MI MI - Julia Niswender, 23, EMU student, Ypsilanti, 10 Dec 2012 - #3

[Spellbound]

I know that many people have mentioned the suspected abuse and allegations dating all the way back to the family's days of living in Gaylord. I have a question. Since Grandma and Grandpa had custody of the twins until the year 2000.... why was there no further petition the court to get the girls back by grandma and grandpa?

http://www.co.monroe.mi.us/egov/probate/Default.aspx - Type in the last name Niswender - hit search

I have no idea what I am reading on those pages. Sorry.

Perhaps the grandparents accepted the report findings at the time and hoped all was well in the family household.

 

[DazednConfuzed09]

I have no idea what I am reading on those pages. Sorry.

Perhaps the grandparents accepted the report findings at the time and hoped all was well in the family household.

5/18/98 – grandparents accept appointment as guardian and continues through 2000.
2/2000 – end of guardianship

No further petitions for guardianship for ANY reason. It leaves me with questions as the alleged abuse seemed to be rather disturbing. Records from Probate would never be deleted as they are governed by State law.

 

[Spellbound]

She was NEVER carrying around the images. What she was carrying was the "discovery packet" because at that time she would have been the one doing the most communication with JT's attorney.

Thanks for clearing that up. It makes more sense than how I understood it.

I don't accept it (yet) as a fact that Julia allegedly reported abuse at her school and that the school contacted CPS. This info was posted by 4ist but I have my doubts. It is not publicly known who the anonymous accuser was. It is unclear how she could have possibly known this. 4ist did not yet have the opportunity to explain where this information came from, but until then I won't accept it as a fact, and don't consider it a "red flag" (yet).

As I understand it, there was a curtain instead of a door. The reason for this is less clear. If the reason was, so that JT could peek at the children while they were taking a shower, then, of course this is a red flag. If the reason was something else, then it may not be a red flag. Perhaps we should hear JT"s reason for having a curtain instead of a door.


From the interviews that I have seen, the family seems close and loving. So no red flag for me.

It is OK that we have different views on this. Glad we can be civil, anyway. Thank you for sharing your thoughts.

 

[rosesfromangels]

Tlcya – WS Forum Moderator 4-27-15 12:37 pm Post #696 Chelsea Brock #4 forum
James Turnquist is a named POI in Julia's case but has not been named or even remotely suggest as one by LE in Chelsea's case. Thanks. - Has this changed???

Technically there has never been mention of JT being a POI or a suspect of any sort with Chelsea or did I miss that news report? If this is new information, I thought it was to be accompanied with a link. Would you kindly post a link please. Thank you.

For the benefit of all, I am going to recommend strongly that we continue to examine any and all connections the Niswender and Bruck girls had. We just might find some additional insights. We may be missing something obvious right under our noses.
And I mean in general, not specific to the POI in the Niswender case. We need to get out of specific "camps" and look around more. Connect dots.

 

[DazednConfuzed09]

For the benefit of all, I am going to recommend strongly that we continue to examine any and all connections the Niswender and Bruck girls had. We just might find some additional insights. We may be missing something obvious right under our noses.
And I mean in general, not specific to the POI in the Niswender case. We need to get out of specific "camps" and look around more. Connect dots.

I agree with you that we can sleuth about their connections outside of JT.

 

[rosesfromangels]

I agree with you that we can sleuth about their connections outside of JT.

I think it's very important we do so, but we need more insights from the girls. I would like to chart every mutual touch point right down to their dentists, hair stylists, grocery stores, you name it. Examine common touch points, and then identify any insights that arise from that. Perhaps the girls or LE are already doing this. I feel so strongly it should be done.

 

[TigerBalm]

I know we had discussed the fact that that JT was being investigated in early November 2012 on an earlier thread, but I have to ask; if the first Tournquist computer was not given to LE until December 2014, WHAT did LE have that prompted an investigation in November 2012? WHO/WHAT initiated the 2012 investigation?

ETA: Was it from the Grandma's accusations?

Not sure where anyone stated Turnquist was being investigated in early November 2012, media reported the alleged offense date was in November 2012, see video attached.

http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/2...n-of-interest-after-murder-of-julia-niswender

 

[TigerBalm]

My understanding of the bathroom door is this - JT and KT moved to a home in Gaylord on what most would consider a temporary basis ( 2-4 months ) This was not to be a long term address - they did this because JT had a chance to improve himself in employment, when that fell thru they began the process of coming back down to Monroe. The door was not TAKEN off by JT or KT - but in fact was off the hinges when they moved into the home, which has been described to me as --- not the greatest home but acceptable on a short term basis. They made contact with the Landlord in regards to correcting the door - and when that did not happen - they hung a dark colored drape/curtain over the door with a rod to create some sense of privacy for both themselves and the children.

Again - this is what I have been told and I can not state it as fact since I was not in the home to physically see this! But am told it had nothing to do with the girl's bathroom behavior and was not removed by either parent.

I then question this --- IF the family was aware that CPS had been called, and IF the grandparent's still had rights, and IF there were all of these concerns about JT and his behavior's even in general..... Why didn't any of these overly concerned individual's make their own calls to CPS?

I know from personal experience that I have called MULTIPLE times on the same group of individual's because I feared for the safety of the children - and they were of no relation to me. I can not image how many times a DAY I would have called if they had been relatives or even grandchildren.

I'll assume for this post that what you were told was in fact what happened.... then I question what stopped the mother and step father from going to a local store and buying a door, so the children (and themselves) would have privacy while using the rest room????

It appears from what you were told and posted above, it was the landlords fault as well as possibly the grandparents.... SMH

 

[MIMOMMY]

They were not financially in a situation to be running out to buy doors, and had asked the landlord to repair the door. Remember this was a temporary stop for them, so it would not have made a lot of sense to put money into a rental home they only planned to be at for a short amount of time.

Also, I think it is important to remember that the girls were very young at this age. I am in no way saying that age plays a part in whether or not someone needs privacy, but I do believe that a adolescent requires a different level of it than a teenager per say. Again JMO

 

[TigerBalm]

They were not financially in a situation to be running out to buy doors, and had asked the landlord to repair the door. Remember this was a temporary stop for them, so it would not have made a lot of sense to put money into a rental home they only planned to be at for a short amount of time.

Also, I think it is important to remember that the girls were very young at this age. I am in no way saying that age plays a part in whether or not someone needs privacy, but I do believe that a adolescent requires a different level of it than a teenager per say. Again JMO

The twins couldn't have been that young, since from what I remember being posted they were 10 yrs old when Turnquist entered their life, so exactly how old were they at the time their mother and stepfather moved them to a new city but were too poor to purchase a door for privacy or rent a property that actually had a bathroom door???

My little 3 yr old niece deserves and expects privacy when she goes to use the rest room, any child does as well IMO.

 

[DazednConfuzed09]

I'll assume for this post that what you were told was in fact what happened.... then I question what stopped the mother and step father from going to a local store and buying a door, so the children (and themselves) would have privacy while using the rest room????

It appears from what you were told and posted above, it was the landlords fault as well as possibly the grandparents.... SMH

Why would anyone put money into a home that was not theirs with the risk of not being paid back by the owner and possibly be charged damages for installing something the owner did not agree to? I've rented from a "slum lord" once and learned my lesson!

I take MIMOMMY's statements to be two different thoughts by questioning if one statement is misrepresented (obvious differences in stories of opposing view points) why couldn't another statement be misrepresented as well?

 

[TigerBalm]

Why would anyone put money into a home that was not theirs with the risk of not being paid back by the owner and possibly be charged damages for installing something the owner did not agree to? I've rented from a "slum lord" once and learned my lesson!

I take MIMOMMY's statements to be two different thoughts by questioning if one statement is misrepresented (obvious differences in stories of opposing view points) why couldn't another statement be misrepresented as well?

Who cares if they would or wouldn't have been reimbursed for the price of the door, at least they and their minor children would have had privacy while using the rest room. Also, since when does installing a door on hinges cause property damage??

I agree with you about one statement being misrepresented, then why couldn't another... only I question the self serving statements being presented by the accused, and his wife to MIMOMMY, whom she just met in the fall of 2012, shortly before Julia was murdered.

 

[black_squirrel]

The twins couldn't have been that young, since from what I remember being posted they were 10 yrs old when Turnquist entered their life, so exactly how old were they at the time their mother and stepfather moved them to a new city but were too poor to purchase a door for privacy or rent a property that actually had a bathroom door???

My little 3 yr old niece deserves and expects privacy when she goes to use the rest room, any child does as well IMO.

Trojan mentioned before that they were around 12-14. According to sale records, the Turnquists bought their house in November 2002, when the twins were 13. They probably moved out of the Gaylord house soon after.

 

[FindHG]

The twins couldn't have been that young, since from what I remember being posted they were 10 yrs old when Turnquist entered their life, so exactly how old were they at the time their mother and stepfather moved them to a new city but were too poor to purchase a door for privacy or rent a property that actually had a bathroom door???

My little 3 yr old niece deserves and expects privacy when she goes to use the rest room, any child does as well IMO.

Why would you throw away a door if your short on funds?

 

[DazednConfuzed09]

The twins couldn't have been that young, since from what I remember being posted they were 10 yrs old when Turnquist entered their life, so exactly how old were they at the time their mother and stepfather moved them to a new city but were too poor to purchase a door for privacy or rent a property that actually had a bathroom door???

My little 3 yr old niece deserves and expects privacy when she goes to use the rest room, any child does as well IMO.

Hmm... money for groceries or money for a bathroom door? Which one would I do? I'd buy a curtain and buy groceries!

 

[DazednConfuzed09]

Why would you throw away a door if your short on funds?

We could go tit for tat on this. When visitors were so worried about the door, was there an offer to purchase one for them?

 

[MIMOMMY]

I don't believe it was even a matter of purchasing a door and how much that would cost. I believe it was probably a landlord with broken promises of coming to fix the door.


My statement in regards to the grandparents is not in regards to the door. But more so in regards to the repeated statements about how concerned everyone was for YEARS yet did nothing.....

I think we should also note...one grandparent left the home and the other left state.

 

[TigerBalm]

Hmm... money for groceries or money for a bathroom door? Which one would I do? I'd buy a curtain and buy groceries!

Or not move your family out of town if you were so poor, you had to choose between your preteen's bathroom privacy and putting food on the table.... JMO

 

[MIMOMMY]

As always...when I comment in regards to my opinion vs. Something the family has told me I state as such.

I don't know why it matters how long I have known any of the family.... it seems to me 3 years is longer than not at all. And everyone else is clearly allowed to state their opinions....

 

[TigerBalm]

We could go tit for tat on this. When visitors were so worried about the door, was there an offer to purchase one for them?

Again not understanding the deflecting blame away from the parent and step parent onto visitors.