is still up and has to do the cleaning. She is tired and becomes very irritated. She takes off Jonbenets underwear and cleans her roughly. She wants to make sure there is no more bed wetting that night so she takes out a diaper and an oversized panties. Part of the potty training for Jonbenet was always a spanking (i don't believe there was an sexual abuse). Of course, Jonbenet protested and screamed. This is where Patsy loses it, and very violently swings Jonbenet over her knee to give the spanking. If I look at the bathroom pics then it is possible that Patsy sat down on the toilet and spins Jonbenet over her knee so she would hit her head on the bathtub. Because of the spinning motion this would have been with a huge force and caused the head injury. Instantly Jonbenet loses consience. I don't think she ever suffered or realized what happened to her.

One of the first things Patsy would do is to cover the nakedness of her 'dead' child. So she just grabs the oversized panties that are close by. Whether she thinks Jonbenet is already dead I don't know. For sure she realizes the head injury is enormous. She then decides to end her suffering by strangling her child, or the strangling was part of the staging.

Following the panties and diaper theory, there is no way that either Burke and/or John were involved in the accident. It shows that the accident occured right after Jonbenet took off her dirty underwear, and right before she was about to be changed into diapers.

Just my opinion of course.

 

[Lookindreams]

I have read every book since 2006 and PR has so many inconsisitancies.............Tell me again I read in the books over and over that they took the Jeep to the whites but yet PR constantly refers to the gifts as being in the trunk of the car that doesnt make sense to me Jeeps do not have trunks. Also JBR walked into that basement either by force or by herself (whichIMO is stupidity since the window was broken and it was 9 degrees outside..... also PR states that they never used the washing machine and dryer in the basement but after looking at photos the machines have laundry soap bleach etc sitting next to them and the washer top is open.........none of this makes any sense according to PR who stated she would deliver the last basket after the holidays. What was in that basket. Perishables wouldnt last why not just finish? does anyone have any new evidence to answer my questions they are important because if my child was murdered I would never lie about anything and one lie leads to another which completely destoys their crediability

 

[Lookindreams]

Tell me why a dozen yellow roses were put on JBR coffin at the funeral when she was being buried? It wasnt JBR fav color which was purple .......Why not red for love or even white for purity? Why when she was found dead did the family stay at friends homes when PR father had a condo right in town? The abrasion measurements appear to be quite large approx 7-8 inches and I believe I read 1/3/4 and rectangle this was not a flashlight or a golfclub or even a baseball bat.........what was used ?????????any answers

 

[DeeDee249]

Tell me why a dozen yellow roses were put on JBR coffin at the funeral when she was being buried? It wasnt JBR fav color which was purple .......Why not red for love or even white for purity? Why when she was found dead did the family stay at friends homes when PR father had a condo right in town? The abrasion measurements appear to be quite large approx 7-8 inches and I believe I read 1/3/4 and rectangle this was not a flashlight or a golfclub or even a baseball bat.........what was used ?????????any answers

I think you are getting confused. The hole in her head was rectangular and found to be a perfect fit to the edge of the very large flashlight that was found in the R kitchen. (in tests performed by another pathologist, not the one who did JB's autopsy. It was gross neglect that a flashlight found in the home was NOT tested against the hole in JB's skull, especially when the coroner ruled it was the result of blunt force trauma.
The "abrasions on her cheek were small, about the size they would be if they were cigarette burns. (they were never identified as such). The large abrasion you mention, 7-8 inches, was the reddish triangular mark on the front of her throat. This kind of mark is sometimes seen on some (but not all) strangulation victims. It isn't known exactly what caused the one on JB, but it can be caused by the pressure at the point where a ligature s twisted or put the most pressure on the victim's throat.

 

[WHITEFANG]

My theory is that an intruder- or possibly two intruders- had gained entry to the house via the broken basement window, having targeted JonBenet after seeing her perform in the kiddie pageant world. While waiting for the Ramseys to return home the ransom note was written almost as an afterthought, using Ramsey-owned pen and paper, perhaps to confuse the police. JonBenet was removed from her bed and silenced using a stun gun. In the basement she was tortured and killed.

The perps saw her perform and that's when they decided to abuse her, right then? Did one or both have access to the specific financial information referenced in the note?

 

[WHITEFANG]

Could PR have used the word "trunk" in a generic, broad sense to include "the back of a jeep?"
Did the Ramsey's have hired help to do routine chores and cooking?

I have read every book since 2006 and PR has so many inconsisitancies.............Tell me again I read in the books over and over that they took the Jeep to the whites but yet PR constantly refers to the gifts as being in the trunk of the car that doesnt make sense to me Jeeps do not have trunks. Also JBR walked into that basement either by force or by herself (whichIMO is stupidity since the window was broken and it was 9 degrees outside..... also PR states that they never used the washing machine and dryer in the basement but after looking at photos the machines have laundry soap bleach etc sitting next to them and the washer top is open.........none of this makes any sense according to PR who stated she would deliver the last basket after the holidays. What was in that basket. Perishables wouldnt last why not just finish? does anyone have any new evidence to answer my questions they are important because if my child was murdered I would never lie about anything and one lie leads to another which completely destoys their crediability