Meredith Kercher murdered in Perugia, Amanda Knox convicted #3

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jat said:
http://abcnews.go.com/International...t-steve-moore/comments?type=story&id=11541334
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I'm cynical because I've sooooooooo had it up to here with all the talking heads who come out of the woodwork in infamous crimes.

I don't disagree with him on some aspects. I don't know if Amanda is guilty - I suspect she was at least there & a witness to something. However, I also believe the way the evidence, crimescene, interrogation, and even the trial were handled was disgraceful.

Her & Raf's guilt was not proven in a way I'm comfortable with as a human being. There are cases where I feel strongly that the accused is guilty and there are cases where I feel just as strongly that the accused is innocent and then there are these kinds of cases, where if I were a judge or juror, I just couldn't convict them because my faith in the justice system has been compromised.

As much as it may not be fair or even reasonable, this case did reflect poorly on Italy's justice system, whether she's guilty or not. I hope it will be a catalyst for some changes there. And mostly I hope the right people are behind bars.
 
Yes.... she's innocent and ???? Italian justice system. :) Thank you article.
 
nosysw said:
I just saw this on the news...Didn't follow the case closely but if half of what this guy says is true, OMG! Seriously, how could this have happened to an American citizen in another "civilized" country. I guess I missed alot...Would love to hear more from you sleuthers who have followed this- what do you think of this report?
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Totally doo doo! If you read the recently released English translation of the Judge's Motivational report (on Perugia Murder File site) you would see that this guy obviously didn't. His 'view' of the case is limited by his lack of knowledge of the case.
Their appeals (AK and RS) are probably not going to help them any... and the only avenue they really have left is in the court of American public opinion. Which in most cases is presented as an 'injustice' to AK... without really investigation what they (the media) are reporting about.
 
gibby207 said:
Yes.... she's innocent and ???? Italian justice system. :) Thank you article.
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Are you being facetious? If not, you obviously haven't really looked at the case presented :waitasec: or the Judge's report.
 
LadyL said:
I'm cynical because I've sooooooooo had it up to here with all the talking heads who come out of the woodwork in infamous crimes.

I don't disagree with him on some aspects. I don't know if Amanda is guilty - I suspect she was at least there & a witness to something. However, I also believe the way the evidence, crimescene, interrogation, and even the trial were handled was disgraceful.

Her & Raf's guilt was not proven in a way I'm comfortable with as a human being. There are cases where I feel strongly that the accused is guilty and there are cases where I feel just as strongly that the accused is innocent and then there are these kinds of cases, where if I were a judge or juror, I just couldn't convict them because my faith in the justice system has been compromised.

As much as it may not be fair or even reasonable, this case did reflect poorly on Italy's justice system, whether she's guilty or not. I hope it will be a catalyst for some changes there. And mostly I hope the right people are behind bars.
Click to expand...


Well you should be cynical... because he is nothing but a 'talking head'.

You 'don't know if she's guilty' :waitasec: , but 'suspect' she was there???
Then she is GUILTY if she was there. Which of course she stated more than once she was.

*What exactly do you find 'disgraceful'??? Could you be more specific?
Why does if 'reflect badly' on the Italian Justice system? Do you realize that over 12 judges looked at the evidence before the trial to even bring them to trial in the first place? Do you realize that judges and jurors on the panel found them guilty beyond a doubt?

Don't worry over your hopes because the right people are behind bars.
 
nosysw said:
I just saw this on the news...Didn't follow the case closely but if half of what this guy says is true, OMG! Seriously, how could this have happened to an American citizen in another "civilized" country. I guess I missed alot...Would love to hear more from you sleuthers who have followed this- what do you think of this report?
Click to expand...

What do I think? I haven't heard anything that would convince me she was innocent.
I also think her behavior was pretty bizarre. Who smiles when going to court while on trial for murder?
 
jjenny said:
What do I think? I haven't heard anything that would convince me she was innocent.
I also think her behavior was pretty bizarre. Who smiles when going to court while on trial for murder?
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How about her 'all you need is love' Beatles shirt in court? :waitasec:
 
LadyL said:
I'm cynical because I've sooooooooo had it up to here with all the talking heads who come out of the woodwork in infamous crimes.

I don't disagree with him on some aspects. I don't know if Amanda is guilty - I suspect she was at least there & a witness to something. However, I also believe the way the evidence, crimescene, interrogation, and even the trial were handled was disgraceful.

Her & Raf's guilt was not proven in a way I'm comfortable with as a human being. There are cases where I feel strongly that the accused is guilty and there are cases where I feel just as strongly that the accused is innocent and then there are these kinds of cases, where if I were a judge or juror, I just couldn't convict them because my faith in the justice system has been compromised.

As much as it may not be fair or even reasonable, this case did reflect poorly on Italy's justice system, whether she's guilty or not. I hope it will be a catalyst for some changes there. And mostly I hope the right people are behind bars.
Click to expand...

*How did this case reflect poorly on Italy's justice system? Any examples available?

*What 'changes' do you hope are made? Any examples available?

*The Judge's Motivational Report should/would ease some of your worries IMO.
 
I was curious about this case so I purchased a book called "Murder in Italy". The problem with that book is that it was so pro-Amanda that I doubted all the factrs were truly in it. Can anyone recommend a book about this case that isn't so one sided?
 
Ummm....missyjane77....that article was posted about 10 posts up and there is discussion following it. What do you think about that FBI agent's opinion?
 
SleuthyGal said:
Ummm....missyjane77....that article was posted about 10 posts up and there is discussion following it. What do you think about that FBI agent's opinion?
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That's what I get for not paying attention! I happen to agree with the agent; however, I've always been of the opinion that Amanda is innocent.
 
Have either of you read the Judge's Motivational Report? :waitasec:
 
My opinion on the FBI guy is this: he doesn't have a dog in this fight, so to speak. He's not related to AK or anyone else involved. His opinion isn't going to change anything, but hopefully it inspires people to keep asking questions and making sure they understand all the facts in the case. He raises some good points and questions.

I assume he values his reputation, at least to some extent. Therefore, I would also assume his citation of his opinion and why and how he came to it is based on an analysis of the case (as opposed to just reading some media reports, which is what the average layperson does).

He sees a crime scene and handling of a crime scene that doesn't allow him to have confidence in what the Italian prosecutors allege. What he's saying is that the scene + handling + some of the evidence raises reasonable doubt to AK's guilt. He goes further and says he believes AK is innocent of the crime. That's a bold statement for someone with a background in federal law enforcement/investigation....i.e. if I say it then I'm just a joe...errrr josephine schmo saying it. If an ex-FBI person says it, it carries much more weight.

Perhaps our (the U.S.) standards are higher...they might just be...and things the Italian jurors don't see as problems, U.S. experts would cringe over (like the handling of the crime scene, which we know does not follow strict protocol established by forensic standards).

In any event, the fact that a guy with an FBI background, who isn't related to anyone in this case sees issues that for him point to 'not guilty,' is certainly compelling. The FBI is known to be conservative and very pro-law enforcement/pro-prosecution.
 
I' ve always been on the fence about her "real" guilt. But I also have experience with the Italian police system in that we had our passports stolen (this was somewhere in 1982). We were directed to the Caribinieri and I can say they were very professional and very re-assuring.

As to Amanda, as I said I have been on the fence. Going by what I have read, I think she must have been there and hence guilty by way of association. Did she stick a knife in Meredith (pardon the crude way of saying it) I don't know. But she lived in the same house.... and she more or less admitted being there, even thought she was high.
Now I am a frequent visitor to Italy (even now after our passports were stolen on our very first visit in 1982) and I would trust the Caribinieri above anything (certainly would trust them more than the municipal police), but I also know it can be quite intimidating if you don't speak the language. Now I understood that to be the reason that Amanda was in Italy, was to perfect the Italian language. By perfecting I understand she already had a working knowledge of Italian. Please correct me if I'm wrong because I am working from memory here.
 
:)

Irish Frieke, thank you for sharing your perspective based on your experiences in Italy. I did not at all get the impression you based your opinion on Knox's guilt based on those experiences. I think you bring up a good point wondering how well developed Amanda's expressive and receptive abilities with the Italian language were. I have wondered about that myself. Thank you for posting your thoughts:)
 
Here is the link for the English translation of the Motivations Report.

I have read it, but I find it helpful to also look at AK's and RS' appeals at the same time. At one time, I had found a "google-translated" version of them. I can't find it, But this site has links to both of the documents in Italian as well as an English summary of each.

Personally, I found the motivations report fairly arbitrary in what evidence the judges and jury believed, and that which they discarded. To me, that's just not good enough if you are going to convict someone of murder.

FYI, there are a series of articles written by the "FBI guy" on the Injustice in Perugia site. They descibe his thoughts in much more detail than the TV interviews.
 
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