MI MI - Macomb Co, 2 WhtFems, UP10563 & UP11130, body parts in sewer, Aug'12

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves
Two fleshy body parts found in a Warren sewer in December were from an unidentified female but not the same woman whose partial remains were found in a Sterling Heights sewer line last summer, police said Friday.

A DNA analysis of the two pieces found by sewer contractors on Dec. 20 near 10 Mile and Schoenherr roads determined they were from a white woman, Warren Police Commissioner Jere Green said.

scary

http://www.clickondetroit.com/news/...omen/-/1719418/19338752/-/vi5b9c/-/index.html

Body parts found in Macomb County sewer belong to women
Police in Warren say DNA confirms body parts found in Sterling Heights, Warren sewer belong to 2 white women
 
http://www.menafn.com/menafn/556b4e...-match-to-earlier-remains-police-say?src=main

"It's not a standard investigation and you go A, B, C, D," Green said. "We've exhausted all our law enforcement information sources and haven't been able to come up with any hits on missing persons or DNA profiles. ... We've kind of come to an end and exhausted all those tools."

Green said Warren police are turning to the public for help. Anyone who recognizes the tattoo on the body parts found in Sterling Heights as belonging to someone who may be missing or was involved in a medical procedure that resulted in skin removal is asked to contact the department. There were no tattoos on the body parts found in Warren, Green said.

Investigators don't know when or where the body parts entered the 21-mile sewer line that runs from Oakland County to Detroit. Authorities previously said the parts found in Sterling Heights likely were dumped upstream. Based on the condition of the parts found in Sterling Heights, they likely were not in the line for long, police have said"
 
http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/nation/2013/03/08/chicago-morgue-photos/1974475
/
"In a bid to identity the missing or forgotten dead, the Cook County medical examiner is posting photos of some bodies that have lingered at the morgue for more than three years.

The new website lists information about 18 unclaimed bodies as of Thursday. All but one were found in Chicago.

Three link to at least one photo -- taken during autopsies -- and two others note that photos are "pending."

"We're hoping that that photo can trigger somebody's memory, that you know, that person grew up down the street from me, or that person used to live nearby and I know where their mom is," Cook County Medical Examiner Dr. Stephen Cina told the local Fox News affiliate"
 
TSo it might be worth the effort to start asking about home plastic surgery, see what comes up.


It could even be the work of a legitimate plastic surgeon... qualified and with good reviews even... who just happens to be shonky when it comes to waste disposal. It would be tempting to save money that way, I think. I mean it isn't as if putting flesh down the drain hurts one's patient directly. Or maybe it could be an employee who did it for some reason, maybe without the surgeon's knowledge

I hope they've been looking into every surgery that is on that sewer line. Also, if the people who do health coverage would co-operate, it might be possible to do mail outs to women who have made claims involving removal of large areas of skin during the relevant time period and in the relevant geographic area. Obviously it isn't OK just to give away people's medical info, but a mail out requesting contact if a tattoo had been lost in surgery could be done without actually releasing individuals' details to the police.

Also interesting, I found this example of a tattoo lost to a tummy tuck. It isn't the tattoo we are after, alas, but it shows quite well how a large tattoo could be wiped out totally by even a medium sized TT.

http://www.realself.com/review/puerto-vallarta-mexico-tummy-tuck-tummy-for-change
 
BBM
"We're dealing with this as a homicide right now," he said.

A homicide that police believe metro Detroit can help solve.

"You can have a thousand theories at this point, and we simply need one phone call," said Detective Mel Nearing.

There are literally thousands of places throughout Oakland and Macomb counties where these parts could have been dumped, so police really need your help on this one. If you have any information, give Warren Police a call.

Read more: http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/story/2...ce-no-id-on-body-parts-in-sewer#ixzz2NtbpSabU
 
According to Warren Weekly, the victims remain unidentified but the cases are considered related: "No matter what you say, you have to assume the two (cases) are related," (Jere) Green said. "It's a little beyond coincidence." According to Warren Police Detective Cpl. Mel Nearing, "We're not ruling out medical waste at this point."

But there is little hope of it being medical waste. If it is medical waste, it is the waste of a corpse and definitely not plastic surgery. The removal of several chunks of flesh 4 to 5 inches wide and an inch deep would kill anyone. Since the chunks were sliced up after removal, it was one big chunk of flesh initially and that would simply be fatal. I doubt that the waste could be from a medically dissected corpse either. First, the article states, "Investigators said it appeared that the pieces were cut with a sharp object but that they did not believe the instrument was specialty tool designed to cauterize an incision." Second, there is little chance of the same team of sewer workers finding body parts at two locations 4 months apart by coincidence. In fact, the skin chunks appeared in one instance the day AFTER they entered the sewer system. That tells you that someone put the flesh in the sewer system upstream specifically so that it would be found by this team.

Police are also now seriously considering homicide. I think, though, that they were probably considering it rather earlier for the reasons I've just stated. My guess is that someone is killing prostitutes.
 
But there is little hope of it being medical waste. If it is medical waste, it is the waste of a corpse and definitely not plastic surgery. The removal of several chunks of flesh 4 to 5 inches wide and an inch deep would kill anyone.


Removing that much muscle would tend to indicate death (although not necessarily, people can reasonably expect to survive having a leg medically amputated near the hip, and a large thigh has more than that much muscle) it is quite clear that people regularly have that much skin and subcutaneous tissue removed in abdominoplasties, lower body lifts, masectomies, etc.

Here's a picture of the offcuts from a largish abdominoplasty.
http://exploreplasticsurgery.com/wp...nnus-removal-dr-barry-eppley-indianapolis.jpg
 
Removing that much muscle would tend to indicate death (although not necessarily, people can reasonably expect to survive having a leg medically amputated near the hip, and a large thigh has more than that much muscle) it is quite clear that people regularly have that much skin and subcutaneous tissue removed in abdominoplasties, lower body lifts, masectomies, etc.

Here's a picture of the offcuts from a largish abdominoplasty.
http://exploreplasticsurgery.com/wp...nnus-removal-dr-barry-eppley-indianapolis.jpg

They've consistently described it as if there's muscle as well as fat.
 
Removing that much muscle would tend to indicate death (although not necessarily, people can reasonably expect to survive having a leg medically amputated near the hip, and a large thigh has more than that much muscle) it is quite clear that people regularly have that much skin and subcutaneous tissue removed in abdominoplasties, lower body lifts, masectomies, etc.

Here's a picture of the offcuts from a largish abdominoplasty.
http://exploreplasticsurgery.com/wp...nnus-removal-dr-barry-eppley-indianapolis.jpg


The fat tissue removed in abdominoplasty is NOT subcutaneous fat. It is called visceral fat and too much of it is unhealthy. Subcutaneous fat, which is what is attached to the dermis (which, in turn, is attached to the epidermis) is essential to your health. The subcutaneous tissue is an insulator that is essential to regulating your body's temperature. It also contains nerves, hair follicles and sweat glands and cushions your bones so that you don't get seriously hurt if you take a fall (it thins out as you age which is why old people often suffer terrible injury in falls that barely faze you or I). Without it, you also have no buoyancy in water and would immediately sink and drown. Removal of the subcutaneous layer invites infection and blood clots.

It is the subcutaneous fat layer that was found in the sewers. You can't lose that much and expect to live.
 
The fat tissue removed in abdominoplasty is NOT subcutaneous fat.


No.

A big fat belly is comprised of a hefty layer of subcutaneous fat, a bit of fat within the muscles of the stomach (intramuscular fat) and varying amounts of visceral fat. Visceral fat is the fat that is packed around organs within the body cavity itself. An abdominoplasty removes a big flap of the skin with subcutaneous fat attached and the rectus muscles underneath are repaired if they've split. Usually is doesn't remove any visceral or muscular fat whatsoever. And that's why tummy tucks aren't so much an option for people with big hard pot bellies full of visceral fat with the skin stretched tight over the tummy, and are a great option for anyone who has a big pouchy flap of sloppy stretchy subcutaneous flat with plenty of spare skin in the tummy area, but not much fat in their abominal cavity itself.

Subcutaneous fat is pretty much the only type of fat a tummy tuck deals with.
 
News article: http://www.mlive.com/news/detroit/index.ssf/2013/03/morbid_mystery_of_human_remain.html

Major points from this article:

* The removal of the flesh could have been lethal, but investigators haven't ruled out other scenarios:

Investigators are asking anyone searching for a white, female who went missing prior to December; or who had a medical procedure that could account for the removal of flesh with a tattoo, contact authorities.

The parts were found December 20th and had been in the sewer less than a day at that time, so I wonder why they're looking at missing dates "prior to" the entire month.

* Among scenarios being considered are a serial killer or a copycat

* The body parts were fresh in both cases (presumably this rules out our theory they could have been frozen)
 
I really wish Lisa Knights DNA was available for comparison. This could be her. Missing in June 2012 with multiple tattoos from an area about 3hrs away. Someone else brought her up earlier on in the thread as well. There are a number of photos available for 3 of her tattoos, none of which I feel are a dead ringer for the ones on the skin found but who knows if she had more that aren't documented.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/15207/41

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/k/knight_lisa.html
 
I really wish Lisa Knights DNA was available for comparison. This could be her. Missing in June 2012 with multiple tattoos from an area about 3hrs away. Someone else brought her up earlier on in the thread as well. There are a number of photos available for 3 of her tattoos, none of which I feel are a dead ringer for the ones on the skin found but who knows if she had more that aren't documented.

https://www.findthemissing.org/en/cases/15207/41

http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/k/knight_lisa.html

Thanks for posting, this link has large pic. of tattoo and links back to Ws's page.
MI MI - Lisa Knight, 29, Ossineke, 8 Jun 2012 - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community

https://www.google.ca/search?q=Lisa...forums%2Fshowthread.php%3Fp%3D9555200;600;450
 

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