Mexico Mexico - Jenny Chen, 26, Oaxaca, 11 April 2016 #2

[webant]

But from Lilibets figurations. The gps was off 2 hours prior to being in the area of where Jenny was at.

Plus I doubt a company would make it easy for driver's to mess with the gps anytime they want. Especially when they are traveling through corrupt parts of Mexico with a truck load of beer.


But still. We would need to see the itinerary that the company had planned for the driver that day. And what time he made it to those stops. And was he late or early to those stops. Etc etc.

But Jr made it seem like the driver picked up Jenny and then turned off the gps. Which doesn't seem to be the case.

Yes, it looks like the GPS was off 2.5 hours or so before Jenny was reportedly picked up.

Reading the article that Lilibet linked to a page or so back, it looks like drivers can in fact turn off the GPS, which I would think could be grounds for being fired (unless the driver was well connected and protected).

 

[Lilibet]

And the truck in question was "coincidentally" sold. What "odd" timing.
LE should find that truck, grab some luminol and get busy.

Since it appears from Kugar's website that they own the trucks, I'm beginning to think Kugar quickly sold the truck when they realized that their driver was probably involved in a crime. And I would not be at all surprised if Kugar deleted the eight hours on the GPS during which Jenny was picked up by their driver and went missing. Kugar is owned by a powerful company with political connections, according to a FB comment...rumor I know. But they would not want this kind of publicity. A little mordida (bribe) to LE and there will be no luminol or GPS check.
"Money doesn't talk. It swears." Bob Dylan

 

[DexterMorgan]

Did the witness say what time Jenny got in the truck? I thought she went in a store and seen the atm was out of funds?

Now he wants a detail timeline of the driver which is understandable.

But I don't see him telling us the detail timeline that his witnesses gave him.

Example. What time did Jenny grab her Cancun sign and head out. What time did she go to get cash before realizing for herself that the machine was out of cash. What time did the truck pull up.

Now she got to the peoples house around midnight on the 12th and stayed to morning or afternoon while teaching them Chinese and waiting for the ride that the host promised her.

But how long did she wait before getting frustrated and taking off.

And was this ride suppose to take her to Cancun which is fairly far.

Idk. But I still think the last people to see her would be on my radar.

Jmo.

 

[Lilibet]

It looks to me like the truck GPS recording stops at 11:30 in Matias Romero Avendano. Have you found another place by that name in Veracruz and if yes, is it 127km from any of the Santa Marias in Oaxaca? When I google search 'Matias Romero Avendano Sayula de Aleman' all that comes up for me is the Matias Romero Avendano on the map that I posted.

The distance from Sayula de Aleman in Veracruz to Matias Romero Avedano is 130km. The distance, via Hwy 185, from Sayula de Aleman to Juchitan is 187km, which doesn't match the GPS log's 127km.

There are a number of locations in the area of Juchitan with the name of Santa Maria (or part of) and most of these are in the 127km range from the Matias Romero Avedano on the map I posted. Maybe a trip from Matias Romero Avendano down to the coast and then up to Santa Maria Guienagita would be 127km?

I wish we had the actual GPS coordinates.

On this map, the distance between Matias Romero Avendano Sayula de Aleman, Veracruz and Oaxaca Juchitán de Zaragoza - Santa María Guienagati 2674 is 122 km, 2 hours 5 minutes on 185. Pretty close to 127 depending on route. I managed a screenshot.
See link below.

https://www.google.com/maps/dir/Mat...1!1s0x8595553aa2b0d937:0xb0f2df428f149e64!3e0

 

[webant]

On this map, the distance between Matias Romero Avendano Sayula de Aleman, Veracruz and Oaxaca Juchitán de Zaragoza - Santa María Guienagati 2674 is 122 km, 2 hours 5 minutes on 185. Pretty close to 127 depending on route. I managed a screenshot.

That is obviously it. Ouch! And, the log states 123.5km, not 127 (I missed that too). So it looks like there was no detour, as all the kms are accounted for. Jenny was picked up reportedly at 2pm, so there are what, 4-5 hours between then and when the GPS came back online? But not much distance traveled during those 4-5 hours. We can't be sure that Jenny was out of the truck by the time the GPS came back online either. That scenario makes sence, but it isn't a certainty.

 

[GigTu]

Lillibet, it's time for us to bow down to you. Thank you for the map!

 

[webant]

Since it appears from Kugar's website that they own the trucks, I'm beginning to think Kugar quickly sold the truck when they realized that their driver was probably involved in a crime. And I would not be at all surprised if Kugar deleted the eight hours on the GPS during which Jenny was picked up by their driver and went missing. Kugar is owned by a powerful company with political connections, according to a FB comment...rumor I know. But they would not want this kind of publicity. A little mordida (bribe) to LE and there will be no luminol or GPS check.
"Money doesn't talk. It swears." Bob Dylan

And if that is true, how reliable is the 'GPS data' log that they have turned over? If they could delete items from that log, could they also add or alter items? If yes, then why would they leave an obvious gap like that missing 8 hours?

Maybe they can delete but not add or alter; but this doesn't make sence because if they (Kugar) deleted the missing 8 hours, wouldn't they have also needed to insert the 123.5km where we see it now (5th line down on Page 2 of the log)? I say this because it seems likely (a certainty?) that if the now missing 8 hours had reached Kugar intact, there would have been a different distance traveled appearing on that 5th line of the log's Page 2, due to events taken place during those previous 8 hours. Wouldn't even just the truck stopping to pick up Jenny have changed that 123.5km number on the 5th line of the log's Page 2? Does this point to the driver as being the one responsible for the log's missing 8 hours?

Hopefully there will be actual GPS coordinates available from Qualcomm Headquarters in the future (this might also clear up where in the chain of data collection those missing 8 hours were lost).

 

[DexterMorgan]

If the company said they sold the truck; Then I'm sure they have a bill of sales receipt and documents to prove it. Which the p.i or lawyer can easily track down.

Now if the company wanted to just get rid of the truck; They could have easily set it on fire for the insurance or say it was hijacked by the cartel or something.

So would a corrupt company sell a truck which has a paper trail. Or would they simply get rid of it and report it stolen?

But anyways. If they sold the truck then hopefully JRs team will find the new owner and have the truck sprayed with luminol.

 

[Lilibet]

That is obviously it. Ouch! And, the log states 123.5km, not 127 (I missed that too). So it looks like there was no detour, as all the kms are accounted for. Jenny was picked up reportedly at 2pm, so there are what, 4-5 hours between then and when the GPS came back online? But not much distance traveled during those 4-5 hours. We can't be sure that Jenny was out of the truck by the time the GPS came back online either. That scenario makes sence, but it isn't a certainty.

No "ouches," Webant. You're doing great. I hadn't thought about the fact that Jenny may have still been in the truck when the GPS came back on. That's certainly a possibility.

Now help me out with this puzzle. Based on JR's answer to a comment on HFJ about JS, the driver listed on the GPS info, I get the impression that JS is the driver with the family. Someone asks if JS has been questioned by police. JR says that JS says he was part of a convoy and with his family. JR says the convoy story was proven inaccurate.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/hel...=678780825630298&comment_tracking={"tn":"R0"}

So if there was no convoy, why are we looking at family guy's GPS records? Since JR released the GPS records of JS, are we to assume he IS the driver who picked up Jenny? Why release the GPS records of the family guy and not the driver who picked up Jenny? If they were not in a convoy, how could the family guy cover for the single guy as stated in the press release?

Here is what the press release says. It doesn't really clear this up for me. No mention of the second driver being interviewed in June, but JR feels one driver is covering for the other. We really need to see both GPS records.

The initial prosecutor’s team went to interview the two truck driversfrom Kugar (Truck Company) these were drivers who were in the area that Jenny was picked up. The first driver said he was in a convoy with another driver, and he could not “was with his family” so it was impossible to fit Jenny in his cab. This was accepted by the police, and they moved on to random Chinese girl sightings throughout Southeast Mexico.

The transport company representatives told me that according to their GPS records, neither driver one stopped at the area where Jenny was picked up. Also if they did stop, (even if the engine was running, there would be a GPS alert. This is due to the amount of truck robberies in this area. The company will know if something is wrong of the truck takes an unscheduled stop. This is inconsistent with one truck driver’s testimony that accepted that he stopped and waited for 15 minutes in that crossing.

-We have two drivers who were driving in the time an area that Jenny disappeared. They said they were in a convoy, and one claims he was driving with his family; but the GPS shows there were not in convoy.
-It seems to me that one driver is covering the other and they have both initially refused polygraph tests.

If JS IS family guy, and WASN'T in a convoy, what relevance are these records? Or is this just JR's fuzzy communication on FB...again raising more questions. I know I'm missing something. Help!

 

[Lilibet]

If the company said they sold the truck; Then I'm sure they have a bill of sales receipt and documents to prove it. Which the p.i or lawyer can easily track down.

Now if the company wanted to just get rid of the truck; They could have easily set it on fire for the insurance or say it was hijacked by the cartel or something.

So would a corrupt company sell a truck which has a paper trail. Or would they simply get rid of it and report it stolen?

But anyways. If they sold the truck then hopefully JRs team will find the new owner and have the truck sprayed with luminol.

Good points, Dex. If the truck was sold for legitimate reasons, there should be a paper trail. But if the company is corrupt, a paper trail could be obscured by forging new documents. Let's hope the corruption I suspect isn't the case and this truck can be tracked down.

 

[tarabull]

Lillibet, it's time for us to bow down to you. Thank you for the map!

YES! --- Thanks for all you do Lilibet!

:bow:

Bowing to YOU!

Where would we be without YOU!

(Quite a collaboration here!!!)

:hug: all around!

Where are you Jenny?!?!

:candle:

 

[Lilibet]

:blushing: Tarabull, GigTu and other dear ones...

It's all about teamwork...working together. I never cease to be amazed by the brilliant minds and caring hearts on WS. We bring out the best in each other. I hope we can help find Jenny somehow.

:yourock:

 

[Satchie]

But Jr made it seem like the driver picked up Jenny and then turned off the gps. Which doesn't seem to be the case.

When I read the press release, I immediately interpreted it as implying the gps data had been tampered with after the fact. It makes perfect sense to me that this would be done at the behest of local Corona/Kugar staff to protect their jobs (truckers aren't supposed to pick up hitch hikers, for eg) and keep out police/bad publicity. Not necessarily on orders from Corona/Kugar senior execs .

 

[Lilibet]

When I read the press release, I immediately interpreted it as implying the gps data had been tampered with after the fact. It makes perfect sense to me that this would be done at the behest of local Corona/Kugar staff to protect their jobs (truckers aren't supposed to pick up hitch hikers, for eg) and keep out police/bad publicity. Not necessarily on orders from Corona/Kugar senior execs .

I agree completely. Perhaps the possible two hour part of the gap before Jenny was picked up was Kugar making sure more time was missing than needed. There are other gaps as Dex pointed out that might be there to make the eight hours less suspicious. That makes more sense to me than the driver turning off the GPS two or so hours before he even encountered Jenny.

 

[DexterMorgan]

Did the cement mixer truck drop Jenny off at the host's house that night?

Did he drop her off somewhere near by at night and she came across strangers that were going to let her stay for the night since it was late?

Btw. I also agree with Lilibet about needing to see the other drivers gps to compare how the data looks.

Because I think Jr seen both but picked the one with the most missing data.

Also. If the guy was with his family. Then of course he may turn off gps when dropping them off or having a family outting on company time. So the family story can be plausible and related to why the gps data skips.

Now I truly wonder if maybe the ride did come and pick Jenny up from the hosts residents.

And the family may be covering since they know something. Maybe they took her to the atm and seen the Corona truck. And after things went awry. They decided to say she caught a ride with the truck. Idk.

But he definitely states the truck area is dangerous. So I would guess the area where Jenny stayed was dangerous as well.

So I just can't believe that she vanished after only being at this residents for 13hrs or so.

Jmo for now. I'm not fully sold on the story the hosts has given thus far.

 

[webant]

No "ouches," Webant. You're doing great. I hadn't thought about the fact that Jenny may have still been in the truck when the GPS came back on. That's certainly a possibility.

Now help me out with this puzzle. Based on JR's answer to a comment on HFJ about JS, the driver listed on the GPS info, I get the impression that JS is the driver with the family. Someone asks if JS has been questioned by police. JR says that JS says he was part of a convoy and with his family. JR says the convoy story was proven inaccurate.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/hel...=678780825630298&comment_tracking={"tn":"R0"}

So if there was no convoy, why are we looking at family guy's GPS records? Since JR released the GPS records of JS, are we to assume he IS the driver who picked up Jenny? Why release the GPS records of the family guy and not the driver who picked up Jenny? If they were not in a convoy, how could the family guy cover for the single guy as stated in the press release?

Here is what the press release says. It doesn't really clear this up for me. No mention of the second driver being interviewed in June, but JR feels one driver is covering for the other. We really need to see both GPS records.

The initial prosecutor’s team went to interview the two truck driversfrom Kugar (Truck Company) these were drivers who were in the area that Jenny was picked up. The first driver said he was in a convoy with another driver, and he could not “was with his family” so it was impossible to fit Jenny in his cab. This was accepted by the police, and they moved on to random Chinese girl sightings throughout Southeast Mexico.

The transport company representatives told me that according to their GPS records, neither driver one stopped at the area where Jenny was picked up. Also if they did stop, (even if the engine was running, there would be a GPS alert. This is due to the amount of truck robberies in this area. The company will know if something is wrong of the truck takes an unscheduled stop. This is inconsistent with one truck driver’s testimony that accepted that he stopped and waited for 15 minutes in that crossing.

-We have two drivers who were driving in the time an area that Jenny disappeared. They said they were in a convoy, and one claims he was driving with his family; but the GPS shows there were not in convoy.
-It seems to me that one driver is covering the other and they have both initially refused polygraph tests.

If JS IS family guy, and WASN'T in a convoy, what relevance are these records? Or is this just JR's fuzzy communication on FB...again raising more questions. I know I'm missing something. Help!

I have more questions than answers. JR's press release does seem "fuzzy" (surprisingly so to me).

JR did state that this is the 'GPS' log of the truck that his PI feels is most likely to have picked up Jenny. As for whether or not JS is the driver with the family in his truck, I don't have a feel for that at this time.

The company reportedly states that neither driver stopped in the area where Jenny was picked up, but one driver said he was stopped there for 15 minutes. To me, this is a big and possibly important contradiction. A driver who claims to have been stopped in that area, seems like a driver who would not have disabled his GPS unit. Which driver is making this claim, JS with the missing 8 hours, or the other driver?

JR has stated that the GPS units in those trucks record position every 5 minutes (or something to that effect?), but that is not what we see in the log, which might be a condensed version of the actual GPS recording.

What value is this 'GPS' log? I'm not sure, but less than the actual GPS coordinates of the log, independently supplied and translated. But it is all we have to work with at this time.

Possibly of more solid evidence would be a forensic examination of the missing (sold) truck. And, whatever cell phone records that might exist for the trucks in question (compared against the 'GPS' log).

 

[webant]

I have more questions than answers. JR's press release does seem "fuzzy" (surprisingly so to me).
.

from JR's press release:
"Early morning on April 12[SUP]th[/SUP] 2016, Jenny arrived at Lagunas crossing from Oaxaca by hitching a ride with a cement mixer. A shop keeper, who is also a witness was kind enough to welcome Jenny into their home to stay the night. Jenny only had 40 peso’s and was in the need of a bank ATM. The next morning, Jenny showered, and ate with the shop keeper’s family. "

Doesn't this imply that Jenny would have started hitch hiking on the 13th? And yet the missing 8 hours are on the 12th. Is this just a typo error?

and again from the press release:
"Once hearing this information, I immediately flew to Mexico and met with these witnesses. They showed me a pad of paper that Jenny was teaching the family Chinese writing, in which Jenny had written her name. There is no doubt Jenny was there on April 12[SUP]th[/SUP]. "

There is a 3 hour 'window' in the 'GPS' log on the 13th, from 1:40pm to 4:40pm.

 

[Claudius]

I have more questions than answers. JR's press release does seem "fuzzy" (surprisingly so to me).

JR did state that this is the 'GPS' log of the truck that his PI feels is most likely to have picked up Jenny. As for whether or not JS is the driver with the family in his truck, I don't have a feel for that at this time.

The company reportedly states that neither driver stopped in the area where Jenny was picked up, but one driver said he was stopped there for 15 minutes. To me, this is a big and possibly important contradiction. A driver who claims to have been stopped in that area, seems like a driver who would not have disabled his GPS unit. Which driver is making this claim, JS with the missing 8 hours, or the other driver?

JR has stated that the GPS units in those trucks record position every 5 minutes (or something to that effect?), but that is not what we see in the log, which might be a condensed version of the actual GPS recording.

What value is this 'GPS' log? I'm not sure, but less than the actual GPS coordinates of the log, independently supplied and translated. But it is all we have to work with at this time.

Possibly of more solid evidence would be a forensic examination of the missing (sold) truck. And, whatever cell phone records that might exist for the trucks in question (compared against the 'GPS' log).

I agree with you, and am surprised that he's had this much information for this long, and his press release is this "fuzzy." It says that she woke up, showered, ate breakfast with the family, then waited "several hours" for a ride. Then it says she was picked up in the "early hours" by the Corona truck. I may have missed it, but does he say what time the witnesses saw her enter the truck? So sorry if it's already been discussed.

If the truck really was sold, I wonder what the normal turnover rate is for trucks in trucking companies. Did they sell other trucks around the same time? Maybe they are downsizing? The strikes are causing a lot of distribution problems in the area, and there were rumors that Modelo will stop production in Oaxaca, but the company disputed those rumors.

http://aristeguinoticias.com/0107/mexico/cerveceria-modelo-presenta-problemas-de-distribucion-en-oaxaca/

The discrepancy that Webant pointed out above (company denies they were in the area, and driver says he was there for 15 min) is suspicious to me. It's all so unconventional, I wonder if the same people interviewed all parties, or if there was a communication problem. JR only talks about one of the drivers being interviewed - what about the other one? Maybe I'm having reading comprehension issues.

Thanks to all WSers who have been breaking this down. It's certainly getting confusing!

 

[Claudius]

from JR's press release:
"Early morning on April 12[SUP]th[/SUP] 2016, Jenny arrived at Lagunas crossing from Oaxaca by hitching a ride with a cement mixer. A shop keeper, who is also a witness was kind enough to welcome Jenny into their home to stay the night. Jenny only had 40 peso’s and was in the need of a bank ATM. The next morning, Jenny showered, and ate with the shop keeper’s family. "

Doesn't this imply that Jenny would have started hitch hiking on the 13th? And yet the missing 8 hours are on the 12th. Is this just a typo error?

and again from the press release:
"Once hearing this information, I immediately flew to Mexico and met with these witnesses. They showed me a pad of paper that Jenny was teaching the family Chinese writing, in which Jenny had written her name. There is no doubt Jenny was there on April 12[SUP]th[/SUP]. "

There is a 3 hour 'window' in the 'GPS' log on the 13th, from 1:40pm to 4:40pm.

Thank you! I guess I was having reading comprehension issues. He doesn't say she was picked up by the Corona truck in the early morning. From the above, it does sound like she was last seen on the 13th and not the 12th. Hopefully somebody who is a HFJ member can ask him to clarify.

 

[Satchie]

Rats, lost a long reply.

Looking at the table, I think it primarily records the events of the truck being turned off and on, rather than specifically gps locations.

When the truck is turned off, it records the distance that was travelled since the truck was turned on. When it is turned on, it records the amount of time since it was turned off, when the truck was supposed to be moving.

It often just notes the route the truck is on between location A (eg Tierra Blanca) and location B (eg Sayula de Aleman), ie in this example Highway 145.

I don't think the data is missing between 11:30 am and 7:14 pm, the driver just had the truck on that whole time, but travelled only 123 km until reaching the company depot in Juchitlan de Zaragoza to unload (DESCARGA).

So the data usn't missing, but info about what the driver was doing is. Drivers usually leave the trucks idling while they sleep at truck spots, so that's possible, except that the driver presumably slept between 2 and 8 am, when the truck was on without travelling far.

Part of the time could have been the protest roadblock mentioned by witnesses. Or something else.

I'd put more time into this, but not right now.