GUILTY MI - 4 students killed, 6 injured, Oxford High School shooting, 30 Nov 2021 *Arrest incl parents* *teen guilty* #5

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Thank you to everyone for posting the daily updates! I have not been able to watch the trial and it’s very much appreciated.

Is anyone here familiar with the book by Dr. M. Scott Peck, “The People of the Lie: The Hope for Healing Human Evil”?

He recounts some cases he encountered as a psychiatrist where he felt he encountered true evil. In one family he worked with, the oldest son had committed suicide with a gun. The younger brother, Bobby, fell into a depression and started acting out. For Christmas that year, his parents gave him the same gun that his brother had used to kill himself. They had all kinds of excuses for doing that—for example they said they couldn’t afford anything else.

Basically, they were enabling Bobby to do the same thing his brother had done.

It gives me chills to think about and it’s what I think every time I hear that JC lied and said that EC’s friend had killed himself. Was she in a way giving the message to EC to do what she claimed his friend had done?

Hopefully, she is not pure evil, and I’m just glad she will never be able to have another child (due to her age)

I could be way off base, but wanted to share.

“Dr. M. Scott Peck brilliantly probes into the essence of human evil.

People who are evil attack others instead of facing their own failures. Peck demonstrates the havoc these people of the lie work in the lives of those around them. He presents, from vivid incidents encountered in his psychiatric practice, examples of evil in everyday life.

This book is by turns disturbing, fascinating, and altogether impossible to put down as it offers a strikingly original approach to the age-old problem of human evil.”

Totally this. One of Peck's main points is that the "people of the lie" see what their child needs, and choose the opposite. This is evil in the context of child development, and exactly what we have here. There's nothing more egregious IMO than ignoring your son's explicit cries for help (seriously, how could he have been more explicit?), and prioritizing horses over taking care of him.

I actually think Ethan is better off in prison, although this might be an unpopular opinion. He has structure, he has people around, he'll have consistent meals, a schedule, some help even if meager, know what's required of him; these are all things Brown's expert on juvie in the Ferriter trial are essential, and have not been part of his life. I also hope he gets to develop his brains; he seems to have done well at school, and prison has offerings.
 
Plus they were feeding it to Ethan, without any concern, evidently, with how it might affect him mentally, his decision-making, etc. It's not a drug to play around with. And teens can have totally different reactions to psychotropic medications than adults (some make them suicidal).
Teens do take empty liquor bottles from parents and display them in their rooms so the empty liquor bottle photoed by LE on the side of EC's bed could have been that or he could have been drinking from it?
When he and his 1/2 brother Eli ,(from Florida) who was staying with them in Michigan ,worked at a local diner where EC picked up shifts here and there Eli got caught smoking pot.
The adult who caught him said they were calling his parents and Eli answered "where do you think I got it from?
There's also a morning text between parents after a bad night with EC (fight with parents) who woke up in their bed and asked father how he got there.
James had texted Jennifer that Eli doesn't feel good and looks like he had too much to drink last night, James asked her if she gave him and Xanax and she said no, a Melatolin.
Looks like or did EC have too much to drink the night before?

Bottom line is that it appears that drugs and booze were in house staples and JC had accused EC of being on drugs, according to EC's text to his buddy,
 


I actually think Ethan is better off in prison, although this might be an unpopular opinion. He has structure, he has people around, he'll have consistent meals, a schedule, some help even if meager, know what's required of him; these are all things Brown's expert on juvie in the Ferriter trial are essential, and have not been part of his life. I also hope he gets to develop his brains; he seems to have done well at school, and prison has offerings.
When EC was sentenced Judge Rowe mentioned that EC had been caught on a hacked device(?) looking at violent pictures or a violent video, I forgot which one.
 
Totally this. One of Peck's main points is that the "people of the lie" see what their child needs, and choose the opposite. This is evil in the context of child development, and exactly what we have here. There's nothing more egregious IMO than ignoring your son's explicit cries for help (seriously, how could he have been more explicit?), and prioritizing horses over taking care of him.

I actually think Ethan is better off in prison, although this might be an unpopular opinion. He has structure, he has people around, he'll have consistent meals, a schedule, some help even if meager, know what's required of him; these are all things Brown's expert on juvie in the Ferriter trial are essential, and have not been part of his life. I also hope he gets to develop his brains; he seems to have done well at school, and prison has offerings.
I found the info.

Oxford High School shooter Ethan Crumbley looked up ...

1706850866498.jpeg
FOX 2 Detroit
https://www.fox2detroit.com › news › oxford-high-sch...



Jul 27, 2023 — ... Ethan Crumbley was caught illegally accessing a website known to show murder, torture, and more violent content on a jail-issued tablet.
 
I found the info.

Oxford High School shooter Ethan Crumbley looked up ...

View attachment 480080
FOX 2 Detroit
https://www.fox2detroit.com › news › oxford-high-sch...



Jul 27, 2023 — ... Ethan Crumbley was caught illegally accessing a website known to show murder, torture, and more violent content on a jail-issued tablet.
"He was given a tablet to use (to get his) GED (and) there are several reasons they're allowed to use it for. He was allowed to access the internet and he immediately went to a website that we know to be about real death, killings," Willis said.

During a hearing in February 2022, details about the tablet were revealed. It was to be shared among inmates and help minors with their education.

Willis said Crumbley was able to figure out how to bypass security and access more than the intended content, which led him to the website – which was not named in court. '


Oxford High School shooter Ethan Crumbley looked up ...

View attachment 480080
FOX 2 Detroit
https://www.fox2detroit.com › news › oxford-high-sch...
 
Scroll down to:

"Specific request"​

  • "4:37 p.m. Thursday"

If JC sticks to her original statement when cross examined by the prosecution regarding her communication with her attorney, will the prosecution then take action to interrogate Attorney Smith? And, if so, how would they do that? Would they impeach JC's attorney?
 
When EC was sentenced Judge Rowe mentioned that EC had been caught on a hacked device(?) looking at violent pictures or a violent video, I forgot which one.
That might be an issue for him until the end of time.

Also, in my experience, sometimes it can be an obsession to re-visit scenarios you've lived through. Here's a benign example: I almost drowned as a kid. I am scared to death of the ocean. Now, I compulsively watch competitive surfing. The waves are terrifying. I LOVE watching surfing.

Murderers often re-visit murder scenes. Many people who have suffered violent events go over and over them (this is a symptom of PTSD) in their heads.

While it's true Ethan might have had a history of killing animals (one that we know of?), it seems to me obsessions and compulsions, and the drive to re-visit bad experiences, are VERY complicated, and not available to just one interpretation.
 
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If JC sticks to her original statement when cross examined by the prosecution regarding her communication with her attorney, will the prosecution then take action to interrogate Attorney Smith? And, if so, how would they do that? Would they impeach JC's attorney?
The prosecutor did mention the State Bar Ethics in regards to that.

Smith apparently told LE she hadn't had contact or a response from them, yet texts proved she had been in contact within two or three minutes of telling LE she hadn't.
 
Articles with some recap from yesterday.


 
I need the full picture. Could only watch snippets. I plan to catch up tonight.
Nice of you to be interested in my opinion.

I am very interested in your opinions. Could you tell us what you think of her testimony?
I put my impressions in this post but they may be too harsh.

I do think Shannon Smith has done quite a good job with the image. She's only 45 and she's been dressed and presents as if she's much older. Granny Crumbley, favorite hobbies - board games, carving pumpkins, family camping trips and wholesome activities.

Hope that the jury had time to take notes with plenty of question marks and also reflect on JC's performance over night before the barrage starts up again on Day 7. ( Smith's antics might make it hard for jurors to focus on complex evidence and hold their train of thought because of all the small explosions, smoke and mirrors in the courtroom. )
 
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I thought it may be worthwhile to revisit an open letter Jennifer posted to former president Trump. The thoughts expressed do not really match up with some of the things she's said on the stand. Granted, it is from 2016.


Here is a link to the actual post, available in archive form. NSFW language.

Some relevant snippets, imo, my comments in blue


I have high hopes you will shut down Big Pharma, make health care affordable for me and my MIDDLE CLASS family again. So did they have health insurance consistently for Ethan or not?

As a female and a Realtor, thank you for allowing my right to bear arms. Allowing me to be protected if I show a home to someone with bad intentions. Per her testimony, guns aren't really her thing. Did she regularly carry while showing homes?


I need you to stop common core. My son struggles daily, and my teachers tell me they hate teaching it but the HAVE to. Claimed Ethan was a fairly decent student, did not mention daily struggles with learning while on the stand.

My husband suffered a stroke and a broken back and we were with just my income. Do you know how hard it is to support a family on only $40,000 a year? Is the broken back/stroke true?
 
If JC sticks to her original statement when cross examined by the prosecution regarding her communication with her attorney, will the prosecution then take action to interrogate Attorney Smith? And, if so, how would they do that? Would they impeach JC's attorney?
AFAIK the state cannot do that without causing a mistrial.
An attorney cannot wear two hats, can't testify as a witness while also representing their client in the same trial
 
'My husband suffered a stroke and a broken back and we were with just my income.'
!
I thought JC said yesterday that her husband lost his job during covid ( Please correct this if you can recall what she said more accurately. Would rather not have to rewatch Day 6 to find the timestamp )

If in fact, JC is a prolific liar, why wouldn't the state want to use that?
 
'My husband suffered a stroke and a broken back and we were with just my income.'
!
I thought JC said yesterday that her husband lost his job during covid ( Please correct this if you can recall what she said more accurately. Would rather not have to rewatch Day 6 to find the timestamp )

If in fact, JC is a prolific liar, why wouldn't the state want to use that?
I'm confused on James' work history as well. I also thought she said he lost his job during Covid, but is this job the same job??? And he was doing DoorDash at the time of the shooting.
 
I put my impressions in this post but they may be too harsh.

I do think Shannon Smith has done quite a good job with the image. She's only 45 and she's been dressed and presents as if she's much older. Granny Crumbley, favorite hobbies - board games, carving pumpkins, family camping trips and wholesome activities.

Hope that the jury had time to take notes with plenty of question marks and also reflect on JC's performance over night before the barrage starts up again on Day 7. ( Smith's antics might make it hard for jurors to focus on complex evidence and hold their train of thought because of all the small explosions, smoke and mirrors in the courtroom. )
Thank you, thank you. Well said.
Smith needs an “I’m sorry” jar. IMO
 
An old link - not trial evidence - but just some context because Jennifer testified yesterday on his use of Ouija board from age ten and his later interest in horror, spooks etc.

Lori Dow told KIRO Radio’s Gee and Ursula Show that her son would play with Ethan when they were 5-6 years old. At that time, the Crumbley family lived in Issaquah.

“We mentioned we were going to get our son home to go to bed and they said, ‘Oh, Ethan won’t go to bed for hours. He puts himself to bed,'” Dow said about Crumbley’s parents.
“He would just decide on his own bedtime, go to bed at 2 or 3 in the morning sometimes. If he was too tired for school, [his mom] would just call him in sick,” she added.

Dow says he seemed to be exposed to violence from a young age as well, from what she knew.
“He was watching horror, like pretty serious horror movies with his parents even at 5 years old, things like ‘Saw.’ He would play first-person shooter games, like Call of Duty, and that was perfectly fine with them,” she said.

“He was essentially being treated just like another resident in the house and not a child that needed structure, and rules, and protection from violent things at that early age,” she said.

Dow said she never allowed her son to be at Ethan’s house without her or her husband present.

At school, Dow said Ethan started getting into fights at a young age and not listening to his teachers, which she says his mom blamed on the teachers.

She admitted that she was relieved when the family moved away, though they remained acquaintances through social media.

“I’m not a psychologist, but it was almost like he was being desensitized to feeling painful things or stressful situations,” Dow said, citing one video the parents posted to social media as an example.
In the video, Dow explains, Ethan’s parents told him he could earn $100 if he ate a huge spoonful of really hot horseradish without reacting or crying. Dow says as he was eating it, the parents would laugh.
Ethan’s family also had guns at the home, Dow explained, which her family found out after asking questions. The Crumbley family wasn’t comfortable, Dow says, sharing how the guns were secured, but she later found out they were not secured.

 
I'm confused on James' work history as well. I also thought she said he lost his job during Covid, but is this job the same job??? And he was doing DoorDash at the time of the shooting.

James Crumbley Jobs:

November 11, 2016 - Jennifer posts an open letter to Trump and says in the letter:

"My husband suffered a stroke and a broken back and we were with just my income."


2017 - Advantzware ___ Telemarketer ___ A Florida-based software company where James worked remotely from his home in Michigan generating sales leads.

2020 - Covid ___ James was furloughed from his job as a telemarketer right after the pandemic hit.

February 2021 - James started working at a San Francisco-based security technology company, according to his now-deleted Facebook profile.

 
It's no wonder to me that people's (especially toyboy) opinions changed as lies were exposed and more information about the Crumbley's came out. Sometimes, probably usually, you only see some sides of people and who they are is not who they originally appeared to be. JMO.
I do think some people are missing a chip, grey matter…there are many theories. They are self absorbed & it’s very important their created image is upheld . Children are appliances that should -preform - to make the parent look good. IMO she gave up on him a long time ago. I know ppl of this ilk . They just busy themselves in things that support their ego. Maybe throw the disappointing child a bone once in awhile.
Indeed they live the dark lie.
If something “stupid” happens they have no conscience .They see themselves as a victim. She has been projecting, blame shifting & gaslighting pretty much her entire testimony with the help of Smith setting the narrative .
Cant wait for the cross . Hope we see her true side as she is exposed.

Moo
 
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